What is the appropriate amount of Green ganking?

I have read that the corruption system is designed to protect Greens(non-combatants). The bounty hunter system and to an extent the military node is based around people consistently getting corrupted. How many corruption/bounty hunter events need to happen in order for the system to be worth it?

If successful ganks are rare, then the bounty hunter system falls apart. I do a big quest chain to unlock the system and level a military node for the benefits, but have to compete for the rare red with everyone else in the node?

If I was in a bounty hunter guild but people only became corrupted near my node 2-3 times per day, I don't think that would be enough content for the guild to partake in. Maybe a bounty hunter guild more as an RP or icing on the top thing while focusing on other PvP content like Caravans?

If successful ganks are common, Greens will be rare and AoC will get the reputation of a murderfest. However, there will obviously be more content with the Bounty Hunter system. I normally farm to relax but if the success rate of bringing my stuff back drops below a certain percentage, I don't know if I'll do it much.

My theory, I think the corruption system is not designed to protect greens but to increase the Risk (in the Risk vs. Reward) of hunting greens. Corruption will be common, farming will be a high risk activity or in groups for rare materials, and the majority of lower rarity materials will be farmed from freeholds.

What does everyone else think? How many people need to be corrupted for the game to make sense? Or more importantly, how often? Is it okay if Bounty Hunting is a rare activity?

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Mag7spy

Depends on the type of content you do, it could go from never being pked, to once in awhile (some amount of multiple hours), to much more often with certain pieces of contested content (important loot drops, rare materials, rare bosses), Or to certain ganks that usually revolve around drama.

This is also why i feel some elements are exaggerated with peoples concerns of corruption do to how strong the system is, you most likely won't experience much. PvP will be higher at the start with people trying to gauge the risk vrs reward and then it will slow down once they realize the punishment and the lack of chance to get away from the punishment (ie population density of the game plays a huge role).

You are going to be pvp from guild / node wars more than any corruption system.

Dygz

I mean - dying from consensual PvP (Sieges, Caravans, Guild/Node Wars) is irrelevant to ganking.

akabear

I have a hope that green ganking will be similar to how it was on my L2 server.

There, random green ganking was very rare and infrequent. Common during beta but settled down when multiple guilds had created their position in the world. When it did happen repeatedly, it was usually only done by a rogue individual with no guild ties. These individuals often faced continual retribution from guilds often brutal and they eventually stopped (and learned).

However, there was also planned/strategic green ganking of individuals. This was done to provoke or end guild wars, to claim territory for experience points, deter attendance at castle wars, or to secure raids. Such actions had significant political and guild positioning consequences.

Your experience was influenced heavy by the guild you were in and the position they took in the world. (passive, neutral, aggressive)

CROW3

Out of curiosity, how long did/does it take for a purple (combatant) to turn back green (non-combatant) in L2?

Pyrolol

Tell me you didn’t play earlier mmo’s without telling me. You have entered a PvX game. In almost every mmo ive played there would be random ganking when leveling to max level, or farming materials such as mining etc, then you would gank back if they were still in the area

If you got camped, you would ask your friends, guilds or even strangers nearby etc to come help and in return sometimes if they didn’t give up after that they would do the same and by the time you realize it, you would have a mini skirmish / mini war on your hands

This made the game random and fun and took leveling or going out into the world more exciting and also you got a break from doing something grindy, eventually it will die down and then people would go back to what they were doing or it kept going and if you yourself were over it, you could just go somewhere else to level

Nowadays, it’s everyone rushing to max level without interruptions as quickly as possible, I don’t envy them because they missed out on some thrilling PvP action back in the day
So many people on these forums trying to take the fun random things out of this game instead of just going with it and seeing the fun side 🤦🏻‍♂️

Ludullu

CROW3 wrote: »

Out of curiosity, how long did/does it take for a purple (combatant) to turn back green (non-combatant) in L2?

Just checked. 2 minutes. At least in the version that came out 6 years after release.

Yuyukoyay

I'd imagine when the game comes out it will be a lot more punishing than that. This just seems like literally the last thing in the game they would bother to tune.

Depraved

ExiledByrd wrote: »

I have read that the corruption system is designed to protect Greens(non-combatants). The bounty hunter system and to an extent the military node is based around people consistently getting corrupted. How many corruption/bounty hunter events need to happen in order for the system to be worth it?

If successful ganks are rare, then the bounty hunter system falls apart. I do a big quest chain to unlock the system and level a military node for the benefits, but have to compete for the rare red with everyone else in the node?

If I was in a bounty hunter guild but people only became corrupted near my node 2-3 times per day, I don't think that would be enough content for the guild to partake in. Maybe a bounty hunter guild more as an RP or icing on the top thing while focusing on other PvP content like Caravans?

If successful ganks are common, Greens will be rare and AoC will get the reputation of a murderfest. However, there will obviously be more content with the Bounty Hunter system. I normally farm to relax but if the success rate of bringing my stuff back drops below a certain percentage, I don't know if I'll do it much.

My theory, I think the corruption system is not designed to protect greens but to increase the Risk (in the Risk vs. Reward) of hunting greens. Corruption will be common, farming will be a high risk activity or in groups for rare materials, and the majority of lower rarity materials will be farmed from freeholds.

What does everyone else think? How many people need to be corrupted for the game to make sense? Or more importantly, how often? Is it okay if Bounty Hunting is a rare activity?

you are right, the system isn't meant to protect greens. its for risk and reward.

anyways, its possible that there's more to it to the military nodes and bounty hunter system. being able to detect red players is just one thing out of many. there will probably be other things attached to it that have nothing to do with red players

Otr

ExiledByrd wrote: »

What is the appropriate amount of Green ganking?
...
What does everyone else think? How many people need to be corrupted for the game to make sense? Or more importantly, how often? Is it okay if Bounty Hunting is a rare activity?

It should adjust itself based on the value the players are fighting for.
In areas with valuable resources, fighting will be more frequent.

ExiledByrd wrote: »

I normally farm to relax but if the success rate of bringing my stuff back drops below a certain percentage, I don't know if I'll do it much.

You can always farm naked the lowest tier resources.
Or hire somebody to guard you (pay for protection). Don't be greedy.

Texas

You don't need to farm naked. Ashes is not a full loot game.

Aszkalon

ExiledByrd wrote: »

What is the appropriate amount of Green ganking ?

... ... ... ... ... Bots.

Gank - them - AAALL. !! (lol)

Gank them until the End of all time.
Gank them until the Ancients themselves are impressed by your Corruption.

Gank them until the People who created them are convinced they are wasting their Money and Ressources by keeping the very Computers running the Bots are "playing" Ashes of Creation with.

Muahahahahahahahah !!

Or maybe just tell/ask your Mayor to declare "War" on the Node they are part of -> main Importance they are not part of your own Node - so that Players/Citizens of your Node can kill them repeatedly and ENDLESSLY without ever even getting corrupted for it.

* maniacal Villain Laugh once more *

Solvryn

Ganking is fine.. corpse camping someone - is not fine and should exponentially increase corruption.

The game is still relatively tame compared to full loot systems, mostly because it has to be in order for gear to have any real meaning unless they added in Asherons Call drop system which is based off of value.

Also, people with pvp rank should be incredibly low when accruing corruption, assassinations are a valid tactic and are always apart of a greater stratagem.

NCPs have to learn that they will be ganked from time to time and let it roll off their shoulders.

Just like PvErs and PvPers need to learn to work in unison, not constantly be against each other, it's not the way to be successful in this sort of environment.

Futuere

ExiledByrd wrote: »

What does everyone else think? How many people need to be corrupted for the game to make sense? Or more importantly, how often? Is it okay if Bounty Hunting is a rare activity?

This won't be something anyone could answer until launch or even several months after to see if the server population is stable enough to keep PvPers. From my experience in Archage, it had a healthy community of PvP with hundreds of active pirates and non pirate gankers along with an enemy faction. It all depends on where you want to farm or location of the node/resources and the risk the ganker wants to take.

If Bounty Hunting is rare it will be because it is boring or the risk to gank is too high. If the reward is high and respawn for the ganker is close by with minimal loss then it will happen all day every day, I suspect this will be high value end game zones and near major shipping lane/crossroad or harbors.
If it is a zone or two away or has minimal value in resources and takes 15-20 minutes to run back then ganking will only happen occasionally (a few times a day). Then you have the wandering gankers, they could stick to 1 zone all day or travel around several, ganking in one spot moving to the next like you would mining nodes and only see them every hour or two.

Infamous PvPers 99% of the server knows and hates will also be a thing keeping it alive.

Pretty much it's going to depend on the zone and it will happen enough as long as the player population stays high enough to support it.

Chuck Zitto

I enjoy how it was set up in Arch Age. Moving caravans or ships full of goods through non pvp zones and turning it in didn't get much money but was completely safe. If you went through a pvp zone or turned in way out in the middle of the ocean you got alot better rewards. That way there was always people for me to come steal there goods or big fish they fished up without getting penalties.

Laetitian

Chuck Zitto wrote: »

I enjoy how it was set up in Arch Age. Moving caravans or ships full of goods through non pvp zones and turning it in didn't get much money but was completely safe. If you went through a pvp zone or turned in way out in the middle of the ocean you got alot better rewards. That way there was always people for me to come steal there goods or big fish they fished up without getting penalties.

Caravans have next to nothing to do with the frequency of people going corrupt.

akabear

Following on from earlier comment.

Might not the "appropriate amount of green ganking" be the community's response to self-regulating to maintain appropriate levels of behavior?

And everything else dependant on one's self or guilds' actions/diplomatic approach and positioning in the world!

ExiledByrd

akabear wrote: »

Following on from earlier comment.

Might not the "appropriate amount of green ganking" be the community's response to self-regulating to maintain appropriate levels of behavior?

And everything else dependant on one's self or guilds' actions/diplomatic approach and positioning in the world!

That depends on the corruption system. If the penalties are severe enough to make enforcement a deterrent, then the community can decide how much they are going to enforce. If the penalties are lax then there is a lot less than the community can do.

Hinotori

All pvp is good pvp tbh.

akabear

ExiledByrd wrote: »

akabear wrote: »

Following on from earlier comment.

Might not the "appropriate amount of green ganking" be the community's response to self-regulating to maintain appropriate levels of behavior?

And everything else dependant on one's self or guilds' actions/diplomatic approach and positioning in the world!

That depends on the corruption system. If the penalties are severe enough to make enforcement a deterrent, then the community can decide how much they are going to enforce. If the penalties are lax then there is a lot less than the community can do.

That`s the point, if the killing a green is not too severe, then instead of having game systems regulate server-acceptable ranges of player behavior the player community can.

I, for one, would much rather have reasonable capacity and accept reasonable consequence to kill that annoying bot that is always in my favorite spot than wait several days or weeks for the player initiated report to be actioned on.

Dolyem

I'll be testing corruption a lot for alpha 2. But the tldr answer is enough to supply relevancy to the bounty system, to causing conflicts between players, guilds, nodes etc , and to OWPvP in general. Corruption is meant as a deterrent griefing, not a prevention of ganking.
That being said, corruption also has to be enough of a deterrent to hinder players from excessive ganking/camping.

Off the top of my head I would make every 3 corrupted kills increase your difficulty to perform in the game exponentially. So initially you wouldn't be drowning from the effects, but as you continue, each tier would be significantly more noticeable than the last. Maybe having the 3rd tier being an outright necessity to reduce corruption in order to be functional. So 3, youd be feelin a slight effect, 6 would be a very noticeable stat decrease, and 9+ corruption kills youd be sweating to take on a fight.

All of this doesnt factor in level differences contributing more corruption and what not which would obviously be a factor as well.

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