AOC is NOT a PVP game.

AoC is a PVX game and that means something.

This started as a reply during another Forum post but It became long winded so I just made a post. As always any thoughts of your own are appreciated.

I think there is a general confusion on what AoC is trying to be and why some people incorrectly think that this game is being designed around Nostalgia or PVP. Its not.

I look at this game as closer to a Story to be read, or something you could write about and even if you didn't play there would be stories you would want to hear. You can have a version of meaningful conflict with out PVP for sure but the more you risk the bigger the conflict and the more interesting the story. Just look at Eve Online, I've barely touched that game but I've heard the stories and there's a chance you have to.

The idea isn't that you need to focus on your inventory when out collecting but that its a dangerous world full of conflict(terror). You need to address that, no one will likely disturb you but there is a chance and that chance pushes players in to Social content essentially. Players may provide protection services or people will group to collect to ensure safety or be aware of the other players and maybe be a little more friendly etc. Its simply not as simple as "other players want to kill me while I collect flowers and that's silly". Its that with out that you are sacrificing the core of the game and reducing the need for players to rely on each other.

Even the Nodes are designed to create conflict. So the goal is to create a world that feels in conflict. (Ideally they do add corruption effects to your character when you increase in corruption.) Where you are going out in to the world and your safety isn't guaranteed. When you see a player you ask yourself, who is that? what are they doing? what do they want? If they are corrupted, what do I do ? Did they kill someone that pissed them off or are they just out to cause trouble? You have just entered into conflict simply by being there.

People should be very clear that this is NOT a progression train that you hop on and off with no need to interact with other players and even when you do they might as well be AI for the value that it brings to the experience. I think In-fact you are most likely to prefer bots because the players tend to gravitate towards toxic behavior with a " if you slow me down you are hurting me and now I am pissed off" style of development. When i say Modern MMO's/RPGs feel empty it barely seems to even scratch the surface.

I played Wayfinder and that games feels so dam empty just like so many before it, for what it is its probably decent but I am not interested. There are a lot people that are upset that T&L has auto-play but because there is such a focus on just instant gratification that players and companies seem to just assume that anything outside that wont work, they design games that are one breath away from being AutoPlay. So clearly Autoplay was the next logical step.

Which is probably why it takes someone like Steven Shariff to change things. Remember WoW had 0 experience going in to making their MMO with only a vision and not enough money, before WoW they made RTS's and Action RPGs in a world where gaming itself was certainly not mainstream. If anyone remembers how silly their launch was and how little content the game had it would probably blow them away. It took them a full year or more to even get their servers in line. Either way they developed a game that everyone wanted to play for that time. Everyone projected a massive failure. They came out on top because their vision of WOW at that time hit the right chord.

Despite being the most popular MMORPG to date Blizzard are also oddly enough the last developer anyone should talk to before making their own MMORPG. They made what they made and that worked for them and that's it, even recently though it seems they don't understand why anyone keeps playing their own game.

Main Point is this, stop focusing on if this game is PVP or PVE, they operate together to achieve a larger goal from a Man who made a world as a Dungeon Master and wants to see that world live. Telling him to reduce the conflict points would be like telling GRR Martin to stop killing characters.

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Fiddlez

Mag7spy wrote: »

Playing a mmorpg
- Gets banned because of mass report and you are a lead for a war
- Severs crash from ddos attacks during a siege and you can't reconnect and log back on and your castle is destroyed.
- getting crushed by another guild and losing wars, your guild breaks apart in game
- Spy loots your guild bank, ruins guild in game.
- Off game actions causing drama in guilds to ruin guild or leadership and pull people away
- Paying people off to throw fights or recruit them.

PvP mmorpgs been there done that crap, also anyone feeling this is "content" or takes advantage of these things in full and enjoys it honestly are not gamers and are just pathetic. Arguing these meta bs makes a game better is an actual joke and you should be embarrassed for saying this is a reason why a certain kind of content is better for it.

Again complete and actual embracement. no one deserves to deal with anything like this it isn't good content is it just toxic level elements because your lack of ability to actually win in the content.

back to gaming.

100%

Noaani

Fiddlez wrote: »

Everytime Conflict in PVE is brought up it's through designs outside Developer intent. In other words it's through griefing.

I can't stress enough how wrong this is.

If you said some times instead of every time, you'd be correct.

I mean, I've said many times on these forums that the way my guild gets to the top of the server in every game we have played for the last few years is to destroy any guilds above us. We don't do that via PvP, even thiugh we have most played PvP games lately. We also don't break rules (not purposely, at least). Rather, we do it by breaking up the guild in question, usually by destroying their collective ego (though not always).

This kind of thing is far easier in PvP games, because people in those games expect conflict via PvP. When that conflict comes via any other method, they simply aren't used to it and have no idea how to fight back.

Fiddlez

Noaani wrote: »

Fiddlez wrote: »

Everytime Conflict in PVE is brought up it's through designs outside Developer intent. In other words it's through griefing.

I can't stress enough how wrong this is.

If you said some times instead of every time, you'd be correct.

I mean, I've said many times on these forums that the way my guild gets to the top of the server in every game we have played for the last few years is to destroy any guilds above us. We don't do that via PvP, even thiugh we have most played PvP games lately. We also don't break rules (not purposely, at least). Rather, we do it by breaking up the guild in question, usually by destroying their collective ego (though not always).

This kind of thing is far easier in PvP games, because people in those games expect conflict via PvP. When that conflict comes via any other method, they simply aren't used to it and have no idea how to fight back.

I'm not entirely sure if you read this but....yeah. Yikes.

For the record It was meant that everytime you bring it up. We have already resolved multiple times that PVE can have meaningful conflict. You are correct that, that statement the way its worded is incorrect.

Percimes

Men, gone a week and you give me all that to read through!

Not interested in drama. Not interested in conflict. Not really interested by rewards.

How bad will it be for me?

Fiddlez

Percimes wrote: »

Men, gone a week and you give me all that to read through!

Not interested in drama. Not interested in conflict. Not really interested by rewards.

How bad will it be for me?

Depends, do you like cake or death?

Dygz

Pretty sure everyone still participating in these forums likes “cake”.

CROW3

Dygz wrote: »

Pretty sure everyone still participating in these forums likes “cake”.

Well... not everyone.

Dygz

It's possible to like "cake" and also like to eat pie.

Noaani

Dygz wrote: »

It's possible to like "cake" and also like to eat pie.

This is objectively false.

One can either like cake, or like pie. There is no situation where someone can like both.

To anyone that thinks this is even remotely possible, I just don't even know what to say.

Fiddlez

Dygz wrote: »

It's possible to like "cake" and also like to eat pie.

Are we talking about what I think we're talking about?

Raven016

Dygz wrote: »

Pretty sure everyone still participating in these forums likes “cake”.

They also hate being fat.

Percimes

Meat pie and cake, in the same meal. Human sacrifices. Cats and dogs living together. Mass hysteria.

Aszkalon

Fiddlez wrote: »

AOC is NOT a PVP game

* chuckles in Highwayman *

CROW3

Soooo… you’re playing a necromancer?

consultant

Well gents everyone in Ashes of Creation will be flagged for PvP all the time so it is technically a PvP game, but if you PvP in a non PvP area you become red. Corruption sytem. But the single detreming factor is that every one will be flagged for PvP so it is a PvP game. By the way in MMO let say there is a PvP server well that does not mean palyers do not PvE just means every one is flagged for PvP. Almost everyone does PvP and PvE as far as MMOs care concerned.

Theplague4u

Anyone that said ashes was suppose to be a pvp game or suggest corruption free servers are just PK griefer losers. Even though I’m looking forward to the pvp aspect of ashes I have no desire for ashes to be pvp centered. Ashes would fail or have an extremely small player base if it was PVP centered, that’s a fact. There needs to be a balance and Steven is working on that. Hopefully he’s successful because that’s extremely important for a healthy player count.

hleV

DrPlague wrote: »

Anyone that said ashes was suppose to be a pvp game or suggest corruption free servers are just PK griefer losers

Average PvEer comment.

Noaani

hleV wrote: »

DrPlague wrote: »

Anyone that said ashes was suppose to be a pvp game or suggest corruption free servers are just PK griefer losers

Average PvEer comment.

Average comment from someone that plays MMO's with populations measured in the tens or hundreds of thousands, as opposed to the millions.

hleV

Try to make sense next time.

Aszkalon

CROW3 wrote: »

Soooo… you’re playing a necromancer?

I personally, plan to make at least 'ONE' of my Characters a Necromancer. Still undecided if i should make this one my Main, tho.

But i could imagine so much cool things when actually being one, that might be somewhat hard to program for dear Intrepid. 😁

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