Dygz wrote: » I don't see it. I don't think I would be paying attention to chat bubbles during a fight, but...maybe you can post a link that shows what you mean.
Vhaeyne wrote: » Dygz wrote: » I don't see it. I don't think I would be paying attention to chat bubbles during a fight, but...maybe you can post a link that shows what you mean. I think he means like this:https://youtu.be/PsMH4BX2h3U?t=767 Edit:Around 12:50 you can see it clearly. Time link did not work for me. You can see that DBM injects the mechanics timer into chat, so the raid can see when it via the chat bubble. Something I don't think we will have to worry about with Ashes. Not because we won't have meters, but because it is easier to prevent third-party programs from doing things like this. Instead of injecting numbers you could just have the text like "Stack on me" or "Spread". We also won't have macros. So, tanks could not make a macro for skills like ones that I have seen FFXIV paladins use. They have a CD called "Passage of Arms" that creates a cone of protection around them while they hold out their shield. It is a very cool and useful positional if people stand in it, but they need to be reminded. The macro makes it so the tank types "Stand behind me!" or something in party chat when he casts the skill. I think the best solution for Ashes is to keep not having macros and not supporting third-party programs, but to instead have a system of easy to identify raid mechanics like this:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSgaau-sOc8 I always have to remind people that these easy mechanics are the skill floor for FFXIVs PvE mechanics. FFXIV does this because it is also a game that is very against add-ons. An add-on called "Paisley park" surfaced for ACT about a year ago. It would automatically place markers on the battlefield. Square was so mad about the destructiveness of this add-on that they completely rewrote the way markers are placed and made it so markers cannot be placed in combat. They did this in a single patch and made it bannable. Personally, I really like FFXIV's built in system of common mechanics because it is a happy medium between DBM and nothing.
Maezriel wrote: » As for your take on macros I don't agree. There's a huge divide between automating your rotation like in some expansions in WoW and being able to click a button to bark your guild recruitment. A basic macro system wouldn't break the game in any way.
The issue with macros is that from an anti cheat metric perspective it's difficult to define what a macro is against a script. And in order to catch all scripts sometimes you have to prevent the macro usage. So really that's a that's a data issue. If we allow for macros then we lose our ability to precisely ban script users, botters.[6] – Steven Sharif
Vhaeyne wrote: » You can see that DBM injects the mechanics timer into chat, so the raid can see when it via the chat bubble. Something I don't think we will have to worry about with Ashes. Not because we won't have meters, but because it is easier to prevent third-party programs from doing things like this. Instead of injecting numbers you could just have the text like "Stack on me" or "Spread".
Dygz wrote: » Vhaeyne wrote: » You can see that DBM injects the mechanics timer into chat, so the raid can see when it via the chat bubble. Something I don't think we will have to worry about with Ashes. Not because we won't have meters, but because it is easier to prevent third-party programs from doing things like this. Instead of injecting numbers you could just have the text like "Stack on me" or "Spread". Again, I think that's already covered by that "giant global text" Steven, Maggie and Toast use to give us directions for forming a raid or how to prep for the next siege. Seems likely raid leaders will have access to that.
Vhaeyne wrote: » Maezriel wrote: » As for your take on macros I don't agree. There's a huge divide between automating your rotation like in some expansions in WoW and being able to click a button to bark your guild recruitment. A basic macro system wouldn't break the game in any way. Not my take on macros. They just are not expected to be in the game. I think there are other instances of Intrepid saying there will not be macro support, but this is the one on the wiki: The issue with macros is that from an anti cheat metric perspective it's difficult to define what a macro is against a script. And in order to catch all scripts sometimes you have to prevent the macro usage. So really that's a that's a data issue. If we allow for macros then we lose our ability to precisely ban script users, botters.[6] – Steven Sharif I worded my response above as if that is common knowledge because I have seen a few threads this last year complaining about no macros. Specifically, old and disabled people really want macros. Personally, I see macros as a tool. If a situation calls for that tool, I would use them.
Maezriel wrote: » Dygz wrote: » Vhaeyne wrote: » You can see that DBM injects the mechanics timer into chat, so the raid can see when it via the chat bubble. Something I don't think we will have to worry about with Ashes. Not because we won't have meters, but because it is easier to prevent third-party programs from doing things like this. Instead of injecting numbers you could just have the text like "Stack on me" or "Spread". Again, I think that's already covered by that "giant global text" Steven, Maggie and Toast use to give us directions for forming a raid or how to prep for the next siege. Seems likely raid leaders will have access to that. Vhaeyne wrote: » Maezriel wrote: » As for your take on macros I don't agree. There's a huge divide between automating your rotation like in some expansions in WoW and being able to click a button to bark your guild recruitment. A basic macro system wouldn't break the game in any way. Not my take on macros. They just are not expected to be in the game. I think there are other instances of Intrepid saying there will not be macro support, but this is the one on the wiki: The issue with macros is that from an anti cheat metric perspective it's difficult to define what a macro is against a script. And in order to catch all scripts sometimes you have to prevent the macro usage. So really that's a that's a data issue. If we allow for macros then we lose our ability to precisely ban script users, botters.[6] – Steven Sharif I worded my response above as if that is common knowledge because I have seen a few threads this last year complaining about no macros. Specifically, old and disabled people really want macros. Personally, I see macros as a tool. If a situation calls for that tool, I would use them. That's fair, sorry for jumping to it being your personal opinion. There's been a few odd decisions like this that tend to stick out and mix that in w/ the endless suggestions/opinions it's not always easy to tell what exactly is Intrepid and what's the players.
Vhaeyne wrote: » Maezriel wrote: » Dygz wrote: » Vhaeyne wrote: » You can see that DBM injects the mechanics timer into chat, so the raid can see when it via the chat bubble. Something I don't think we will have to worry about with Ashes. Not because we won't have meters, but because it is easier to prevent third-party programs from doing things like this. Instead of injecting numbers you could just have the text like "Stack on me" or "Spread". Again, I think that's already covered by that "giant global text" Steven, Maggie and Toast use to give us directions for forming a raid or how to prep for the next siege. Seems likely raid leaders will have access to that. Vhaeyne wrote: » Maezriel wrote: » As for your take on macros I don't agree. There's a huge divide between automating your rotation like in some expansions in WoW and being able to click a button to bark your guild recruitment. A basic macro system wouldn't break the game in any way. Not my take on macros. They just are not expected to be in the game. I think there are other instances of Intrepid saying there will not be macro support, but this is the one on the wiki: The issue with macros is that from an anti cheat metric perspective it's difficult to define what a macro is against a script. And in order to catch all scripts sometimes you have to prevent the macro usage. So really that's a that's a data issue. If we allow for macros then we lose our ability to precisely ban script users, botters.[6] – Steven Sharif I worded my response above as if that is common knowledge because I have seen a few threads this last year complaining about no macros. Specifically, old and disabled people really want macros. Personally, I see macros as a tool. If a situation calls for that tool, I would use them. That's fair, sorry for jumping to it being your personal opinion. There's been a few odd decisions like this that tend to stick out and mix that in w/ the endless suggestions/opinions it's not always easy to tell what exactly is Intrepid and what's the players. I feel the same way. I only remember the macro thing because of the number of times handicapped, and older people have brought it up in the last year. It is a fair argument. Macros can help people with limited movement do a lot more. I also get that any game with tabbed targeting is going to be extremely vulnerable to bots. I guess the idea is that it is easier to have bot detection when macros don't exist because bots use repetitive keystrokes and key press timings the same way macros do. If I was a botter I would just add some randomized input lag between each key stoke to mimic humans inprefection. Just like DPS meters, it will be an endless game of cat and mouse. I guess Intrepid thinks no macros is more helpful than hurtful. I could never play a game like FFXI without macros, but I rarely use macros in most modern MMOs other than for raid call outs or mouse over macros.
Maezriel wrote: » Giant global text is limited to being right in the middle of your screen so directions have to take that into account. However, a speech bubble from an officer simply saying Follow Me will pop up right in their location same for people fighting a boss, having a speech bubble right next to you say "Go Left" can be followed, whereas if it pops up for the group on the other side of the boss you can quickly know to ignore it. This is why I keep equating it to formation flags from ancient militaries.
