DPS Meter Megathread

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George_Black

Keep building addons to perform. Meanwhile those that understand that in AoC you have to fight other players off to claim the raids/xp spots/raw mats, will leave you eating dust.
They will get the FHs while you try to tinker your builds at lv10 with your data and meters.

All while having a monitor clean of all the clutter, enjoying the looks of AoC.

Songcaller

Some pub pundits have decades of experience across the board. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the words or wisdom.😆

George_Black

Neurath wrote: »

Some pub pundits have decades of experience across the board. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the words or wisdom.😆

Not sure if bait or I should join in a laugh

Songcaller

George_Black wrote: »

Neurath wrote: »

Some pub pundits have decades of experience across the board. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the words or wisdom.😆

Not sure if bait or I should join in a laugh

There's no harm in a good laugh 😆

Depraved

for some reason ive been much happier the last few days not really reading these things hahahaha

Ludullu

Azherae wrote: »

Should be easier this time since we got NiKr's class change.

He countered my whole shtick by mentioning ow bosses. I still agree on that part

George_Black wrote: »

It's like watching all those pub "pundits" talking about what their sports team needs to get better, while the rest of the gamers are the talented ones, performing successfully ingame without all the pseudo-science.

I am one of those pub dudes for majority of sports, but don't sport teams have meetings about their games (both pre- and post-game)? Don't they discuss strats during breaks? Don't their trainers go over data to account for anything unexpected?

If anything, you seem exactly like one of those pundits who sit on the sidelines and yell at players "to do it in a better way".

Songcaller

Depraved wrote: »

for some reason ive been much happier the last few days not really reading these things hahahaha

I read the smaller posts. The back and forth not so much 😒

Ludullu

Neurath wrote: »

I read the smaller posts. The back and forth not so much 😒

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xi1DahW2R2k

Songcaller

NiKr wrote: »

Neurath wrote: »

I read the smaller posts. The back and forth not so much 😒

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xi1DahW2R2k

🤣

Mag7spy

Azherae wrote: »

George_Black wrote: »

Dps meters/trackers/combat addons capture the essence of shallow mmos with lacking content for competition, rewards and rivalry.
I thought after 200 people would go back to their lives, but here we are.

Shot-caller's online, let's start the run.

We're in the shallow part right now, so as always we gotta go for Max Deeps.

Should be easier this time since we got NiKr's class change.

This you is better lol

George_Black

NiKr wrote: »

Azherae wrote: »

Should be easier this time since we got NiKr's class change.

He countered my whole shtick by mentioning ow bosses. I still agree on that part

George_Black wrote: »

It's like watching all those pub "pundits" talking about what their sports team needs to get better, while the rest of the gamers are the talented ones, performing successfully ingame without all the pseudo-science.

I am one of those pub dudes for majority of sports, but don't sport teams have meetings about their games (both pre- and post-game)? Don't they discuss strats during breaks? Don't their trainers go over data to account for anything unexpected?

If anything, you seem exactly like one of those pundits who sit on the sidelines and yell at players "to do it in a better way".

No. I am the guy that knows that only good players and good attutide make the difference. The rest is a waste of time and a poor excuse of salaries.
Very few coaches inspire and lead. The rest of the 'data team' are nonsense.

And remember, reality, real bodies are nothing like a keyboard and graphics.

Turning games into sience may bring views on youtube but the truth of it is you are kidding yourselves.

Azherae

That's a really good point though, we should try to stay a little more mobile now that NiKr has changed class to "An Instance Of Dark Lord" and has his Core Armor.

Noaani, I figure will still be using the big abilities with the long cast times when the platforms bring up the randoms to trigger the windows for the mechanics.

So if we all use shorter posts we should get it down quick while still getting a good content rank.

I'm gonna need a timeline of when zRanger and Adrenaline were effective in L2 relative to its content cycles. Once I have that, I can deploy the web crawlers. Any other precursors to these two like walker, also good, don't wanna waste crawlers on the wrong targets.

Azherae

Mag7spy wrote: »

Azherae wrote: »

George_Black wrote: »

Dps meters/trackers/combat addons capture the essence of shallow mmos with lacking content for competition, rewards and rivalry.
I thought after 200 people would go back to their lives, but here we are.

Shot-caller's online, let's start the run.

We're in the shallow part right now, so as always we gotta go for Max Deeps.

Should be easier this time since we got NiKr's class change.

This you is better lol

Nah, you gotta get used to my full form first, only after that is my Joker aspect a relief. Comedy is about subverting expectations.

Thanks for the confirm though.

We should use the "Chess players vs TCG players" positioning this time to start, according to George and Noaani, so I'll get that set up. As usual, NiKr just has to stand opposite Mag, tho, which might complicate things.

Noaani

George_Black wrote: »

It's like watching all those pub "pundits" talking about what their sports team needs to get better

It's more like talking to the management of that sports team.

You see, with those pub pundits, they can theorize all they like, they could be right, they could be wrong. With them, it doesn't matter because what they come up with isn't going to be put in to practice.

With us, when we think we have something worth considering, it gets put in to practice.

George_Black wrote: »

.
They will get the FHs while you try to tinker your builds at lv10 with your data and meters.

Why would I be looking at tracker data if I can instead be contesting someone in game?

This just goes even more towards showing your lack of understanding on the matter. The bulk of ones interaction with a combat tracker and the data from it happens outside of the game, usually while you don't have access to the game itself.

If I'm able to play the game, I'm probably playing the game. If I am looking at data, it is because I can't play the game in that moment - perhaps I am on my commute to work or some such.

Essentially, combat tracker data is a way to interact with the game and learn more about the game during a time of the day/week/month where you wouldn't otherwise be able to interact with the game at all.

So really, rather than it being us sitting there parsing while others get freeholds, it is both of us contending for a freehold followed by you doing nothing until you are online next, and those of us with trackers looking over data to learn more about the game before we are able to come back next.

Ludullu

Azherae wrote: »

I'm gonna need a timeline of when zRanger and Adrenaline were effective in L2 relative to its content cycles. Once I have that, I can deploy the web crawlers. Any other precursors to these two like walker, also good, don't wanna waste crawlers on the wrong targets.

I'm pretty sure I heard about adrenaline in late 00s. And considering that I was on the outskirts of that game's sphere of influence (and waaaay further away from those who'd use adrenaline and the likes), I'd imagine its roots go to super early versions of the game. Not sure about zRanger though.

@JamesSunderland do you remember the 21st night of september (which is coming up btw) when you first heard of those two?

Azherae wrote: »

We should use the "Chess players vs TCG players" positioning this time to start, according to George and Noaani, so I'll get that set up. As usual, NiKr just has to stand opposite Mag, tho, which might complicate things.

Considering that the only TCG I've ever played and/or were even interested in is Artifact, Mag's opinion on it would be the deciding factor.

Azherae

Ok, ready!

I'd explain the whole strat but it's better if some people don't have to think about it anyway.

EQ2, by all data currently available to me, is a Chess style game for PvE. When you want to make the game more interesting, you change the board. You introduce special rules for different zones or squares. You change the starting configurations of the pieces. The challenge for a player who likes this (Noaani, a few others who normally leave discussion to Noaani):

1) Figure out all the new board zone rules, and when the board expands or shrinks
2) React to this by deciding what pieces to move where, either beforehand, or where to put them after the board change triggers an automove.

FFXI is a 'TCG' style game for PvE. The board usually matters much less, when you want to do something interesting, you 'add an OP card', 'change a rule that normally is there for balance', or alter the function of the limiting resource pool in the game. The challenge for a player who likes this (Mag, George, Depraved sorta, me):

1) Figure out what the new Card does
2) Adapt known strategy to the fact that a weakness that the enemy normally has that keeps them in check, has been removed, or to the fact that your resource pool acts differently

Trackers work on both game types, but 'TCG side' people don't seem to care about all the things that make stuff easier for them, and 'Chess' style people don't seem to care about the dynamism that PvP brings to the TCG style. Understandable.

NiKr, because you want a hard 'TCG style' game, but you're talking to a 'Chess style enthusiast' half the time, you end up trying to ask 'can't this be hard anyway?' But you always offer TCG-style suggestions for difficulty.

If Ashes is TCG-style as a game, it will have less interesting pure owPvE (any situation where no conflict happens counts as this). Mag can stand on the 'but it's not less skillful!' side. NiKr can stand on the 'ffs Mag you're not listening' side.

Ofc you can all just ignore this, I'll reposition everyone whenever George reminds me to.

The current challenge ofc is 'Figuring out what Steven was trying to sell when he said his stuff'. He talks about stuff that means the game can supposedly please both sides, but on the owPvE at least, it kinda can't consistently do both. Our 'Hybrid Combat' offers no clues either, and Tumok told us nothing because WoW is mostly Checkers.

90% of this thread has been 'what is Steven's actual product tho?' and then back and forth between these two 'camps'. Why stop now?

Ludullu

Azherae wrote: »

If Ashes is TCG-style as a game, it will have less interesting pure owPvE (any situation where no conflict happens counts as this).

Situational cards all the waaaay! I wish I had played mtg to know what jokes to make about lands and shit

Don't those change the situation on the mat in a somewhat major way? I feel like my insistence on "give players pvx tools, so that pve can still be difficult even in the ow but still doable when it's pvx" would fall under a "I turn this land card to activate pvx combat mode, because there's a new plainswalker on the mat". Or smth like that

Ludullu

Azherae wrote: »

The current challenge ofc is 'Figuring out what Steven was trying to sell when he said his stuff'.

I am curious how deep we'll have to be into A2 to figure this out. Rn my theory is ~1 year.

JamesSunderland

NiKr wrote: »

@JamesSunderland do you remember the 21st night of september (which is coming up btw) when you first heard of those two?

When i first heard of them they didn't even had a proper name and the initial "3rd party tool project" kinda branched out to different directions with different names as time went by(zranger/adrenaline and walker being the main names), but the big datamines and first source pack leaked(C4 version) that gave origin to them were around ~2006...

First time i remember seeing it with the L2Walker name was around 2006,
First time i remember seeing it with the Adrenaline name was around 2007,
First time i remember seeing it with the Zranger name was around 2008.

They had similar functions as they mostly shared the same base, but still had their peculiarities and things they were better for and things that they had exclusively.

Aszkalon

Never cared about a Damage Meter.

Uninvolved from the fact that i heard only about just negative Discussions from others when it was involved. Jepp, the World of Warcraft Community is in fact "THAT" toxic, hahahahahahah. x'D

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