Alpha 2 queues = SCAM?!?!?!?

OK im going off on a tangent but seriously this just freaks me out.

A year ago there were supposed to be 100k already on board for alpha 2. Now we have expected launch at 9k users?

We ain't going to get the dropoff you normally get, because its weekends only. The CCU to registered users ratio is going to be much higher than typical games for the first 3 months. Easily going to be 50k people on Oct 25th prime time trying to log in. Probably the same on Saturday Oct 26th... Maybe 30k on Sunday... But hell ain't 9k wtf?!

Then next weekend probably same thing because everyone still hyped. Could be 3-4 weekends with 30k+ users throughout 50% of the playable time.

Like maybe by February 2025 they drop down to 9k concurrent, or april or something. And I would think that is minimum users.

They said that they would whip up new realms. But shouldn't they have started with at least 10-15?

They have already said that queues will be a thing for the actual game launch, but in this case we are paying some fair cash to "test" the game, and we may just be stuck in queues the whole time.

Can you imagine the sucker that spends $120 for 7 weeks of Alpha 1 Wave 1 and is stuck in a queue EVERY WEEKEND? LOL

That would be a total scam.

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Khronus

I'm not sure you understand at all what was said during the AMA. My suggestion would be to go back and watch it but this time don't freak out when you hear something you don't like. Listen all the way through. It will be OK and if you decide to buy into the alpha 2 to help test (not to PLAY a game but to TEST with other TESTERS), you will be able to get in.

Side note.....do you really think they want to sell these passes just for people to sit around and not help them test? Like...really?

arkileo

Steven did pretty clearly say they'd spin up new servers if needed.

That said, I think there might be some calculus in this decision. Phase 1 only has limited content (Riverlands plus some Tropics/Desert). 3k players is 1/3 of the intended final concurrent population. The land area present at the start of A2 is not 1/3 of the total end land area. So the population is going to be too large for the starting area.

You might think that the obvious solution is to just add more servers, but if they do that then we end up with the reverse situation over time. As A2 progresses, more content will be added, but the server population is only expected to decrease, so we end up with less players than intended for the area. So long term it might be better to limit the number of servers in order to maintain the appropriate number of players for the area that will eventually be developed. Then again, people might just leave because they can't get in.

Not sure what the winning answer is here, but I'm sure IS put a lot of thought into it.

Xeeg

arkileo wrote: »

Steven did pretty clearly say they'd spin up new servers if needed.

That said, I think there might be some calculus in this decision. Phase 1 only has limited content (Riverlands plus some Tropics/Desert). 3k players is 1/3 of the intended final concurrent population. The land area present at the start of A2 is not 1/3 of the total end land area. So the population is going to be too large for the starting area.

You might think that the obvious solution is to just add more servers, but if they do that then we end up with the reverse situation over time. As A2 progresses, more content will be added, but the server population is only expected to decrease, so we end up with less players than intended for the area. So long term it might be better to limit the number of servers in order to maintain the appropriate number of players for the area that will eventually be developed. Then again, people might just leave because they can't get in.

Not sure what the winning answer is here, but I'm sure IS put a lot of thought into it.

Yeah but honestly if they had 0 queue / high merge risk servers i would play on those. If they got to spin some more up and then merge players that opt in that would be easy enough.

Piedplat

If I purchased the package with alpha 1, beta 1 and 2, in which wave I will be 1, 2 or 3?

rollox

No matter what they get testing of the login and authentication servers. Plus they get tests of how many players can be in a zone. How well the server meshing tech handles having 3000 players in the starting area.

Then also they get tests on how far they can ramp up the users. If by some miracle everything fires up and runs without a hitch at 3000. They can then say ok, let's open up the que and load in another 500 - 1000 and see what happens.

Even logging in and waiting in a queue is helping the test.

They get to test how quickly and efficiently they can spin up a new realm. How quickly the network and communication services can begin logging players to a new realm created on the fly. And then on the other side of that they get tests on how to and what impacts are when servers merge.

I am not sure what to expect with merges early in alpha. I would expect more of a server landscape and realm number reset when there is a wipe. To start this all over and iterate on those tests again.

Hinotori

Piedplat wrote: »

If I purchased the package with alpha 1, beta 1 and 2, in which wave I will be 1, 2 or 3?

@Piedplat if you've already got an A2 package then you're automatically phase 1 all the way through the other 2 alpha phases into the beta and so on until the launch.

Only new key buyers actually have to worry about what phase they'd like to be in

Noaani

Xeeg wrote: »

DominusRegius wrote: »

That’s why they put such a large emphasis on this isn’t a game. It’s a development test. They don’t need a bunch of people who just plan on getting on just to play a game. It’s meant to get the dedicated players who have passion for their project, people that certainly care about this games future, the ability to communicate issues etc more accurately. That way when the people who only care about having fun, can actually have fun

yeah but you can have passion for the project and still not want to waste weekends upon weekends waiting in queues to play and taking naps or doing other things lol just to get in... That just sucks.

With it being weekend only, I'm not even going to download it.

I'll look at testing when it's either persistent, or at least weeks long.

BackgroundDust

steve said 3k "per realm" - i'm assuming server and 100k people are likely to want to play or something, also people buying these keys are able to play only on 3rd week (unless they got alpha 2 package or something earlier) if I'm not mistaken. have you ever seen an mmo with 1 server? They will have a few maybe just not on a day 1. also, from october to november there are only 3 months and wipes are likely to happen and mergers are likely to happen too to manage players per server. I think they know what they are doing.
and again with that key you get access to all 3 phases which will be easily over 6 months.

BlackBrony

Xeeg wrote: »

Smaashley wrote: »

Actually it's 10$ more than Phase 2 access, so it's not a 120$ scam. I understand your concern, there will probably be huge queues. Then why don't you just buy the Phase 2 or Phase 3 keys ? They literally give you the option.

Still, if you pay $120 for 7 weekends of Alpha 1 Wave 1 and you literally cannot even play because the game is purposefully throttled, that is some messed up shit imo.

You're paying to TEST, I repeat, TEST the game. NOT play the game. I repeat, NOT play the game.
Being in a queue is also TESTING the game.

Xeeg

BlackBrony wrote: »

Xeeg wrote: »

Smaashley wrote: »

Actually it's 10$ more than Phase 2 access, so it's not a 120$ scam. I understand your concern, there will probably be huge queues. Then why don't you just buy the Phase 2 or Phase 3 keys ? They literally give you the option.

Still, if you pay $120 for 7 weekends of Alpha 1 Wave 1 and you literally cannot even play because the game is purposefully throttled, that is some messed up shit imo.

You're paying to TEST, I repeat, TEST the game. NOT play the game. I repeat, NOT play the game.
Being in a queue is also TESTING the game.

Lol if you pay to "test" the game and you are only stuck in queue that's still lame bro. You are not going to convince me that we should be happy to queue test the game for multiple prime time weekends.

PherPhur

Xeeg wrote: »

Smaashley wrote: »

Actually it's 10$ more than Phase 2 access, so it's not a 120$ scam. I understand your concern, there will probably be huge queues. Then why don't you just buy the Phase 2 or Phase 3 keys ? They literally give you the option.

Still, if you pay $120 for 7 weekends of Alpha 1 Wave 1 and you literally cannot even play because the game is purposefully throttled, that is some messed up shit imo.

They include the other phases. If you want to save 10 bucks I suppose a person could get phase 2 access instead.

What pisses me off is that these new alpha keys don't include the betas, I think that's some shit. If they can support the new alpha players buying keys for the alpha, than they can support the beta right? Since they were planning on already letting their original A2 players play beta?

Make it make sense to me.

Oh wait, nvm I'll make it make sense. It's because they plan on releasing new keys when Beta 1 drops that were just like the A2 keys they quit selling that include the mandatory shit people don't want like embers and gametime and cosmetics.

Which is overpriced, just like these new A2 only keys are overpriced. Steven tried talking about the value proposition, yea 120 bucks just to get stuck in a que like you said, and have it only exclusively for A2, WITHOUT any embers or gametime or cosmetics lmfao?

This key shit has gone from completely reasonable in my eyes to likely predatory and the decision to quit selling A2 keys might have just been part of that. I now think that decision was made with these new A2 keys in mind and that it has nothing to do with "new network capabilities".

I'm getting real bad vibes from all this

RocketFarmer

People sure love throwing the word “scam” around a lot.

It’s an Alpha. Not the Korean-to-western conversion alpha of an already developed game, but a real alpha. Not an alpha in name only. Not “early access”. An Alpha. Be thankful your character isn’t just a box, because they don’t need all of the details turned on during an alpha unless it’s to test the look and feel of PCs.

It’s a Test, not a game. You’re testing features and systems. If you want to play a game, then wait for release.

As for duration, Alpha 2 wave 3 could take anywhere from 3 to 5 years, in my opinion, based on the time between Alpha 1 to Alpha 2 launch. Plus I fully expect some things to slide from waves 1 or 2 into wave 3 (and iterations of such). $100 for that time is really nothing compared to a monthly subscription. They could have sold Alpha 2 as a monthly subscription and made a lot more money, and players expecting unreasonable things could be in and out at minimal cost to them.

They have been very explicit in stating “do not buy an Alpha key if you expect to play a game.” It’s an opportunity to perform work as a real tester and possibly contribute to some game decisions via voting.

So not a scam. People making such claims either aren’t listening, are trolling, or just attention seeking on their next thing to gripe about. Lot of people make a living or find entertainment from complaining.

Sunboy

I agree it’s a scam. Me paying a company for doing their work? Should it not be reverse?

Much love ❤️

PherPhur

Sunboy wrote: »

I agree it’s a scam. Me paying a company for doing their work? Should it not be reverse?

Much love ❤️

Anytime you have people passionate about working on something IRL, there is always people around to exploit that passion. Hence game developers suffering from some of the most extreme and generally unfair work conditions of any US industry, it's because they'll do it when asked, there's people lining up to get a shot at their dream job so it's not like the employer has to care about absolutely obliterating their mental health(which is apparently a super common issue).

Can you blame the exploiters though, it's basically free money. Who do you know that would turn that down? MILK MILK MILK

Aszkalon

DominusRegius wrote: »

If you watched todays stream on twitch you would learn that they plan on consistently increasing CCU the longer the tests go on and things are working out well.

I admit i didn't watch all of it. I watched a bit, but Reallife happened and so i was busy at the time.

DominusRegius wrote: »

They’ve told people for years not to buy the packs with expectations to play the game or anything.

And they repeat that Statement every time in every Livestream and Presentation. But they are literally like Reason itself trying to talk back against an unrelenting Stream and Flood of Thirst for a good Game.

How many of these People - ( looking at Narc for example ) - are SOOOOOOOOOOO. DESPERATELY. trying to struggle against "dying from thirst" as MMO Gamers,

that they would do literally "anything" to get a new taste of something else,
than these pathetic mishmash MMO's ??

Worry not, Friends. We will have professional Testers in droves. But some People will log in into Verra and be all like :

* dunks Head into water *

* crazy gulping sounds underwater *

And they won't care if they would almost suffocate. They searched desperate for an Escape from all these shitty MMO's. Enough that they embrace a TRUE Alpha and will (hopefully) endure countless Lags, Disconnects, Log-in Que's, Wipes and so on.

People can yapp whatever they like against this Statement of mine - > MMO Gamers were "NEVER" this hyped for any WoW-Expansion i can remember. Not even for Legion. And Legion was the LAST, true WoW Addon until now.

DominusRegius wrote: »

If you’re buying a pack you’re buying it with intentions of TESTING when the chance comes and that means dealing with all the cons of play tests. Especially in one of the most COMPLEX genres of the gaming industry.

If people are upset about anything then that’s because they made impulsive decisions.

I do it for testing - but i do it also to be able to do what i want to do.

" Look around " ... ... ... ... ... ... ... and "breathe" with my Mind and Soul the fresh Air - that i tasted the last time, when i entered the World of Skyrim after my Main Character and Ralof fled from Helgen and Alduin for our Lives.

I just want to ... ... ... ... ... ... see a Video Game World again, one last time which makes my Heart and Soul race in Excitement and Joy - before my Real Life Body gives out one day. And i am willing to work the hard Job of testing a true Alpha,

if it means i am able to help dear Intrepid and Everyone else that Ashes of Creation comes out even "ONE Minute", or even "ONE MILLISECOND" sooner. 🫡 . 🫡 . 🫡 . 🫡 . 🫡 . 🫡

Aszkalon

RocketFarmer wrote: »

People sure love throwing the word “scam” around a lot.

I can solid promise Everyone here in the Forum that i am shitting you not when i say :

- If for every single Time - since January 2024 - i read the Word " SCAM " in Connection to this Game in Development,

- ONE DAY would be taken off from the waiting Time for Alpha Two, meaning it would come One Day sooner everytime someone wrote "SCAM",

then the whole Delay of Alpha Two into late October would be totally reversed and we would likely test the Alpha Two in probably around the next +10 Days or in the middle of September.

DominusRegius

Xeeg wrote: »

arkileo wrote: »

Steven did pretty clearly say they'd spin up new servers if needed.

That said, I think there might be some calculus in this decision. Phase 1 only has limited content (Riverlands plus some Tropics/Desert). 3k players is 1/3 of the intended final concurrent population. The land area present at the start of A2 is not 1/3 of the total end land area. So the population is going to be too large for the starting area.

You might think that the obvious solution is to just add more servers, but if they do that then we end up with the reverse situation over time. As A2 progresses, more content will be added, but the server population is only expected to decrease, so we end up with less players than intended for the area. So long term it might be better to limit the number of servers in order to maintain the appropriate number of players for the area that will eventually be developed. Then again, people might just leave because they can't get in.

Not sure what the winning answer is here, but I'm sure IS put a lot of thought into it.

Yeah but honestly if they had 0 queue / high merge risk servers i would play on those. If they got to spin some more up and then merge players that opt in that would be easy enough.

If you payed for a test expecting to get a fully released game you’re just lame. We’re not here to convince you it’s suppose to be fun we’re trying to tell you it’s BEING TESTED NOT PLAYED. You’re clearly have zero experience in the mmorpg world if you’re crying like a child about wait times. Go PLAY new world, a game that’s actually released, instead of sitting here making a bunch of meaningless complaints about needing to wait. If wait times are upsetting you during the alpha stages then I HIGHLY recommend you leave this game and this genre behind and not touch it with a 10
Foot pole. This genre has and will always be known for having queues. Especially on something like first day releases and TESTS.

DominusRegius

Xeeg wrote: »

BlackBrony wrote: »

Xeeg wrote: »

Smaashley wrote: »

Actually it's 10$ more than Phase 2 access, so it's not a 120$ scam. I understand your concern, there will probably be huge queues. Then why don't you just buy the Phase 2 or Phase 3 keys ? They literally give you the option.

Still, if you pay $120 for 7 weekends of Alpha 1 Wave 1 and you literally cannot even play because the game is purposefully throttled, that is some messed up shit imo.

You're paying to TEST, I repeat, TEST the game. NOT play the game. I repeat, NOT play the game.
Being in a queue is also TESTING the game.

Lol if you pay to "test" the game and you are only stuck in queue that's still lame bro. You are not going to convince me that its fun.

The alpha legit only has 3 races, a fraction of the map and is missing classes if I remember correctly still. Alpha 2 won’t even have duels at the start. You’re not going to get to PLAY much. Your expectations just don’t match reality. If anyone is to blame it’s yourself and your own lack of drive to look into something before you drop money. You bought something because you put little to no effort to look into the product you were getting.

Did you even buy one of the packs???

DominusRegius

Xeeg wrote: »

BlackBrony wrote: »

Xeeg wrote: »

Smaashley wrote: »

Actually it's 10$ more than Phase 2 access, so it's not a 120$ scam. I understand your concern, there will probably be huge queues. Then why don't you just buy the Phase 2 or Phase 3 keys ? They literally give you the option.

Still, if you pay $120 for 7 weekends of Alpha 1 Wave 1 and you literally cannot even play because the game is purposefully throttled, that is some messed up shit imo.

You're paying to TEST, I repeat, TEST the game. NOT play the game. I repeat, NOT play the game.
Being in a queue is also TESTING the game.

Lol if you pay to "test" the game and you are only stuck in queue that's still lame bro. You are not going to convince me that its fun.

If you bought the 100-120 dollar packs with the expectations to PLAY the game in a state of “early access” like your traditional AAA company then you didn’t watch the ama. If you bought the 250$ dollar pack with the expectation that it’s going to get you access to again, an early access game, then you didn’t watch a single stream over the years period.

You put your money before your brain as simple as that 🤷🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️💀

Xeeg

DominusRegius wrote: »

Xeeg wrote: »

DominusRegius wrote: »

If you payed for a test expecting to get a fully released game you’re just lame. We’re not here to convince you it’s suppose to be fun we’re trying to tell you it’s BEING TESTED NOT PLAYED.

Nice straw man argument. I never said anything about playing a fully released game. I can see the blood vessels protruding from your thick forehead like an erect male reproductive organ. You need to calm down.

If you say so lol, you’ve made it pretty clear you’re based in a completely different reality then most. Almost every argument you’ve made you make it very clear you’re just here for alpha 2 to play a game.

Fair enough. We are funding this project. We didn't even get shares, at the very least we should be able to complain about things we don't like and praise things we do like.

I don't like waiting in queues, its possible that their current design could result in queues for many weekends.

It's also possible that they fire up enough realms to drastically reduce queues. I am complaining now so that the latter is more likely.

Having hardware/software issues that need to be fixed is one thing. But purposefully throttling the people who paid to test the alpha to waste hours of primetime on weekends waiting in queues is lame AF.

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