lamina5432 wrote: » I do think 5 sec between auto-attack would feel to long but I wouldn't mind a little bit of something like that. Mainly so instant cast spells wouldn't generally interrupt the auto-attack combo.
Azherae wrote: » lamina5432 wrote: » I do think 5 sec between auto-attack would feel to long but I wouldn't mind a little bit of something like that. Mainly so instant cast spells wouldn't generally interrupt the auto-attack combo. This one can be slightly more difficult to encode than you might think at first, so it may take some time to add even if they do it. But long ago in Alpha-1, this was how it worked for a while. Anyway, on to channeling my group's thoughts on this, with minimal mentions of TL or TP gauges! AoC's Archetypes and stat formulae are designed in a way that we think will diminish weapon trees no matter what you do (not expanding on this, see previous line). There just aren't enough effects to go around that don't take up the same slots as Archetype skills. This is a weird thing to say as someone who loves MOBA itemization, but I'd say the problem comes in the game style. AoC isn't really about 'hitting things with your weapon' a lot of the time, even with the TTK change. I don't mean that it can't be, but moreso that the way they've chosen abilities to work, very 'independently' of weapon, means that unless they start making playstyles where the Archetype skills feed into the weapon itself in some way (affecting parameters of auto-attacking or finishers a lot), the thing you care about is the strength of the skills you will use. But this is a balance tightrope in every other game I've played. The attack speed/attack delay of weapons is tied directly to how everything about the combat works. And if one starts adding stat-lines to weapons while also having Finishers on them but not tying them to Archetypes, it creates the sort of swingy itemization meta that usually requires MOBA level telemetry outputs to even start working on. There wouldn't be a reason to engage with it if it was changed to what OP suggests, basically. It would fall squarely between 'games we actually like the combat/weapons systems of' and 'games some of us quit and most of us were never willing to seriously play'. Also, OP left out Spears and Staves. I'm not going to go into that too much but I will say that you can often judge a game's combat system based on how well it handles or fails to handle those, so a suggestion that leaves them out even incidentally can't inspire confidence for us.
lancehavenbay wrote: » Azherae wrote: » lamina5432 wrote: » I do think 5 sec between auto-attack would feel to long but I wouldn't mind a little bit of something like that. Mainly so instant cast spells wouldn't generally interrupt the auto-attack combo. This one can be slightly more difficult to encode than you might think at first, so it may take some time to add even if they do it. But long ago in Alpha-1, this was how it worked for a while. Anyway, on to channeling my group's thoughts on this, with minimal mentions of TL or TP gauges! AoC's Archetypes and stat formulae are designed in a way that we think will diminish weapon trees no matter what you do (not expanding on this, see previous line). There just aren't enough effects to go around that don't take up the same slots as Archetype skills. This is a weird thing to say as someone who loves MOBA itemization, but I'd say the problem comes in the game style. AoC isn't really about 'hitting things with your weapon' a lot of the time, even with the TTK change. I don't mean that it can't be, but moreso that the way they've chosen abilities to work, very 'independently' of weapon, means that unless they start making playstyles where the Archetype skills feed into the weapon itself in some way (affecting parameters of auto-attacking or finishers a lot), the thing you care about is the strength of the skills you will use. But this is a balance tightrope in every other game I've played. The attack speed/attack delay of weapons is tied directly to how everything about the combat works. And if one starts adding stat-lines to weapons while also having Finishers on them but not tying them to Archetypes, it creates the sort of swingy itemization meta that usually requires MOBA level telemetry outputs to even start working on. There wouldn't be a reason to engage with it if it was changed to what OP suggests, basically. It would fall squarely between 'games we actually like the combat/weapons systems of' and 'games some of us quit and most of us were never willing to seriously play'. Also, OP left out Spears and Staves. I'm not going to go into that too much but I will say that you can often judge a game's combat system based on how well it handles or fails to handle those, so a suggestion that leaves them out even incidentally can't inspire confidence for us. It's pretty odd you say a post doesn't inspire confidence because it doesn't mention items that are NOT even in the game right now. Items in the game, are what was listed. So that's a pretty asinine assertion in and of itself. It's actually pretty insulting that you try to discredit a post entirely because of something so trivial. Additionally, attack speed does not affect skill cooldown, so it's a pretty straightforward path to make auto attacks viable. More attacks in a shorter amount of time, in addition to the already present 150% crit multiplier. It's relatively simple math. If a crit is 150% multiplier, then a 70% auto attack crit, (175%dmg) would outpace a 30 second cooldown on a 175% dmg skill. The only difference is that the player would need to remain on target longer. The only modification that would need to be done to make auto attacks more viable would be a light 10-20% increase on combo swing damage. Because crit would double it and increase the sustain to a competitive rate. To make them sustain better, combing continuation, which was already in this post -would be the only other thing needed. But that's all detailed in this post. Your reply really leaves a lot in the air for no reason.
