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Dungeon Finder/Looking For Group System

Hey guys, there was a discussion in the Discord about Dungeon Finder and the pros/cons of a system like Dungeon Finder. Some of the cons to it are that it sometimes spurns social engagement. A pro is that it makes it ten times easier to run through a dungeon. I was thinking about all of my D&D campaigns and how they start out. Immediately I thought, "A tavern!". Maybe instead of a menu option in the game for LFG/Dungeon Finder there could be taverns spread out across a Node that allow you to use the LFG/Dungeon Finder feature in a more social way. For example, you walk into a tavern that is for Lvl 10-20 dungeons, you go to the board in the back of the room, and look at all of the people wanting groups for specific dungeons. Once you select a listing on the board you get thrown into a chat room, get acquainted with your party, and then embark on your journey. If you don't think you mesh well with your party feel free to abandon the party and start the search all over again.

Comments

  • It's not just a matter of finding a group, but getting to the dungeon itself. When Blizzard brought in the LFD system, the game world shrank to the capital cities where players would just stand around waiting for the dungeon queue to pop. I was guilty of this too where I leveled a number of different healing classes and as soon as I unlocked the dungeon finder I just stayed in the cities all the time. I literally leveled from 15-70 without stepping foot outside Stormwind, simply because I didn't need to. I wasn't the only one either, I know tons of people who did it.

    Put in too much convenience like LFD and people stop playing most of the game.
  • I think with the dungeon finder ect, you should have to create it by finding people to run it. For example, having a tavern in a node which people come together to participate in a dungeon and then all run off to it. This is better than queue and then teleport to the dungeons, as it loses all back story to them and some dungeons will be discoverable and will lose its part of the world and would be something you just run through until you gear.

    Although a LFG thing should be added, but not a dungeon finder like in WoW, more like the group finder like the world quests in WoW.
  • Just a thought. I would definitely be on-board with a "post-it" type bulletin board in taverns that are local to dungeons. Would be nice to frequent your tavern of choice and find a listing for an adventuring party looking for more members (meet here at 8pm CST) to attempt ZYX dungeon, etc etc. But please, please leave the instant port and instant group out of it. Certainly could be handled by forum posts, but would be much more immersive if it were accessible in-game.
  • As wonderfully written up in a MMORPG article (<a href="http://www.mmorpg.com/columns/the-war-against-down-time-1000008597">Mark Kern: The War Against Down Time</a>) downtime is a great way to give players an opportunity to get to know one another. While a LFG tool for quests is welcome the LFD and LFR tools only facilitated faster leveling while greatly diminishing social time.

    While the tavern idea is nice there are also other quest hubs to gather at - These could be small clearings/campsites that could grow with the dominant node up to roadside taverns or even a small village. Useful for the players just wanting to group up for a particularly difficult quest as well a small gathering areas for those looking for RP. And should the world be as dynamic as presented then these quest hubs could grow or shrink, change, or even disappear due to the actions and/or inactions of the players.

    Depending on how fast an average player can level (one level per zone? one level per quest line? etc) will determine the necessity of a LFD tool. Of course, in the very earliest days after launch finding a group should not be a problem so this is something the devs could easily push towards the back of the queue.
  • That's a great idea. These LFD/LFR spots don't necessarily have to be inside the Nodes. There's a lot of flexibility and possibility when considering an effective LFD/LFR tool.
  • LFG tools in WoW was an amazing idea and made running dungeons so much easier, BUT it totally killed the social feel to the game. Shortly after it launched pug lfg groups wouldn't even take the time to say hi in chat. Just my 2c
  • If you want to run into a dungeon, go run into the dungeon! Hike your butt over there with your party (like back in the good ole ff11 and old WoW days) and just jump in!

    Or, at the very least, have the LFD feature only be triggered once you are at the dungeon itself. That way, you still need to make the trek.

    Exploration and travel makes the game fun. Especially if this is an open world pvp game, and you might have to fight off bandits on your way to the dungeon.
  • No. There should be no Dungeon Finder in this game Period. Why the hell would I play Ashes of Creation with a Dungeon Finder? Really? There will be no fucking community to speak of period. People will bitch that its hard to find crafters to do anything so NPCs will pop up replacing crafters. And then world PVP goes to shit because no one can find groups because there is no automated tool there.

    Basically This. If this game has a Dungeon Finder. I WILL NOT PLAY PERIOD. I already play a game with a Dungeon finder that is called FFXIV. There is 0 community there because of it but Why the hell would I go from One Game to Another Game with a Dungeon finder? I will tell you I will not. Many people I know that would play Ashes will not as will not as well because you are just copying and pasting WOW in the Ashes of Creation Skin. Its time to STOP bringing up MMORPG killing tools like Dungeon Finders.

    If anything Just make FFFXIVs Party finder but add in a way for a player to post themselves looking for a group. Groups need to be organic and people need to talk to each other when forming a group. No I am not suggesting spamming chat, but I am saying add tools that do not Automate grouping period. If you do that there is no reason for people to leave games that already do this crap for a game that is doing the same think with a new skin.
  • I am not sorry, but I hate Dungeon Finders. They kill the MMORPG Community. I agree we need a Party Finder system but it should not be automated at all period. There is 0 reason to jump from 1 Dungeon Finder game to another just to do the same dam thing I am doing in FFXIV.
  • [quote quote=8372]That’s a great idea. These LFD/LFR spots don’t necessarily have to be inside the Nodes. There’s a lot of flexibility and possibility when considering an effective LFD/LFR tool.

    [/quote]

    Why cant you use a Non Automated Group Finder tool to make a group and socialize with people. No I am not talking about a chat channel spamming. I am talking about Party Browsers and looking for Party Browsers. People can list themselves as looking for a group and groups can look for members. Why do you need LFD?
  • Screw this. I am going to throw another log onto the fire. People want dungeons that are require more effort than WOW or FFXIV because with LFD tools you cannot make any tough content because people who use Automated group finder tools dont want to do anything more than a 10 minute spam buttons fest and move on to the next dungeon.

    People the are here in Ashes of Creation DO NOT WANT THE SAME OLD CRAP OF THE LAST 10 YEARS. We want Dungeons that require CC, Teamwork and Support classes and add to that Dungeons that are 60+ minutes long. Also we want Dungeons that are not spammed so we get X amount of stones a week to get our gear.

    We want Dungeons that are done for fun not done for gear. That means now LFD because the people who use this tool will consistently complain that stuff is too hard. Just look at Square Enix's get togethers that Duty Finder content is too hard when it is already so mindlessly easy you just have to get out of the avoidable damage and do the dance to kill the boss. No these people want to stand there and whack a mold the boss.


    Ashes MUST be different for people to want to come here, not be the same old game that every Wannabe MMORPG player wants to come to. I understand people have time limits. I am married and have 3 kids. I know exactly what it is like to not have time to do things in game. BUT that does not make me want easy stuff in Ashes.

    What I want is Tough content that will take time, that does not have a gear treadmill attached to it like FFXIV or WOW. I want Dungeons that require me to put together a group though commutation not the press of a button. I want to bring Support classes. I want to only do 1 or 2 a week because they consume time to do. I also want save points so if stuff comes up my group and I can just pick up where we left off.

    Anything less will just make this game like ever other game out there.
  • I fully agree with Helzbelz on this. There was so many rants and arguments about the DF systems I read, and how it deteriorate the communities in every MMO it appear, that I just simply can't comprehend, how one would want to duplicate the same mistakes onto this game.
  • Honestly I think the LFG in WoW currently is a good way to go, but implement it better in terms of an RPG feel. I'm talking about the pre-made group finder, the the LFR or LFD, the place where you can list a group and wait for applicants to apply and then decide whether or not to take them with you. I thought this solved some of the issues with PUGing in WoW where instead of sitting around a capital city and watching General chat or Trade chat you could look for each form of content specifically.
  • [quote quote=8764]Honestly I think the LFG in WoW currently is a good way to go, but implement it better in terms of an RPG feel. I’m talking about the pre-made group finder, the the LFR or LFD, the place where you can list a group and wait for applicants to apply and then decide whether or not to take them with you. I thought this solved some of the issues with PUGing in WoW where instead of sitting around a capital city and watching General chat or Trade chat you could look for each form of content specifically.

    [/quote]

    Yea having a way to list groups and list yourself as someone looking for a group is a lot better way to go. It also slows down the dungeon grind which a lot of people here do not want. Yes we do want dungeons but we want them to be something that is special to do not 10 minute rinse and repeat as they are today. Not every day a person should do a dungeon. A good way to fix that is force them to make pre-made groups, if they have a group of friends that can do that; Good for them.
  • I could write a huge rant about my feelings towards the LFD/LFR tools, but Helzbelz pretty much summed up all my feelings about these tools :P

    For me the demise of the server community in WoW partially died when they introduced the LFD system...

    They latest LFG tool is much better though, its easier to find a party without the need to spam trade chat, but there is no automation involved and you still need to travel to the dungeon as it should be!
  • [quote quote=8798]I could write a huge rant about my feelings towards the LFD/LFR tools, but Helzbelz pretty much summed up all my feelings about these tools <img alt="????" src="https://s.w.org/images/core/emoji/2.2.1/svg/1f61b.svg" />

    For me the demise of the server community in WoW partially died when they introduced the LFD system…

    They latest LFG tool is much better though, its easier to find a party without the need to spam trade chat, but there is no automation involved and you still need to travel to the dungeon as it should be!

    [/quote]

    Also if the design of the game is not a treadmill where one needs to spam dungeons for gear there is 0 need for a Automated Grouping tool. Dungeons should be geared towards a good place to get crafting mats that makes higher level or stronger items, A good amount of Gold and cosmetic\Glamour items so you can change the look of your gear. Yes some gear should drop off the bosses and mobs; BUT it should be the same gear crafters make that you can find on player vendors or player auction houses. So if you get items you cannot use you can just sell it, make the gold then buy yourself the gear you want. Gear out of dungeons should be just if you got a piece you can use great if not sell it and buy what you want.

    If you do this and have item decay where gear breaks. The currency of the game will constantly be changing hands and making gold to buy what you want/need will never be a problem. We need to go back to SWG's gear/crafting/Item Decay system. If we do that we will have a good game.
  • +1 to listing parties for certain things, where people apply to you and you need to make the decision to bring them.

    I am alright however, with Dungeon Finders, like in Final Fantasy 14, provided you cannot q for them inside a city, or away from the dungeon, thus taking away the 'lack of community' feel that comes with people afk waiting for dungeons in cities.
    The fact is though, sometimes there are not enough people online to pre-make a party with. And we all know how annoying/frustrating and drama filled static groups can be. And how /difficult/ it can be to find one. People are stingy, and will not bring people with them if they dislike them, or see them as noobish.
    I think if there is going to be a Dungeon Finder (where you are paired randomly with people) then you should have to start that finder at the dungeon itself, that way when you get to the dungeon, you might actually find other people looking for groups.
    This still allows communication between players, but also allows those playing at awkward times to do the dungeons they need to do through random pairing.
    Furthermore, you'll still have the option to specifically look for parties through some type of Party Finder (Which I think would be neat if you had to walk up to a local signpost and read a list of parties ;D +1 to immersion )

    I think that in the way I described here, it allows for what people seem to be asking for in this thread, and if people wish to use a dungeon finder method, they will have to actively walk out of town and make the journey to the dungeon, in order to join up for a random q that may or may not be across servers.
    You are actively making the decision to join a random party, rather than put one together yourself.
  • [quote quote=9305]+1 to listing parties for certain things, where people apply to you and you need to make the decision to bring them.

    I am alright however, with Dungeon Finders, like in Final Fantasy 14, provided you cannot q for them inside a city, or away from the dungeon, thus taking away the ‘lack of community’ feel that comes with people afk waiting for dungeons in cities.
    The fact is though, sometimes there are not enough people online to pre-make a party with. And we all know how annoying/frustrating and drama filled static groups can be. And how /difficult/ it can be to find one. People are stingy, and will not bring people with them if they dislike them, or see them as noobish.
    I think if there is going to be a Dungeon Finder (where you are paired randomly with people) then you should have to start that finder at the dungeon itself, that way when you get to the dungeon, you might actually find other people looking for groups.
    This still allows communication between players, but also allows those playing at awkward times to do the dungeons they need to do through random pairing.
    Furthermore, you’ll still have the option to specifically look for parties through some type of Party Finder (Which I think would be neat if you had to walk up to a local signpost and read a list of parties ;D +1 to immersion )

    I think that in the way I described here, it allows for what people seem to be asking for in this thread, and if people wish to use a dungeon finder method, they will have to actively walk out of town and make the journey to the dungeon, in order to join up for a random q that may or may not be across servers.
    You are actively making the decision to join a random party, rather than put one together yourself.

    [/quote]

    First if you have ANY automated grouping tool in the game even server only the community will not exist period. Take SWTOR for example, they have a several only Dungeon Finder and there is 0 community. Yet When there was no community Everyone knew the best guilds to join even if odd hours that did dungeons. The problem is Today people Lack acceptance that it is their responsibility to find friends that play the same time as they do. I have friends that worked 3rd shift so ended up playing on AU/NZ servers. That is just the way things should be. There is 0 reason ever to have a Dungeon Finder tool, Especially when people are fighting to make it so dungeons are done for other reasons than GEAR. If you dont have to do Dungeons like you do i n FFXIV to cap stones every fucking week, then if you dont do a dungeon you still can get the gear you just buy it with Gold.

    If you really want to do the dungeon you wait until there is a time when you can do it with friends.
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