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Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Bard feels bad now. The main mechanic of the class has been changed and gutted.
LaureTheGamer
Member, Alpha Two
First, we can agree that bards have need the nerf after nerf that we've received. This is not a letter against nerfs.
Bards are a commonly played, well-loved class with a core gameplay loop that makes sense. By attacking, you do a *thing* that changes with each aura (melody). It's simple, and it works.
However, the bard I logged into doesn't feel like the same class. It doesn't play the same way anymore. Instead of attacking to support the group while balancing the innate desire to finish weapon combos with the need to heal and do other things, we now must fan our keyboards, often with zero regard for what spells we are actually casting. We no longer really care what our spells do. We now must care that they each add a single stack of Resonant Weapon. Press 'em all. Press 'em as fast as you can. Don't think too hard. Just spam.
With a single change, the class I love has transformed into something I hate. It's gone from a meticulous prediction-based class to a button mashing monstrosity. I'm not sure what the design intent was behind this decision, but I PLEAD with you to reconsider. Accomplish the goal in another way. I cannot describe the disappointment I had trying to play my class this weekend. I simply hid from my class's newly changed playstyle by spending the whole weekend in the crafting systems.
Sincerely,
A concerned ex-bard-lover
Bards are a commonly played, well-loved class with a core gameplay loop that makes sense. By attacking, you do a *thing* that changes with each aura (melody). It's simple, and it works.
However, the bard I logged into doesn't feel like the same class. It doesn't play the same way anymore. Instead of attacking to support the group while balancing the innate desire to finish weapon combos with the need to heal and do other things, we now must fan our keyboards, often with zero regard for what spells we are actually casting. We no longer really care what our spells do. We now must care that they each add a single stack of Resonant Weapon. Press 'em all. Press 'em as fast as you can. Don't think too hard. Just spam.
With a single change, the class I love has transformed into something I hate. It's gone from a meticulous prediction-based class to a button mashing monstrosity. I'm not sure what the design intent was behind this decision, but I PLEAD with you to reconsider. Accomplish the goal in another way. I cannot describe the disappointment I had trying to play my class this weekend. I simply hid from my class's newly changed playstyle by spending the whole weekend in the crafting systems.
Sincerely,
A concerned ex-bard-lover
3
Comments
That just lets you button mask harder. You *do* get a stack on Resonant Weapon if your dance cancels a dance.
This is my main complaint.
It's pretty obvious that this can't stay as-is. Already the number of Bards has plummeted, and players like me, who just reroll, aren't tempted to go back to a class that isn't fun anymore.
TBH, I can now write a looping script for a bard on a second PC, place it wherever I'm farming on my main and not care. All I now care about is mana.
Whereas before, Bard was an active playstyle, it's now the most bot-compatible of all archetypes.
This is an angle I forgot about. Pressing buttons felt like a negative and now it's something I'm expected to do.
The channeled abilities feel a little bad (not happy with most of the damage spells - I'd rather whack them in melee with Menacing Melody than use a damage song - but most of my colleagues in my guild like Dark Lullaby)
I can min/max getting 4 stacks but it's also at the cost of not holding unto abilities for them to be meaningful.
florusih, shield dance, alacracity, wonder, auto attack
tomato, tomato, silence, mez, auto attack
Flourish, Shield Dance w/ Mighty Step gets me 3+ stacks, auto attack
discordance, get off the stage, dark lull, nimble, auto attack
tomato, tomato, chill, maddening, auto attack
flourish, shield - auto attack
Saga, auto attack
2 stack of resonate left over, alacracity, wonder, auto attack.
im not really caring about holding my get off the stage, mez or silence for interrupt now, because I have to be a mana battery due to pensive alone doesn't keep people mana up and utilizing resonate is the only effect way to keep people decently well off.
But this is just boring gameplay loop that is brain dead. I enjoyed before, observing enemy cast bar to interrupt abilities such as black lung, corrupt sacrifice, whirlwind, that one goblin bomb ability, etc.
The group dependence of bard's passive and active mana regen discourage you from using other melodies , even if you go for weaving 2 at the same time which is more micro intensive.
Talking about pointless micro:
* Songs feel like that. You literally press a button every 30 seconds to refresh a group wide stat buff. Not really engaging, I defo have some mixed feelings about that.
* Anthem of Alacrity - The attack speed buff is really good, but casting it for 2 seconds, to get only a 10 second long buff again feels micro intensive.
I haven't run the numbers, but I suspect the recent Resonance changes restrict the archetype playstyle too much and push it towards the buff bot too much for my liking. Any dps bard was doing has been intentionally restricted by number of active abilities you cast. Not a great change for a class with average ability cooldown of 25 seconds.
The constant build switching between single and multiple target ability versions, melodies also feels pretty bad, especially on the bard.
Several weeks back I created a topic where I expressed a concern that clerics and bard will be turned into heal / buffs bots, and certainly bard just might go in that direction. Stop limiting number of valid playstyles per archetype.
Blown past falling sands…
Saga feels like a waste. It might not mathematically be a waste - but I'd rather keep my yellow or blue stack than than Saga. Red stacks I'd prefer to have but I think the red Saga is the only one worth it (when it works... which is about 50% of the time.. and I'm usually in combat when it fails to do anything so no time to /bug). The rest are underpowered, unclear, or just flat out glitchy. (The reduced gravity effect is hilarious - but since the recent rebalance I'm not going to 'waste' two of my already spread thin points for something silly)
Alacrity is one of my favourite spells, but then I'm a melee front liner bard, and usually it's the tanks and fighters I hit. We've discovered that fighters whirlwind gets nutty with attack speed keeping the momentum going. I absolutely get more done with Alacrity even with the 2s cast - and even if not I'm giving up a bit of my action time to benefit someone who does more with the same amount of time. Alacrity is something I cast 100% of the time when it's off CD - even before remembering to recast my Story. It's also great when the cleric is trying to res someone.
Going to call this out explicity. So much this. It's terrible that I have to choose between ST and group versions of these. I've settled on them mostly being group for what I do (and I try not to respec since I know we won't be able to do it instantly in the future). This means I'm using the AOE even when I'm soloing.
1) Hard disagree. I'm a front line support bard whacking people with the new carphin scepter I got (Was using a greatsword before that). Only time I go 'caster' is if I feel like it's unsafe for me on the front - I watch what my more experienced fighters are doing. I'm in 5 medium/3 heavy armour so I can take just as much punishment as they do. If you are going cloth/book you are going to feel more like a caster than medium/spellbow
2)Don't do that, you are probably overhealing. Cast quick wit, stories and whatever other 'must cast on cooldown' abilities (alarcity for me) and you'll be fine. When I mana battery if I'm casting hymn of the mind on cooldown and maintaining 3 blue stacks I'm actually fine to switch to menacing when people are above 50%. Spamming your abilities and overhealing is not neccessary.
Or you need more Magic Power. It's probably that, you probably don't have enough Magic Power gear.
3) Not sure what you mean here. I'm frontline dps support and I'm whacking with my mace just as vigorously as the fighter next to me (but not as hard) while making his hits harder and faster.
4) You can be a mana battery and versatile. Weave melodies more (even if you are using Crescendo, which I do, use the right melody for the task at hand) and use a story that grants Mystery (Wonder or the other one, depending on who your DPS is). If you are the mana battery, ignore Saga - mystery stacks are more important.
* ability to save builds
* discussion about the whole single / AoE target
* cry about classes like bard which have a lot of abilities and build flexibility (at least on paper, in case case you want the group wide mana regen, enjoy your mana gas station jobs)
* stop pushing archetypes into really narrow roles: all classes should have useful utility and be totally toothless when it comes to dps. Especially when classes like mage exist in their current silly dps state.
Blown past falling sands…
bard is the only class that doesn't have a narrow role. there's at least 3 roles we can specialize into and we can dabble in the third.
My spec without changing anything can either go frontline DPS support (where I use a melee weapon and buff the frontline dps) or be the mana battery - or a bit of both if I'm feeling pro active enough to swap melodies mid fight. And even swapping between those roles I can still throw down shielding dance (I'm standing on the front anyway) or toss an Area Lovely Seranade if things are dire.
My party doesn't avoid an enemy using Whirlwind - I'm already putting up a shield as soon as it goes up.
and I can do the same role and comparable damage if I'm on the front whacking with my scepter or on the back shooting them with my spellbow.
The other classes? 100% one-trick ponies. Fighters and Rangers even get iffy if they have to swap into ranged or melee, respectively. There is no 'give' to those classes.
I like how reactive bard is however changes to Resonance will push you away from that frontliner role, those passives depend on active abilities now.
Blown past falling sands…
They didn't though. I was afraid they would, but they genuinely didn't. I actually feel more active on the front line than I did before. (There are certain enemies that I do not feel comfortable in melee against - Crystal Golems for example, but that has nothing to do with the resonance changes)
The only thing that changed is that instead of sitting there whacking with my greatsword for procs - I'm being more pro-active with my tomatoes and jest (giving me a dedicated button for jest helps - was impossible to use jest with a defensive and offensive target selected before). I'm remembering to use Hymn of the Mind more often for resonance.
I'm still mostly attacking with my melee weapon (now a scepter since I got a good one in Carphin). you don't need full resonance to be effective (especially when running Menacing, which I usually do) even a stack or two will proc the effect, and I save my situational abilities for situational needs (Shielding dance, lovely serenade, clever retort when I need to counter).
I have Alacrity, Whichever Story, hymn of the mind, and quick wit that I cast on cooldown. Sometimes Clever retort for humiliated if I don't need it for a specific counter. That by itself is enough resonance to be effective. Any situational thing I need to use just makes me stronger.
Before - I felt bad any time I was not auto attacking. I was literally disincentivized to do anything else because resonant weapon was more important.
And to be clear - this is still true when I'm the main Mana battery. I do not struggle to keep the party's mana full with just my basic 'always cast on cooldown' abilities and saving my reactive abilities. And it's given me more freedom. Before I was required to use the spell shortbow to maintain mana, because it procced faster. Now that proc speed isn't as important since resonance is the key limitation - I'm fine to use a greatsword in melee when playing mana battery.
This change has been 100% upside, with no downsides. I can only think that "I have to spam my spells to generate resonance" is the wrong mentality, because that is not what I'm seeing in my play.
I was even main healer (no cleric) for a small grinding party recently and I kept the party up primarily with jest, joy, and whatever cheerful resonance procs I got in between. Shielding dance and serenade only for the 'oh shit' moments'. You do not need 4 resonance in between every finisher. You simply don't. one or two is enough, and you get that from quick wit and stories alone.
It's possible the perspective difference is because you are level 19. You get a gear upgrade at 20 and more Magic Power. I also have the Halcyon cloak that's only available to citizens of Halcyon.
Blown past falling sands…
Oh I 100% backflip out of melee ranged for any channeled ability except shielding dance. Even for nimble dance when there's debuffs I'm dancing around the outside of the party (or flourish to give my dance a bigger area)
Lovely Serenade and Anthem of Alacrity are the only real non-dance channels I use. Alacrity I move in such a way to make sure I hit the most number of people. If there's only 1 or 2 people in melee I try to angle it to hit one of the backline. Seranade is mostly just a backflip and then heal the frontliners taking area damage. (backflip being a dodge into a dump while moving backwards)
Positional awareness is key as a bard if you are in melee or doing any dances. I guess I can understand players who aren't comfortable being mobile feeling like they are 'just another mage' though.
Fought a corrupted tank who was 3 levels lower than me 1v1 (19 v 16) and that was a pretty one-sided fight too, mostly because he didn't time his knockdowns. We strip a tank's buffs and his armour isn't well suited for magic damage - even from a scepter.
I have both a melee and a ranged weapon and can adapt as needed for the situation. This change is less limiting than what we had before, because before doing anything but auto-attacking was a net negative.
I do not get your perspective that this limits playstyles - it seems like it gives us more.
Does ANYONE know if "Magical Casting Speed Rating" stat affects auto-attacks with weapons like spellswords and spellbows?
Blown past falling sands…
With that said, the new changes feel GREAT for solo-trio. In smallman I am able to constantly twist songs with Counterpoint as the situation needs, frontline, and even semi-tank effectively (no 3 stars lol) while keeping everyone topped off with HP and mana. My only complaint would be that I wish bard DPS was globally increased maybe 10%, which would feel a little bit better without bringing us anywhere close to actual DPS classes. With 3x tragedy buffs and menacing I can almost do more than just tickle things, but a small increase would go a long way toward overall effectiveness in a more active playstyle without taking it too far. Just my two cents.
Speaking of which, is there anyway to get it so that flourish goes in the direction of your movement key, akin to how dodge works? Currently, I have to manually turn my character to do a flourish sideways or backwards, wondering if anyone has worked that out yet.
I was under the impression that it doesn't add a stack with chilling lament, lovely serenade, lullaby, etc., but now that you mention it, it may just mean the base melodies (and I was reading too much into what non-melody meant). Although, any channeling ability should do 1 resonance per tick though.