"Armour will be part of the silhouette and threat assesment"

So I watched the Jan stream and it was all nice and groovie until we got to that point
"Armour will be part of the silhouette and threat assesment"

I mean that sounds amazing and it is as it should be ... except ... its bullshit
Cosmetics will fuck this up
Last time I voiced my concerns I have been told we will get some sort of indicator what armour type our enemy is wearing under his wedding dress cosmetic (yea I know, dogshit and unimmersive). Did this change? I would love if it did, but I can imagine cosmetic Andy's going mental if it did

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Noaani

Atama wrote: »

It's very simple, everyone should have a gear score and their DPS rating (as determined by DPS meters) floating over their heads.

I bet Steven would love that!

Gear score is the second worst thing WoW bought to the MMO scene, after LFG.

Rageclaw

I somehow miss the old wow (like the original, not the bis farming simulator they call classic). You would look at a player and you knew exactly what he achieved and how powerful he is, because you simply recognized the gear pieces

daveywavey

Rageclaw wrote: »

Nobody mentioned pay to win. Where cosmetics come from is irrelevant, what matters is that slapping cloth cosmetic over plate armour is bad design, to an extent that you need to apply some bandaid indicator onto people to offset the missing visual cue

Go and read tautau's post again. Have a real good read. I'll wait.

daveywavey

The whole 'threat indicator/inspection' thing is ridiculous. In a game that focuses on Risk, you shouldn't be hand-fed information to tell you how best to kill someone.

Noaani

daveywavey wrote: »

The whole 'threat indicator/inspection' thing is ridiculous. In a game that focuses on Risk, you shouldn't be hand-fed information to tell you how best to kill someone.

The game is focused on risk, not luck.

If you have no idea what gear an opponent has in a game with a RPS system, you are operating on luck.

daveywavey

Noaani wrote: »

daveywavey wrote: »

The whole 'threat indicator/inspection' thing is ridiculous. In a game that focuses on Risk, you shouldn't be hand-fed information to tell you how best to kill someone.

The game is focused on risk, not luck.

If you have no idea what gear an opponent has in a game with a RPS system, you are operating on luck.

Risk is the chance of suffering some sort of negative impact. Chance is based around probability. There's always going to be an element of luck involved in risk.

Noaani

daveywavey wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

daveywavey wrote: »

The whole 'threat indicator/inspection' thing is ridiculous. In a game that focuses on Risk, you shouldn't be hand-fed information to tell you how best to kill someone.

The game is focused on risk, not luck.

If you have no idea what gear an opponent has in a game with a RPS system, you are operating on luck.

Risk is the chance of suffering some sort of negative impact. Chance is based around probability. There's always going to be an element of luck involved in risk.

Risk can be managed, luck can not.

Caww

Unless the silhouettes are cookie-cutter style that can't be altered by cosmetics/dyeing, other than noticing cloth/leather/steel I'm not sure what can be cleaned from seeing that. A lot of people are going to be viewing the game with a pulled-back wide-scale camera view, which will further diminish fine details or distinctions. The larger sieges will more than likely be pell-mell and it turns into hit and survive as best you can no matter what you think the other person is using. I could see duels using this type of close inspection.

If they really made it a significant piece of information available at a glance then it would add some "cautious" element to the PvP aspect, or maybe even the NPCs for PvE.

daveywavey

Noaani wrote: »

daveywavey wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

daveywavey wrote: »

The whole 'threat indicator/inspection' thing is ridiculous. In a game that focuses on Risk, you shouldn't be hand-fed information to tell you how best to kill someone.

The game is focused on risk, not luck.

If you have no idea what gear an opponent has in a game with a RPS system, you are operating on luck.

Risk is the chance of suffering some sort of negative impact. Chance is based around probability. There's always going to be an element of luck involved in risk.

Risk can be managed, luck can not.

Managed, yes. But not controlled.

Managed: They're Level 50, using a cosmetic and so are likely to be pretty heavily invested in the game, and they're using a melee weapon.

Controlled: They're Level 50, part of this religion and so will have these augments, they're using a cosmetic but I can see that they're using these two armour sets which give them these specific buffs, and they're using a melee weapon, but it does a very specific damage type that I can specifically build for since I know exactly what it is, and their Mining skill is 3 points higher than when they left the city an hour or two ago so chances are they're carrying something tasty.

Managed:

Controlled:

Jahlon

Every character will have an icon on them (similar to a buff/debuff) that will indicate their armor type (plate, leather, cloth) and tier (poor, uncommon, common, epic, legendary, etc)

tautau

"The lucky man is the man who knows how much to leave to luck." Horatio Hornblower (C.S. Forester)

CROW3

Jahlon wrote: »

Every character will have an icon on them (similar to a buff/debuff) that will indicate their armor type (plate, leather, cloth) and tier (poor, uncommon, common, epic, legendary, etc)

Ugh. I was really hoping that wasn't going to be the direction IS went. If C3PO and R2-D2 had icons over their heads, those stormtroopers in Mos Eisley would have been like 'Those ARE the droids we're looking for!!' and Star Wars would have been a 15 minute short.

daveywavey

CROW3 wrote: »

Jahlon wrote: »

Every character will have an icon on them (similar to a buff/debuff) that will indicate their armor type (plate, leather, cloth) and tier (poor, uncommon, common, epic, legendary, etc)

Ugh. I was really hoping that wasn't going to be the direction IS went.

There's still time! Get your feedback in now!

Wulfenthrad

Perhaps he could be referring to when you have cosmetic slots turned off?

A clarification would be nice regardless.

CROW3

Atama

CROW3 wrote: »

Jahlon wrote: »

Every character will have an icon on them (similar to a buff/debuff) that will indicate their armor type (plate, leather, cloth) and tier (poor, uncommon, common, epic, legendary, etc)

Ugh. I was really hoping that wasn't going to be the direction IS went. If C3PO and R2-D2 had icons over their heads, those stormtroopers in Mos Eisley would have been like 'Those ARE the droids we're looking for!!' and Star Wars would have been a 15 minute short.

But it's a game. Immersion should never trump gameplay. We are going to have a UI, that is essential to being able to play a game, and indicators for enemies is part of the UI.

In the distant future when we have deep-dive full-immersion virtual reality, and we can experience every sense the way our character would, then you can remove things like icons floating over heads. Maybe. Even at that point I'm not convinced that you can do that and have it really be a functioning game.

McShave

JustVine wrote: »

McShave wrote: »

if you have plate gear, you can only have plate cosmetic on it. you wont be a tank going into battle looking like a fairy princess, unless you use a full body outfit on.

I don't suppose you would know where to find the quote for that? Last response I got when I asked was 'look in the apoc streams' lol.

I wish I could give you the source, but I don't really have the time to dive through all the livestreams. I'm pretty sure Steven mentioned it in one of the dev update streams last year.

Tulima

The easiest solution seems to be the option to turn off cosmetics.

Would cosmetic owners be opposed to that?

mcstackerson

Tulima wrote: »

The easiest solution seems to be the option to turn off cosmetics.

Would cosmetic owners be opposed to that?

Yes. One of the big points of customizing a character in an MMO is to show it off. Having the option to turn that off, removes that. At that point you might as well mod your game instead of buying stuff on the cash shop.

Noaani

McShave wrote: »

JustVine wrote: »

McShave wrote: »

if you have plate gear, you can only have plate cosmetic on it. you wont be a tank going into battle looking like a fairy princess, unless you use a full body outfit on.

I don't suppose you would know where to find the quote for that? Last response I got when I asked was 'look in the apoc streams' lol.

I wish I could give you the source, but I don't really have the time to dive through all the livestreams. I'm pretty sure Steven mentioned it in one of the dev update streams last year.

I'd like to see a source for this too, as it is contrary to what my understanding of it is.

Now, here's a major issue I have. If you are only able to use plate cosmetics with plate gear, etc, and if there is no icon in a characters nameplate denoting the armor type being used (hard, considering multipole slots), then this means that someone using a full costume has rendered themselves more time consuming to threat assess.

This is an advantage.

The issue there is that full body costumes are ONLY available by purchasing them.

So, not having that icon on the nameplate means costumes are straight up pay-to-win. Anyone supporting not having them is supporting pay-to-win. Even if they don't like the idea (I don't like the idea), they have to either support it, or accept pay-to-win in Ashes.

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