Make PvP death more punishing/rewarding

RedLeader1

The problem right now is that as an offensive PvP player, dying is not that great a risk. All I am in danger of losing is stuff I have looted off other people. I am never going to make a net loss for a PvP session.

Can we add a mechanic, where death also has a player drop a % of the material damage to their gear (that can be used in the repair of their killer's gear), of the appropriate quality. This increases the reward of PvP against PvP targets, and can be balanced as necessary, it can be a very incremental amount.

The idea is to create a mechanic that provides a reward for killing a purely PvP player, and punish losers in PvP more than the victors. It also could (potentially) make PvP targets more lucrative than soft PvE targets.

I know to a lot of PvE players, this may seem counter-intuitive, but I think it will help foster PvX play. Repairing material costs will increase the risk in PvP, but not the reward, this mechanic will provide a positive balancing mechanic that just increases flexibility.

kadimir

RedLeader1 wrote: »

The problem right now is that as an offensive PvP player, dying is not that great a risk. All I am in danger of losing is stuff I have looted off other people. I am never going to make a net loss for a PvP session.

Until you go red and you lose your gear? Why should people lose even more than they already do when they die? If you tag a player and they purple up and fight back - what penalties make sense? any penalties that would apply to you would apply to them - so basically you're asking for no one to actually want to pvp? Or are you asking to make it so that you can hurt other players progress more by ganking them?

RedLeader1

I'm just saying that it incentivises a PvP player to play defence. Those epic gear scraps picked up from dead attackers will potentially be far more valuable than heading off and ganking lowbies.

You create a loss/reward system for purely PvP activity. And you get more for killing a better geared player! Outside of players dropping glint/mats for PvE stuff. You can balance it out. Forget about how much, or how little you drop, or where that balance exists.

You have a slider that you can set where risk-reward is balanced. Right now, both sides are incentivized to roll out and both attack, the worst they can do is break even. And both sides are rewarded collectively, only by how many PvP non-participants they loot collectively. They are almost on the same side, because the more they loot, the more they are fighting over.

This way defending against an inferior enemy could be more lucrative in armor scraps than any lowbie stuff you might get attacking. And you create greater risk for the PvP attacker, who is now risking equipment debt.

I am not saying that PvP and PvE shouldn't be linked, just that you need mechanics for risk/reward on both sides, to balance it. In PvP right now, materially, PvE provides ALL the reward and faces ALL of the risk, and PvP activity provides NONE the reward, and has NONE of the risk. I just feel that might be a problem down the line.

kadimir

RedLeader1 wrote: »

I am not saying that PvP and PvE shouldn't be linked, just that you need mechanics for risk/reward on both sides, to balance it. In PvP right now, materially, PvE provides ALL the reward and faces ALL of the risk, and PvP activity provides NONE the reward, and has NONE of the risk.

Serious question, do you think people who gank lose more often than they win?

do you- yourself, die more often than you kill right now?

RedLeader1

kadimir wrote: »

RedLeader1 wrote: »

I am not saying that PvP and PvE shouldn't be linked, just that you need mechanics for risk/reward on both sides, to balance it. In PvP right now, materially, PvE provides ALL the reward and faces ALL of the risk, and PvP activity provides NONE the reward, and has NONE of the risk.

Serious question, do you think people who gank lose more often than they win?

do you- yourself, die more often than you kill right now?

That is just the point though. If I kill a lowbie in green gear, I will only collect green armor scraps, Even if I kill 10000 of them I wont cover my armor repair, if I die one time. However the person that kills me and takes my legendary armor scraps, is going to have a valuable resource for armor repair to keep or sell. It would be rewarding for PvPers to defeat other PvPers. Right now if your node is being attacked in world PvP, there is no real incentive for anyone to play defense. Well, not until after they finish ganking and have all their victim's stuff.

Right now those PvPers would ride by each other waving as they go to raid the other's node. Nothing to be gained by PvPing someone without loot!

kadimir

You didn't answer my question

RedLeader1

People who gank win more often than they lose. But what difference does that make? If they lose more in one death than they gain in 10000 kills, why is that important?

PvPers want this as well. They don't want the lowlife that ganks lowbies to get more out of it than the champion that kills the other side's champion.

CROW3

RedLeader1 wrote: »

If they lose more in one death than they gain in 10000 kills, why is that important?

Maybe stay away from Vegas. You’re welcome.

Veeshan

PvP kills imo the 25% drop and 25 delete rate should just be swapped to 50% drop and 0% delete. Adds to the reward to accommodate the risk but doesnt take more from the person who dies.

RedLeader1

Veeshan wrote: »

PvP kills imo the 25% drop and 25 delete rate should just be swapped to 50% drop and 0% delete. Adds to the reward to accommodate the risk but doesn't take more from the person who dies.

Yeah, you cant do that if you want any kind of economy. Not to mention the potential for abuse.

Veeshan

RedLeader1 wrote: »

Veeshan wrote: »

PvP kills imo the 25% drop and 25 delete rate should just be swapped to 50% drop and 0% delete. Adds to the reward to accommodate the risk but doesn't take more from the person who dies.

Yeah, you cant do that if you want any kind of economy. Not to mention the potential for abuse.

you can still loose stuff from PvE deaths the other option is 40/40/20 where 20 gets destroyed if u still want some resource destruction

kadimir

RedLeader1 wrote: »

People who gank win more often than they lose. But what difference does that make?

It's quite simple, if the majority of the time gankers win, the actual net effect of your proposed changes simply makes the game worse for your victims. You're not advocating for an increase in your risk, youre advocating for slight increase in risk for you while nearly certain punishment increase for everyone you attack.

Zapatos80

This is exactly why Corruption is extremely punishing. Sure, you can kill a newbie and get some materials/glint... but then if you die, you can lose completed items.

RedLeader1

kadimir wrote: »

RedLeader1 wrote: »

People who gank win more often than they lose. But what difference does that make?

It's quite simple, if the majority of the time gankers win, the actual net effect of your proposed changes simply makes the game worse for your victims. You're not advocating for an increase in your risk, youre advocating for slight increase in risk for you while nearly certain punishment increase for everyone you attack.

You are absolutely wrong, I am not changing the risk at all. I'm greatly increasing the reward for attacking higher level players, so it is much greater than the reward for ganking.

At the moment ganking can easily be more rewarding than killing a champion, if the champion is just joining the fight or hasn't done any PvE.

I'm trying to make it so it isn't worth gankers risking notching their sword, chopping off their target's head.