And sense PVP missions seem like they will be a thing. Like protect this caravan. Meaning if PVP does occur someone is loosing XP. Not really my thing. I just don't understand why developers can't see dying in itself isn't punishment enough. I guess lets all add insult to injury instead.
By and large the mechanics that are proposed are the mechanics that the players want.
I find that hard to believe. But I guess I could be in the minority. Do you have any proof to this claim, or are you just throwing out your opinion as fact?
Tbh honest, nobody knows how the pvp system will play out. Miracles are possible, maybe AoC will be that one game with a balanced pvp system that is actually fun to play, or it will end up in just another stupid gankbox like Archeage. Everything is possible mate.
Hmmm, in my experience casual players make up the majority of players in any game. And most of them don't watch streams jump on discord or make forum post. Unless they are upset at something. I feel you are basing your opinion on a top % of players. That are willing to play beta's, and alpha's in the first place.
Okay. Let's see if we can extract some understanding from your posts.
So, you think only top players would share their opinions about the game, basically. Alright. Fine. Question for you though: What do you mean by "top players"? The game isn't even out, what metric are you using to determine who is a top player?
If you are saying that everyone willing to play alphas and betas and be in the discord and back the game early...are all "top players" which seems like you're saying... then who TF else are we supposed to be hearing from?????
That's everyone here, including you. Are you saying we shouldn't listen to you?
AngryFansaid: PVP... Well it looks even worse to me now. I don't mean to sound like a dick or anything, but I never liked open world PVP to begin with.
And the fact it looks like you are punished harder for not fighting back. Ya I don't think this game is for me. Plus I just realized they are adding death penalties on top of it all. While the concept of the overall game sounds great. I really don't want to deal with those two things. So much so I think I will just pass on the entire game itself.
A shame really.
This game has been VERY clearly marketed. If you are somehow surprised by finding out the game is going to have PvP elements, that is totally on you. Coming on the forums to wrestle with logic and twist reality to pretend your opinion is valid ain't doing anyone any good. That's the real shame.
AngryFansaid: I can't really fathom any player who doesn't want to take part in the open world PVP. To actually like being punished for it more heavily than those who fight back. It blows my mind that a non-combatant has a heavier death penalty than a combatant does. If this stays a thing. I don't see most casual players hanging around. AngryFansaid: I am guessing most casual players who see the PVP mechanic, and understand it. Have already written off the game. So that would be why i believe you don't see many people even talking about the PVP itself. At least that's what I think.
See here you go again.. Casual players doesn't mean PvE only, dude. There are casual PvP players too. You trying to use those concepts interchangeably. Also, while we're on the subject, how would casual players have already seen and discounted this game if you also claim only top players would know about it?
You know that doesn't make sense, right?
Look, this is going to be a PvX game whether you personally like it or not. That is the game. PvX. There will be PvE. There will be PvP. Get over that.
Now that you've gotten over that, what are your remaining problems... if any?
PVP... Well it looks even worse to me now. I don't mean to sound like a dick or anything, but I never liked open world PVP to begin with.
And the fact it looks like you are punished harder for not fighting back. Ya I don't think this game is for me. Plus I just realized they are adding death penalties on top of it all. While the concept of the overall game sounds great. I really don't want to deal with those two things. So much so I think I will just pass on the entire game itself.
A shame really.
While they talk about ways to clear corruption. There isn't any talk that I see about clearing a combatant flag. I assume there is a way. It also only uses the word attack... Does that mean my AOE skills may unintentionally mark me as a combatant?
Also sense you only loose gear on you. A griefer can just swap out his high end gear while he is board, and go loot people until he is hunted enough to clear his corruption flag. I just don't see how the penalties will stop that style of game play. And the fact that a none-combatant is punished more than a combatant. Well seems like the game will encourage it.
That and the added death penalties. Which I feel are a hard-core type mechanic. And they all scream that this isn't a game I am going to like. I mean good luck to the rest of you out there. But thiefing stuff from others seems to be the core concept of the game. Way more so than I would like. So I'm out.
FYI: this forum seems to be buggy as crap I had to re-post this comment like 50 times before it stayed. Looks like it count's each edit as a potential spammer, and just deletes it. Pretty lame if you ask me.
PVP... Well it looks even worse to me now. I don't mean to sound like a dick or anything, but I never liked open world PVP to begin with.
And the fact it looks like you are punished harder for not fighting back. Ya I don't think this game is for me. Plus I just realized they are adding death penalties on top of it all. While the concept of the overall game sounds great. I really don't want to deal with those two things. So much so I think I will just pass on the entire game itself.
A shame really.
While they talk about ways to clear corruption. There isn't any talk that I see about clearing a combatant flag. I assume there is a way. It also only uses the word attack... Does that mean my AOE skills may unintentionally mark me as a combatant?
Also sense you only loose gear on you. A griefer can just swap out his high end gear while he is board, and go loot people until he is hunted enough to clear his corruption flag. I just don't see how the penalties will stop that style of game play. And the fact that a none-combatant is punished more than a combatant. Well seems like the game will encourage it.
That and the added death penalties. Which I feel are a hard-core type mechanic. And they all scream that this isn't a game I am going to like. I mean good luck to the rest of you out there. But thiefing stuff from others seems to be the core concept of the game. Way more so than I would like. So I'm out.
FYI: this forum seems to be buggy as crap I had to re-post this comment like 50 times before it stayed. Looks like it count's each edit as a potential spammer, and just deletes it. Pretty lame if you ask me.
everything is still being tested .... that includes everything having to do with PvP ... i don't know why this thread is full of peeps " rampaging on a tirade " with these ridiculous posts
Anything is bound to change through testing with that said, here's the list for Questing Concerns ... yeah this is just one of them
Nodes with " big-time " guilds aren't going to have any kinda dominance over the server and here's why https://youtu.be/STUmnHRKqNc?t=411
The only way in how guild(s) will get that " dominance " over the server ... is if literally every other Guild submits defeat and never challenges the big Guild(s) ... which will likely not happen. Otherwise, they can kiss this MMORPG goodbye
Despite this, PvPers needs PvEers & RPers for their game to be alive - this revelation always occurs after most players leave ... so i might as well post this comment now as a " heads-up "
Some red flags ...
My.Com ( fml ) ... but after more info have been revealed ... My.Com will ONLY be overseeing the EU Servers - not NA nor OCE/SEA . Intrepid will still maintain & possess 100% creative control over their MMORPG ... this would assume that no suspicious changes to Cash Shop ... oh and ..
Pre-Established Cash Shop .. thats Cosmetics-Only. The only bright thing to this Cash Shop , is that it more of an Online Storre due to the RL items of Shirts, Sweaters, Mousepads, Lanyards and Caps
Steven has a peculiar background ... but the other Founding Devs does not ( kinda balances-out )
Honestly , this Thread is just one big misunderstanding that got out of control ... i can't even ... She's ( he ? ) just asking for questions & giving her/ his opinion on the matter ...
@Eragale Assuming that I grasp what you are saying above, it is not a rare phenomenon, especially for crowdfunded games. Anyone that voices an opinion or questions the exact "setup" of the game, as it is currently known, is immediately unpopular. They are "different" and "unsupportive" of the game. They are generally told that the game is "not for them", called trolls if they argue, told or encouraged to go away, etc...
Now the WAY that these people sometimes argue their points earn them this kind of treatment, but not always...
Take a look at the forums of other games in development. It's the same almost everywhere.
PVP... Well it looks even worse to me now. I don't mean to sound like a dick or anything, but I never liked open world PVP to begin with.
Since you don't like open-world PvP that is probably why you have the perspective you have. Your bias is coming through pretty hard.
And the fact it looks like you are punished harder for not fighting back. Ya I don't think this game is for me. Plus I just realized they are adding death penalties on top of it all. While the concept of the overall game sounds great. I really don't want to deal with those two things. So much so I think I will just pass on the entire game itself.
A shame really.
You could look it at as if you are punished harder for not fighting back. Or you could look at it as if you take less losses if you do fight back.
You also keep glazing over the trade-off. As a pacifist, if you choose to not fight back you are sticking the other guy with corruption which is a x3-x4 penalty and the chance to drop his gear.
While they talk about ways to clear corruption. There isn't any talk that I see about clearing a combatant flag. I assume there is a way. It also only uses the word attack... Does that mean my AOE skills may unintentionally mark me as a combatant?
Your AOE skills will not unemotionally mark you as a combatant. You need to specifically flag up for PvP.
Also sense you only loose gear on you. A griefer can just swap out his high end gear while he is board, and go loot people until he is hunted enough to clear his corruption flag. I just don't see how the penalties will stop that style of game play. And the fact that a none-combatant is punished more than a combatant. Well seems like the game will encourage it.
Since there is no fast travel if he did just storage his gear that's going to be a long trek to get his gear if he needs it.
Do you really think someone is going to run around flagged up killing people for what little gatherables they can carry on them. Your gatherable carrying capacity is limited, and when the ganker does kill you he only gets a percentage of what you are carrying not all of it.
Plus, when he is hunted enough to clear his corruption, he is going to be deep into negative XP that will affect his combat effectiveness until he earns all that xp.
If you think the game encourages ganking, then your bias isn't allowing you to see that the corruption mechanic will prevent it. The penalty is too big compared to the gains.
That and the added death penalties. Which I feel are a hard-core type mechanic. And they all scream that this isn't a game I am going to like. I mean good luck to the rest of you out there. But thiefing stuff from others seems to be the core concept of the game. Way more so than I would like. So I'm out.
No offense, but if you are hung up on the "thieving" concept being the core concept of the game, you clearly did enough research to see something you didn't like and you want to be hung up on it.
I don't agree that the sole purpose of a PvP server is to be a murderbox. The purpose of a PvP server is simply to separate those who enjoy PvP combat from those who don't want their gameplay interrupted by PvP combat when they're not in the mood for PvP combat.
@AngryFan I think you need to learn more about the details of the design - you have some significant misconceptions about the mechanics.
You also have some valid concerns about whether Corruption will be a sufficient deterrent to unwanted PvP combat, but there's no way for us to determine how well it actually works until we play the game.
Same, really, for the death penalties.
NDA is supposed to be lifted in the next couple of weeks, so... Just keep an eye on the development and see if your concerns are answered to your satistfaction... or not.
Either the explainers didn't explain well or the OP didn't understand well. Whether you like open world pvp or not isn't the issue here. This topic has already been beat to death and everyone still here understands the system and how it is supposed to function or they are here because they still want to try the game.
Thats what i would suggest. Try the game when it comes out.
And not everyone here are angry backers that just shut down any negatives. I didn't even back the game but i hands down will be playing it when it comes. People here explain things and it does get frustrating when the questioners don't understand and pose a counterargument that has already been answered. Again that doesn't mean we are shutting you down.
And to everyone saying that Steven and Intrepid isn't trying to make a game for everyone. In all fairness, they kinda are. Or thats how i see it anyway. They're trying to include as much as possible and balance it all as well and they're trying to make the game realistic and immersive. Thats why i'm still here. I love everything that they're doing and have hope. I fully understand the systems that have been explained and the positives and negatives to them. Everyone here is hoping for a successful game. We aren't just mindless cult followers. If there is a flaw, believe me we will be the first to scream about it. If you can't understand the base systems of this game, well like i said. At least give it a try when it comes.
Like many have already pointed out. Some section of people here on the internet are simply not going to do research before coming to conclusions. Some will and still not really understand what is there to find. Some are and not going to believe that it will work as described. Etc...
Maybe the best thing that we can do is try and point out where they have misunderstood, that we won't know for sure until a certain point in development and they should wait and see. We all look better without the name calling and dismissals and in some cases I see the patience really paying off.
It is going to happen over and over.
Take a chill from the "White Knights of the Design' stance. Have some patience. The internet is a great place to get info, Assuming humans can always grasp it or believe it or agree with it is a fool's game.
Comments
So, you think only top players would share their opinions about the game, basically. Alright. Fine. Question for you though: What do you mean by "top players"? The game isn't even out, what metric are you using to determine who is a top player?
If you are saying that everyone willing to play alphas and betas and be in the discord and back the game early...are all "top players" which seems like you're saying... then who TF else are we supposed to be hearing from?????
That's everyone here, including you. Are you saying we shouldn't listen to you?
PVP... Well it looks even worse to me now. I don't mean to sound like a dick or anything, but I never liked open world PVP to begin with.
And the fact it looks like you are punished harder for not fighting back. Ya I don't think this game is for me. Plus I just realized they are adding death penalties on top of it all. While the concept of the overall game sounds great. I really don't want to deal with those two things. So much so I think I will just pass on the entire game itself.
A shame really.
I can't really fathom any player who doesn't want to take part in the open world PVP. To actually like being punished for it more heavily than those who fight back. It blows my mind that a non-combatant has a heavier death penalty than a combatant does. If this stays a thing. I don't see most casual players hanging around.
AngryFan said:
I am guessing most casual players who see the PVP mechanic, and understand it. Have already written off the game. So that would be why i believe you don't see many people even talking about the PVP itself. At least that's what I think.
See here you go again.. Casual players doesn't mean PvE only, dude. There are casual PvP players too. You trying to use those concepts interchangeably. Also, while we're on the subject, how would casual players have already seen and discounted this game if you also claim only top players would know about it?
You know that doesn't make sense, right?
Look, this is going to be a PvX game whether you personally like it or not. That is the game. PvX. There will be PvE. There will be PvP. Get over that.
Now that you've gotten over that, what are your remaining problems... if any?
And the fact it looks like you are punished harder for not fighting back. Ya I don't think this game is for me. Plus I just realized they are adding death penalties on top of it all. While the concept of the overall game sounds great. I really don't want to deal with those two things. So much so I think I will just pass on the entire game itself.
A shame really.
While they talk about ways to clear corruption. There isn't any talk that I see about clearing a combatant flag. I assume there is a way. It also only uses the word attack... Does that mean my AOE skills may unintentionally mark me as a combatant?
Also sense you only loose gear on you. A griefer can just swap out his high end gear while he is board, and go loot people until he is hunted enough to clear his corruption flag. I just don't see how the penalties will stop that style of game play. And the fact that a none-combatant is punished more than a combatant. Well seems like the game will encourage it.
That and the added death penalties. Which I feel are a hard-core type mechanic. And they all scream that this isn't a game I am going to like. I mean good luck to the rest of you out there. But thiefing stuff from others seems to be the core concept of the game. Way more so than I would like. So I'm out.
FYI: this forum seems to be buggy as crap I had to re-post this comment like 50 times before it stayed. Looks like it count's each edit as a potential spammer, and just deletes it. Pretty lame if you ask me.
And the fact it looks like you are punished harder for not fighting back. Ya I don't think this game is for me. Plus I just realized they are adding death penalties on top of it all. While the concept of the overall game sounds great. I really don't want to deal with those two things. So much so I think I will just pass on the entire game itself.
A shame really.
While they talk about ways to clear corruption. There isn't any talk that I see about clearing a combatant flag. I assume there is a way. It also only uses the word attack... Does that mean my AOE skills may unintentionally mark me as a combatant?
Also sense you only loose gear on you. A griefer can just swap out his high end gear while he is board, and go loot people until he is hunted enough to clear his corruption flag. I just don't see how the penalties will stop that style of game play. And the fact that a none-combatant is punished more than a combatant. Well seems like the game will encourage it.
That and the added death penalties. Which I feel are a hard-core type mechanic. And they all scream that this isn't a game I am going to like. I mean good luck to the rest of you out there. But thiefing stuff from others seems to be the core concept of the game. Way more so than I would like. So I'm out.
FYI: this forum seems to be buggy as crap I had to re-post this comment like 50 times before it stayed. Looks like it count's each edit as a potential spammer, and just deletes it. Pretty lame if you ask me.
everything is still being tested .... that includes everything having to do with PvP ... i don't know why this thread is full of peeps " rampaging on a tirade " with these ridiculous posts
Anything is bound to change through testing
with that said, here's the list for Questing Concerns ... yeah this is just one of them
- "Guild Questing" https://youtu.be/3UIqmWTGZ2k?t=1580
- Reference to GooseBumps ( very juicy info,) https://youtu.be/3UIqmWTGZ2k?t=2266
- " EQ Epic Questlines ? " https://youtu.be/3UIqmWTGZ2k?t=3035
- Seasonal Quests ? https://youtu.be/KS57Q1BKsuE?t=2457
- Grindy Quests ? https://youtu.be/8l12DLKqJ5w?t=2516
- https://youtu.be/1duIKUf8gVs?t=1257 ( ends at 29:29 | 4=Part Question )
- Question Markers ? (
https://youtu.be/dT7KJT_NYEk?t=3160 ) - ( Backtracking on Quests ? ) https://youtu.be/gsvSbCyRr6E?t=3514
- Water-oriented quests https://youtu.be/JH-sX1aFljM?t=3714
- Legendary Quests https://youtu.be/u8ne-4Xl3Rw?t=644
- How will quests be interesting ? https://youtu.be/u8ne-4Xl3Rw?t=2023
Nodes with " big-time " guilds aren't going to have any kinda dominance over the server and here's why https://youtu.be/STUmnHRKqNc?t=411Some red flags ...
Honestly , this Thread is just one big misunderstanding that got out of control ... i can't even ... She's ( he ? ) just asking for questions & giving her/ his opinion on the matter ...
@Eragale Assuming that I grasp what you are saying above, it is not a rare phenomenon, especially for crowdfunded games. Anyone that voices an opinion or questions the exact "setup" of the game, as it is currently known, is immediately unpopular. They are "different" and "unsupportive" of the game. They are generally told that the game is "not for them", called trolls if they argue, told or encouraged to go away, etc...
Now the WAY that these people sometimes argue their points earn them this kind of treatment, but not always...
Take a look at the forums of other games in development. It's the same almost everywhere.
- Since you don't like open-world PvP that is probably why you have the perspective you have. Your bias is coming through pretty hard.
And the fact it looks like you are punished harder for not fighting back. Ya I don't think this game is for me. Plus I just realized they are adding death penalties on top of it all. While the concept of the overall game sounds great. I really don't want to deal with those two things. So much so I think I will just pass on the entire game itself.A shame really.
- You could look it at as if you are punished harder for not fighting back. Or you could look at it as if you take less losses if you do fight back.
- You also keep glazing over the trade-off. As a pacifist, if you choose to not fight back you are sticking the other guy with corruption which is a x3-x4 penalty and the chance to drop his gear.
While they talk about ways to clear corruption. There isn't any talk that I see about clearing a combatant flag. I assume there is a way. It also only uses the word attack... Does that mean my AOE skills may unintentionally mark me as a combatant?- Your AOE skills will not unemotionally mark you as a combatant. You need to specifically flag up for PvP.
Also sense you only loose gear on you. A griefer can just swap out his high end gear while he is board, and go loot people until he is hunted enough to clear his corruption flag. I just don't see how the penalties will stop that style of game play. And the fact that a none-combatant is punished more than a combatant. Well seems like the game will encourage it.That and the added death penalties. Which I feel are a hard-core type mechanic. And they all scream that this isn't a game I am going to like. I mean good luck to the rest of you out there. But thiefing stuff from others seems to be the core concept of the game. Way more so than I would like. So I'm out.
The purpose of a PvP server is simply to separate those who enjoy PvP combat from those who don't want their gameplay interrupted by PvP combat when they're not in the mood for PvP combat.
Shadowbane was designed to be a murderbox.
I think you need to learn more about the details of the design - you have some significant misconceptions about the mechanics.
You also have some valid concerns about whether Corruption will be a sufficient deterrent to unwanted PvP combat, but there's no way for us to determine how well it actually works until we play the game.
Same, really, for the death penalties.
NDA is supposed to be lifted in the next couple of weeks, so...
Just keep an eye on the development and see if your concerns are answered to your satistfaction... or not.
Thats what i would suggest. Try the game when it comes out.
And not everyone here are angry backers that just shut down any negatives. I didn't even back the game but i hands down will be playing it when it comes. People here explain things and it does get frustrating when the questioners don't understand and pose a counterargument that has already been answered. Again that doesn't mean we are shutting you down.
And to everyone saying that Steven and Intrepid isn't trying to make a game for everyone. In all fairness, they kinda are. Or thats how i see it anyway. They're trying to include as much as possible and balance it all as well and they're trying to make the game realistic and immersive. Thats why i'm still here. I love everything that they're doing and have hope. I fully understand the systems that have been explained and the positives and negatives to them. Everyone here is hoping for a successful game. We aren't just mindless cult followers. If there is a flaw, believe me we will be the first to scream about it. If you can't understand the base systems of this game, well like i said. At least give it a try when it comes.
Like many have already pointed out. Some section of people here on the internet are simply not going to do research before coming to conclusions. Some will and still not really understand what is there to find. Some are and not going to believe that it will work as described. Etc...
Maybe the best thing that we can do is try and point out where they have misunderstood, that we won't know for sure until a certain point in development and they should wait and see. We all look better without the name calling and dismissals and in some cases I see the patience really paying off.
It is going to happen over and over.
Take a chill from the "White Knights of the Design' stance. Have some patience. The internet is a great place to get info, Assuming humans can always grasp it or believe it or agree with it is a fool's game.