Simple question. Do you want Ashes to succeed, or fail?

Are you for Ashes succeeding or failing. I ask this because by reading some of these threads makes me think you all want it to fail. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Its understandable if you have questions. But to beat to death, over and over, on these forums, on reddit, on Reactions from content creators. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Say your piece and move on, or am I to assume you guys want to tank Ashes. Lots of people still have hope, and I think you guys just want to ruin it for everyone because your feelings are out of control.

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Ayeveegaming1

Aszkalon wrote: »

Ravicus wrote: »

I too want to be a necromancer!!! Welcome brother. We might find ourselves on the same field of battle, I hope to call you brother. I know my signature days rogue, but I made that some years ago haha.

Ahoi Ravicus. 🫡 .

We still have to wait up to Quarter Two of 2025 to be able to test our beloved Archetype of Summoner, but it will be worth the wait i am sure.

Stay healthy and safe and never forget - where most People see only dead folks lying around - we see possibly Friends or useful future Servants who might help us on our travels.
Dead People are just Allies we haven't met sooner. (lol) - and with a bit of "late healing" and magical convincing i am sure they will lend us a willing, helping, dead and cold hand to get our Stuff done in the World of Verra.

grimhildr

I enjoy participating in Alpha testing so I think I am going to optimistically buy in for A2. The keys are a decent value now I think. I have a ton of fun testing Star Citizen and have spent way more money on that. I hope a similar sort of culture can be fostered here. I especially like Star Citizen's Issue Council for tracking bugs.

iccer

I've been following the project since 2017. Of course I want it to succeed.

This "game" has become different than what I expected it would be, and the closer we get to launch, I think less and less it will be what I imagined it would be.

Maybe that's my fault, maybe Steven's vision changed, maybe it's just the implementation of certain systems that's a problem, I have no idea.

I'm still hopeful, I want the game to be good.

Now we can talk about what exactly does "succeed" mean. Whether it's going to be a flop, whether it will live up to hype, whether it will be one of the most popular MMOs... I think we all might have a different answer. I just want the game to be good, enjoyable, and to have a decent population so it can sustain itself.

I think during Alpha 2, more precisely in about years time, I will have a clear a clear vision of whether the game will be for me or not. There's a few thing I'm waiting to see how they're implemented, and one thing they've yet to showcase, which is the key part of the game for me, which will either make me not want to play the game, or make me want to play it even more.

I think they've made many mistakes, not just recently but throughout the years.

The thing that worries me, is that it might be the case that they do not have many things actually thought out and planned how they would work. I still think they're making it up as they go, and then when they make it into a somewhat functioning state, they showcase it to us.
What would really help is them saying, we are aiming to do this, and we want it to work like this. If they are unable to do it for some reason, that's cool, but at least we know what they wanted to do - and they are doing that with some stuff. But I just think the general audience is simply not familiar with what the game will be all about, and how it will function, which is also why many people are not happy with the direction the game's going in.

ariatras

Ravicus wrote: »

Are you for Ashes succeeding or failing. I ask this because by reading some of these threads makes me think you all want it to fail. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Its understandable if you have questions. But to beat to death, over and over, on these forums, on reddit, on Reactions from content creators. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Say your piece and move on, or am I to assume you guys want to tank Ashes. Lots of people still have hope, and I think you guys just want to ruin it for everyone because your feelings are out of control.

I appreciate your passion for Ashes and your concern about the atmosphere in the community. However, I'd like to offer a perspective that considers the role of criticism in the development and success of any project, especially something as complex as a video game.

1. Negativity vs. Apathy: It’s important to recognize that negativity, while sometimes uncomfortable, is often a sign of engagement. When people care enough to critique or voice concerns, it’s because they are invested in the outcome. Apathy, on the other hand, would be a much more worrying sign, as it indicates a lack of interest or belief in the project. In the context of game development, negative feedback often stems from a desire to see the game succeed and from a belief that there is potential worth salvaging.

2. Constructive Criticism: There’s a significant difference between destructive criticism and constructive feedback. While the former seeks to tear down without offering solutions, the latter is crucial for the iterative process of game development. Constructive criticism highlights areas where improvements are needed and often comes with suggestions for how to address those issues. This type of feedback can guide developers to make changes that align the game more closely with community expectations, thereby increasing its chances of success.

3. The Role of Community Feedback: Communities are a vital part of the ecosystem for any online game, especially one as ambitious as Ashes. Developers often rely on community feedback to identify issues that they may not have anticipated or that require prioritization. The forums, Reddit discussions, and content creator reactions all provide valuable data points that can help the development team refine and improve the game.

4. Balancing Passion with Perspective: It’s natural for discussions to become heated, especially when people are passionate about a project. However, it’s important to balance that passion with perspective. Constructive criticism should be encouraged, but it’s also beneficial to acknowledge what is going well and to support the development team where appropriate. A balanced approach ensures that the feedback is both actionable and motivational for the developers.

5. Fostering a Positive Yet Critical Community: The best outcomes often arise from a community that is both supportive and critical. Being critical does not mean being negative for the sake of negativity, but rather holding the project to high standards because you believe in its potential. Encouraging diverse opinions and a robust dialogue around the game can lead to a better final product, as it ensures that a wide range of perspectives are considered.

Nemeses

This has got to be one of the stupidest questions I've seen of late, and I've seen plenty, simple really covers it.

Ravicus wrote: »

Are you for Ashes succeeding or failing. I ask this because by reading some of these threads makes me think you all want it to fail. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Its understandable if you have questions. But to beat to death, over and over, on these forums, on reddit, on Reactions from content creators. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Say your piece and move on, or am I to assume you guys want to tank Ashes. Lots of people still have hope, and I think you guys just want to ruin it for everyone because your feelings are out of control.

Typical fanboi post, its the critics that actually get games changed for the better, well most of the time, fanbois like you are a cancer for any game. you just lap up everything the developers put out, and ask for more please.

You need to be asking questions and pushing, 90% of the time players know far better than Devs what works!!

iccer

iccer wrote: »

I've been following the project since 2017. Of course I want it to succeed.

This "game" has become different than what I expected it would be, and the closer we get to launch, I think less and less it will be what I imagined it would be.

Maybe that's my fault, maybe Steven's vision changed, maybe it's just the implementation of certain systems that's a problem, I have no idea.

I'm still hopeful, I want the game to be good.

Now we can talk about what exactly does "succeed" mean. Whether it's going to be a flop, whether it will live up to hype, whether it will be one of the most popular MMOs... I think we all might have a different answer. I just want the game to be good, enjoyable, and to have a decent population so it can sustain itself.

I think during Alpha 2, more precisely in about years time, I will have a clear a clear vision of whether the game will be for me or not. There's a few thing I'm waiting to see how they're implemented, and one thing they've yet to showcase, which is the key part of the game for me, which will either make me not want to play the game, or make me want to play it even more.

I think they've made many mistakes, not just recently but throughout the years.

The thing that worries me, is that they do not have many things actually thought out and planned how they would work. I still think they're making it up as they go, and then when they make it into a somewhat functioning state, they showcase it to us.
What would really help is them saying, we are aiming to do this, and we want it to work like this. If they are unable to do it for some reason, that's cool, but at least we know what they wanted to do - and they are doing that with some stuff. But I just think the general audience is simply not familiar with what the game will be all about, and how it will function, which is also why many people are not happy with the direction the game's going in.

Since I wrote this one in hurry, let me actually add more to it:

When I said it may seem that they are making it up as they go, it could be true, but it could also be due to poor communication.
So far the game is going in a direction that still interests me, some things haven't turned out the way I expected (wanted) them to - Freeholds and player housing, mainly, with a few other things, but a lot of stuff have been in line with what I expected, somewhat.

Another issue is that players read something, somewhere, or hear about it during live streams, and a few years later, after hearing nothing about it, we get something that's not entirely the same as what they "promised". Things change, everything is subject to change as they keep repeating, so that's why players are giving feedback, and why they're being negative about something they don't like. Since this is an open-development game, it's only logical to conclude that they will take in players feedback about stuff they showcase. It's a totally normal thing.

If you actually want to filter out useless feedback, I think it would be helpful to also be clear about how you want the game to look like, what's the gameplay going to look like, rather than talking about systems in isolation. That is, if the devs know the answer to it, and I'm pretty sure they do, it just hasn't been communicated properly.
This also loops back to my first point, where it seems that they make stuff up as they go. It looks that way, because we just get showcases that are mostly shown in isolation, it's like "hey look what we added", then another stream, "hey, look what else we added". Obviously they want to not spoil the game too much, but that's all going out of the window when Alpha 2 drops.

By filtering out such feedback, you might just get people who are on board with the project, who understand what you're going for, and who want to play that sort of a game, rather than players who think they're getting something they're not.
These players will be able to help out the most, and give better feedback.

The key pattern we see here is communication.
It just needs to improve, maybe we actually get a stream that just explains the vision for the game, how it's going to play, what we are going to do, what's the gameplay going to look like, how do systems tie into that, and how they will work, etc. etc. - it's hard to keep a track of all of that, when you do one stream a month, where you showcase everything in isolation.

I just don't get this post, or rather I don't get why you posted it on Ashes forums. Obviously people here want the game to be good and to succeed. Now if you had asked that question on MMORPG subreddit, or in Asmongold's comment section, then I'd get it, and you might get different answers.

Quarantine

Ludullu_(NiKr) wrote: »

Ravicus wrote: »

Ya, I'm really not trying to argue or disagree with you. All of htis has been stated repeatedly. My point is the image and the reputation for the game. I just hope people understand how it looks to people that are just hearing about the game.

But here's the fun question though. Would this "image and reputation" be better if Intrepid did better after all the feedback, instead of just kneejerking reactions every time?

We all want the game and the devs to succeed, otherwise we wouldn't be here (at least the oldtimers). But saying that "the feedback has been given, you should stop", to me, sounds like "I've hit that person, it's known, stop telling everyone what I did or I'll get a bad rep". Shouldn't have hit a person if you're scared of bad rep.

Reputation is everything.

Ayeveegaming1

Xeph wrote: »

I completely agree with you. It’s important to voice concerns, but constantly dwelling on the negative can create an atmosphere that’s counterproductive to the success we all want for Ashes of Creation. Constructive criticism is crucial, but it should be balanced with hope and positivity, especially in a community that’s excited about what this game can/has become. We all want Ashes to succeed, and keeping discussions forward-thinking and solution-oriented will help us get there.

Let’s focus on supporting the development and building a community that reflects the game’s potential.

Thank you. This is exactly what I am talking about. I appreciate your post.

RocketFarmer

I think the anti-fan may have a greater time investment than the fan. Seems to be the nature of the internet. The more serious position is indifference, which we won’t see posted. The indifferent gamer will just go do something else.

Now there are many who are providing criticism, but not in a way that’s actionable, and a bit hyperbolic. Intrepid needs something concrete they can implement to that doesn’t destroy their vision. Oddly enough the entire Alpha 2 key order thing was Intrepid trying to please the community. Sometimes that’s a no win position. So everyone providing feedback has to take it into consideration. Perhaps we help Intrepid more by using these forums to hammer out these various positions into what most in the community can agree upon. Oh, there will still be disagreement on some subjects and Intrepid will need to make decisions that will alienate some to half of the community, there after making that community smaller.

And then there are those who just want to see the world burn.

ralangorf

Ravicus wrote: »

Ludullu_(NiKr) wrote: »

Ravicus wrote: »

Hopefully your beta issue is/will be addressed soon.

Nah, I'm too small of a niche to care about in this context. There's maybe a few dozen people out there with giveaway A2 keys and ONLY B2 bundles. If even dozens It's a very very precise combination of things.

If you can't get it, I have extra beta keys from Kickstart and I could gift you one.

Hey just a shot in the dark but if you still have that code I'd really like it. I missed the last package window by a week and now keys are two weeks later entry

RonDog98

Ludullu_(NiKr) wrote: »

Ravicus wrote: »

We had hype and momentum going into A2 showcase, now its everyone spitting fire, raging against the machine.

And I wish that hype continued. But we at first got delayed from the inital promise. Then we got a staggered release of the A2. With a staggered high pricepoint. Which led to the drama. Which led to a huge overcorrection. Which led to initial backer drama. Which has now led TO YET ANOTHER OVERCORRECTION.

And none of that came directly from complainers, because complainers could only react to what Intrepid was doing.

I'm still hyped for A2. I'll still be there on day one sitting in a queue waiting for the broken servers to come back up. I'll still shower Intrepid with a ton of feedback on anything they ask me to test.

But I cannot agree with telling people to stop giving feedback about Intrepid's fuckups, especially when there's been several of them in a row, especially when quite a few of them relate directly to people's money (both already-spent and about-to-be-spent ones).

As Crow said, this will blowover soon, just as all previous "dramas" have. People have goldfish brains. And with all the hype surrounding Ashes, the more followers the game has - the more goldfish brains.

I’m very curious what that outline of fuck ups is. I thought I’ve been following close but I guess not.

Ayeveegaming1

ralangorf wrote: »

Ravicus wrote: »

Ludullu_(NiKr) wrote: »

Ravicus wrote: »

Hopefully your beta issue is/will be addressed soon.

Nah, I'm too small of a niche to care about in this context. There's maybe a few dozen people out there with giveaway A2 keys and ONLY B2 bundles. If even dozens It's a very very precise combination of things.

If you can't get it, I have extra beta keys from Kickstart and I could gift you one.

Hey just a shot in the dark but if you still have that code I'd really like it. I missed the last package window by a week and now keys are two weeks later entry

sorry bud, I do not. I have some friends that already claimed them.

nanfoodle

LaZzIsFree wrote: »

Ravicus wrote: »

Kilion wrote: »

From where I stand projections on amount of content and time of delivery are nothing more than an inside joke with the fine difference that for Ashes there is an actual end goal compared to for example Star Citizen.

Well said. Thank you for your statement.

Star citizen is the best example of anybody still believing they are "developing in a good speed"

Star citizen .. infamous for taking forever .....
kickstartet in 2012 ... and the persistens universe was released in 2015 ... so three years after the kickstarter...

this mmorpg here is 8 years in developement and we still wait on the first time anybody others than the A1 testers 3 years ago get into the game ... this is even WAYYYYYY slower than star citizen ...

additionally .... ill spam my frustration as many times as i want ... since i feel mistreated big time ...

There is very few forums that would agree with your thoughts on SC. Most gamers see it as the scam it is. I hope the people that poured their money into, find some happiness.

Ludullu

RonDog98 wrote: »

I’m very curious what that outline of fuck ups is. I thought I’ve been following close but I guess not.

Delays on releases and showcases. An issue with the givaway during the last charity stream. Some misspeaking about design info, that has to be cleared up later (which usually only happens on discord).

All of this just chips away at the image of their competency. And then we get to this key (now bundle) debacle and it definitely doesn't help in any way with that image.

Yes, it's great that they change stuff due to feedback, but how much bett would it be if that particular feedback didn't need to be stated.

unknown

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Otr

nanfoodle wrote: »

LaZzIsFree wrote: »

Ravicus wrote: »

Kilion wrote: »

From where I stand projections on amount of content and time of delivery are nothing more than an inside joke with the fine difference that for Ashes there is an actual end goal compared to for example Star Citizen.

Well said. Thank you for your statement.

Star citizen is the best example of anybody still believing they are "developing in a good speed"

Star citizen .. infamous for taking forever .....
kickstartet in 2012 ... and the persistens universe was released in 2015 ... so three years after the kickstarter...

this mmorpg here is 8 years in developement and we still wait on the first time anybody others than the A1 testers 3 years ago get into the game ... this is even WAYYYYYY slower than star citizen ...

additionally .... ill spam my frustration as many times as i want ... since i feel mistreated big time ...

There is very few forums that would agree with your thoughts on SC. Most gamers see it as the scam it is. I hope the people that poured their money into, find some happiness.

I hope they don't. Is bad for the game industry. People should not assume in advance the risk of failure which is caused by developer's incompetence or lies. There should be competition on the market and the better developers to succeed because they are doing better games.

unknown

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