Noaani wrote: » Maezriel wrote: » I disagree. I disagree. Developers should develop the game and gameplay to be as they want it. At that point - and no sooner - they should look and see if that gameplay is compatible with a controller. If it is compatible, then they should go to the effort of making it work. If the gameplay is not compatible, they should not put that effort in. Basically, games shouldn't be designed around a need to have controller support - but should have it if it makes sense when the gameplay is developed.
Maezriel wrote: » I disagree.
Maezriel wrote: » So basically ignore my entire comment about those who can't physically use a mouse and keyboard?
Maezriel wrote: » When you include all trigger and bumpers as modifiers controllers have easier access to far more hotkeys than a traditional mouse and keyboard setup.
Noaani wrote: » Maezriel wrote: » So basically ignore my entire comment about those who can't physically use a mouse and keyboard? Yes, completely. If a game is enjoyable to people but the gameplay itself makes it not suited to people with a disability of some form, why should the develoeprs have to make that game less enjoyable? If we were talking about a large number of games, then I would agree that something does need to be done. However, we are not, we are talking about only a small number of games - as almost all games are simple enough to be easily played with a controller. Edit; as to basic functionality with a controller, that doesn't need developer support.
FuryBladeborne wrote: » Maezriel wrote: » When you include all trigger and bumpers as modifiers controllers have easier access to far more hotkeys than a traditional mouse and keyboard setup. I can't pass this up. A keyboard = all the commands in existence going through a computer. Also, using control, shift, and alt as modifiers, I could turn just the keys on the left hand of the keyboard into over 100 commands. That's just the keys immediately under my left hand. I guess the traditional mouse that you cite doesn't even matter at this point.
Maezriel wrote: » Even WoW can be played w/ a controller through a third party addon w/ absolutely zero changes to it's gameplay.
Maezriel wrote: » You would lose nothing by Intrepid coding a basic level of controller interaction into the game and pretending otherwise to excuse excluding disabled people is just plain stupid.
Maezriel wrote: » It depends on how modifiers are implemented for a controller. Keyboard might have a greater number of keys, but you're still generally limited to the reach of one hand.
Maezriel wrote: » allow players to interact w/ the world and keybind abilities through a controller in order to include as many people as they can regardless of physical disabilities. Designing games to be inclusive to a wider playerbase should not be an afterthought.
Noaani wrote: » Maezriel wrote: » Even WoW can be played w/ a controller through a third party addon w/ absolutely zero changes to it's gameplay. You realize WoW has the simplest gameplay of any MMO out there, right? I mean, it is possible to write a macro for some classes and participate in a number of raids using a single button. Maezriel wrote: » You would lose nothing by Intrepid coding a basic level of controller interaction into the game and pretending otherwise to excuse excluding disabled people is just plain stupid. I'm also not saying they shouldn't do it. What I am saying is they shouldn't specifically design the gameplay around the need for it, if the gameplay would be better if they did something that made it unfeasable for controllers to be used, then they shouldn't be prevented from making the gameplay better in order to implement controllers. I am also specifically saying they SHOULD implement controller support if - after the gameplay is developed - it makes sense to do so. Pick your battles a bit better.
Maezriel wrote: » Noaani wrote: » Maezriel wrote: » Even WoW can be played w/ a controller through a third party addon w/ absolutely zero changes to it's gameplay. You realize WoW has the simplest gameplay of any MMO out there, right? I mean, it is possible to write a macro for some classes and participate in a number of raids using a single button. Maezriel wrote: » You would lose nothing by Intrepid coding a basic level of controller interaction into the game and pretending otherwise to excuse excluding disabled people is just plain stupid. I'm also not saying they shouldn't do it. What I am saying is they shouldn't specifically design the gameplay around the need for it, if the gameplay would be better if they did something that made it unfeasable for controllers to be used, then they shouldn't be prevented from making the gameplay better in order to implement controllers. I am also specifically saying they SHOULD implement controller support if - after the gameplay is developed - it makes sense to do so. Pick your battles a bit better. Color blindness was brought up last stream. Should Intrepid wait until all the effects are finalized before considering colorblind options and controls? What about hearing? What if Intrepid felt audio queues were important to the game? Hell, many players aren't deaf but prefer to play w/ game sounds muted as they mindlessly grind w/ Netflix in the background...should we "wait until gameplay is finished" before considering not forcing audio queues? Or? Maybe it's better to have accessibility options in mind before spending months, if not years, finalizing something and then realizing you need to go back and shovel something new in. I'm not the one claiming disabled gamers should be an afterthought to my personal enjoyment so I'm quiet comfortable w/ this hill I'm on. I'm not the one who should pick a better fight here.
Blair wrote: » I played WOW classic with a controller and I loved it. I played retail, neverwinter, ESO etc there all great with a controller. As for the 30 ability's thing, no one has a 30 button rotation especially when the hot bar only holds 13.
