Glorious Alpha Two Testers!
Alpha Two testing is currently taking place five days each week. More information about Phase II and Phase III testing schedule can be found here
If you have Alpha Two, you can download the game launcher here, and we encourage you to join us on our Official Discord Server for the most up to date testing news.
Alpha Two testing is currently taking place five days each week. More information about Phase II and Phase III testing schedule can be found here
If you have Alpha Two, you can download the game launcher here, and we encourage you to join us on our Official Discord Server for the most up to date testing news.
Comments
Players love to run thro quests for solo experience & rewards
quests that require any effect into reading is often dismissed
losing gold or progress due to improper dialogue options doesnt feel good.
I think the time to reward should also be looked at. People are currently grinding in open world for glint or granite at a rate of ~2g/hr, so having rewards around these value metrics per time spent would be good.
Collar quest line was good
Helped exploring carphin and Winstead
players are a little upset with congested areas either from quests or gear grinds, and the last boss is bugged into a wall.
People are also concerned about the artisan and caravan progression, If there were quests that streamlined an artisan by rewarding mats or gear upon completion i think that would be great.
Time spent for rewards should be looked at.
as rewards do get completed and fulfilled they will naturally water themselves down in value. something to help with this would be a reward deep inside a specific quest chain for ___ artisan. Some rewards dont have to be as grand either. the Bag quest in lionshold is very helpful early on. Another mount quest would relive alot of tension around level 14.
Archetype quests and artisan quests would help with immersion.
Incorporating some level of PvP quests/ rewards would also help.
POI specific quests can help with building and advancing the story as alot of people only know we just came out of a portal.
Town Crier or Town specific quests to get people familiar with the area/node lore would be nice.
Kissing a Bullywog quest would be great.
In some capacity having:
Archetype guild hubs for quests
Merchant guilds for caravan for quests- this could help people fulfill resource boxes instead of just glint
Artisan guilds for quests/ specific craft rewards & materials
Guild Guilds for guild progression quests
Lore/Node/POI quests- used for low rewards and experience gain
PvP quests for lawless zone etc
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved? Rewards glintwise are fine, but there needs to be an order of magnitude increase in Gear related rewards, and offer gathering materials as well. The current farming for gear system at 25 I hope is just place holder. The fact that crafting severely lags leveling is also part of the issue.
In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system? Offer crafting materials also as a reward.
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
Less than 25%
Why did you choose that percentage? There are nowhere near enough quests to level with quests at a higher %.
What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic? Start banning the exploiters and griefers. The slap on the hand punishment is not enough. It is hard to feel immersed when both are happening.
2
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?
I think we need a little more experience, more gear, or glint. The Gear is seriously lacking considering we can't craft higher level things. The commissions feel like they don't give in the experience department after running around gathering.
In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?
Being able to get basic gear from quests. From there being able to upgrade the gear from an augments system where you craft the augments. Make people more excited to craft the gear we all need with better rewards for crafting.
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
50–74%
Why did you choose that percentage?
for a game to be well rounded for experience the adventuring should be higher with greater reward to keep things moving along quest wise. Economy should be second because we need to craft to get stronger. Events are fun side things to do. Have a high reward but limit the time to do them each week so they can't be farmed.
What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
Main quest lines that give you a history lesson and a goal for end game. Let us learn about the world around us so we care about what happens to it. I can't wait for the lore.
I would give it a 2. If it were bug-free and working as intended, I would give it a 3. Overall, the quests are better than most modern MMOs, but they still lack in certain aspects
Experience and glint rewards are not bad, but I'd like to see other stuff as a reward for quests as well.
Ashes has a long leveling period. Quests/events/story arcs can't be a sustainable way to go through the leveling period (because this would create a scenario where quests and events are generic and many to fill that void, instead of focusing on fewer quests/events with more quality.
The initial levels can be more leaning into quests, you are introducing players to the world, they need more guidance, and the leveling gain is quick, so you can introduce quality quests without requiring excess effort. As levels get longer, having people level mainly through quests/events would make the quality decrease to make up for the quantity of quests required to fill an entire level. Therefore, on higher levels, players should focus on unlimited activities like mob grinding/commissions/professions, and quests/events should be things to break the routine and create an exciting adventure instead of a mindless quest grind (collect x rabbit ears, kill y bears. This is what commissions are for)
So I would say at lower levels, quests could be as much as 80% of your leveling time. After leaving the initial zone and tutorial (around level 5 or 10), this number would decline rapidly, with quests/events being like 20~30% of your leveling time. For these higher levels, 50~60% of your time should be dedicated to mob grinding/professions, depending on your preference. The rest of your time should be filled by other activities like story arcs, caravan runs, social org progression, and everything else that can give experience in the game.
General quest feedback
I've seen over these testing phases, quests getting more markers, clearer indication of what to do and how to do it. I am not opposed to some quests being more handheld. Routine quests, usually used for leveling, with a simple theme and gameplay, with low rewards, more intended for day to day play, can totally be streamlined. No one needs to wander around aimlessly to find a baker or to go kill goblins.
But I don't want to see all the quests becoming like this. We should have a big portion of quests streamlined, and quite a few milestone quests really intricate and complex, and require community collaboration and investigation to solve, and challenging PvE encounters to overcome. These quests that require a lot more effort should have equivalent rewards. Unique items, mounts, buffs, titles, secret locations with different mobs to hunt and gathering materials, lore information that could be useful for other quests. Rewards that really make the effort worth it.
Especially at max level, quests that are incredibly challenging even to the players with soft-cap power can create the feeling that exploring is worth it. Imagine solving a quest that took you 4 months to solve, and a skilled group of players, and in return getting an artifact item.
These types of quests should be completely hands-free on the UI side. No markers, no quest log telling you what to do. But this doesn't mean wander aimlessly and hope to stumble into something with luck. Players need clues, breadcrumbs to follow. And these breadcrumbs come through not only dialogue with NPC quest givers, but with other related citizens in the world, lore information like books and scrolls, riddles, and other visual indications like symbol riddles. We should also be able to go into all quest dialogs at will to reread information we forgot. An encyclopedia recording every location you visited, every NPC you met, and every mob you fought can also help.
These quests can't be straightforward either. A simple puzzle like the bridge in Befallen forge won't cut it. It needs several steps, information available on several different locations (like a random book in a library), multiple combined trigger conditions, some not accessible to the players (like time of day, weather, world state in general. Information that can be maintained solely server side and never communicated with the client). We're talking about quests rewarding stuff like artifacts (unique items) here. It needs to be very intricate, and it can't be stuff that is datamined or spoofed/sniffed.
Some possible tools that can be used for improving quests:
Another thing that can help with the feeling of mystery and reward exploration is teasers. Seeing locations you don't know how to access, items that you don't know how to reach, doors you don't know how to unlock, hearing about "mythical" places and items from NPCs. Stuff that is at your visual reach, but not actually reachable. It could even be stuff that is truly inaccessible to players currently, but that will be accessible in a future expansion (of course, you don't tell the players that, you let them believe that the mystery wasn't solved until then). A game that does this with excellence is Tibia. Some examples of mysteries still unsolved by players (some decades old):
https://tibia.fandom.com/wiki/Mysteries
https://tibia.fandom.com/wiki/Odd_Places
And an example from one of the best quests in the game, when it comes to mystery and exploration being rewarded (you can use YouTube's English subtitles). It's two long videos, but for whoever is responsible for designing things like this in the company, I highly recommend watching it, as I think Tibia has a very unique way of doing things:
https://youtu.be/K_nvKS29-Gs
https://youtube.com/watch?v=-5umVog1vFI&pp=0gcJCX4JAYcqIYzv
And a quest guide in English to help when the subtitles cause some confusion on names and other stuff (but watch the video cause the guide only gives you direct instructions, it doesn't detail how the process of discovering the clues and progressing in the quest, which is the good part):
https://tibia.fandom.com/wiki/Opticording_Sphere_Quest
Other research material about tibia and questing:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNDP6qMlTA4&list=PLjGtUC6KapI1I2pujCIMNX-Q2nXT824wn
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQdpiJpmt_U&list=PLBDKQTokJedNvUvwUHEYhlcW21jisIjHv&index=8
Last but not least, another way to reward exploration is just having stuff like treasure in a very deep place in a dungeon, in a special room with a challenging pve encounter, or a secret room. It doesn't even need to be a quest in a quest log, just a puzzle/challenge with a reward at the end.
To finish, a small QoL feature. Give us an Indication if the quest is a quest that requires a group (like killing 3* mobs) at the start, so if we are alone, we know we won't be able to complete it.
edit: Apparently EverQuest had the same questing system as Tibia? I haven't really played EverQuest, but from this video, I could say that it sounds extremely similar and should be an inspiration for quests:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=otAkP5VjIv8
solid 2
2. How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?
Right now, quest rewards in Alpha Two feel underwhelming compared to other MMO experiences. The rewards (both in terms of gear and XP) often don’t feel worth the time investment, especially when compared to mob grinding. What’s missing is a sense of progression and purpose. Quests should feel meaningful and part of a larger adventure—not just disconnected tasks. They should lead into other quests, reveal more of the world, and encourage organic exploration.
3. In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?
Engaging and fair quest rewards should strike a balance between utility and excitement. In a PvX, economy-driven game, that means:
XP that feels substantial to make questing a viable leveling path.
Materials or currency relevant to local economies to feed into player-driven markets.
Unique or situational gear that makes exploring different areas rewarding.
Quest chains that gradually reveal the world and lore, while connecting players to dynamic systems like node progression or regional conflicts.
4. Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
50–74%
5. Why did you choose that percentage?
Quests should be the backbone of progression, especially early and mid-game. They help guide players, introduce systems, and create natural social interaction. However, in a sandbox like Ashes, other activities—like gathering, PvP, and events—should also contribute meaningfully. A 50–74% range allows for players to pursue quests as a main path without feeling forced, while still leaving room for alternative playstyles and emergent content.
6. What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
I feel most connected to a game world when my actions have visible, lasting impact and when the world feels alive and worth exploring. Ashes of Creation can enhance immersion by:
Encouraging exploration-based questing that naturally leads players into diverse zones.
Tying quests into node development, local politics, and player events, so you feel your choices matter.
Creating quest chains that evolve based on node stages, world events, or even failed attempts.
Ensuring that the world feels reactive, with consequences tied to how players interact with it.
Right now, the world feels like it needs more reasons to explore, more connective tissue between quests, and more rewards that reinforce the game’s unique identity.
Maybe I don't completely understand why grinding is more of a healthy leveling experience for this game than questing is, but I don't know why the game has to rely so heavily on grinding. I think the idea is Ashes doesn't want a player's whole levelling experience to be questing. That grinding/gathering/events puts you more out in the world and participating in the community of the world more than if you were questing. I expect most of us, me included, have more "on rails" levelling than sandbox leveling. Currently grinding is >80% of the levelling experience. A lot of us are used to games where questing is 100% of the levelling experience. I was happy to see that in a recent patch, I could get a decent amount of xp just gathering and processing. Anything different was welcome.
I do not want Ashes to be WoW. I think I understand that grinding will make a better community in the game world. I just think the percentages should be tweaked. I would say, the 33% of leveling should be questing, 33% should be grinding, and 34% should be miscellaneous artisan, events, exploration, node development, commissions. In a theme park the reason that 100% of the game is questing is because that's all the world is. Questing can achieve 2 things, bringing players into the fantasy of the world and bringing players to the lore rich grinding spots. The truth is grinding is so dry at the moment. And truthfully I expect that even at launch, grinding will not be the exciting/fun part of levelling. It will be a necessary evil. Grinding does not make me feel connected to the world. Quest make me enjoy the world. Grinding helps me progress.
Currently, I feel like the questing needs a lot of work. There are obviously lots of bugs. Quest givers indicate they offer quests, but I can't accept them for some reason. Quest that are bugged and don't complete. Its an Alpha, I expect this will get better. But some things for quests have gotten on my nerves.
-I've had a few times where I get started on a quest and complete 2-3 stages of quest to then get a new quest objective for a way higher level target than I can handle at my level. The one I most recently remember is one you get at Nika Brae or to Nika Brae, then you go to a tree outside of Winstead and follow tracks to mob that is level 17. (I was 11) All the fun, and momentum immediately screeched to a halt.
-Another issue I have with quests is the vague goals. Some are direct, but there is some where the dialog doesn't even have a call to action. It says something like, "I found some crates in the water by the docks." What am I supposed to do? The crates did nothing.
-Something else that bothers me is the lack of organization with where quests are given. I'm cool if say there is an NPC out in the middle of nowhere with a quest. But maybe have a NPC in a quest HUB give me a quest or a rumor to locate that NPC. "Travellers have said they hear angry shouting north of the crossroads."
Thats it. Most of us like questing, it vary familiar to the MMO community, and I expect it will do good for Ashes to lean into it, without giving up on the identity you are trying to cultivate. Good Luck!
I was hoping the way they are currently desinged was a placeholder option more than actuall quests.
1. Rewards: quests dont feel rewarding and feel deattached to surrounding world. Thats also why I hope its due current state of testing, but... I expect a lot of improvement in rewarding part: example, i bet there is enough space to fill in quests that for example: granting guaranteed 5 legendary copper. Simple mini quests, with interesting stories, easteregglike
2. Quests currently feel like a side project. And its bad. I feel like you guys kind of sleeping on opportunity to recycle systems that are already core of the game and connect it with quests. Best to explain with another example: adding a quest that at the end grants a player caravan part that will upgrade cargo storage or speed of the caravan. Benefits of these kind of ideas:
-makes quest-loving players take a look of caravan system in the game. Kind of this idea I could notice in early "get a horse" quest, where player discovers processing and gathering.
- makes a caravan enjoyer take a look at a quests in the game
-
Following that idea, how about quest that one of the missions would be bringing Caravan from node A to node B?
3. For future, quests that unlock certain cosmetics/ like outfits, saddles for mounts? Will not write ideas of how to design questline like that, I think team can have certain ideas after reading above. That being said I'm no expert in quest design, just a person who experienced really good captivating quests.
4.
6. Quests connection between each other. I would actually like to see a situation where you can't start or proceed after certain point in a quest if you for example haven't finished 4 out of 10 missions in other quest.
To sum it up, in my opinion current quests feel a bit too generic, and they are not lore wise captivating.
I believe that dialogues, maybe some cinematics and cutscenes in certain spots during quest completion (plxplx) would make people enjoy them more. Also UI needs more player friendly rework.
Ashes has great potential with beautiful locations.
I can imagine a questline with Gemspring and what hides behind spiderwebs for example, complete dungeon, only available for courageous adventurer's that agreed to help find a lost child in nearby village... Potential is great, just spread the wings a bit more, hopefully in later phase 3 or early beta 1 we can see you doing just that
- On a scale of 1–5, how would you rate the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? (1 = Very poor, 5 = Excellent) Rating: 2 Because currently there's hardly an incentive to quest rather than grind in one spot for hours.
- How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?:
- In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?:
- Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
- Why did you choose that percentage?:
- What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?:
I would like to see more ways to be able to enjoy my time while playing. Currently I have my most fun while playing with my guildies. Right now though everyone's taking a break until Phase 3 so I'm mostly soloing and running pug groups. If I could at least have a zone quest or some kind of crafting questline that involved crafting full sets of armor or weapons as the reward. That way new players won't feel like wet noodles when they first get out of the starting zones. Some grind/challenge is good. If you get into the inconvenience level of grind/challenge then you're asking for an unsustainable player base.Some of the quests are kind of cool where they have puzzles and award some kind of armor upgrade early on. However 90% of them just award some meager amounts of exp or glint.(which can be stolen if you die!) They also have a tendency to be quest item mass farming quests. (Looking at you Church of the Seven star's Hymns.) You could improve this by creating zone questlines. Games like WoW, FFXIV, SWTOR, and GW2 did this the best imo.
Regardless of the economy system, you have to keep people's interest and teach them how to navigate each individual zone with some kind of quest direction. And not having every important quest giver have a ? above their head is just lazy. Teach people about the lore of a zone but you may have to handhold them in some way. Give them awards that keep that dopamine going. Giving new players the option to quest solo and have those quests award some kind of "bare minimum" gear that can get them through the leveling paths without being forced to craft or grind at every moment. Other MMOs usually offer essentially a full set of gear that helps them keep up with their peers.
Less than 25%
25–49% I think this game needs this percentage to keep a sustained playerbase.
50–74%
75% or more
I think this is the sweet spot for questing vs grinding difference.
I stated before that zone questlines that keep you moving from the tutorial town outward and having you visit each new POI would massively improve the quality of life for players stuck solo. I have sat for over an hour spamming LFG chat trying to get a group for a grind spot all while standing near the entrance of a POI like Highwaymen Hills. I eventually gave up and logged off. When you're playing as a DPS sometimes you just can't find someone who needs a 9th DPS. And suggesting for me to start a group. I am a Rogue. Clerics and Tanks get grabbed before I can even whisper these guys. I believe the problem is lack of alternative leveling options. I would feel much more immersed if I had a questline from the beginning that takes me to each POI of a zone. At the end of each quest it might lead to into the next zone. Riverlands-->Desert-->Tropics-->etc. All while teaching me about the lore of each grind spot and dungeon.
We just need something besides grinding in one spot for 6 hours. It's hard to have D&D or Pathfinder style multiplayer immersive experiences when we're standing in a small room spamming AOE. Getting trained on by players who want that spot also doesn't feel immersive. We're basically fighting for grind spots. Just shooting ideas. You could have it so those who are stuck soloing could be running questlines inside of instanced dungeon-like spots. If we wanna keep it group oriented it could even be just 2-4man co-op instanced quest dungeons.
Hunting Quests: 4
Character development (or, RP type quests): 1
Honestly, after spending the last couple of weeks going old school with SWTOR and EQ (progression server), more of these type quests should be added to the game. Probably not items though, as it conflicts with crafters, but materials for crafting would be great.
3 for levels 1-7 || 1 for anything beyond that
To be candid, what’s out there now isn’t working—so much so that I was inspired to submit a general application to help design better questing. Ashes of Creation has immense potential: a bold, brilliant world that deserves an in-depth narrative to immerse players and bring each region's unique culture to life.
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?
I was honestly floored when I got the horse and the resource bag—super cool moment. I really liked how the board quests worked too. You just go here, it’s marked on the map, kill XYZ—simple, clean. But the XP? Not even close to worth the travel time.
The coin quests for gear early on felt great. Now that I’m creeping into the 20s, I just wish there was still something like that to chase.
I’m not saying questing should be the fastest way to level. But it should be viable. Right now it feels like a waste. Compared to just grinding mobs in a group for an hour? Questing doesn’t even come close.
I really enjoy the random events—they keep things fresh and feel like they give solid XP rewards.
In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)? Why did you choose that percentage?
25–49% & 50–74%
I think this should really be up to the player. Sometimes I’m in the mood to be super social and love grinding with a group. Other times, after a rough day or a bad group experience, I just want to get lost in the world—explore, maybe stumble into some PvP, and enjoy a story that engrosses me, a gamer's way of relaxing and watching Game of Thrones or Lord of the Rings.
What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
Above all, it is the connection to the inhabitants of the world that draws me most deeply into an MMORPG’s embrace—this human element is, and always will be, my enduring enchantment.
Equally vital are the realms’ sights and sounds: the vivid tapestry of visuals, the haunting melodies that a bard might weave across a bustling city square or a tranquil countryside glade—these breathe life and authenticity into the experience.
Yet, it is the narrative that ultimately binds the soul of the world to its players. Conflict must be crafted with care, offering the choice to walk the path of hero or villain. How do the customs and cultures of Sujoma stand in stark contrast to those of the Riverlands? Without a living story to root my character’s journey, the world feels hollow—no matter how breathtaking its vistas. This truth explains why I may depart a game as visually magnificent as Throne and Liberty, yet remain ever drawn back to the enduring saga of SWTOR, Classic WoW, and FF.
Other opinions...
I want to touch back on the concept of War Tokens and suggest that each region feature a centralized conflict between two or more factions. I’m a big fan of the PvX dynamic. Imagine more random events with level restrictions that pit these factions against each other, where players choose a side to support. This would group players into raid-style teams aligned by faction. XP would be awarded based on kills, encouraging active competition between opposing sides. Additionally, War Tokens could be earned by completing strategic objectives such as defeating powerful bosses, capturing flags, or securing fortifications. This approach would foster meaningful PvP engagement while blending seamlessly with PvE elements.
Thanks for reading and asking the quest-ions!
Engaging: I believe the quests are engaging enough as they are; only the rewards side of the quest isn't rewarding enough for the effort you put in as you invest lots of time for both travel and the quest itself as some quests require you to wait for an npc and sometimes to continue a quest you need to level a few more levels without you even having an indicator that shows if an npc has another quest available in a couple levels. Quest unique equipment could be a good incentive for players to opt for quests and would also cause players to get the idea that they should try out more quests to garner more rewards that they cannot get from simply farming a few monsters
Leveling Experience: I feel like the leveling experience should be about 50-74% as you get exp from both the quest itself and the monsters you hunt/treasure you find
Connected and Immersed: seeing more players around and getting an achievement for quests or a title that shows you are a completionist/cleared a difficult quest that many others fail to even discover.
Use it as an aid to balancing progression. Every bit will help.
Current rewards are insane. The insanity mostly comes from the token stuff, because it literally gives you all the items you need to get to lvl25. That is wack beyond belief. Imo the MOST that quests should give is recipes and specialized crafting materials for items. And ideally, those quests should take you to a mob that drops the materials that are required in the reward recipe.
As for leveling, imo it should be around 30%, but I think there should be a system where any xp that you get from quests that would take the xp gain number above that 30% - the xp should be stored and then applied at the next lvl. So people can quest at all times, but they'll get a delayed xp reward for it, because they gotta participate in the open world mob hunting and in artisanry too.
And if you manage to include those 2 other activities into the quest requirements, while the quests themselves appeal to the quest lovers (not me) - that'd be amazing.
EDIT: You could also steal Genshin's mechanic of "any additional xp at max lvl is transfered into money". Sure, we'll have xp debt from deaths, but we'll still be getting xp from other sources while we have 0 debt, and it's not like we'll have extra storage of xp that would then go against any incoming debt, so I think getting node currency, from the node whose ZOI you got your xp in, would be a great way to push people to interact with nodes more and it would also make xp gain at max lvl valuable.
Obviously there'd need to be a proper ratio of xp per ndoe currency here, but that's a classic "subject to testing" situation.
Overall, 1. The early quests to get your mount and some starter gear are good, but most of the quests after that point are a whole lot of work for really miniscule rewards. The most egregious example is the surplus equipment coins quest line, where not only do you have to have a super weird amount of knowledge to ensure you don't lock yourself out of the later quest lines (finishing Rebel Rousers locks me out of the questline starting at the 2nd Sword Outpost? Why? And how would I know that was going to happen?), which is hours of effort for a set of basic, starter gear.
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?
Lots of points here:
1) Where to get quests needs to be obvious. It should also be far more obvious if an item I've picked up gives a quest if I click on it, as opposed to being just a thing to turn in. Again, an egregious example is the surplus coins quest line - as a new player, sans 3rd party guides, how would I know to ever go find Martin Swift? Am I just supposed to aimlessly wander around and happen upon him? And how would I know that turning in the Rebel Rousers quest in Samia's Hope would lock me out of the quest line that starts at 2nd Sword Outpost? Locking myself out of a ton of surplus coins and thus harming my ability to get quest rewards for doing what a quest tells me to do, with zero warning, is really bad. In short - do not make completing one quest line lock out another quest line otherwise people will lose rewards and engage with questing less.
2) Quests need to give WAY more experience on turn-in. The world you're building is ENORMOUS. It takes a very long time to run from place to place, and often through areas with monsters significantly higher level than you. If you want questing to be a legitimate activity people want to engage in, they need to give WAY more xp (even 10x wouldn't be enough, it probably needs to be closer to 25-50x) to compete with just mindless farming.
3) Glint, as a quest reward, is not only boring, it also is hugely problematic because if I accidentally die to one of those very high level mobs that's on the route from the place where I get the quest, to the place where I actually need to do the thing to complete the quest, and back again, I can potentially permanently lose some, which cuts into the reward. Just give copper/silver/gold for quests early on, or better yet, give the gear we're going to buy with it early on directly. Glint for commissions is fine because you can wait until you're in a safe spot to turn them in, glint for questing feels like crap.
4) NPCs that give quests are often standing in completely random places instead of there being an actual quest hub. I get wanting to make us explore, but there needs to be a reason someone is encouraged go to to a location besides just "ooh look over there, I think I'll walk there and see if there's anything there". Quests are inherently a game-guided activity, so it makes little sense to put the barrier of distance and obscure location in the way when the game is going to be solved via 3rd party guides anyway. All it does is discourage questing and encourage more repetitive grinding due to the massive downtime associated with travel distances.
5) The one thing that's working well with questing is the repeatable quests like the one where you pick up pieces of goblin trash and turn them in, and you can do it over and over. It works for a lot of reasons - the quest-giver is adjacent to where the quest targets are, the quest-giver is on a main road, a very natural place to find a quest, and the quest rewards, while not amazing, are decent relative to the time spent completing it.
In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?
Three big things on this:
1) For quests under maximum level, the experience needs to be attractive relative to the expected duration to complete the quest, including travel time. Compare the expected duration of the quest to the amount of xp someone could get in a typical group grinding for that same amount of time. People will gravitate toward whichever is better, within a range. Even if questing is only 85-90% as efficient as grinding, people will still do it a lot because getting into groups isn't always convenient.
2) Choice - every quest should offer a choice between at least two of the following: piece of level-appropriate gear (not necessarily an upgrade, but something maybe you could feed to an alt or a friend or even just to put on the market for someone to make an over-geared alt), materials, or currency.
3) The quest should have some sort of non-personal reward as well - this could be something like node XP, guild XP, or progress toward some sort of other collective goal. Look at EVE Online's projects system or daily goals system for ideas on how to implement this effectively in a PvX sandbox game.
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
Less than 25%
25–49%
50–74%
75% or more
Why did you choose that percentage?
I feel like this question is a bit loaded due to the word "should". My opinion is that people ought to have an actual choice between several attractive options. Right now, there's not really a choice to level via questing because the questing is so unrewarding, so more or less everyone is forced into grinding as the only viable option. Events aren't predictable enough and are often bugged, so they're not attractive. Artisan professions give a miniscule amount of xp per time period, but can give a good chunk of xp that you gain passively while the job runs as a "bonus". If you want there to actually be viable alternative options to leveling, you have to look at the xp gain rate per time period of the best option, and make all of the options fall within a certain amount of that, adjusting rewards for the level of risk. For example, you might say "this quest is worth 50,000xp, but here's a 4x bonus if you do the whole thing while flagged for pvp" or something.
So it's tough to say because the question presumes that the options are equally accessible, when they're not. I'd lean toward like 50%, but a lot of stuff would need to change for that to even be possible because the downtime associated with running places to turn in quests really hurts the xp-per-time metric.
What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
Immersion comes from the absence of things that break immersion. Look at Guild Wars 2's heart system, as an example. You show up to an area, engage in a variety of generally helpful things to the local NPCs (pick some flowers, kill some monsters, mine some rocks, catch some squirrels, do this jumping puzzle, go scout that undiscovered area on the map), and are rewarded. Rinse and repeat. Also, there's no mob tagging so it's very much a "look, we're all helping!" thing. Further, world events that "count double", meaning the world event has a reward and also doing the world event makes progress toward completing the local meta-objective. In short, keep me in a flow state of "doing stuff", and make the stuff to do intuitive, and I'll be immersed. Have me constantly looking at my 2nd monitor to make sure I don't accidentally turn in a quest that will completely unintuitively lock me out of another quest chain later on? Immersion broken.
Don’t feel limited to the thought-starters above. Feel free to drop whatever feedback you have regarding your experiences with quests below 👇
Right now, the vast majority of time in-game is spent either running from one place to another, or killing monsters. If you want questing to be engaging, the xp rewards need to go up dramatically. Commissions need seriously a 25-50x numerical increase to the xp rewards, and probably a 10x minimum increase on the non-xp rewards. This is literally just a numerical adjustment that could be done at any time, and I'm not sure why it hasn't been done up to this point, as I guarantee that almost no one is doing anything with commission boards after they leave Lionshold. Quests need to be obtained from quest hubs, points of interest or other obvious places, not tucked away at some random NPC that you'd have no idea was even there without a 3rd party guide (Martin Swift is a great example of this). Quests should be tuned for the level at which you obtain them, as should their rewards.
Remember, players are concerned about reward per unit time, not just reward-per-instance-of-a-thing, and doing activities in groups makes them go faster. Going faster is its own reward.
I believe questing should be a large portion of the leveling experience. Having a good story line that fills in the world around you is what makes the game come to life. Id give 75% to 80% questing is the right direction. Grinding is not fun. You sit in one place for hours and hours. Hope for drops, Hope for groups. It would be nice to do quests, and do quests with groups. 3 star mob kills/bosses for the quests etc etc. The game has a lot to offer with story, but as of now we have no quests that delve us into anything. Chase a curse, chase a church. There is no connection to world around us.
-The rewards are okay as they currently stand. I'd give them a 2.5 I suppose. However, it is hard to really place what rewards we should be getting when quests do not have level ranges that are easily recognizable. You can kind of tell how difficult it is based on the zone that it's in, though, some quests start out as very easy but get progressively more difficult as it goes on, making me feel like I'm able to complete it at first and then ultimately deciding that I must be higher level to finish the quest. The completionist in me does not like this. I do feel the rewards should never be greater than a piece of crafted gear for the same level or else this undermines the crafter.
- I would increase XP gains, currency gains and, reduce items to rare things that help crafting, leaving core gear earned to be crafted or found in drops. Perhaps cosmetic loot that changes your appearance or allows you to transmog gear.
- In my opinion, what makes questing engaging and rewarding is having a mixture of quests you can do on your own, quests where you need other people to help (this allows you and your friends to team up or allows you to meet new people and make new friends), or have the quests completely force players to go head to head for the same resource in a pvp style loot grab (this should be the rarest of the quests).
- 33% should be from questing imo. Quests are a pillar of the mmorpg experience and add to the game's world building and narrative structure. Grinding using repeatable node quests should be another 33% and it should help nodes grow significantly as the node system is another pillar in this game. Finally events and gathering/processing/crafting should be the remaining 33%. Events being 16.5%, they're fun non-competitive community events. Gathering/Processing/Crafting should be the other 16.5% as the reward for these systems should be less about the experience and more about the benefits of supplying your allies and yourself with gear, as well as the economic gains to be made by the most dedicated of crafters.
- Verisimilitude is the key to a great quest. I've got over 20 years' experience as a game master for ttrpgs and even more as a gamer and the most memorable quests for me always had this key aspect. I put myself in my character's shoes and walk their path, through perils, loss, glory, and reward. To make these quests more dynamic, I'd like to mention a quest that my friends revel about even to this day. We experienced challenge, joy, and felt like our time was rewarded when we went datacron hunting in Star Wars: the old republic, the mmorpg. Hunting down these datacrons had you doing fun little jump puzzles, brain teasers, and all of them forced you to focus on exploration, at least during the hunt. Each one of the datacrons gave you a permanent stat increase to only one attribute. Then when you've gathered each of the single datacrons, your friends were required to chase down the final datacron, one that offered a permanent plus 10 to all stats. You could not do this alone. You had to do a hazardous jump puzzle and have people pull switches along the way to open doors to the next levels. Then you'd have to daisy chain the first player up a level while the person who just got the +10 to all datacron, jumped down to take the starting position. We had a group of 10 people with us when we attempted this and the elation we all felt when the 10th member grabbed their buff was unforgettable.
I have crafted quests for decades, but I am no professional. I'm just speaking from my own personal experience when offer these ideas or suggestions. In my humble opinion, you have a excellent foundation for Ashes, adding these ideas to enhance the game all fit within the four pillars of the game you originally mentioned in your kickstarter 8 years ago. The Node System, meaningful pvp engagement, the economy, and just as important, the narrative. The key to the narrative is verisimilitude. Hope this feedback helps.
^_^
-AJ
I would rate the current quest rewards at around 1-2, but the changes to get gear from them is a step in the right direction. I think improving on xp rewards in addition to providing more gearing choices, would be a good direction to take it.
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?
I think the current quest rewards lack xp for the effort involved. While the new quests recently added give a tokens to exchange for gear, the xp rewards do not match the effort.
In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?
I think providing common/uncommon and in the more time consuming questlines even Rare, would be a good starting point with comparable xp rewards. Doing this and then taking into consideration the gear tempering system and eventually the ability to upgrade gear passed their base quality tier would be achieve a good balance between quest rewards feeling impactful while also still taking into account the PvE economy-driven system and even the crafting side of that economy as well.
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
IMO, I think 50-74% would be good enough balance, balance if the quests a varied in both depths and quality and even difficulty.
Why did you choose that percentage?
I picked this percentage b/c questing is an avenue for lvling that can encompass not only those that play solo, but also in groups depending on the difficulty of the quest. Whether it's a very difficult quest b/c of the steps required to do it or b/c of puzzles/hidden secrets that come with them that lead to the players sharing that knowledge with one another. They are activities that can be done by all types of players. Narrative driven quests with multiple conclusions that are only possible based on choice you made along the way, that give unique rewards or even cosmetic ones based on choices made.
What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
I think having each area/POI and even as far as ZOI with their intricate storylines would make the world feel immersive.
What kinds of quests I hope to see?
I hope take some inspirations from Runescape when it comes to our questing. I would like to see each POI have their own interesting story that is separate from the overarching story that tells you a bit more about that area and it's lore. Allowing for short but quality stories to be told. Like Daragal Estates or the Cursed Archives storyline (unfortunately that story arc was bugged and could not get my whistle). These are the stories I look forward to do and spend time doing them. As long as we get comparable rewards to the effort, I wouldn't mind spending my time doing them.
On a scale of 1–5, how would you rate the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? (1 = Very poor, 5 = Excellent)
1. Very Poor.
Quests do not offer any significant reward incentive over commissions, in terms of either experience or reward. Especially confusing as quests are not repeatable and sometimes require a greater time investment (sometimes just in troubleshooting), while commissions are repeatable, easy, and quick. Rewards need to be beefed up to become worth the time investment as so they are not skipped in favor just commission grinding.
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?
As previously mentioned, they are minimal. Calling them placeholder would feel accurate. The only things offered are glint and experience. Some variety would go a long ways. This would be an excellent place to offer choices in gear flavored to the quest, especially around starter areas.
In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?
Glint is still a safe, if boring option, gear as mentioned previously, but I'd also like to suggest artisan materials. While there's no shortage of common quality materials, a small bundle of guaranteed higher rarity random materials could also be a worthy reward in a game that has a greater focus on player-driven economy. Artisan quests could also offer experience in their particular artisan classes, perhaps even recipes using resources found in those regions.
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
- Less than 25%
- 25–49%
- 50–74%
- 75% or more
Why did you choose that percentage?Personally, I like 50-74%.
I'm a mostly casual solo player. I like having a structured experience to introduce me to areas. I like it when an area's quests flow in a way that shows me where I can find level appropriate enemies to fight and gives me a reason to fight them, and allows me to scout resources and riskier areas (such as dungeons) from a distance. This way once the quests are done, I know where to go to for future grinds instead of having to rely on 3rd party tools and guides on where I should be going.
What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
Immersion.
Well-written and voiced NPCs. Characters who have history, struggles, and ambitions within it. Players need to be able to spend time with characters, see them do things, go on the quests with them, not just report back to them. A quest giver who stands in one place on the map and tells me to go slay 15 goblins is easily forgettable. But a character who asks me to come along with them to scream at and kill goblins because the goblins burned down his village is a character and a quest I'll remember.
Dynamic.
Forces of nature that can be consistently seen having an affect on the environment or forces players to be constantly wary of (think of the roaming Fel Reaver in WoW's Hellfire Peninsula). Overarching narratives for each area gives helps differentiate them. Verra has areas with creeping corruption. Perhaps there is a monster or villain flying around actively spreading corruption? While I'm out exploring, gathering resources, or otherwise grinding, it adds to the experience if I some lunatic riding a wyvern starting indiscriminately slinging patches of fire onto the ground for me to avoid. If part of the questline for a region to trying to confront and stop them, I'm going to be interested in doing so as I the player have a stake in it.
The world of Verra is quite pretty, but it feels empty. It needs characters to give it character. Not every NPC is going to be interesting. But at least a few of them should be memorable enough for players to want to make fanart and memes for.
Other thoughts.
There are very few quests at the moment. Quite a few of which do not even work.
Sorry for the Wall O' Text.
Cheers,
KormVA
Thank you for your hard work and the opportunity to have such discussion !
I got a bit carried away.
Rereading my message I noticed the number of line for "what could be improved" is huge in comparison to the rest of the message.
So let me precise:
I love the game in current state, I love Alpha two and regret to not have enough time to explore it as much as I wish.
I hope my message conveys it accordingly.
Reading other's message before posting, I removed the sections with topics I already saw on too many post:
e.g. "People queuing for mob respawn vs instance" <- immersion breaking in both cases
On a scale of 1–5, how would you rate the current quest rewards in Alpha Two?
-> 2 (reasons described below in the working well / could be improved sections)
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two?
-> The xp per quest is a bit lacking comparing to other activities
-> The amount of currency seems balanced and follow natural pace of the player progression through leveling (you can repair, travel, continue your adventure)
-> The number of item we got is rare
-> The progression in the world, understanding, access to facilities, systems, explanation, lore is the real reward
What’s working well, and what could be improved?
Working well
-> Questing at early stage is meaningful, you feel you need it
A. It guide you, you know "where to go", in case you cannot decide by yourself or feel unease exploring too early
B. It introduces you to the world systemsn, the basics of the basics without "locking" you to it
C. It sketches by the interaction with the NPCs the lore, the principle of the world and some of it's intrigue
Could be improved
A. Lack of quests for specific level (low level) :
There is some "big gaps" between levels where a player who would try to level mostly via questing be out of quests and will be confused or frustrated from the lack of quests of his level.
Without guidance for "what other activity for your level is beneficial" he might not engage naturally in the other activities by himself.
Increasing the number of quests in each area, especially side quests for reputation, more in depth lore, increase slowly xp/currency in low risk activities in low level zone might improve new joiner overall experience as bringing more diversity/path to chose for the early progression.
B. Tell people what is possible at their level :
"I am forced to do x to progress that sucks (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)" might be a reaction from some players.
Players used to other games or simply playing their first mmorpg with pre-made ideas of what to expect from other genres might have this reaction.
The incentive to develop nodes & economy early on by other activity than questing is not widespread in the gaming culture.
It might deserve specific explanation, contextualisation using among other means quest, dialogue, music/ambiance change or pnj overheard discussion.
Quests that explains these others activities like the ones present in Alpha Two for the gathering and processing system with their pros and cons is a good excuse to extend further the narration and drop additional lore information on top of letting know the player the options at his disposal.
C. This is more than "a Quest" :
Giving some hint on the synergy between some other activities and quests might educate the player on the possibilities Verra offers him.
Even the already explained system might have a bit more of a verbose approach.
The commissions lacks clear visibility as per it's time & difficulty / xp ratio as you will complete them without realizing it peforming other tasks/quests/etc.
D. Hint and hook, entice and fascinate, reward according to the risk taken :
Increasing a bit the rewards in the risky zone for your level area for low levels might be a good incentive to low level to "not follow the main road and standard path as it always ends up an xp negative experience, full loss, time and energy wise"
e.g. :
Loot on random mobs provide an item, that gives new quests, before looting it the player does not know it
The same goes for treasure hunts, hiddent location & events, etc.
Killing a bit more goblins or taking additional risk exploring might sounds boring when you do not know that.
You might prefer to go the next quest asap to "maximise xp gains"
But if one of the pnj tells you that one of the goblin is a freak and has a weird book of fun drawings but the other goblins stole it from him ;
You might caught the player attention and he might engage in few more just "to be sure"
If rewards are rare make them menaingful
E. Overall story telling and voice acting ; lore ; NPC dialogue design should fit the world of Verra and enhance it (not the case yet):
Knowing that this is an Alpha, there is obviously only a tiny fragment of what the game has to offer here.
However, this is what makes the soul of a game, people will even 20 years after recognize a soundtrack, remember a character voice, using one of there iconic line, etc.
There is a huge necessity to early on, sprinkle a bit or charisma on this game receipe to engage and immerse.
So far in this Alpha Two, music and landscape, with the changing of weather, light and music change contributing to a living ambiance is a full win.
The sense of danger in the zone with high level mobs, powerful event, and pvp enjoyer was awesome.
Nethertheless, I could not found a single dialogue, character name or character that kept me gigling or impressed me to the point I could remember it.
When speaking to one NPC already in dialogue with another NPC or two, the conversation might simply involve them into it.
At the moment you need to clic to each of them, and if you missclic triggering another dialogue accidentally, they happend to continue speaking alltogether as the previous NPC does not stop nor react to the other event.
This sounds a bit unnatural and might break the immersion.
This is probably not the point of an Alpha Two but this bias might make us underappreciate the current level of design of the quest.
In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?
-> Quest rewards must bring something, be useful, meaningful
If you give a potion, that's before the user can craft it
If you give some stuff, it's because the player has none at this stage of progression and need it to continue
Bind item names to the Lore, to characters, places, lineage, etc.
-> Multiple choice makes things spicier ; each resulting in a different reward, making them virtually rarer
If you give player option in dialogue, attune the reward accordingly (even flavor text has its effect)
-> Rewards second life
Even when not to be used anymore, because better option is available, a reward can have other use
Recycling, combining older elements, or new stage of evolution to catch up current better item is a way to go to keep people engaged and attached to it
Quality of life storage and browsing for stored rewards contribute for people to keep/reuse them instead of selling them right away and buying new ones afterwards when needed
-> Quest reward can have multiple shape/aspect
Prerequisite to something else, a key, an access to a dungeon
Reputation to a NPC, faction, specific Nodes offering other type of things to buy
Additional lore, cosmetic, intel to new dongeon location or tips
The only thing that really matter with fair quest rewards might be that the two axis of "difficulty" and "time spent" to complete it might result in a proportional reward.
To an epic questline being completed, an equivalent epic rewards must be granted.
But it does not have to be a stuff part, a weapon or a mount each time, it can be a rare crafting material, time gated collectible, that requires a collective effort and participation to reveal its true colors.
To understand the usage and complete the unknown receipe you received this might be only the piece of a puzzle. Sometime it is just the intel how to use a previous mysterious reward.
Sometimes the best reward for a quest completion is just the next quest being unlocked ; when plot is revealed and things unfold under your eyes it can be compelling and satifying enough : now you know the truth!
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
25–49%
Why did you choose that percentage?
First of all, currently I do have the feeling this is below 25%.
And every competitive player would skip the quests and engage in group organized activities to be more efficient.
This is not my case
The game core principles revolves around a synergy between all activities.
Your contribution to the discoveries, the nodes growth, the community of player (with the subgroup you would belong in) are valuable assets to the game.
I think there might be a bit of incentive to the player to not play Ashes Of Creation solely as a single player game.
If you can always avoid challenging events, dangerous zones, elite mobs, dreadful dungeon and still progress as fast or even faster than the people striving for the community, it is not healthy.
You'd like to reward more those who takes risk and invest in caravans, spend time gathering and crafting, contribute to Nodes progression.
Still, you want the players to be able to play the game the way they want without too much impediment but also not spoiling the other's experience.
So if up to 49% of the experience they can acquire with the natural progression of the game can come from only quest without slowing them down it gives them enough freedom to do so.
Passed the 49%, this is still viable for them to rince and repeat quests, but this is a bit less efficient, to a point they would have a significant incentive participating in group activities, joining guilds, etc.
On the other hand, giving less than the 25-49% experience coming from questing might result in a negative outcome.
Some people are already not doing the quest because they found it not appealing enough.
The very competitive nature of the game and the advantage it gaves to the one who progress first makes Quests obsoletes if they lack behind in efficiency/rewards/etc.
Furthermore, in case some node specific situation or server practices or population circonstances create a very challenging environment for x,y,z reason, the option of questing should remain viable to get experience.
Let's say, you start the game late or war is everywhere on your server or monopolistic situation have crystalized forces to a point the entry bareer is awefully huge for other activities...
You would be more than happy to be able to continue questing with a litle boost advantage on the already overleveled, overpowered and rich other player.
You would like to have an alternative option to give you time and opportunity to understand how the worlds works, make connections, join other existing groups or form one yourself.
And this is only possible if as a new player or someone coming after you do have value, or potential value.
You need to be able to reduce at least part of the gap that separate you from veteran player, by being a valuable assets joining a guild or participating in event.
Before you are ready to do all that you need to play the game, learn the game and questing seems quite about right in these situations ; so you need to have a decent xp from doing it.
The percentage itself matter less than the coherence/relationship between the quests and the other activities.
You can give "less xp from quest" under certain conditions, but you can also give perks or reward synergies for diverse activities.
Sometimes some quests might boost of facilitate some other activities.
Sometimes some other activities will unlock new quests or grant a buff helping to the completion of a particularly dangerous quest.
Advancing your Node and getting some reputation or higher rank in your profession, or escorting caravans, you might simply unlock more quests and have more options.
You might also simply improve the quantity, quality or rarity of a reward.
And it can vary depending on the condition or threat that currently apply on the node (or major event in progress), such as it remains dynamic and contribute to the immersion.
But this have to be either told explicitely or sufficiently hinted to the player such as he could navigate the game in full knowledge of the facts and with an informed opinion.
What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
Aesthetic:
Consistency is key.
A consistent world is mandatory for immersion.
Voices, graphic, music and pace have to match.
Light/dark balance, general tone of the dialogues, ...
If something is too out of scale or too out of place it will show in a negative way.
Lore:
Exposure is key.
Culture, history and indigenous habits and customs needs to be everywhere.
Shown, told, explained, experienced in all the ways possible.
Wall of texts are great, especially when they are optional and easily available in books.
Or desguise in Bard songs or in Necromancer spells.
Even better if you happen to unexpectedly participate to a local festival to learn they wear this or eat that to that occasion.
It is a very easy way to have a world feel dynamic when the banners, the flags, the color of the city or the guard outfit changes under circonstancies.
Or if the mobs that are vulnerable to certain things or on the contrary feeds on others get bigger, weaker/stronger, more/less colorful..
Or if those events in the world affect temporary drop rates or quality chances for craft when that certain god gives his blessing
(even for a very small amount but when a proc occur the music switches with the theme of that god)
This are the small touches spread evenly everywhere in a way you will not notice them ; not because they are part of the world that naturally merge with it...
But because they are what make this world what it is.
Quality of the writing:
Coherence is key.
If some people value x or y thing, let it shown in their dialogue.
If they hate dward and you are a dwarf, let then ask 2 additional questions before entrusting you that quest.
If a threat is upon a village, let people be in fear for a while.
Then when you get more intel on the threat, let them panic, maybe temporary close their shop by night.
Even raise the price of their good because they fear to lack.
Or if on the contrary situation is more undercontrol, let them contribute because they are less ont their guard.
It's not likely everyone in the village will give you a hand but this is totally impossible that when everyone's life is at stakes none of them give you significant intel or help.
And when the issue is solved and quest finished, adapt the text such as they do not consider you still a complete stranger.
Let it simply resonnate with the Reactive world you are trying to establish in that game, this is brilliant and promising.
Voice acting :
Credibility is key.
You want to have the player immerse ?
Let him have goosebumps because he feels the passion, the rage or the fear in the voice actor delivery.
You want your world to be dynamic ?
Let them host complex characters that are not "LiongateBoy3" but people with a connection with the world, that you will not only encounter once.
Of course that appplies to a limited set of main NPCs.
The character you knew with a specific mood and tension in the state you encountered him first, has changed because of the things his went through and the circonstance he is now in.
Let the player hear that.
Why this playful character who was hitting on you when you met him first seems so gloomy? Oh.. he is griefing today.
But a bit of time has passed and he opens a little bit, you hear his story.
Happens you can tell him who killed his parents. (Yay, a new quest !)
Now you have a fierceful voice, claming revenge, but quickly realizing he is no match to his ennemy now begging for your help.
Finally then you help him to discover his parents were the evil guys, the NPC renonce to his vengeance and uses his own blood to help you dispell the curse that plagues the kingdom.
With a mix of bitterness and gratitude in his voice and the sacrifice he made to save the realm, you'd have almost aready forgotten that NPC was once only a flirty brat the first time you met.
This is the kind of credibility that builds up and rely on the other elements of aesthetic, lore and story telling that voice acting can either magnify or screw up the immersion.
The Dynamic aspect of it requires to incorporate characters progression and corresponding act into the narration, the way the scene is set and the other NPC react and describes him.
NPC population :
Diversity is key.
I guess this one is self explanatory but let's make it both immersive and dynamic.
The achemist of this small town is more likely to be in his shop everyday, that's his job.
And well we need that NPC here.
But the people in the street or his other NPC customer needs to change every now and then, people needs to cross the street, some by foot some with horse-drawn carriage, etc.
And there is that quest, where the alchemist is asked by the Mayor of the nearby town to deliver a decoction against the curse.
That day his son needs to replace him at the shop, else you'll see him in 2 places, and that kinda break the immersion.
We might not want to see the NPC change clothes everyday, but if there is a huge incentive to seasonal change in the world, might have also a summer and winter outfit for some key characters.
There is a lot of people from different race, size, color, wealth in that area ?
Be sure to represent them according to the lore.
This city in the Desert loves trades more than everything and welcome merchants from all over Verra ?
Better seeing all races represented there to not break immersion.
That biome on the other side of the map, where the elves leave has a cataclysmic event?
The elven population in that merchant city might temporarly shrink because they went back to check on their families.
Or went to fight the menace of that dragon that way sleeping in the forest and made it burn as he woke up.
I apologise for the long message.
I hope it'd contribute to that lovely discussion.
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?
I have honestly not really done many quests, they feel weak compared to just grinding. I think Quests should be similar to RuneScape, they should tell a story, maybe unlock certain areas or systems organically or unique quest items that can be used later. There should also be fun puzzles that incorporate other systems in the game, or be genuinely difficult to complete.
In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?
Unique quest rewards, achievements, access to new areas or systems, it doesn't necessarily have to be gold or EXP always, although certain quests could give a lot more similar to the importance of the Waterfall Quest in RuneScape for newer accounts to get a jumpstart, maybe specific quests give big rewards a new character would feel is beneficial, while some exist to advance storylines or access new areas, items, or skills, or advance your character. For example, some questline with a Militia could give you a starter set of armor for your class that is really good for new players, and another questline a weapon? Etc.
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
I don't like the framing of this, Quests are their own system and should be treated like it is, not a vehicle to progress you somewhere or level you, leveling is an archaic system and/or only useful for quickly telling someones power level. If Quests are treated like this instead of as their own gameplay feature, they're going to suck. NOBODY likes quests purely as a vehicle for 'leveling'
* On a scale of 1-5, how would you rate the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? I would rate the current quest rewards in Alpha Two as a 1.5 out of 5.
* How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What's working well, and what could be improved?
* What's working well: The current coin system is a positive aspect.
* What could be improved: The coin system needs significant expansion and integration into other activities.
* In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvP system?
From my perspective, engaging and fair quest rewards should incentivize diverse gameplay and offer cosmetic progression.
* Dungeon-based Quests: Implement quest givers within each dungeon that offer coin rewards. Additionally, grant one coin for each boss kill. This would strongly incentivize players to actively seek out and defeat dungeon bosses, not necessarily for stat-based gear, but for desirable cosmetic skins. Currently, there's little motivation to engage with bosses.
* Crafting Quests: Introduce specific quests tied to crafting progression. For example, upon reaching Novice, Intermediate, or Master tiers in an artisan profession, a quest could award a unique cosmetic item (e.g., a shirt, an axe skin) to visually represent a player's dedication and hard work in leveling their artisan skills.
* Caravan Quests: Incorporate quests specifically centered around caravans.
* Meta-Dungeon Quests: Introduce a high-level quest that rewards a unique weapon or mount skin upon defeating all bosses across all dungeons. This would provide a compelling long-term goal for players.
* Combat Achievements: Implement an achievement system that rewards players for combat milestones, such as healing 100,000 damage, blocking 100,000 damage, or dealing a certain amount of damage. These achievements could provide small experience gains or cosmetic "glints" (visual effects or unique titles) to celebrate player contributions in combat roles. This system could be expanded with numerous achievement tiers to provide ongoing recognition.
* Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)? I believe approximately 25 of the leveling experience should come from questing.
* Why did you choose that percentage? This percentage allows for a significant portion of progression through quests, while still leaving ample room and necessity for engagement in other core activities like grinding, gathering, and events, fostering a balanced gameplay experience. Id like to see gathering gice more exp as well.
* What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
* Rewarding Exploration and Achievement: Quests that acknowledge and reward players for engaging with challenging content, such as defeating all dungeon bosses, would foster a deeper connection and a sense of achievement.
* Visible Progression: Cosmetic rewards tied to crafting and other activities allow players to visually express their accomplishments, enhancing immersion.
* Recognition for Gameplay Contribution: An achievement system, particularly for combat roles, would make players feel recognized for their ongoing contributions and skill in various aspects of the game, increasing engagement and a sense of belonging within the world.
2? Some quests give very good rewards, such as the mount from sweat of your brow, or the parcel quest giving green gear, however the majority seem to give way too little glint for the amount of time spent there.
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?
I normally assume the quest rewards aren't worth my time because of the amount of quests I've done that didn't give me anything more than I could get out of a commission or two made me think that way. I was interested what Grubfuddle would offer me, because it felt like completing a quest unlocked a new store or something for me?, but it seems what rewards he offers isn't implemented yet. I thought it was interesting to have a quest that might unlock new NPCs to speak and trade with.
In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?
They could give you profession-specific rewards. Since crafting is so interlinked to each other, no one's going to be able to gather all of their stuff. Maybe they give out some gatherables (as long as its a one-time quest/reward) So people have the option to make some recipes on the cheaper end. Or they can sell the gatherables for money. Or unlock new NPCs that either sell, trade, do events, or even open up new quests, which is more rewards. Like maybe you complete a questline that opens up some scavenger NPC who sells you unfinished treasure maps (You'd still have to have a scribe unlock the map.) Or maybe you complete a quest and get a crafting recipe?
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
25–49% --Something like 30-40%
Why did you choose that percentage?
I think like 20% of it should come from crafting. Which leaves only 80% left for solo or group play. While I really enjoy group play (PvE or PvP), I think it's nice to have some meaningful breaks from group play here and there. Especially if you get a bad group/bad experience and just want to play alone for a bit. I think that should be viable and still be able to progress your character during that time. Delve into the world a bit, get some lore! Don't just mash rocks.
What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
Having ways to personalize and specialize my character. Surprisingly not super related to questing at all (heck, maybe some quests should give you costumes as rewards! lol I know I'd chase them then) But yeah, it's not normally the questing that makes me super immersed. Things on the docket that aren't implemented yet would make me feel more involved, like the character creator as it was previewed in the past (so we had full customization) or player housing. I think big events that cause the community to come together and fight it off together are things that make me feel the most immersed. The Node War was a good example, but if there were some PvE events that threatened a node too so lower level characters could get involved; that'd be wicked awesome! Speaking of, I wonder why there's never an "Event" notice at a Node? It seems like a perfect place to get people to start playing together.
Quests Unlocking NPCs: Example
In the realm of ideas that completing some quests opens up NPCs for other options; here's a fun anecdote from my DND campaign. In our campaign there was a now infamous shopkeep named Blinksy. Blinksy ran a children's toystore whose chain of shops could be found in any city we visited. Strangely, if you went into the shop it was always the round, jovial Blinksy himself running the counter no matter what city you were in.
Our group took a boat and got involved in a heavy sea-battle at one point. When we boarded the other ship we found printed on the cannons; "Is no fun, Is no Blinksy" which was printed on all of his toystores. We returned to the town to question him about his slogan being found on the cannons. To which the toyseller responded, "I see, I see. Are you perhaps customers for the most dangerous game~?" He waved a finger and the whole shop shut itself down with magic, door shut- and locked, curtains on the windows drawn themselves, and all of the shelves in the shop flipped out, replacing the toys with soooo many weapons. The dude was a secret armsdealer! For the rest of the campaign we went to his toy-shop for ammo, poisons, enchanted and sometimes cursed weapons, by walking up to counter and saying we would like to purchase "for a dangerous game."
You know, give me some intrigue! Codewords! Or maybe a shopkeep just feels super indebted to you so they'll offer you "the good stuff" and you unlock some other wares, like lvl10 white gear from that starting vendor. Also "Cursed Gear" would be a pretty interesting line of items. Like it raises one stat, but lowers others. It's probably best to break the item down for their components, but maybe you're really reeeaaallly desperate for MP or something xD Obviously the better option would be player-made gear, but you are too poor.
3 - some are incomplete, sometimes the quests get stuck, and bugs of course. I frankly haven't noticed the rewards being outstanding in either a positive or negative way, so 3.
That said, I mainly did them to get starter gear because Shol economy made crafting starter gear far harder than it was worth.
In the current leveling and economic situation, the quest rewards that give gear are critically important for getting some half-decent lvl 0 or lvl 5 gear as you blast through towards level 10+ in a matter of hours.
I am assuming this is not the intended end state of the economy, what with the almost impossibility of collecting enough materials to craft lvl 0 gear before you hit the level threshold for the next tier of gear - unless all you do is gather, process, and craft. Even then, I would expect you to be at least level 5 on artisan provided xp alone, if you're lucky with the gathering drops.
The same issue occurs again as you approach level 20 - I think most players at that point will still have a few pieces of lvl 0 and lvl 5 gear on them, unless they're in an organized guild that plays a lot, and maybe not even then.
If you leveled exclusively via artisan-provided XP, maybe you could be crafting lvl 20 gear around the time you hit level 20, but most players are grinding NPC's for gear, which takes far less effort, and is almost as good.
Node leveling speed is not keeping up with player level, so even if you gathered, processed, and crafted your way through thousands of metal material to reach the next tier of weaponsmithing, you would still not have access to tools to gather materials for the next tier, let alone crafting benches for same.
It is possible to gather a few pieces of higher tier materials from some mobs, but that just pushes you back into outleveling your gear.
Any quest that rewards gear should allow selecting for gear that fits your class/build, unless it's thematically very important to stick with a specific gear piece. Even then I would err on the side of a more flexible quest reward for the player.
As for XP and Glint rewards, I haven't really considered them an issue.
I would like to see quests give rewards that are useful, but not as good as you could purchase from a crafter. The effort required to get an item should be worth it - as things currently stand, with the state of the economy, it is almost entirely not worth crafting lower level gear, as you'll out-level it while grinding for comparable gear in less time than it takes to gather the necessary materials and craft it.
Especially if you start on a fresh server without any apprentice crafting stations, in an economy that levels slower than the players do.
In that scenario, it's more effective to quest and grind XP while getting some gear drops, if any quests offer gear, rather than craft it, because few if any persons have enough material to craft gear anyway.
50-74%
I am imagining that leveling, at least early game (level 1-10), should be 50% quests/events, 25% grinding, and 25% gathering. Perhaps from level 10-20, it could be balanced differently, and change as the level gets higher.
This all depends on how exactly the game is intended to play - if it's supposed to be way slower to level, then this changes - quests XP would be almost mandatory if leveling was significantly harder. They're currently mandatory for gear reasons (at least the ones that give gear), but that's another tale.
I feel connected when I am able to more or less smoothly move around the game world, fight NPC's, run away from NPC's I shouldn't have attacked, die because I didn't run fast enough, revive and run back to collect what is left of my dropped materials, then go to a storage NPC and stash what is left while weeping uncontrollably.
In all seriousness, that is very immersive and dynamic.
I also enjoy semi-casually wandering around gathering everything in sight that I have the skill and tools for, while repeating the last few steps of the above if I get too close to the wrong NPC.
Crashes and bugs break immersion, especially when they get you killed and cause you to lose materials you were gathering. Even just getting stuck pulls you out of the experience and into a mode where you need to think about bug reporting and such.
I am sure it is more difficult than I realize, but economic issues seem to push me out of doing certain things I am interested in.
Example: I would be more into crafting if the return was better for the effort and time invested.
Tiny things that remind me the Ashes world isn't complete or real:
Crafting experience rewards being exactly the same regardless of material rarity.
Mount getting stuck partway through an animation because I jumped off something.
Fall damage capped at 150hp even when landing from that jump off the skybridge into the center of Lionhold
Can't complete an optional quest reward because none of these damned goblins drop the splitliker pickle or whatever the F it is. That's the quest which currently rewards the lvl 0 Goblin Patchhide Chestpiece, uncommon rarity.
Quest start item drops from mobs even though I finished the quest weeks ago - "Our Family Fights", I think that one is.
Quest NPC you have to loot for quest continuation has spawn time length too long, and location too few, causing camping of spawn location.
I expect some of the issues will be addressed as development continues.
Some of my most immersive moments so far have been PVP or PVE (that became PVX) guild events.
So, working with other players to accomplish a goal.
2
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?
The experience rewards are improved since Phase 1 but still lacking. In the vast majority of quests, stopping and grinding mobs is much faster xp than going through the steps of the quest. I have no opinion regarding glint rewards, they seem fine.
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities?
75% or more
Why did you choose that percentage?
The best leveling experiences I've had in MMO involved fairly continuous questing, with rare, short xp gap periods where grinding mobs is needed. Artisanship should not be part of that equation (and should stand on its own as a somewhat reasonable way to level up).
What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
It's important for the NPC, quest writing, and activity to stick to a theme based on the NPC's perspective. Quest writing should also strongly support the overarching narrative of the NPC's faction's campaign and Intrepid should minimize 'standalone' narratives that could fit anywhere.
2.5
How would you describe the current quest rewards in Alpha Two? What’s working well, and what could be improved?
->Surplus token rewards are a really good idea. Gives you the choice over what is most needed for the player when they complete the quest. Gives you the option to keep them for later, etc. It's easy to update the reward lists for the developers over time to give more options for all classes when the game grows. As of the quests themselves, most of them are your standard MMO quests to go kill xx monsters or gather xx items and were for me fun to complete. I'm always grabbing commissions, so the side quests were a nice change of pace that forced me to explore and provided a nice challenge.
->First of all, You absolutely need to change that you get locked from the Surplus Token Chain quests when completing the Historian chain quests in Samia's hope. I love the starting region of the game, I found it really fun to go through multiple times (4 times so far up to lvl 10+). But for phase 2.5. It felt natural for me to go from Lionhold (that mostly have the Ruins of Aela quests and low level commissions only to do) to samia's hope for the higher level commissions and because that there is some fun side quests to discover.
-Repairing the carriage; Good quest, simple and quickly done.
-Finding the manuscript or epitaph; this one was bugged for me couldn't complete it)
-Exploring the ruins with the spiderlings to get evidences; This one is tough and was really fun to do with a group but it really could be easier to locate the evidences. One of the objectives is not even visible or barely on the map. I had to check a guide where some people found the interactable spot. It should be explained better somewhere that one of the evidence is obtained by looting the stone brick from the golem. On another note the stone brick only drops for one person in a group and that is a problem too.
But overall more quest in Samia's hope than in Lionhold and the Historian chain quest locks you out of the chain form Lionhold that gives Surplus Token wich is bad and counter intuitive and restrictive.
->Secondly, from there, all the quests i encountered were not shown on minimap or anywhere. I randomly came across some cool quests but only because i was curious and was trying to speak to everyone. For example the one near the Foul grog lake where you need to find a soldier's package or something. I managed to find another one to find rusty shields somewhere but i got lucky and can't remember where i found it. The quests should not be random thing you come across by accident but they should be well indicated and impossible to miss.
In your opinion, what makes for engaging and fair quest rewards in a game like Ashes of Creation that features an economy-driven PvX system?
->Recipes are a good idea for rewards. Multiple rewards choices where you get the choice between certain weapons or armor to best suit your needs, crafting ressources that you can use or trade, the 'stockade bag' was a very nice addition cause it's really useful. Rewards should be a little more significative. Should give 'decent' experience, some glint AND something useful such as gear/crafting materials/recipes/artisanship tools/mounts/bags/potions/food/XP Scrolls/etc.
Roughly what percentage of your leveling experience do you feel should come from questing compared to other activities (e.g., grinding, gathering, events)?
25–49%
Why did you choose that percentage?
->I personally am an explorer type of gamer. I'm feeling good with the current loop of grabbing all the gathering/killing/exploring commissions and then going to explore to complete these. I'm also always on the lookout for side quests to do. It's always a fun surprise to discover new locations and npc's scattered everywhere. For me there will never have enough quests and lore in a game. I'm the kind of gamer that like to have a goal to accomplish instead of just grinding. I'm also more often playing casually and solo. some quests allows me to go at my pace and direct me to place i wouldn't have gone maybe otherwise. If there is a reward (even if useless) I'm gonna be curious to do it.
->So that's why i need at least 25 to 49% of my experience to be while directed to cool places from quests. It gives a motive to explore and can guide players to new territories.
What helps you feel connected to a game world, and what could Ashes of Creation do to feel more immersive and dynamic?
->I liked the new world events you added. That kind of thing is always fun.
->More quests is a win for me always. The more quest with a wider range of difficulties. It should be stated if a quest requires to be in a group or is doable solo by some ways.
->Quests should be easy to spot. You need to make it obvious, not hidden.
->To end this I want to wish the Ashes of creation all the best for the years to come.
One of my biggest gripes is probably the overabundance of less quantitatively needed materials and the rarity of the more quantitatively needed materials. For example scribe needing 10 red ink and 1 magic powder. I need 10 rubies for every 1 daffodil and snowdrop. I can farm daffodil and snowdrop everywhere in crazy abundance. So my crafting is held up greatly by needing so much of the far rarer material Ruby. It'd make more sense if it was like 5 Rubies for every 10snowdrop/daffodil. I could get behind that a bit more. It doesn't need to be super achievable and easy, but it should be doable. Tailoring similar, Flax was super rare and I couldn't use snowdrop/daffodil thread for anything (that I found). I ended up having to farm droppings in order to even get flax to make linen. It made gathering nearly pointless to support tailoring.
I think my other gripe is probably the cost of processing vs. the cost of selling to vendor. For a 4 hour processing, only make a couple silver seems almost a slap in the face. It hardly makes up for the cost of repairing tools and time spent harvesting. Not saying it should net a lot to the vendor by any means, but at least make it profitable enough that I don't feel I've wasted 4 hours of gathering and processing for less money than if I had killed a few grems.
Crafting gear doesn't coincide with levelling either. I love crafting and I'm a far more dedicated crafter than anything else, but even still; by the time I could craft myself a set of novice armor, tools, weapons; my character was past the need for them. By the time I hit apprentice, I no longer needed the apprentice level tools/armor/weapons. That would be fine but I can't trade tools at all, cant trade any of my craftables to my alts without using a 3rd party, it really made crafting seem pointless. I mean sure I can make gear upon request, sell my services, and even craft a a nice epic or heroic piece of gear and sell it; but it's rare to be able to use anything I craft. Oh, I also lost a heroic tool because I wanted to make my alt a tool, made a rare one. Didn't know it was going to straight up replace my heroic and leave me with a rare... feel kinda gypped on that. I assume that is something already in the works to fix though, I hope.
Overall I do rather enjoy the playstyle and look forward to the updates and changes. Especially the implementation of summoner and archetypes. This post is just highlighting my annoyances. The game is looking like it has great potential.