Be honest, what do you expect from AOC and how long are you willing to wait?

I am seeing in various comments on U2, twitter, Reddit, etc, that you think that AOC must be the definitive WOW KILLER, the new MMO chosen by the gods and that should come out fast.

Calm down guys

AOC does not pretend to be the new WOW killer, AOC wants to be AOC working for its community, improving itself little by little and becoming what they and their community want it to be.

As Steve said, there will be many errors and that is the best of all, to improve something you have to go step by step seeing errors and improving it, nothing starts being the best and that is why they are working with their community, with the alpha players to give us in the future what their community and they want.

I hope they take time, I prefer an MMO with a very solid base to be able to work on it and improve over time than an MMO that comes out quickly but does not have a solid base.

In short, I would not care if AOC comes out in 2025 or 2026, I would wait for it, since seeing the effort they are making, the problems they have had (Jeff's departure), and the future problems they may have, I know very well that It is a LONG FIGHT to create from scratch a project that is thinking to give the MMO community the MMO they deserve.

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daveywavey

I'm expecting a fun game with well thought out systems and mechanics. I'm willing to wait until it's ready.

Andy

I hope AoC will follow Steven guideline and won't transform into an another "fast food themepark MMORPG".

Conrad

Aoc already pretty much persuaded me. I'm just waiting for the right cosmetic pack.

ThexBlackxKnight

As long as Ashes doesnt launch at the same time as Elder Scrolls 6 , I am good.

Patsold

For me it's a race, the first good mmorpg that comes out and makes me feel good, I'll stick with it. .

Sry AoC :P

Talents

Well atm there's no other upcoming game that has what I want to the degree that Ashes does. ArcheAge 2 was probably going to but according to recent rumours it's actually gonna be a mobile MMORPG so that's a fat no from me. Riot's MMORPG is probably gonna be a relatively generic PvE themepark (but a good one). New World is ass. I'd be fine waiting until like 2025, and even then I'd still play the game when it launched if it did launch after that.

Muricall

I am looking at AoC as the last chance for me and MMORPGs. Recently I just quit WoW and Blizzard definitively cause I am just sick of it, as I am sick of the whole genre. Monotony, uncreativity, and unethical decisions regarding payment/service models(from Kickstarter till sustain costs and beyond ) define the state of the art.
If AoC will release in 2-3 years I am going to give it a try,(and crank the fuck out of it xD) if not I am done with the genre.
long story short: My Expectations are high, high as they should have been for a long time.

Zeshio

I really don't get this thing about anyone saying AoC is a WoW killer. I feel like you're saying that just to put some grand statement out there, because it's certainly not on Reddit, and I haven't really seen it here either except for the occasional super excited person.

The truth is we're all just waiting for that next great (or good) MMO that will pull us in. There's an obvious waiting game to this as games get developed, and people will continue to wait until they find what they want. Simple as that.

Inixia

Zeshio wrote: »

I really don't get this thing about anyone saying AoC is a WoW killer. I feel like you're saying that just to put some grand statement out there, because it's certainly not on Reddit, and I haven't really seen it here either except for the occasional super excited person.

I think I agree with this, I'm not sure anything can be a WoW killer until it finally burns out on its own. WoW is not really a game running on merit at this point, its less a game in the traditional sense and more nostalgia for built up content and social connections that formed years ago when it released at the at the right time/climate... that all kind of feeds itself.

Saedu

Zeshio wrote: »

I really don't get this thing about anyone saying AoC is a WoW killer. I feel like you're saying that just to put some grand statement out there, because it's certainly not on Reddit, and I haven't really seen it here either except for the occasional super excited person.

The truth is we're all just waiting for that next great (or good) MMO that will pull us in. There's an obvious waiting game to this as games get developed, and people will continue to wait until they find what they want. Simple as that.

I don't think anyone is saying it's a WoW killer. Steven has explicitly stated that is not his objective. However, WoW is ripe for significant attrition and it would be wise for IS to capitalize on this by introducing a "new" type of dynamic open world focused MMO to these players. This game needs to appeal to both the current base as well as new to truly succeed. It's too ambitious of a project to not require attracting a large user base to keep it funded long term.

Regardless, it needs to be good/fun and it needs to move the MMO ecosystem fundamentally forward by taking the best elements from past MMOs and adding new innovative/fun experiences. If it cannot do this within about 2 years it will probably be as @Noaani is predicting. I think it has potential to achieve this goal if the quality is there, the node/siege systems turn out to be as exciting as they look, and the game isn't too punishing/grindy (I don't think there are enough players out there who enjoy the highly punishing grind games. It doesn't need to be as soft as casual WoW either... The risk/reward needs to be balanced and moving character progression forward at a good pace).

This game cannot just be Lineage 3 (or another super hardcore/PvP only MMO) or it won't survive more than a few years. It cannot be just nostalgia. It needs to be innovative.

Oh, and the class name "Tank" needs to change to something like "Warrior" or "Guardian" (tank/tank can be renamed to something like "Eternal Guardian"). The augments + gear need to be strong/meaningful enough with tradeoffs that allows a single character to change roles and be fully viable (or to be a hybrid between two roles, but master of neither if augments are only partially applied). This greatly enhances the long term playability of a character, which is increasingly important the more time it takes to level up a character.

Exiled King

been waiting almost 5 years....hopefully it releases soon......really need a new MMO game.

RocketFarmer

For when it releases, anyone have a pool going on for that?

While Steven views it as a PVX game, I think most will refer it as a PVP MMO. That perspective might change if the content for PVE and the entire node system knocks it out of the park.

Not a WoW killer. The game may, however, influence the development of other games if it is good enough.

Hardcore players will keep playing indefinitely.

How soon does the first wave of players move on to the next game? Again, depends on the content and how fast they burn through it. It’s a reason I think a game needs to figure out the replayability factor, and that may require quantum computers to generate more sophisticated AI and story elements on the fly that is unique to each character each time. Obviously not a today thing. So a good number of players will do as they always do. Hop from one new game to the next until the newness wears off. I don’t think that’s Intrepid’s market. That said, nodes may be the closest thing the game has to providing “new” content that changes over time.

If the crafting system is better than most, and the annoyance of PVP doesn’t run them off, the players who are into that should have plenty to do.

For me, given the early state of the game plus a history of developers promising something just too good to be true or flat out failure to deliver, I am in wait and see mode. Nothing personal, it’s just the nature of this industry.

Noaani

RocketFarmer wrote: »

While Steven views it as a PVX game, I think most will refer it as a PVP MMO.

This is what I have been saying for a while.

Any content in which the outcome is mostly determined by who wins PvP, is PvP content.

The flag in capture the flag does not count as PvE, nor does an open world encounter.

So far, I have seen nothing at all in Ashes that makes me think the term PvX is anything more than marketing - there is no actual meaning behind it.

The way this game used to be talked about (by Intrepid) was that the PvP existed as a catalyst for change of the PvE content. This change is both in terms of the content as a whole via the node system, but also on a smaller scale where the results of PvE can change hands via PvP.

The thing with this as a game foundation is that it requires the PvE to be of high quality. If PvP exists as a catalyst of change to PvE, if the PvE isnt worth it, then the catalyst to change it isnt worth it either.

What we have right now is open world content that will be bested by whoever's wins at PvP, the rewards of that content will be claimed by whoever's wins at PvP, and the content itself will be determined by whoever's wins at PvP.

This is not a PvX game. Even without any real definition of what a PvX game is, this is not it unless L2, Archeage, Darkfall, Wildstar, EVE, BDO and Albion are also PvX games.

In other words, Ashes is just another game that exists so that PvP can exist, so that more PvP can exist, so that more PvP can exist.

This is why I have no doubt that with what we know of the game so far, it will endure the same fate as every other MMO that existed so that PvP could exist, so that more PvP could exist, so that more PvP could exist.

This is a shame.

Even though I spent years playing Archeage and enjoying myself there, I wanted more from Ashes.

Warth

The closer this ends up to a fantasy mmo version of eve, the happier i am with the result.

Willing to wait? Forever as i'm not waiting for it. No point wasting a second thought until close to release

Eloc

If we look at the game from a marketing perspective you can draw a better and smarter conclusion to when they SHOULD launch. Final Fantasy 14 is set to release its final expansion Endwalker this fall. That gives that game about 15-18 months from launch till the presumable end of the road. WoW suffers from a complete lack of enthusiasm from development. Understandable as i dont think they were thinking the game had 20 years of run time in it. It is time for WoW to end, to give blizzard a new start at a new game with new development talent with enthusiasm and commitment to put out something that isnt repetative vomit. WoW is being chocked for every penny by Activision and they know the game is dying and they are just fleecing every penny they can out of it on the way down. New World looks to be a flash in the pan game, big pretty sparkles at launch to crickets in 2 months.

2025 - 2026 launch would be a disaster for this game. Hype is at a peak right now and the longer you wait the more stale the community will be. Why even have an alpha\beta 4 years before release? that just makes no sense from a development perspective. All we have told them so far is that combat needs major reform before it can be fun. And it needs to be fun. Good combat is the absolute core of the game as thats what we the players will spend most of our time doing and will be the lynch pin of success. A beta should happen 3-6 months prior to a release to find hard bugs not crowdsource dev ideas.

This game needs to try hard for a 4th quarter 2022 release. even if it lacks some content it would buy them the 6 months they would need to get a hardy patch out in time to keep people playing. I doubt that will hit that mark but they need to hit the summer 2023 launch table. That is prime time to convert all the players leaving the other major MMO's

I see a 2023 launch, in order to effectively hit the power vacuum that is in place

Noaani

Now, while my thoughts are somewhat documented above, I do feel I have to say...

Eloc wrote: »

2025 - 2026 launch would be a disaster for this game.

Not as much of a disaster as launching an incomplete/buggy game.

Ashes is better off being released without the same level of hype (even though that can be generated later) than it is releasing and becoming the next No Mans Sky.

Dygz

We still have to officially hit Alpha One.

Venessa

I'm willing to wait long enough - that being 2024(ish), I agree a lot with what @roost said. They explained the issues and implications of a long development time extremely well. I'm all for being patient and giving the time the team needs, after all it gives me more time to get myself into a comfortable position where I can balance work and studies with gaming! But taking too long will definitely kill the hype and bring more negativity towards the game.

As for what I expect? Not much, and not too little either. I expect them to implement everything they are promising, and continue developing to the high standard they're setting for themselves, and doing so with consistent care. I also really enjoy PvP (despite not being the best at it), so I allow myself to be a little more hopeful that the combat will be something that will allow me to immerse myself in PvP. In line with their action/tab target hybrid combat aim, I'm hoping it'll have some similarities to BnS, and just feel smooth y'know. I want that feeling of truly enjoying PvP again.

Overall, I'm just expecting this game to be something I can use all my free time on

I miss playing MMOs.

Conrad

Saedu wrote: »

Zeshio wrote: »

I really don't get this thing about anyone saying AoC is a WoW killer. I feel like you're saying that just to put some grand statement out there, because it's certainly not on Reddit, and I haven't really seen it here either except for the occasional super excited person.

The truth is we're all just waiting for that next great (or good) MMO that will pull us in. There's an obvious waiting game to this as games get developed, and people will continue to wait until they find what they want. Simple as that.

I don't think anyone is saying it's a WoW killer. Steven has explicitly stated that is not his objective. However, WoW is ripe for significant attrition and it would be wise for IS to capitalize on this by introducing a "new" type of dynamic open world focused MMO to these players. This game needs to appeal to both the current base as well as new to truly succeed. It's too ambitious of a project to not require attracting a large user base to keep it funded long term.

Regardless, it needs to be good/fun and it needs to move the MMO ecosystem fundamentally forward by taking the best elements from past MMOs and adding new innovative/fun experiences. If it cannot do this within about 2 years it will probably be as @Noaani is predicting. I think it has potential to achieve this goal if the quality is there, the node/siege systems turn out to be as exciting as they look, and the game isn't too punishing/grindy (I don't think there are enough players out there who enjoy the highly punishing grind games. It doesn't need to be as soft as casual WoW either... The risk/reward needs to be balanced and moving character progression forward at a good pace).

This game cannot just be Lineage 3 (or another super hardcore/PvP only MMO) or it won't survive more than a few years. It cannot be just nostalgia. It needs to be innovative.

Oh, and the class name "Tank" needs to change to something like "Warrior" or "Guardian" (tank/tank can be renamed to something like "Eternal Guardian"). The augments + gear need to be strong/meaningful enough with tradeoffs that allows a single character to change roles and be fully viable (or to be a hybrid between two roles, but master of neither if augments are only partially applied). This greatly enhances the long term playability of a character, which is increasingly important the more time it takes to level up a character.

Should be called Warden. 100% fits and sounds epic

Selo

I hope that AoC will stay true to what they said and go back to the mmorpgs of old and doesnt turn into another fortnite AC BR

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