Strevi wrote: » worddog wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » Having followed this project for like 5 years, I’m just going to give you a blunt assessment based on my observations: - you’re never going to get a PvE Ashes server - you’re either going to get a PvX Ashes w/tuned corruption, or you’re going to get a FFA PvP Ashes It’s as simple as the dude funding the whole deal is a stone cold ow pvp fanatic, so when he says ‘this game isn’t for everyone,’ he might be talking to you. I notice a trend of people wrongly assuming I want a PvE server. You can defend and argue for things without being personally attached to them. The point of the topic was:Why would separate servers that focus on PvE be bad? People then assumed the point of the topic was:I want a PvE server, tell me why I shouldn't want one. A lot of the comments here are just arguing a strawman argument that doesn't actually exist. You intentionally create the topics in a controversial way. That is your real objective.
worddog wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » Having followed this project for like 5 years, I’m just going to give you a blunt assessment based on my observations: - you’re never going to get a PvE Ashes server - you’re either going to get a PvX Ashes w/tuned corruption, or you’re going to get a FFA PvP Ashes It’s as simple as the dude funding the whole deal is a stone cold ow pvp fanatic, so when he says ‘this game isn’t for everyone,’ he might be talking to you. I notice a trend of people wrongly assuming I want a PvE server. You can defend and argue for things without being personally attached to them. The point of the topic was:Why would separate servers that focus on PvE be bad? People then assumed the point of the topic was:I want a PvE server, tell me why I shouldn't want one. A lot of the comments here are just arguing a strawman argument that doesn't actually exist.
CROW3 wrote: » Having followed this project for like 5 years, I’m just going to give you a blunt assessment based on my observations: - you’re never going to get a PvE Ashes server - you’re either going to get a PvX Ashes w/tuned corruption, or you’re going to get a FFA PvP Ashes It’s as simple as the dude funding the whole deal is a stone cold ow pvp fanatic, so when he says ‘this game isn’t for everyone,’ he might be talking to you.
worddog wrote: » Strevi wrote: » worddog wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » Having followed this project for like 5 years, I’m just going to give you a blunt assessment based on my observations: - you’re never going to get a PvE Ashes server - you’re either going to get a PvX Ashes w/tuned corruption, or you’re going to get a FFA PvP Ashes It’s as simple as the dude funding the whole deal is a stone cold ow pvp fanatic, so when he says ‘this game isn’t for everyone,’ he might be talking to you. I notice a trend of people wrongly assuming I want a PvE server. You can defend and argue for things without being personally attached to them. The point of the topic was:Why would separate servers that focus on PvE be bad? People then assumed the point of the topic was:I want a PvE server, tell me why I shouldn't want one. A lot of the comments here are just arguing a strawman argument that doesn't actually exist. You intentionally create the topics in a controversial way. That is your real objective. No I'm genuinely bad at expression and communication lol
worddog wrote: » The guy in that video is making claims of what a PvE server must be. He is not accounting for the fact a PvE server can have all the things he says it can't have.
Aerlana wrote: » worddog wrote: » The guy in that video is making claims of what a PvE server must be. He is not accounting for the fact a PvE server can have all the things he says it can't have. The first point he says is "no corruption so no Bounty Hunter" The first thing... You just didnt watch video. You would say "for PvE boys, bh is not an interesting thing, right But what about the FFA areas : high seas, and node's ruins ? For the high seas there will be content, and so, on PvP servers it would be a FFA PvP, and on PvE servers it would be no PvP, two totally different game there again. You will say "force flag people for high sea" ... You REALLY think that PvE fan of the game won't do post again and again, megathread or spam of threads to have this removed on PvE servers ? Sure devs don't have to follow every idea in forums even the most supported one... and there is no bad buzz right ? Because people will feel ignored, despised if they see that this highly popular request is not listened...
Blip wrote: » Its so annoying that every time we get a PvP\ PvX MMO the CareBears always show up and try to change it. By screaming its grefing, its anti social, its not fun bla bla bla. If AoC \ Intrepid ever change the PvP flaging and\ or the death penalty like XP loss or loot drop`s am going to delete my account in a instant. The risk vs reward and PvP is what makes Ashes GREAT.
worddog wrote: » Blip wrote: » Its so annoying that every time we get a PvP\ PvX MMO the CareBears always show up and try to change it. By screaming its grefing, its anti social, its not fun bla bla bla. If AoC \ Intrepid ever change the PvP flaging and\ or the death penalty like XP loss or loot drop`s am going to delete my account in a instant. The risk vs reward and PvP is what makes Ashes GREAT. Who's trying to change the game? I couldn't find them. So far I haven't actually seen a single argument for changing PvP flagging, death penalties or loot drops. Could you quote what you're referring to?
Mag7spy wrote: » worddog wrote: » Blip wrote: » Its so annoying that every time we get a PvP\ PvX MMO the CareBears always show up and try to change it. By screaming its grefing, its anti social, its not fun bla bla bla. If AoC \ Intrepid ever change the PvP flaging and\ or the death penalty like XP loss or loot drop`s am going to delete my account in a instant. The risk vs reward and PvP is what makes Ashes GREAT. Who's trying to change the game? I couldn't find them. So far I haven't actually seen a single argument for changing PvP flagging, death penalties or loot drops. Could you quote what you're referring to? Guy makes a thread called pve servers and says something like this. You can't make this trolling up.
worddog wrote: » Mag7spy wrote: » worddog wrote: » Blip wrote: » Its so annoying that every time we get a PvP\ PvX MMO the CareBears always show up and try to change it. By screaming its grefing, its anti social, its not fun bla bla bla. If AoC \ Intrepid ever change the PvP flaging and\ or the death penalty like XP loss or loot drop`s am going to delete my account in a instant. The risk vs reward and PvP is what makes Ashes GREAT. Who's trying to change the game? I couldn't find them. So far I haven't actually seen a single argument for changing PvP flagging, death penalties or loot drops. Could you quote what you're referring to? Guy makes a thread called pve servers and says something like this. You can't make this trolling up. If don't understand something, you could try to understand it. If you don't even want to attempt to understand what other people think I'm not sure why you'd even bother commenting. That's what I would call trolling.
NiKr wrote: » worddog wrote: » So your argument is that we shouldn't provide more options, because it turns out our original version might be worse than the alternative. Yes, imo it's better to have a one design direction that represents the best form of devs' vision, even if it brings in less players, rather than having 2 subpar versions that not only split the playerbase but also split the dev time for each and increase the costs of upkeep of both.
worddog wrote: » So your argument is that we shouldn't provide more options, because it turns out our original version might be worse than the alternative.
CROW3 wrote: » No, it's because having PvP built into the underpinnings of a game's systems and simply adding bacon to a sandwich aren't analogous. Ashes is elementally an OW PvP game, it's not added in like a condiment. The bacon is baked into the bread, the grease covers the entire kitchen, including the cutting boards the lettuce and tomatoes are sliced on. So, I'm not saying you can't pick whatever you want out of your BLT to make it vegetarian, I'm just saying you're not going to be served a BLT without bacon.
worddog wrote: » insomnia wrote: » worddog wrote: » insomnia wrote: » I don't care for PvP. But i understand that it will be part of the game. Maybe look more into the game before you post Not sure why you would play Ashes if you don't care about PvP at all seeing as it is 80% of the game. But it's not. I'm quite certain you can play a big part of the game, without PvP, or atleast open world PvP. Sieges is another thing. That is more like battlegrounds, plus i would proberly only do siege, if it was to defend a node i was part of. I don't have to attack someone that takes i resource i wanted. I have played mmo's where only 1 person could harvest a resource. I don't have to be part of caravans. I can level my character(s). Do crafting/gathering/refining, without having to do pvp. Dungeons, raids. I don't see how you can say it's 80% of the game. Plus I have said before, i'm not sure the game is for me. I'll give it a try, and see how it is The 80/20 split refers to instanced content. There is a small amount of pure PvE content in the game. The vast majority of PvE content has major PvP aspects, making that content PvX. PvP content does not have major PvE content. Node/castle sieges are not PvE, Caravans are not PvE, Arenas are not PvE. I would also say open world ganking and naval combat are not PvE but that might not be true. If you only want to PvP, Ashes can provide that for you, sure you need to get to max level but most hardcore players will be able to do that within a couple weeks or at the very least a single month. I don't count leveling as a very large part of the game when MMOs are meant to be played for months/years. If you only want to PvE, it might be possible, but you are very likely going to be forced to PvP seeing as all the important PvE content is also PvP orientated. If the combat feels really deep, I'll probably spend more than 80% of my time doing arenas. There is genuinely zero PvE involved in that so even if I hate PvE, I can still enjoy the game. But if a player hates PvP? What content is there for them to do? Instanced dungeons that don't even provide good loot?
insomnia wrote: » worddog wrote: » insomnia wrote: » I don't care for PvP. But i understand that it will be part of the game. Maybe look more into the game before you post Not sure why you would play Ashes if you don't care about PvP at all seeing as it is 80% of the game. But it's not. I'm quite certain you can play a big part of the game, without PvP, or atleast open world PvP. Sieges is another thing. That is more like battlegrounds, plus i would proberly only do siege, if it was to defend a node i was part of. I don't have to attack someone that takes i resource i wanted. I have played mmo's where only 1 person could harvest a resource. I don't have to be part of caravans. I can level my character(s). Do crafting/gathering/refining, without having to do pvp. Dungeons, raids. I don't see how you can say it's 80% of the game. Plus I have said before, i'm not sure the game is for me. I'll give it a try, and see how it is
worddog wrote: » insomnia wrote: » I don't care for PvP. But i understand that it will be part of the game. Maybe look more into the game before you post Not sure why you would play Ashes if you don't care about PvP at all seeing as it is 80% of the game.
insomnia wrote: » I don't care for PvP. But i understand that it will be part of the game. Maybe look more into the game before you post
Aerlana wrote: » worddog wrote: » But if a player hates PvP? What content is there for them to do? Instanced dungeons that don't even provide good loot? Many of my friends are curious of this project, and said they could give a try. Also, large part of them dislike PvP... Solution ? i honestly said to them "this game will be open world PvP, no instance PvE content, you will dislike the game" . They won't play it. is it a tragedy ? no.
worddog wrote: » But if a player hates PvP? What content is there for them to do? Instanced dungeons that don't even provide good loot?
Craiken wrote: » I would love to hear Steven's reasons for why a PVE server wouldn't work. He talks a lot about how corruption is supposed to make player killing rare, but player killing must be important for his vision. Otherwise, why allow it at all? I came up with some reasons for why people might be killed. I'm wondering which ones are intended and which ones are supposed to be prevented/discouraged by corruption. -Killing someone whenever they travel with a fully-loaded mule -Killing someone for the opportunity to harvest a rare resource or fight a rare spawn -Killing someone to prevent them from harvesting/grinding in your area -Killing someone who is trying to obtain a siege scroll for your node -Killing someone whenever they enter a dungeon you're farming -Killing someone for roleplay reasons (e.g., hating orcs) -Killing someone repeatedly to prevent them from leveling up a node that's competing with yours -Killing someone repeatedly to reduce competition for housing in your area
Dygz wrote: » CROW3 wrote: » No, it's because having PvP built into the underpinnings of a game's systems and simply adding bacon to a sandwich aren't analogous. Ashes is elementally an OW PvP game, it's not added in like a condiment. The bacon is baked into the bread, the grease covers the entire kitchen, including the cutting boards the lettuce and tomatoes are sliced on. So, I'm not saying you can't pick whatever you want out of your BLT to make it vegetarian, I'm just saying you're not going to be served a BLT without bacon. A PvE server could work. It would just be too much effort for the devs to keep it working alongside the PvP servers.
