Leveling Speed

Wiki says the following:

On release the developers anticipate max level should be attainable in approximately 45 days if playing 4-6 hours per day.

This is equal to ~225 hours to reach level 50. What is your opinion about it? Would you like it to be faster or slower?

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Dygz

Flanker wrote: »

Don't forget that new player who starts 6 months after the launch will play on a server with high level nodes, cheaper gear etc., so I'm pretty sure his progress will be much faster

Maybe... we'll have to see how long high level Nodes remain standing before they are destroyed in a Siege.

Caeryl

Can't relate to wanting excessively slow leveling speeds. 45 days of lengthy play-sessions is plenty to understand your adventuring class, and Ashes has plenty of horizontal progression pathways that you'll still have to pursue.

There is no benefit to drawing out leveling beyond its use as a teaching system, and it ends up necessarily segregating players into players who can comfortably no-life the game and those that can't.

Ashes is already imo catering too much to the no-lifer play style. No need for it to infect leveling too.

Aszkalon

Dygz wrote: »

Maybe... we'll have to see how long high level Nodes remain standing before they are destroyed in a Siege.

Sir Steven said People will be able to hire NPC Troops as Mercenaries, right ?

So i assume it will be "heavily" influenced and/or depending if a Node is destroyed somewhat quickly or might stand tall and proud for several RealLife Years from how much Players are willing and able to invest into defending it.

It would be nice if People could make a Node super-hard to destroy if they just don't shy from high Expensives for a good while. It would reward high Effort and financial Sacrifice - and would secure People's Feeling of Safety regarding their Nodes.

Azphel

Caeryl wrote: »

Can't relate to wanting excessively slow leveling speeds. 45 days of lengthy play-sessions is plenty to understand your adventuring class, and Ashes has plenty of horizontal progression pathways that you'll still have to pursue.

There is no benefit to drawing out leveling beyond its use as a teaching system, and it ends up necessarily segregating players into players who can comfortably no-life the game and those that can't.

Ashes is already imo catering too much to the no-lifer play style. No need for it to infect leveling too.

This doesn't mean it's catering to no-life playstile, in my humble opinion. There will always be plenty of people around your level to do things with. A longer, more meaningful leveling experience just makes it all the more rewarding.

Caeryl

Azphel wrote: »

Caeryl wrote: »

Can't relate to wanting excessively slow leveling speeds. 45 days of lengthy play-sessions is plenty to understand your adventuring class, and Ashes has plenty of horizontal progression pathways that you'll still have to pursue.

There is no benefit to drawing out leveling beyond its use as a teaching system, and it ends up necessarily segregating players into players who can comfortably no-life the game and those that can't.

Ashes is already imo catering too much to the no-lifer play style. No need for it to infect leveling too.

This doesn't mean it's catering to no-life playstile, in my humble opinion. There will always be plenty of people around your level to do things with. A longer, more meaningful leveling experience just makes it all the more rewarding.

There's psychological tricks that might make you personally place higher value on the max level, but it's not actually more rewarding to extended the leveling processing.

Edit: Be mindful that leveling is more than anything else, an enforced time sink, during which systems are gradually introduced with the intention that you'll learn your class and the game systems over the duration of that time sink.

Dygz

Aszkalon wrote: »

Sir Steven said People will be able to hire NPC Troops as Mercenaries, right ?

As Mercenaries to do what, when....???

Aszkalon wrote: »

So i assume it will be "heavily" influenced and/or depending if a Node is destroyed somewhat quickly or might stand tall and proud for several RealLife Years from how much Players are willing and able to invest into defending it.

It does depend on how long Nodes stand.
And we don't have enough data to support assumptions about how easy it will or won't be for newbie player characters to Level 6+ months after Launch.

Aszkalon wrote: »

It would be nice if People could make a Node super-hard to destroy if they just don't shy from high Expensives for a good while. It would reward high Effort and financial Sacrifice - and would secure People's Feeling of Safety regarding their Nodes.

Depends...
Super-stable Metros make for stagnant content in Ashes...
We'll have to play to know how nice that might be.

Depraved

i think leveling will slow down during release when all the node progression systems are implemented. leveling speed will be tied up to the level of the nodes. if there are no high level nodes, there won't be any high level monsters or quests.

Dygz

Azphel wrote: »

A longer, more meaningful leveling experience just makes it all the more rewarding.

I'm pretty sure I disagree with that. I think Bill Trost also disagrees with that.
Margaret probably agreees with you. Streven probably agrees with you.
That is, of course, more of a Hardcore playstyle thing.

Depraved

just because the leveling take slonger, doesnt mean its more meaningful or very rewarding...there have to be other elements that make It so

Myosotys

Depraved wrote: »

just because the leveling take slonger, doesnt mean its more meaningful or very rewarding...there have to be other elements that make It so

This is true but many other elements become less meaningful if the leveling is fast. It's all a question of balance.

Flanker

Wait, it's been like ~10 comments already and not a single person has accused me in "bumping another thread about Leveling from forum alt account"? No way

Caeryl

Myosotys wrote: »

Depraved wrote: »

just because the leveling take slonger, doesnt mean its more meaningful or very rewarding...there have to be other elements that make It so

This is true but many other elements become less meaningful if the leveling is fast. It's all a question of balance.

225 hours over 45-60 days is plenty of time to make use of gear. Progression through levels is vertical, so you'll never be losing power by holding onto gear for an extra level or 5.

There are no other systems that are hardwired in leveling speed.

Aszkalon

Dygz wrote: »

As Mercenaries to do what, when....???

Help Players to defend the Nodes against Attackers ?

Dygz wrote: »

It does depend on how long Nodes stand.
And we don't have enough data to support assumptions about how easy it will or won't be for newbie player characters to Level 6+ months after Launch.

Wasn't there like a Statement or several that Nodes need to conquer and subdue other Nodes to grow into LvL 6 Metropolisses ?

I don't think it will be that easy. But not like we are going to test that anytime soon. That is at least still a good Year from here on.

Dygz wrote: »

Depends...
Super-stable Metros make for stagnant content in Ashes...
We'll have to play to know how nice that might be.

Oh geez. You might be right. Maybe a super-stable Metro would be horrible for many People who would love some change in the World of Verra and might never get it - as long as a certain few Locations are always with a Metropolis.

But when the Metropolis CAN. NOT. otherwise than fall someday

that would also make for nice Content against the feared "Mega-Guilds" and their wannabe-superior, eternal Reign and Rule. Like +400 to +500 Super-Elitist Players defending the Node every Day all Year long and STILL lose it at some point. 🤣 🤣

Depraved

Myosotys wrote: »

Depraved wrote: »

just because the leveling take slonger, doesnt mean its more meaningful or very rewarding...there have to be other elements that make It so

This is true but many other elements become less meaningful if the leveling is fast. It's all a question of balance.

sure but whats more important then? that's the question.

slow leveling can be very meaningful in an open world PVP game if every level matters, kind of like in l2 where if you are a skill level ahead of your opponent, they have almost no chance, or mobs suddenly become much easier because your increased invisible stats, making you use less SS and saving you money, etc. but there isn't a lot to do in l2 pve beside killing mobs for exp/loot/money, aside from a few quests here and there and bosses

i find 2 months reasonable in ashes, considering that there will be a lot of stuff to do besides killing mobs.

RocketFarmer

I think there was a sense of having skin in the game by grinding for levels.

While others want to get to the “fun” content without having to grind. Which is why there is a market for level boosts in other RPGs.

Since AoC is a PVX sandbox, the rate of leveling may not really matter and is perhaps arbitrary. Trying to provide a sense of the old school level grind without the old school level grind.

So looks like they’re going after a 2 month period to get to “end game”, although it’s not really end game. Some might say level 50 is where the game begins.

I’d prefer a slower leveling experience at the rate of 5 levels per in game year (1 or 2 months real time). Meaning 10 months to reach level 50 at minimum. Node progression needs to be at least 2-5 times as slow, or exponential as the node progresses higher. So a Metropolis ought to feel like a Titan in Eve Online.

Caeryl

RocketFarmer wrote: »

I’d prefer a slower leveling experience at the rate of 5 levels per in game year (1 or 2 months real time). Meaning 10 months to reach level 50 at minimum. Node progression needs to be at least 2-5 times as slow, or exponential as the node progresses higher. So a Metropolis ought to feel like a Titan in Eve Online.

That would quickly and immediately turn a lot of potential players away. Nearly 5 months just to unlock your secondary class? Absolutely not.

Nodes are meant to rise and fall with decent speed, because that's how content is enabled or disabled within the world. It shouldn't take 10months before we see a metro-based dungeon.

Myosotys

Depraved wrote: »

i find 2 months reasonable in ashes, considering that there will be a lot of stuff to do besides killing mobs.

I find reasonable the time announced of 45 days (4-6) hours per day ONLY if it's calculted on the XP time only. Otherwise it's way to short if it included side activities of the game.

Worfgar

Azphel wrote: »

Hello, I also believe leveling should be slower. Getting gear should be slow as well, it was always a fantastic experience when you got green or blue gear in previous games, before everything was rushed and games were in a hurry to give players gold or above level items. Leveling up was an achievement and not just an expectation.
Please make things hard for us so they are meaningful!

I also prefer a slower leveling experience. I don't want to rush to get max level. It should be a marathon not a sprint.

Zehlan

Worfgar wrote: »

Azphel wrote: »

Hello, I also believe leveling should be slower. Getting gear should be slow as well, it was always a fantastic experience when you got green or blue gear in previous games, before everything was rushed and games were in a hurry to give players gold or above level items. Leveling up was an achievement and not just an expectation.
Please make things hard for us so they are meaningful!

I also prefer a slower leveling experience. I don't want to rush to get max level. It should be a marathon not a sprint.

Whether it is a marathon or a sprint that dis your choice. No one says you have to power level to 50 and bypass everything else till your max level.I have taken 3 months to get to max level when others have done it in 7 days in other games. I spent the first 9 days 12 hours per days in New World chopping trees and got to max level almost entirely on crafting /gathering.

So in that regard my view is this isn't about people wanting to actually level slower it is actually about certain people forcing other people to level slower because they don't like people to level faster than them! Comes off as petty and not everyone gets a ribbon!

Worfgar

Zehlan wrote: »

Worfgar wrote: »

Azphel wrote: »

Hello, I also believe leveling should be slower. Getting gear should be slow as well, it was always a fantastic experience when you got green or blue gear in previous games, before everything was rushed and games were in a hurry to give players gold or above level items. Leveling up was an achievement and not just an expectation.
Please make things hard for us so they are meaningful!

I also prefer a slower leveling experience. I don't want to rush to get max level. It should be a marathon not a sprint.

Whether it is a marathon or a sprint that dis your choice. No one says you have to power level to 50 and bypass everything else till your max level.I have taken 3 months to get to max level when others have done it in 7 days in other games. I spent the first 9 days 12 hours per days in New World chopping trees and got to max level almost entirely on crafting /gathering.

So in that regard my view is this isn't about people wanting to actually level slower it is actually about certain people forcing other people to level slower because they don't like people to level faster than them! Comes off as petty and not everyone gets a ribbon!

I am never in a rush to get to max level. I just enjoy the ride it takes to get there. I am always wanting the experience to last longer and like it when it means something to gain a level. i don't care who beats me to the finish line. It's just my personal preference.

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