Did We Ever Figure Out What THIS Means (Re: Secondaries)??

Did they ever clarify what this means?

I.e does it mean that the Tank Primary archetype, and the Cleric Primary archetype will start getting access to many of the 8 Secondary archetypes,

OR does it mean that the Cleric & Tank Secondary Archetypes will start to become available for all 8 PRIMARY Archetypes?

Plz help, confused...

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Shabooey

I think it's that the, current, playable archetypes will get access to Tank and Cleric as a secondary archetype.

Vhaeyne

Auldrakar wrote: »

he Cleric & Tank Secondary Archetypes will start to become available for all 8 PRIMARY

My interpretation is this.

unknown

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nanfoodle

Agreed, all classes will access secondary Archtype Tank and Cleric.

daveywavey

Auldrakar wrote: »

I.e does it mean that the Tank Primary archetype, and the Cleric Primary archetype will start getting access to many of the 8 Secondary archetypes

Hmmm, I read it as this one.
I figured they'd want to see more data on the Summoner and Rogue before they start adding augments. Just made more sense that they'd be adding the first augments to the archetypes that have been out the longest and likely already have the most test data.

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Vhaeyne

daveywavey wrote: »

I figured they'd want to see more data on the Summoner and Rogue before they start adding augments. Just made more sense that they'd be adding the first augments to the archetypes that have been out the longest and likely already have the most test data.

The idea that two of the classes are going to get access to expanded options before the rest of the classes is wild to me.

It just seems unfair. Everyone is going to be tank and cleric if that's the case.

unknown

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RocketFarmer

Tank secondary and Cleric secondary archetypes will be available for all eight primary archetypes. Appears they want to test two of the more common secondaries, other than Bard. It’s actually a little worse for those playing Tank or Cleric primary archetypes because they either go Tank/Tank, Tank Cleric, Cleric/ Cleric or Cleric/Tank. In other words more of what you already are or one option to augment to something different. Not sure how many skills that affects, thought they indicated 5. That would be 40 new skill augments, some flavors and others new skills. Think Cleric will the more popular option as players will want some healing to sustain.

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Lodrig

Well we CAN be assureed that

Cleric/Cleric High Priest
Cleric/Tank Apostle
Tank/Tank Guardian
Tank/Cleric Paladin

Will all be come available

Azherae

Lodrig wrote: »

Well we CAN be assureed that

Cleric/Cleric High Priest
Cleric/Tank Apostle
Tank/Tank Guardian
Tank/Cleric Paladin

Will all be come available

It certainly makes more 'sense' for it to be Tank Secondary and Cleric Secondary. These are among the easiest things to work out the broad concepts of, but might take a longer time to balance. They're a good foundation, too.

It would also ease some of the 'strain' on smaller groups trying to do certain content, even if they don't change the level that secondary Archetypes become available.

And ofc, if they do change the level of that, it's still relatively easy to deal with 'This Ranger can pull more hate' and 'this Ranger can heal' and 'This Bard can heal a bit more'/'this Bard can give additional defense buffs' or whatever.

"Some Tanks can summon now, sorry Rangers, y'all have to stay the same until later" just seems so much less likely to me.

(But no, to OP, we don't have any direct clarification yet)

daveywavey

Vhaeyne wrote: »

daveywavey wrote: »

I figured they'd want to see more data on the Summoner and Rogue before they start adding augments. Just made more sense that they'd be adding the first augments to the archetypes that have been out the longest and likely already have the most test data.

The idea that two of the classes are going to get access to expanded options before the rest of the classes is wild to me.

It just seems unfair. Everyone is going to be tank and cleric if that's the case.

It's an Alpha for testing purposes. It isn't about "fair".

Why do augments for everybody when you might have errors or mistakes? Do it on a few, see how they go, and then roll it out to the others. That's how I'd be doing it, anyway.

Vhaeyne

@daveywavey

I don’t enjoy disagreeing with you, but I honestly believe that better long-term data can be collected in a fair environment.

I’m not suggesting that the game needs to be 100% balanced at all times, but maintaining fairness as a priority, even in a test environment, should yield more accurate data about what to expect in the live game.

unknown

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Azherae

Auldrakar wrote: »

daveywavey wrote: »

It's an Alpha for testing purposes. It isn't about "fair".

Vhaeyne wrote: »

I honestly believe that better long-term data can be collected in a fair environment.

I’m not suggesting that the game needs to be 100% balanced at all times, but maintaining fairness as a priority, even in a test environment, should yield more accurate data about what to expect in the live game.

Well, whichever it is, the biggest surprise of this thread is that it's managed to garner this much attention and posts from the community, and not a single dev has come in to quickly correct the record, and let us know which one it is in one quick sentence.

I thought the devs/community managers were much more active on these forums, but they seem to have forgotten it exists.

Nah, this is normal, they know we're used to this.

I can just say I've definitely worked in/with companies who would explicitly choose not to clarify something like this, under these conditions, with pretty solid (if frustrating) reasoning for that. Hopefully you still get the clarification, though, someone usually figures out a way to ask or it gets noted to be addressed somewhere.

Watch out for Steven's next interview with one of the game's Content Creators, maybe someone will get it into their question slate, if it doesn't get answered here.

unknown

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Azherae

Auldrakar wrote: »

Azherae wrote: »

I can just say I've definitely worked in/with companies who would explicitly choose not to clarify something like this, under these conditions, with pretty solid (if frustrating) reasoning for that.

I don't get it, what's the reason for intentionally not clarifying it?

The short answer is that 'it boosts engagement'. Having people with relatively lower expectations have something to talk about and speculate on, is sometimes more useful than clarifying. When you clarify something like this, it's 'over'. One set of people is 'happy' and moves on, another set is 'angry' and also moves on, but the discourse doesn't continue, reaching the eyes of more people who are on either side (or just mostly neutral).

In a community setting, more activity on forums, as long as it isn't too hostile or negative to developers, generally is treated as a positive in my limited experience, so the idea would be to leave certain things vague because they 'don't matter'. Foot-in-the-door tactics somewhat, too.

You'll get the people who are sure they'll get to be Tank/Fighter or Cleric/Rogue who are really hype for this, and on the other side, a pile of Necromancers (Summoner/Cleric) who have been waiting around for years.

If you say nothing, neither of these groups is disappointed early, but the actual 'loss of interest' from people who want clarification, is often low.

Vhaeyne

Auldrakar wrote: »

Well, whichever it is, the biggest surprise of this thread is that it's managed to garner this much attention and posts from the community, and not a single dev has come in to quickly correct the record, and let us know which one it is in one quick sentence.

I thought the devs/community managers were much more active on these forums, but they seem to have forgotten it exists.

I took a break from the forums between A1 and a2. The DEVs feel less active on here since I came back.

It would be nice to see them again. I miss seeing that Picard profile pic drop into a thread and clarify things.

bloodprophet

Vhaeyne wrote: »

daveywavey wrote: »

I figured they'd want to see more data on the Summoner and Rogue before they start adding augments. Just made more sense that they'd be adding the first augments to the archetypes that have been out the longest and likely already have the most test data.

The idea that two of the classes are going to get access to expanded options before the rest of the classes is wild to me.

It just seems unfair. Everyone is going to be tank and cleric if that's the case.

I see it the other way around.

Tank and cleric augments for everyone. NOT tank and cleric being the only ones to get secondaries.

As far as confirmation think the whole thread is speculation so far.

Fairness has nothing to do with anything. Nothing in life is fair.

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