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Intrepid are you missing a massive opportunity?
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This is a discussion that may have happened long since, however I’ve been away for a long while and haven’t been able to keep up.
Apologies if this has been mentioned or discussed, however a search on the forums / wiki proved fruitless.
Personally I can see an opportunity for Intrepid which I can’t see that they’ve yet taken advantage of. One that is currently relevant, however may decrease significantly in relevance once the game is launched.
An opportunity that could potentially:
- Reach a new customer base that might not even consider playing the MMORPG.
- Keep a portion of the current backers engaged fully right up to launch, with hype, interest, and positivity high.
- Develop another income stream.
- Be excessively media and game promotion friendly
- Have no impact upon the development of the MMORPG, whilst helping to feed into the lore and stories (IF you wanted it to).
Financial income from health, fitness and diet industries are huge and very solid (solid by which I mean interest in them is unlike to ever change)
‘Gaming’ fitness has continued to increase in our day to day lives.
Right now you basically have a massive bunch of people, sitting around just waiting for the gates on Verra to open.
A bunch of people who may or may not want to be able to take part in preparing for the journey by improving their health in the real world.
I have personally put on four stone in two years and gone from running and weight lifting to sobbing uncontrollably when I realise that I have to stand up and walk a meter to get my mug of coffee.
Shame. Lots of shame
My only excuse is that I’ve just given birth and I’ve been too tired to move.
That said, I have just kicked off my fitness adventure again, and the best way I have found for me is to use the gaming tools available to me.
Right now the ones that I personally use are the zombies run (c25k app) and the nerd fitness site.
If you’ve never used them, you basically ‘level up’ as you use the app or website to improve your real life fitness and build your virtual stats. You get fitter, your avatar gets stronger.
Nerd fitness includes ‘class’ dependent fitness challenges
Zombies run includes ‘virtual races’ and base building via item collection.
It would not be at all difficult to see a ‘Return to Verra’ app where in you can participate in a variety of fitness ‘quests’, class or species dependent.
It can easily run side by side with the MMORPG or Apocalypse.
I have ‘walked mordor’ before and ‘climbed weathertop’ why not walk the lands that the races are returning from?
Race from coast to coast on the app in r/l and win a metal 3d printed computer designed verran trophy in r/l along with an in game title.
Scale it’s highest peak in the r/l app and get a custom in game climbing ‘action’
You already have a bunch of digital stock that gamers are hungry for, why not use those productively to drive and maintain interest by using them as teaser/incentive prizes for real life achievements?
You wouldn’t be giving away any lore or story unless you wanted to, as it could all be off ‘verra’.
The easiest route to take if this was something of interest, would be to approach a company with a well-established app to adapt to the AoC universe and set it up as a temporary app prior to launch.
Only temporary, because this would then give you figures of demand for such a product which you could consider launching by yourself or licensing off.
Personally, and I have absolutely no idea about business or any of this, I’d be wanting to put together a new kickstarter for a stand alone, fitness app development team, as a separate team and fundraiser they’d be no room for complaint about any intrepid previous kickstarters.
Though if that worked and any app was successful, I’d be tempted to keep any employees hired and set up an official ‘gaming fitness’ team, covering multiple avenues and products, especially given the huge demand already in place for these kind of things.
I’d just get the ball rolling swiftly and see where it took me, because the game is not going to be ‘pre launch’ forever.
Anyway, just a thought.
[P.S I lack the drive to try to put together a website with an 'unofficial' ashes fitness program, otherwise I'd be taking advantage of a potential income stream.
Whilst money doesn't motivate me, I can't say that I'd be terribly upset if you felt the idea here had any merit, and if anything were to come from it, to possibly 'thank' me with.... maybe some cosmetics or account upgrades?
Being a cheeky ar*e, Storybook]
Apologies if this has been mentioned or discussed, however a search on the forums / wiki proved fruitless.
Personally I can see an opportunity for Intrepid which I can’t see that they’ve yet taken advantage of. One that is currently relevant, however may decrease significantly in relevance once the game is launched.
An opportunity that could potentially:
- Reach a new customer base that might not even consider playing the MMORPG.
- Keep a portion of the current backers engaged fully right up to launch, with hype, interest, and positivity high.
- Develop another income stream.
- Be excessively media and game promotion friendly
- Have no impact upon the development of the MMORPG, whilst helping to feed into the lore and stories (IF you wanted it to).
Financial income from health, fitness and diet industries are huge and very solid (solid by which I mean interest in them is unlike to ever change)
‘Gaming’ fitness has continued to increase in our day to day lives.
Right now you basically have a massive bunch of people, sitting around just waiting for the gates on Verra to open.
A bunch of people who may or may not want to be able to take part in preparing for the journey by improving their health in the real world.
I have personally put on four stone in two years and gone from running and weight lifting to sobbing uncontrollably when I realise that I have to stand up and walk a meter to get my mug of coffee.
Shame. Lots of shame
My only excuse is that I’ve just given birth and I’ve been too tired to move.
That said, I have just kicked off my fitness adventure again, and the best way I have found for me is to use the gaming tools available to me.
Right now the ones that I personally use are the zombies run (c25k app) and the nerd fitness site.
If you’ve never used them, you basically ‘level up’ as you use the app or website to improve your real life fitness and build your virtual stats. You get fitter, your avatar gets stronger.
Nerd fitness includes ‘class’ dependent fitness challenges
Zombies run includes ‘virtual races’ and base building via item collection.
It would not be at all difficult to see a ‘Return to Verra’ app where in you can participate in a variety of fitness ‘quests’, class or species dependent.
It can easily run side by side with the MMORPG or Apocalypse.
I have ‘walked mordor’ before and ‘climbed weathertop’ why not walk the lands that the races are returning from?
Race from coast to coast on the app in r/l and win a metal 3d printed computer designed verran trophy in r/l along with an in game title.
Scale it’s highest peak in the r/l app and get a custom in game climbing ‘action’
You already have a bunch of digital stock that gamers are hungry for, why not use those productively to drive and maintain interest by using them as teaser/incentive prizes for real life achievements?
You wouldn’t be giving away any lore or story unless you wanted to, as it could all be off ‘verra’.
The easiest route to take if this was something of interest, would be to approach a company with a well-established app to adapt to the AoC universe and set it up as a temporary app prior to launch.
Only temporary, because this would then give you figures of demand for such a product which you could consider launching by yourself or licensing off.
Personally, and I have absolutely no idea about business or any of this, I’d be wanting to put together a new kickstarter for a stand alone, fitness app development team, as a separate team and fundraiser they’d be no room for complaint about any intrepid previous kickstarters.
Though if that worked and any app was successful, I’d be tempted to keep any employees hired and set up an official ‘gaming fitness’ team, covering multiple avenues and products, especially given the huge demand already in place for these kind of things.
I’d just get the ball rolling swiftly and see where it took me, because the game is not going to be ‘pre launch’ forever.
Anyway, just a thought.
[P.S I lack the drive to try to put together a website with an 'unofficial' ashes fitness program, otherwise I'd be taking advantage of a potential income stream.
Whilst money doesn't motivate me, I can't say that I'd be terribly upset if you felt the idea here had any merit, and if anything were to come from it, to possibly 'thank' me with.... maybe some cosmetics or account upgrades?
Being a cheeky ar*e, Storybook]
4
Comments
https://knightsofember.com/forums/members/winner909098.54
Using the same models that they've already got? Oooooh the potential!
It would need it's own full development team, which is not exactly something you can just pick up at the corner store.
If they went into a partnership with six to start (zombies run) they could hand the development over to a preestablished team who can handle it.
Here in the UK, the economic climate is getting so touchy that you had 800 applicants, including those with doctorates applying for one receptionist job. So putting together an app team quickly might actually be realistic.
However there are also high numbers of pre established app development businesses who are ready and able to handle all of that straight away.
I genuinely don't see why it should impact the mmorpg at all.
Lyriss L'Enescor - Empyrean Cleric of Gray Sentinels
Besides, I really don't think that this app will be profitable, and even if it is, I don't think that they should deviate their focus/funds from the core game, which is AoC. They've already got a lot on their hands.
As to profitability I did an internet search on profits for zombies run, this was in the first few results, now I'm not saying I trust a random web page but it might have a touch of truth in it:
"Zombies, Run! by Six to Start earned $60k in estimated monthly revenue and was downloaded 300k times in July 2020. Analyze revenue and download data ..."
Thats an app that's not linked to one of the most anticipated mmo's either.
It's also not an app you have to pay for either those profits are most likely from other sources such as selling metric data to fitness companies that would like to know if everyone in town x runs for a long flat run or a short hilly run.
"hey bob, they all go up hills, we want our stock to be for hiking and hill running, not endurance trainers''
1. Learn to be a self motivator, you don't need games to keep you in shape.
2. You are just asking for a asset flip.
3. There are plenty of fitness games already on the market or trying to cut into the market.
4. It would be a colossal waste of development time.
5. Just because AoC has an audience does not mean that it is a audience that wants fitness side projects.
6. We have plenty of gaming in our day to day lives, we don't need more.
7. Intrepid is not missing out on a massive opportunity by staying focused on making sure there first game is good.
You have a "Diablo Immortal" tier idea.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
As to it not diverting focus - of course it will. Any story or lore written for that application would need to be new, and if it lore for Verra, Steven will need to approve it.
We are still waiting for him to approve the last few installments of the node videos.
Good catch! I did not even notice that. Selling consumer data would be a lost to the companies public image.
I know I would think less of them.
Also, AoC uses unreal. Not saying your idea would have to use unreal, but the future of unreal on mobile may be dicey for a while with apple being the way they be.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
A bad idea imho for exactly the reasons stated by Vhaeyne. Additionally apocalypse was already very bad PR, this one will make it even worse. Focus on the main game, make it good and spend the time to deliver on all the promises made.
This is better than the internalized crypto miner idea.
Ideas are just that sometimes they're good, sometimes they're as bad as a clout around the head with a wet herring..... and it appears that people are sure this one smells of fish.
Though I am personally still convinced that there's something in this, I guess the way to go is to pull a finger out of my arhrungha and do something 'unofficial' myself.
Though for what it's worth, sometimes having the desire to do something does not make acquiring the motivation to put that desire into action easy.
If it were, there would be no 'diet' industry, there wouldn't be an obesity epidemic, nor would there be anyone who struggled with establishing new habits every January, nor issues with addictions.
To those who say that you have to find the motivation from within yourself, yes that's totally true, but KEEPING the motivation, well that often takes any assistance you can get.
If you are someone who has never struggled with establishing a new habit or giving up an addiction nor ever had a problem doing something regularly that they know they should do, then I congratulate you on beating the human condition, because there really isn't a single person who doesn't suck at something.
Then again, and I can't think of any kind way of putting this, but if you are unaware of the prevalence of data collection within the app industry then you're either ignorant or naive.
If you don't understand the value of 'non-sensitive' information collected by almost every app you've ever downloaded to your phone, every app you've given permission to access your gps, or your photo's, then you really should go away and do research.
The companies that you no doubt already have given permission to on your phones, will use the 'non-sensitive' information, such as how far you go for a run, or how long you play that game for... as a financial asset, because EVERY bit of information can be used by someone for their benefit.
It wouldn't reflect poorly on Intrepid any more than it reflects poorly on every single other app creator out there.
And, I stress this again, I really don't understand the difficulty with grasping the concept of compartmentalising this idea from the MMORPG, both financially and developmentally.
Heck I can already come up with a decent idea without requiring any more input than intrepid has already given,.
They sold a pokeball (?) that was also a pedometer and you could upload your steps into the game or something?
@TheGoodzilla
Haha! I'm intrigued.
What people don't want is that spilling over to their desktop.
If a company has a working relationship with anyone that will pay money for this data, and that company also has invasive software on your computer with your permission (and with administrator access), then how long do you think it will be before there is some unwanted crossover happening there?
Like most people I know, I assume that everything done on my phone is tracked. I have my gaming computer set up in a way where that is not the case, and Intrepid forming a working relationship with a company that purchases this kind of data is not compatible with keeping that computer set up in that manner. There is a reason I have never looked seriously at New World.
Up until you pointed out the data aspect of the app, I was kind of on the fence. I wouldn't want to see Intrepid spend any time or money on this that would take away from the game (which I still think would happen), but if they managed to do it without it affecting the game then that would be fine.
As soon as you said that selling data would be the main source of information as you see it, I'm completely out.
This is true, and also a very low bar.
The idea to make Ashes a text only game is better than the crypto idea.
Virtue is the only good.
If you look back, I only mentioned it in SPECULATION of how six to start can rake in a monthly income of 60k, given that zombies run is now free to download and use.
And I wouldn't have had to mention any of that if someone hadn't queried whether a fitness tie in app could even be a profitable idea. Pokemon GO with it's 20m usd a month would have been a far better example of profitability, but less so for simplicity of design that any AoC tie in might tneed to begin with.
So please, take a moment to understand that it's a skeleton of an idea, very basic... sadly though people are disputing a brainstormed idea based on actual specifics, none of which exist....
I was attempting to explain an app linked to the ashes of creation universe, not Ashes of creation MMORPG itself, which is where others have also got hung up on.
Why would a fitness app use the unreal engine? You don't want to be distracted by a great game when your primary goal is to do exercise.
Please, allow me to start explaining how I would see it, afresh and right from the beginning again. If Intrepid did it, no doubt it'd be groundbreaking and completely different though.
(Also as an aside, I am no fitness expert, just an average fat layperson who once glanced at a barbell. You would need to get it properly laid out)
I was thinking very simple phone (portable) app.
I was thinking the whole thing being funded (through kickstarter) separately and other than basic lore, having no need for input from Intrepids team.
I was thinking, only the very basic Ashes of Creation info, because if it takes your interest, you might want to give the game a go.
Because of only the basics, and not spoiling any lore or stories, I was also thinking the whole app is based around you preparing to enter the gate and travel to Verra.
*edit* First before anything you'd have to go through the question / answer what kind of equipment you have access to, what are your goals etc.
Because you are in the real world yourself, because Verra should feel more 'real' and special, I personally thought that going along the whole wizard of oz route, by which I mean, you start in a black and white world, it's only when you enter 'oz' that colours burst to life. Ie when you play the MMO
My own thought had been a totally retro 64 bit pixel 'freehold' starting zone, where you have a choice to:
Select and equip your character
Go to the training grounds - standard generic workout guide etc then follows..
Explore the wild - You don't know what you'll face but details will change dependent upon your character/two artisan class selections...
Fight a boss - Random daily boss, with one chance to re-roll to a different boss a day (exercises and challenges based on your own personal progression)
Go to your freehold - General exercise guides, hints tips
A loot stash.
So, to choose your character, you have the Ashes mains:
Race (You can choose based on your own personal strengths weaknesses to complement you, challenge you, or just some race at random)
But all races have an advantage in one aspect of fitness, and a disadvantage in another. In the 'exercise/game' part it would possibly equate to an extra five reps or five minutes added or reduced etc. (Ie dwarves being upper body, orcs lower, elves flexibility, humans endurance etc etc.)
You'd want to focus on all main areas of fitness, such as balance, cardio, flexibility and muscle.
Theres a lot of sports and ways you can break that down, but I can't help but think that each class lends itself to a certain type of sport/workout/exercise style. Ie yoga or tai chi for clerics, plyometrics for rogues and heavy weights for tanks.
So the class and race you'd choose probably wouldn't be what you'd actually play in the game, it'd be much more tailored towards what you'd want out of a workout.
I would have a 5 button, quick click option after every set / exercise:
Was the exercise / weight -
1- Childsplay! Challenge me next time (App would suggest considering a heavier weight or more reps etc next time you do the same stuff, if bicep curls)
2 - Easy, but I'm not ready enough to move on yet.
3 - I can do it!
4 - Gosh that was hard
5 - Nope, I can't do that, I moved on too early! (go back to something easier)
By doing this the app could then help work out how well you're progressing, every little improvement, ie an extra rep is an increment towards your level increase.
If you go backwards within that exercise weight/length (Ie a level 5 back to a level one at a lower rate) because things were harder than expected you don't then lose xp, but don't gain it twice if you then move forwards again.
Boss fights scale to your actual ability, so player A on the app fighting bangor tooth rot, might have to lift twice the weight to defeat him than player B.
If that all works, you then think about adding a very small social option to create a 'group' to quest, so motivator, challenger etc, not to actually work out together, but because those are things that can help build habit.
Meh, there's lots, but that's just a half hour ramble to give an idea.
p.s And yeah, lets have artisan 3d modelling!
And yeah, fitness challenges based on verra world challenges etc. Virtual races etc.
And to everyone talking about motivation coming from within, that's great if you are fit, healthy or know where to begin, but they say the hardest part of getting to the gym is simply getting out the front door.
This would be a reason to take that step.
Im sure that everyone is doing something, but the idea would be for us to do something collectively. As for myself, I'm currently at about 150 miles of a 1,000 mile ruck march goal (and stream it) but its not for the faint of heart so I dont expect anyone to join me.
But perhaps we could have some community goal like "5 million jumping jacks for Ashes" where everyone contributes. There are of course problems with relying on the honor system for this, but I think it could be done.
thoughts?
Thing is, without a financial model (which can't include selling data, nor Intrepid developing the game in house), the idea will only ever be a skeleton.
The way in which a product like this will either sustain itself or (ideally) make a profit is the first thing that needs to be considered. So far, the only suggestion to that end has been roundly rejected. There is no real point in thinking up anything else to do with it until that situation has been dealt with.