Tragnar wrote: » Warth wrote: » Now sure how you got the ~1640 Number. However, Mythic N'zoth was killed by about 2350 Guilds, which equals 8.9% of the Players that attempted the Raid in a Mythic/Heroic Setting. 38.7% killed the first boss in the Mythic Raid. (74% and 61% for the Heroic versions). I took these number 2-3 months after the release of the raid. Right now the raid is almost 8months old and the power curve from other places has literally skyrocketted once again and as I said before, there are literally every week gold carries for mounts and achievements. Also the gap of difficulty between heroic and mythic is pretty extreme. As to show how @Tyrantor literally still doesnt understand the point we are making. So let me reiterate for hopefully another chance for him to understand the meaning behind these words. If you allow PvP to happen and at the same time you want to keep this quote from Steven true: It would definitely be in the single digits of population that will be capable of defeating certain content.. then you just need prevent the presence of more than 40 people, because if you don't then it is literally impossible to create challenging encounter that only "single digits of population that will be capable of defeating certain content". I understand guys that you come from PvP-centric open world games, but you should wake up, because PvE-centric open world games are possible and Ashes wants to be a blend of the two to allow the existence of both. I wouldn't be surprised if you ragequit the game after finding out that you are punished for unanswered PvP via corruption system.
Warth wrote: » Now sure how you got the ~1640 Number. However, Mythic N'zoth was killed by about 2350 Guilds, which equals 8.9% of the Players that attempted the Raid in a Mythic/Heroic Setting. 38.7% killed the first boss in the Mythic Raid. (74% and 61% for the Heroic versions).
It would definitely be in the single digits of population that will be capable of defeating certain content..
Hurf Derfman wrote: » Bricktop wrote: » Kneczhevo wrote: » @Bricktop Not knocking you, friend. But Intrepid is making a PvX Sandbox MMORPG. I'm not trying to be condescending, but once you understand the concept, it will be clear. Again, I know this might be confusing and foreign (a lot of AoC is.), just get your head out of the box, and you will see the light. 😁 I like you Knec, you make some solid posts around these forums that I've seen so far. I have played this exact type of game before in the form of Lineage 2 and Archeage and I feel very aware how the meta game will play out. The game is indeed PvX. PvX in that all systems are intertwined and dependent on 1 another. PvP, PvE, and crafting. You need to be able to do all of those things to find success in Ashes of Creation. To secure open world bosses you will need to be able to PvP other groups in order to secure the boss and make it safe for your group to kill. After you secure the area and kill the boss (PvE) it will drop crafting recipes and materials. You will need to utilize high level crafters to make the best gear in the game and reach an end game state. You can very easily see how it is PvX and all the systems are dependent on one another. You can apply this to pretty much any part of the game. Your guild will (possibly) fight for control of an open world dungeon entrance. Once you kill all the opposing guild members inside who you are at war with, your group starts to grind mobs inside the dungeon trying to get a recipe to drop or something along those lines. Your group will have to defend that grind spot and dungeon from other groups. You are PvPing and PvEing during this. I promise you this is very much what the devs meant when they said PvX. I agree it is confusing and foreign to a lot of people. I'm very confident you will understand though. In Black Desert Online you could flag at will on anyone without penalties. This was a common tactic used to protect farming lanes. I being a well geared Ninja would do as I pleased and could solo most 2v1 encounters and run and hide against anything too nasty. That being said; You could summon minor world bosses with a scroll, and pick up groups would form to maximize scroll efficiency, granted it's been almost about 2 years since I played BDO, but I never saw PVP break out in these areas in the two and a half years I played the game. Well that's not entirely true, it happened a couple of times and the aggressors got wrecked. 🤷™️
Bricktop wrote: » Kneczhevo wrote: » @Bricktop Not knocking you, friend. But Intrepid is making a PvX Sandbox MMORPG. I'm not trying to be condescending, but once you understand the concept, it will be clear. Again, I know this might be confusing and foreign (a lot of AoC is.), just get your head out of the box, and you will see the light. 😁 I like you Knec, you make some solid posts around these forums that I've seen so far. I have played this exact type of game before in the form of Lineage 2 and Archeage and I feel very aware how the meta game will play out. The game is indeed PvX. PvX in that all systems are intertwined and dependent on 1 another. PvP, PvE, and crafting. You need to be able to do all of those things to find success in Ashes of Creation. To secure open world bosses you will need to be able to PvP other groups in order to secure the boss and make it safe for your group to kill. After you secure the area and kill the boss (PvE) it will drop crafting recipes and materials. You will need to utilize high level crafters to make the best gear in the game and reach an end game state. You can very easily see how it is PvX and all the systems are dependent on one another. You can apply this to pretty much any part of the game. Your guild will (possibly) fight for control of an open world dungeon entrance. Once you kill all the opposing guild members inside who you are at war with, your group starts to grind mobs inside the dungeon trying to get a recipe to drop or something along those lines. Your group will have to defend that grind spot and dungeon from other groups. You are PvPing and PvEing during this. I promise you this is very much what the devs meant when they said PvX. I agree it is confusing and foreign to a lot of people. I'm very confident you will understand though.
Kneczhevo wrote: » @Bricktop Not knocking you, friend. But Intrepid is making a PvX Sandbox MMORPG. I'm not trying to be condescending, but once you understand the concept, it will be clear. Again, I know this might be confusing and foreign (a lot of AoC is.), just get your head out of the box, and you will see the light. 😁
Malapapas wrote: » Not sure if its been said but GW2 has a mechanic were the more players that enter the mobs/events area the higher the mobs scale i.e. basic > veteran >elite > champion mobs.. a similar mechanic in AoC combined with the player v player element will probably lead to the mobs winning at the end of the day lol...
Tyrantor wrote: » I see you purposely ignored my proposal I made to you and the other epic npc encounter blowhards. I take it that by denial of response you and the rest of the lackies here simply want safe farming as has been pointed out and it has nothing to do with "top tier guild PvE content" and more to do with "Top tier loot content away from PvP". Any argument the three of you make going forward is here on out pure bullshit, half truths and/or lies to push a safe PvE agenda.
Bricktop wrote: » Tragnar wrote: » I understand guys that you come from PvP-centric open world games, but you should wake up, because PvE-centric open world games are possible and Ashes wants to be a blend of the two to allow the existence of both. I wouldn't be surprised if you ragequit the game after finding out that you are punished for unanswered PvP via corruption system. Hahaha A PvE centric game isn't what they are making Tragnar. That's why the world changes on node sieges and not killing dragons. Everybody in this thread who PvPs understands how the corruption system works, half of us already played it in L2. I can assure you the only people who are gonna be ragequitting are PvE players (WoW raiders let's be honest) who are disappointed by the lack of instancing. Some of them have already been threatening to quit in this thread and the other one if they don't get their way and they slowly realize how much PvP is actually in the game. I would much rather see PvE players quit than the game get New Worlded.
Tragnar wrote: » I understand guys that you come from PvP-centric open world games, but you should wake up, because PvE-centric open world games are possible and Ashes wants to be a blend of the two to allow the existence of both. I wouldn't be surprised if you ragequit the game after finding out that you are punished for unanswered PvP via corruption system.
Bricktop wrote: » Hurf Derfman wrote: » Bricktop wrote: » Kneczhevo wrote: » @Bricktop Not knocking you, friend. But Intrepid is making a PvX Sandbox MMORPG. I'm not trying to be condescending, but once you understand the concept, it will be clear. Again, I know this might be confusing and foreign (a lot of AoC is.), just get your head out of the box, and you will see the light. 😁 I like you Knec, you make some solid posts around these forums that I've seen so far. I have played this exact type of game before in the form of Lineage 2 and Archeage and I feel very aware how the meta game will play out. The game is indeed PvX. PvX in that all systems are intertwined and dependent on 1 another. PvP, PvE, and crafting. You need to be able to do all of those things to find success in Ashes of Creation. To secure open world bosses you will need to be able to PvP other groups in order to secure the boss and make it safe for your group to kill. After you secure the area and kill the boss (PvE) it will drop crafting recipes and materials. You will need to utilize high level crafters to make the best gear in the game and reach an end game state. You can very easily see how it is PvX and all the systems are dependent on one another. You can apply this to pretty much any part of the game. Your guild will (possibly) fight for control of an open world dungeon entrance. Once you kill all the opposing guild members inside who you are at war with, your group starts to grind mobs inside the dungeon trying to get a recipe to drop or something along those lines. Your group will have to defend that grind spot and dungeon from other groups. You are PvPing and PvEing during this. I promise you this is very much what the devs meant when they said PvX. I agree it is confusing and foreign to a lot of people. I'm very confident you will understand though. In Black Desert Online you could flag at will on anyone without penalties. This was a common tactic used to protect farming lanes. I being a well geared Ninja would do as I pleased and could solo most 2v1 encounters and run and hide against anything too nasty. That being said; You could summon minor world bosses with a scroll, and pick up groups would form to maximize scroll efficiency, granted it's been almost about 2 years since I played BDO, but I never saw PVP break out in these areas in the two and a half years I played the game. Well that's not entirely true, it happened a couple of times and the aggressors got wrecked. 🤷™️ @Hurf Derfman I never played BDO Hurf, so I apologize that I can't envision what you are saying. I don't think you will be able to summon bosses at will in Ashes of Creation, so the world bosses in the game will absolutely be a place of contention between guilds. What would most likely happen is a long quest line to get a summoning item for the boss or something. PvP is gonna happen often and it will happen at a lot of PvE places such as dungeons and world bosses. We also need more information on the guild war mechanics. Are guild wars going to be a situation where they could run an extremely long amount of time? Or are they going to be settled in a 2 hour max window. If they do short guild wars like that it will cut down on world PvP quite a bit.
Noaani wrote: » The thing some of us also want though, are a few - literally just a few - areas where only PvE will happen. If done right, there will be PvP leading to these locations, and more PvP getting home from them. All it would mean is that there are a few encounters in the game where players can actually PvE properly, just as there are times in the game where people can PvP properly.
Vhaeyne wrote: » Noaani wrote: » The thing some of us also want though, are a few - literally just a few - areas where only PvE will happen. If done right, there will be PvP leading to these locations, and more PvP getting home from them. All it would mean is that there are a few encounters in the game where players can actually PvE properly, just as there are times in the game where people can PvP properly. Agreed, what I would not like is "bubbles" on that world map that are PvE only areas. I think I suggested in this thread or another thread about a week ago that doing something similar to the POE map system for top tier PVE raid bosses would be a possible solution. Having a "Map Device" that is fueled by tokens that drop from the push over world bosses would make a lot of sense. You could have the device in the guild hall or something. It could even allow clans to diversify there ranks. Have people who prefer PvP go fetch the map while the hard core raiders run it when they bring it home.
Bricktop wrote: » Tragnar wrote: » I understand guys that you come from PvP-centric open world games, but you should wake up, because PvE-centric open world games are possible and Ashes wants to be a blend of the two to allow the existence of both. I wouldn't be surprised if you ragequit the game after finding out that you are punished for unanswered PvP via corruption system. Hahaha A PvE centric game isn't what they are making @Tragnar. That's why the world changes on node sieges and not killing dragons. Everybody in this thread who PvPs understands how the corruption system works, half of us already played it in L2. I can assure you the only people who are gonna be ragequitting are PvE players (WoW raiders let's be honest) who are disappointed by the lack of instancing. Some of them have already been threatening to quit in this thread and the other one if they don't get their way and they slowly realize how much PvP is actually in the game. I would much rather see PvE players quit than the game get New Worlded.
Tragnar wrote: » Ashes wants to be a blend of the two to allow the existence of both.
Noaani wrote: » Tyrantor wrote: » I see you purposely ignored my proposal I made to you and the other epic npc encounter blowhards. I take it that by denial of response you and the rest of the lackies here simply want safe farming as has been pointed out and it has nothing to do with "top tier guild PvE content" and more to do with "Top tier loot content away from PvP". Any argument the three of you make going forward is here on out pure bullshit, half truths and/or lies to push a safe PvE agenda. Actually, I didn't address it because you don't understand what is being asked, and I don't feel any need for your approval, nor for you to concede any point. You are not educated in PvE content enough to add value to this topic.
Noaani wrote: » Very few people are asking for instances farming content. Some are, sure. But not most. What most people want are instances for the sake of having an actual PvE experience in Ashes that isn't interrupted by PvP.
Tragnar wrote: » If you make it possible for every place in the open world to be decided by PvP then you have literally no PvE in the game, because any kill of an NPC is a reward by your PvP status and most of the times is absolutely tied to be difficult only with PvP present during the fight
Tyrantor wrote: » Well based on your own words, I'm offering you that an "actual PvE experince in ashes that ins't iterrupted by PvP" What you got wrong, apparently, is that you and everyone else is in FACT asking for instances farming content not " Very few"
Tyrantor wrote: » Not every PvE engagement in game is going to be interrupted by PvP even if players have the option to PvP, there will be days you likely never even experience PvP
Noaani wrote: » The real issue I think you have is that you know perfectly well that you are not cut out for real PvE content - no PvP players are. In my experience of both a PvE only game and a PvP centric game, PvE players are better suited to PvP than PvP players are to PvE.
Bricktop wrote: » Noaani wrote: » The real issue I think you have is that you know perfectly well that you are not cut out for real PvE content - no PvP players are. In my experience of both a PvE only game and a PvP centric game, PvE players are better suited to PvP than PvP players are to PvE. This is without a doubt the funniest thing I have ever read on this forum. Stand out of fire, do DPS rotation, avoid 3 abilities, and win free gear is hard to you as opposed to playing against an actual thinking opponent with a brain who isn't completely scripted, researchable, and predictable. You are just being downright silly at this point.
Noaani wrote: » Bricktop wrote: » Noaani wrote: » The real issue I think you have is that you know perfectly well that you are not cut out for real PvE content - no PvP players are. In my experience of both a PvE only game and a PvP centric game, PvE players are better suited to PvP than PvP players are to PvE. This is without a doubt the funniest thing I have ever read on this forum. Stand out of fire, do DPS rotation, avoid 3 abilities, and win free gear is hard to you as opposed to playing against an actual thinking opponent with a brain who isn't completely scripted, researchable, and predictable. You are just being downright silly at this point. Congratulations, you killed a trash mob.
Bricktop wrote: » Noaani wrote: » Bricktop wrote: » Noaani wrote: » The real issue I think you have is that you know perfectly well that you are not cut out for real PvE content - no PvP players are. In my experience of both a PvE only game and a PvP centric game, PvE players are better suited to PvP than PvP players are to PvE. This is without a doubt the funniest thing I have ever read on this forum. Stand out of fire, do DPS rotation, avoid 3 abilities, and win free gear is hard to you as opposed to playing against an actual thinking opponent with a brain who isn't completely scripted, researchable, and predictable. You are just being downright silly at this point. Congratulations, you killed a trash mob. Congrats, I just killed most raid bosses. I Cleared all of SSC/TK and most of BT before i got bored of WoW and ended my time raiding. It's just not very challenging to me, sorry.
Noaani wrote: » Bricktop wrote: » Noaani wrote: » Bricktop wrote: » Noaani wrote: » The real issue I think you have is that you know perfectly well that you are not cut out for real PvE content - no PvP players are. In my experience of both a PvE only game and a PvP centric game, PvE players are better suited to PvP than PvP players are to PvE. This is without a doubt the funniest thing I have ever read on this forum. Stand out of fire, do DPS rotation, avoid 3 abilities, and win free gear is hard to you as opposed to playing against an actual thinking opponent with a brain who isn't completely scripted, researchable, and predictable. You are just being downright silly at this point. Congratulations, you killed a trash mob. Congrats, I just killed most raid bosses. I Cleared all of SSC/TK and most of BT before i got bored of WoW and ended my time raiding. It's just not very challenging to me, sorry. As I said, trash mobs. WoW raiding isn't really raiding. I assist my brothers guild with mythical raids in WoW on occasion, they are not hard. I've played I think five different classes (though I admit, never a tank), and it never takes me more than one pull to get the hang of both the new class and the new encounter - and that is without having ever leveled a character up in that game, or even owning an account other than a trial. Honestly, if WoW raids are the best we can hope for in regards to PvE in this game, I'll stay away from MMO's for a while. Fortunately, this game has a lot of ex-EQ2 developers making it.
Bricktop wrote: » Noaani wrote: » Bricktop wrote: » Noaani wrote: » Bricktop wrote: » Noaani wrote: » The real issue I think you have is that you know perfectly well that you are not cut out for real PvE content - no PvP players are. In my experience of both a PvE only game and a PvP centric game, PvE players are better suited to PvP than PvP players are to PvE. This is without a doubt the funniest thing I have ever read on this forum. Stand out of fire, do DPS rotation, avoid 3 abilities, and win free gear is hard to you as opposed to playing against an actual thinking opponent with a brain who isn't completely scripted, researchable, and predictable. You are just being downright silly at this point. Congratulations, you killed a trash mob. Congrats, I just killed most raid bosses. I Cleared all of SSC/TK and most of BT before i got bored of WoW and ended my time raiding. It's just not very challenging to me, sorry. As I said, trash mobs. WoW raiding isn't really raiding. I assist my brothers guild with mythical raids in WoW on occasion, they are not hard. I've played I think five different classes (though I admit, never a tank), and it never takes me more than one pull to get the hang of both the new class and the new encounter - and that is without having ever leveled a character up in that game, or even owning an account other than a trial. Honestly, if WoW raids are the best we can hope for in regards to PvE in this game, I'll stay away from MMO's for a while. Fortunately, this game has a lot of ex-EQ2 developers making it. Lol what is with PvErs and smugness. What is the purpose of this post exactly? Sorry my raids weren't good enough for you @Noaani . Im happy for your brothers WoW guild? The last thing we all want is for you to stay away from MMORPGs, seeing as you are incredibly important to all of us.
