Elder wrote: » A bosses difficulty is scaled depending on the performance of players during the previous fights. At the end of the fight, the party with the highest damage done, including first tagging bonus, will be granted looting rights.
ChipsAhoy007 wrote: » I was hoping people would start unflagged, but make it so that anyone not in your party could get hit without that special key combination. And make it so people stack corruption half as much if they kill another unflagged player, so even if someone goes and purposefully stands in someone elses AoE and dies it doesnt grief them terribly.
NiKr wrote: » Not all dungeons are meant to have the peak of pve difficulty. People will flag and will kill each other for loot. It has worked just fine in Lineage 2 for years so it'll work just fine here.
ChipsAhoy007 wrote: » Yea I guess I hadn't really thought of it completely. I was going to say it seems more likely that if 2 groups meet each other at a dungeon on accident that the people getting attacked would just let themselves be killed so the other people get corrupted, them come back and wipe them and their reduced stats(plus get some of their gear). But I hadn't thought about one person being the designated person in a group to get corrupted.
NiKr wrote: » ChipsAhoy007 wrote: » Yea I guess I hadn't really thought of it completely. I was going to say it seems more likely that if 2 groups meet each other at a dungeon on accident that the people getting attacked would just let themselves be killed so the other people get corrupted, them come back and wipe them and their reduced stats(plus get some of their gear). But I hadn't thought about one person being the designated person in a group to get corrupted. You can either just bring everyone below 50% hp and see their healer burn through mana and not have enough for mobs or you can just PK their healer and make them leave, while your PKer wouldn't really lose anything because it was an equally-lvled kill and didn't give him much corrutption. But, considering that travel times won't be instantaneous, wasting time running back to the dungeon might be way less beneficial than just flagging up against your attackers and just beating them. At least that's how it went down deep in L2's dungeons, and that game had TPs to the dungeon entrances so it didn't even take that long to return.
Noaani wrote: » To me, I can't think of a worse way for the game to go than to make this normal behavior.
Noaani wrote: » NiKr wrote: » ChipsAhoy007 wrote: » Yea I guess I hadn't really thought of it completely. I was going to say it seems more likely that if 2 groups meet each other at a dungeon on accident that the people getting attacked would just let themselves be killed so the other people get corrupted, them come back and wipe them and their reduced stats(plus get some of their gear). But I hadn't thought about one person being the designated person in a group to get corrupted. You can either just bring everyone below 50% hp and see their healer burn through mana and not have enough for mobs or you can just PK their healer and make them leave, while your PKer wouldn't really lose anything because it was an equally-lvled kill and didn't give him much corrutption. But, considering that travel times won't be instantaneous, wasting time running back to the dungeon might be way less beneficial than just flagging up against your attackers and just beating them. At least that's how it went down deep in L2's dungeons, and that game had TPs to the dungeon entrances so it didn't even take that long to return. I'm still working out what I think is likely to happen in a dungeon setting, tbh. I don't think the notion of a group only having on PKer is going to be a thing in Ashes. I just can't see how that would work - I can't see why one group would stand there and be killed knowing only one player would gain corruption. The only way I see this being a thing is if groups only ever attack each other while one is taking on some content with a moderate difficulty. To me, I can't think of a worse way for the game to go than to make this normal behavior.
CROW3 wrote: » Meh - I think the single PKr is an academic concept, but in all practicality the sheer awkwardness of that approach will commonly result in the designated Red being killed.
George_Black wrote: » Open world dungeons is a confusing term for people used to playing instanced raids in mmos like wow eso ff14 etc etc. Think of them as overland content inside caves, ruins, forests, towers, etc etc. But the mobs will hit hard, have high HP, be aggressive and social, with slows stuns and aoe dmg. They are the places were the best materials, gold (or certificates for gold) and xp is given. Since the mobs respawn, people find a corner and grind xp. If other groups come near them pvp/pk may happen to protect the corner. There are raidbosses around, which can be contested. Often deep inside a dungeon there might be an epic raid boss, maybe related to a very challenging quest, either to enter the chamber or an extra reward or progress after killing it. As for your flagging concerns there are 0 functional problems, 0 social problems. AoC isnt the first game to have flagged pvp pk or special button. Lineage 2 (mmorpg) was EXACTLY like that and everything worked fine. The catch? These areas are for guilds or smasll organized groups. You cant just join a groupfinder with a bunch of randoms you've never met and expect to hold your corner or kill an RB. To any suggestions about the CORE DESIGN the answer is "no". No discussion. Is there anything you still need clarification on?
NiKr wrote: » Noaani wrote: » To me, I can't think of a worse way for the game to go than to make this normal behavior. I mean, I hope it's gonna be the same as L2 and everyone will just fight each other normally. But I've seen way too fucking many "waaaah I don't want to be attacked when I'm dancing with mobs" people to make me doubt this will be the case. And hell, we don't even know if the whole pvp system won't change before release. I sure as hell hope it doesn't, but there's no real assurance for that.
Noaani wrote: » In my opinion, attacking a player or a group while they are taking on content is low.
NiKr wrote: » Noaani wrote: » In my opinion, attacking a player or a group while they are taking on content is low. That probably stems from your passion for pve and the style of pve you experienced.
Noaani wrote: » NiKr wrote: » Noaani wrote: » To me, I can't think of a worse way for the game to go than to make this normal behavior. I mean, I hope it's gonna be the same as L2 and everyone will just fight each other normally. But I've seen way too fucking many "waaaah I don't want to be attacked when I'm dancing with mobs" people to make me doubt this will be the case. And hell, we don't even know if the whole pvp system won't change before release. I sure as hell hope it doesn't, but there's no real assurance for that. In my opinion, attacking a player or a group while they are taking on content is low. It isn't something that should be prevented from happening, but IMO it should be discouraged. Perhaps something as simple as applying corruption if you attack and kill a group while they are in combat with mobs (just a thought at this stage). To me, the exception to this is world bosses. I'd be quite happy if the area around world bosses was designated as a battleground so that corruption wasn't a thing at all here, and everyone could fight freely.
Noaani wrote: » NiKr wrote: » Noaani wrote: » In my opinion, attacking a player or a group while they are taking on content is low. That probably stems from your passion for pve and the style of pve you experienced. Yeah, no doubt at all. To me, even winning a siege that it looked like we were destined to lose in Archeage pales in comparison to beating an encounter we have been building up to for 11 months, and working directly on for 3 months. Obviously that isn't all content - that is something that at best happens once a year. So, here's my thinking. If I am in a group that is doing dungeon content, that dungeon content will be appropriate for where we are. If another group is on the same content, that content would be appropriate for where they are. As such, the assumption should be made that both groups would be roughly equal - you are not likely to come across a group that is massively better or worse geared than you on content that is designed to provide you with gear (I understand this is not the case in L2 - but itemization in Ashes does look set to be far more substantial than L2's, so logically, the above should hold). If we are keeping an eye out for a rival group, the assumption would be that we would then take them on, while the PvE content we were fighting is still attacking us. Thus, the assumption is that the PvE content we are taking on is so basic that it makes little difference when taking on a similarly geared group. What this means to me is that the game will never be able to offer a PvE challenge. This means that any time we are taking on PvE and are not being attacked, we are only experiencing a small portion of the game - essentially we are keeping ourselves so under extended that we can take on a similarly geared group at the drop of a hat. Honestly, that just sounds mind numbingly boring for the bulk of the time.
