XP gain as a social or anitisocial mechanic

The first iteration of the XP gain felt ideal from my PoV as a guild leader for 20 years.
Reason: I could make a group of 6 or 8 or 9 or 12 and the loss was not that great vs the social gain of being together and not telling someone "YOU CAN'T BE PART OF IT" - a heavily antisocial aspect

The second iteration of XP felt very punishing
Reason: If I had 9 people online I had to either break the current group or tell the 9th "YOU CAN'T BE PART OF IT" - both options heavily antisocial.

I'm fine with grind if you can make it with friends in a social way and the 9 level difference feels punishing enough for 50 levels and not that punishing for lvl 25 as max level.

Suggestion:
TO DO: Pro Social: Increase the required exp to level (if you feel you need) but open up the social aspect and allow people to play together at different levels and sizes.
NOT TO DO: Anti Social: Make a heavy grind while forcing people to split up because grouping is too punishing.

Find more posts tagged with

Comments

JerrySmith

I agree and also,
the amount of exp you get should be in my opinion based of the monster lvl and not the fact that you have 9 people in the group.

Aurellius

I completely agree with the original post. The grind has become the dominant aspect of the game, and the new XP mechanic seems to have exacerbated the issue.

The Social Impact:
* Reduced Group Play: The new mechanic has forced many players to grind solo or in smaller groups, limiting social interaction and community building.
* Guild Divisions: The level disparity within guilds can create tension and distance between members.

The Gameplay Impact:

* Tanking Frustration: Off-tanks, in particular, find the grind tedious and unrewarding. Their role is often reduced to auto-attacking, lacking engaging gameplay.
* Limited Testing: The strict XP range limits the ability to test large-scale content like PvP battles and mass crafting. Faster leveling would allow players to reach end-game content sooner and provide valuable feedback.

A Plea for Change:
While I understand the need to balance progression, I believe the current XP system is too restrictive. Perhaps a more flexible system, allowing players to level at their own pace, could be considered. Alternatively, removing the XP range entirely during the alpha phase would allow for faster progression and more extensive testing.
Additionally, more engaging content, such as challenging dungeons, raids, or PvP activities, would help alleviate the grind and provide players with diverse gameplay experiences.
Let's hope the developers will listen to the community's feedback and make the necessary adjustments to create a more enjoyable and social gaming experience.

Kalnazzar

So 1 person should get the full exp of a kill regardless if he hit the target? This makes no sense, why should a player be given the full exp of a kill or even part of it if the player never tagged the creature. Everyone should have to hit the creature or a system like this is just going to be exploited for power leveling friends and alts. No game should let players speed the level progression like this. When they introduced this kind of stuff to World of Carebears leveling became pointless because it was to quick and too easy.

CrusaderW

Here are my 5 cents:
I don't like grindy leveling processes in general, however I like leveing as it is in AoC, because the combat is fun and the class mechanics are complex enough that you can get better while leveling.

1. I feel that amount of XP you get from quests needs to be adapted to be "worth it" to "waste the time" and do any quests at all. Currently it feels like doing one quest for 10-20 minutes gives me the same amount of XP then killing 5 to 20 mobs. Quests need to become more attractive XP wise in the long run.
2. I agree with the original post that the new group XP rules are super unsatisfying. I has leveling my character super hard on the first weekend and was top level of my group. Then I was lucky enough to have a full weekend of "Girlfriend time" two weekends in a row, which meant not much time for leveling. Then I came back to the game and was informed that I could not level with my buddies I pushed with so hard during the first week, because I was level 18 and they were level 22 and 23, but killing lvl 25 mobs.
I hope that you will overthink this highly excluding new XP distribution mechanic and get closer to the original promise and make a game that rewards social interaction and playing with friends. It would be a shame if it became another case of: "Leveling min-maxing simulator" IMO leveling should be relative the same if you level alone, in small groups or with 24 people, as long as you can find the right mobs that fit for the group. Why not make everyone happy.
3. I personally have no problem with power leveling other people or alts. IMO it's a form of social activity as well: Someone invests the time to help a friend instead of doing something for his own progress in the meantime.
4. I also don't like too strict rules of preventing AFK leveling too harshly, because sometimes you just have to look at your skills or read some tooltips, take your dog for a 5 minute walk, or all the other things that just need 5 minutes for because we still live in physical bodies that need maintenance...

Auricus

I think the change was to stop high lvl groups from power lvling a new player from say lvl 5-10 in a day. A exp cap for lvl needs to be in place to stop this power lvling that the devs dont want and let ppl group together. Still earn a FAIR amount of exp and enjoy there guild friends etc.

Kalnazzar

CrusaderW wrote: »

Here are my 5 cents:
I don't like grindy leveling processes in general, however I like leveing as it is in AoC, because the combat is fun and the class mechanics are complex enough that you can get better while leveling.

1. I feel that amount of XP you get from quests needs to be adapted to be "worth it" to "waste the time" and do any quests at all. Currently it feels like doing one quest for 10-20 minutes gives me the same amount of XP then killing 5 to 20 mobs. Quests need to become more attractive XP wise in the long run.
2. I agree with the original post that the new group XP rules are super unsatisfying. I has leveling my character super hard on the first weekend and was top level of my group. Then I was lucky enough to have a full weekend of "Girlfriend time" two weekends in a row, which meant not much time for leveling. Then I came back to the game and was informed that I could not level with my buddies I pushed with so hard during the first week, because I was level 18 and they were level 22 and 23, but killing lvl 25 mobs.
I hope that you will overthink this highly excluding new XP distribution mechanic and get closer to the original promise and make a game that rewards social interaction and playing with friends. It would be a shame if it became another case of: "Leveling min-maxing simulator" IMO leveling should be relative the same if you level alone, in small groups or with 24 people, as long as you can find the right mobs that fit for the group. Why not make everyone happy.
3. I personally have no problem with power leveling other people or alts. IMO it's a form of social activity as well: Someone invests the time to help a friend instead of doing something for his own progress in the meantime.
4. I also don't like too strict rules of preventing AFK leveling too harshly, because sometimes you just have to look at your skills or read some tooltips, take your dog for a 5 minute walk, or all the other things that just need 5 minutes for because we still live in physical bodies that need maintenance...

Your post raises several points—or at least attempts to—but I honestly don’t see any fundamental ones worth defending. Let’s be real here: Ashes of Creation has made it abundantly clear that they are against surge mechanics. You know, those situations where a swarm of players trivializes fights or undermines the difficulty of the game. Yet somehow, your entire post is asking for exactly that—grouping up en masse, steamrolling content, and gaining full experience for doing virtually nothing. Sounds like a blast, doesn’t it? (Spoiler: It’s not.)

And then there’s the ‘socializing’ argument you’re hiding behind, as if faster leveling magically fosters meaningful relationships. Hate to break it to you, but longer leveling is what actually encourages players to connect, help each other, and bond over shared challenges. But sure, let’s just speed things up and miss all that, because who needs depth and camaraderie when you can zerg your way to max level?

Oh, and let’s not forget the gem about AFK leveling. Really? AFK leveling? What is this, a mobile game? The mere thought of gaining progress while walking your dog or staring blankly at a tooltip makes me want to vomit. Effort and engagement are what make progress rewarding. Expecting to gain experience while literally doing nothing is laughable and goes against everything Ashes of Creation stands for.

At the end of the day, this game is about meaningful effort and immersive gameplay. If you’re looking for a free ride, there are plenty of other games out there for that. Ashes of Creation isn’t going to cater to that mentality, nor should it.

erx

Kalnazzar wrote: »

Your post raises several points—or at least attempts to—but I honestly don’t see any fundamental ones worth defending. Let’s be real here: Ashes of Creation has made it abundantly clear that they are against surge mechanics. You know, those situations where a swarm of players trivializes fights or undermines the difficulty of the game. Yet somehow, your entire post is asking for exactly that—grouping up en masse, steamrolling content, and gaining full experience for doing virtually nothing. Sounds like a blast, doesn’t it? (Spoiler: It’s not.)

And then there’s the ‘socializing’ argument you’re hiding behind, as if faster leveling magically fosters meaningful relationships. Hate to break it to you, but longer leveling is what actually encourages players to connect, help each other, and bond over shared challenges. But sure, let’s just speed things up and miss all that, because who needs depth and camaraderie when you can zerg your way to max level?

Oh, and let’s not forget the gem about AFK leveling. Really? AFK leveling? What is this, a mobile game? The mere thought of gaining progress while walking your dog or staring blankly at a tooltip makes me want to vomit. Effort and engagement are what make progress rewarding. Expecting to gain experience while literally doing nothing is laughable and goes against everything Ashes of Creation stands for.

At the end of the day, this game is about meaningful effort and immersive gameplay. If you’re looking for a free ride, there are plenty of other games out there for that. Ashes of Creation isn’t going to cater to that mentality, nor should it.

With the current system it's very punishing to play with guild mates that are not within a 3 level range.

If someone in your group happens to take a day off and not play, either your whole group has to not play or you have to find a totally new person and cut the person who took the day off from your group entirely because you out level them and it no longer becomes viable to play/level with them due to how inefficient the XP is. This makes the game pretty anti social.

Another issue is with the recent changes, you can only level together in a group of 8 max. Previously you could have groups of 8-16 and it would be viable to do so. Now, the moment you add the 9th player to the group the XP received is reduced by around 50%, this again makes it so inefficient to level as anything but a 8man group and you're forced to tell people to find another group if they're the 9th/10th person etc. This is not about zerging content but rather having a hard restriction on anything but 8man groups.

The way the XP/Grouping worked prior two Nov 8th A2 access was fine, and the above two problems didn't exist. I am not sure why these were changed, I would recommend reverting this or at the very least tweaking it to be more forgiving.

Personally I had a consistent group and wasn't impacted by this to much, I got from lvl 0-24 over the 4 days this weekend it's more so the rest of my guild facing a lot of these issues and players getting screwed over and being forced to find new groups everyday etc as a result of these changes. I agree with the sentiment OP is trying to get at but not the proposed solutions.

Mic

Agreed completely. At least closer to the first iteration. Not being able to group with my friends because they were like 7 levels below me felt goofy. Not being able to group with my friend because they were the 9th person to sign-on felt horrible.

VoidLords

I agree and also more people in the group more fun we will get

Child Item