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Alpha Two Phase III testing has begun! During this phase, our realms will be open every day, and we'll only have downtime for updates and maintenance. We'll keep everyone up-to-date about downtimes in Discord.
If you have Alpha Two, you can download the game launcher here, and we encourage you to join us on our Official Discord Server for the most up to date testing news.
Beware the Sharpest Edge of Ashes’ Double-Edged Sword – A Serious Look at the Current State of Devel
MybroViajero
Member, Alpha Two
The double-edged sword of Ashes is starting to be wielded by people who aim to “push and force” Intrepid’s vision for the game.
At this stage of Ashes’ development, with the door now open to many new testers, we’ve seen a noticeable increase in complaints, criticism, pressure, calls for radical or conceptual changes, shifts in vision and philosophy—alongside constructive criticism, harsh criticism, destructive criticism, and all sorts of feedback.
What has grown the most? The negative side. The sharper edge of the sword, the one that usually causes the most damage, is now being used by some to pressure, harass, wear down, demoralize, and plant doubt about Ashes’ vision as an MMORPG.
BE VERY CAREFUL, and I mean this seriously—even if it sounds like “nonsense,” a drop of water can split the hardest stone if it falls constantly over a long period of time.
I understand that “open development” carries with it that “freedom” of choice, where future players can decide which side of the double-edged sword they will use. I understand that the developers, the Intrepid team, the leadership, and Steven himself are strongly focused on their vision for Ashes. But we must recognize that the pressure of 5,000 testers who have followed Ashes for 5 or 6 years is not the same as 50,000 or 100,000 testers demanding, “Hey, we should change this because I can’t enjoy Ashes with your stricter philosophy, your slower progression, or your risk vs. reward system—those things don’t belong in modern times.”
I’ll put this as “neutrally as possible,” because I too WANT Ashes to succeed. But I also understand that this “success” will be heavily shaped by certain decisions that must be made in the future.
I understand that Ashes is not only a project with a TRUE vision of what an MMORPG should be, but also a “future business.” I can see why some things might need to be adjusted so that 70% or 80% of the future player base finds Ashes more accessible. I can understand it, I can acknowledge it—but I cannot accept it from the perspective of an MMORPG player who not only loves MMORPGs, but who also UNDERSTANDS that MMORPGs NEED a pillar, an example to restore balance to what the concept and perception of MMORPGs have become “right now.”
We shouldn’t be naïve. I know very well that “open development” has two sides. As Steven said in his interview with NyceGaming, he knows both sides have pros and cons; he has accepted them, experienced them, and understands that the positive side is the most rewarding. HOWEVER, let’s not be naïve enough to allow “bad faith and ill intentions” to run wild simply because open development grants that freedom.
These past weeks, we’ve seen heavy pressure from testers on social media—especially on r/MMORPG, Reddit in general, and other platforms, as well as on the forums—trying to push Ashes away from its vision as an MMORPG. They attempt to pressure, discredit, and frame Ashes as a mediocre project “because it doesn’t meet the expectations of the modern MMORPG audience.”
Is it good to take into account all types of feedback—constructive, critical, negative—in order to adapt the project’s vision to the requirements of the future majority audience?
OF COURSE. It’s always valuable to understand your focus group’s perspective.
But is it good to SURRENDER the project’s vision because of the constant pressure of a potential majority audience?
ABSOLUTELY NOT. And although it may sound contradictory, the truth is that the majority of players usually ask for what they are WILLING to play, not what they could actually ENJOY.
Ashes is an MMORPG project built on a pure vision and philosophy of what a true MMORPG should be. If that vision doesn’t align with the future “majority audience,” then why is Ashes even being developed? It makes no sense to build Ashes without at least some “guarantee” that it will become a profitable business—because OBVIOUSLY, without profit, no project can survive, and OBVIOUSLY Steven’s wallet isn’t infinite. Intrepid cannot rely forever on Steven’s personal funding.
Ashes MUST be profitable to continue its journey.
This creates an apparent contradiction, which reveals a truth:
If Ashes has a vision and philosophy that may not scale with what the majority of modern MMORPG players are used to, and if that means 70–80% of future players could drop the game within the first months—should the project be reshaped to secure that future player base?
OF COURSE NOT! If the people developing Ashes do not BELIEVE, BREATHE, and FEEL that the current vision and philosophy of Ashes are THE vision and philosophy that will make millions of players want to play for years, then there is no point in chasing those 70–80%.
Feedback will be meaningless, open development will be meaningless, and the “double-edged sword” of freedom for testers to voice their opinions will also be meaningless.
The only real question is: DO YOU TRULY BELIEVE IN THE VISION AND PHILOSOPHY OF ASHES? Because if the development is merely about adapting to what players expect—even when it’s clear that MANY testers right now don’t fully grasp that vision—then maybe it’s better to start building something else.
As I said before, Ashes of Creation’s development runs VERY DEEP—so deep that many testers currently cannot fully grasp what is being built. Is that bad? NO. That is NECESSARY, because it gives Intrepid the clarity they need to ADAPT, to ADJUST, to LEARN WHAT CAN BE IMPROVED—while always respecting the MMORPG vision and philosophy they are creating.
“Do not be swayed by newcomers who fail to grasp Ashes’ vision, even if they appear to be the majority.
Do not be swayed, either, by those who praise it and claim to understand the path ahead.
If you TRULY believe in Ashes’ vision and philosophy, then the only influence that should truly matter is your OWN DECISION—whether feedback comes as negativity, positivity, constructive advice, destructive attacks, harsh criticism, or blind praise.
None of that alone defines Ashes. What will define Ashes is the strength of its vision, carried by the choices made along the way. And if, for the sake of the project, those choices must sometimes feel like a hard blow in the present so they can secure a stronger future, then that is what must be done.”
In the end, the answer will always be the same: If Ashes is TRULY GOOD, the players will come. Nothing else matters.
I fully trust the Intrepid team. I just wanted to share these words. Best wishes, and have an excellent week.
At this stage of Ashes’ development, with the door now open to many new testers, we’ve seen a noticeable increase in complaints, criticism, pressure, calls for radical or conceptual changes, shifts in vision and philosophy—alongside constructive criticism, harsh criticism, destructive criticism, and all sorts of feedback.
What has grown the most? The negative side. The sharper edge of the sword, the one that usually causes the most damage, is now being used by some to pressure, harass, wear down, demoralize, and plant doubt about Ashes’ vision as an MMORPG.
BE VERY CAREFUL, and I mean this seriously—even if it sounds like “nonsense,” a drop of water can split the hardest stone if it falls constantly over a long period of time.
I understand that “open development” carries with it that “freedom” of choice, where future players can decide which side of the double-edged sword they will use. I understand that the developers, the Intrepid team, the leadership, and Steven himself are strongly focused on their vision for Ashes. But we must recognize that the pressure of 5,000 testers who have followed Ashes for 5 or 6 years is not the same as 50,000 or 100,000 testers demanding, “Hey, we should change this because I can’t enjoy Ashes with your stricter philosophy, your slower progression, or your risk vs. reward system—those things don’t belong in modern times.”
I’ll put this as “neutrally as possible,” because I too WANT Ashes to succeed. But I also understand that this “success” will be heavily shaped by certain decisions that must be made in the future.
I understand that Ashes is not only a project with a TRUE vision of what an MMORPG should be, but also a “future business.” I can see why some things might need to be adjusted so that 70% or 80% of the future player base finds Ashes more accessible. I can understand it, I can acknowledge it—but I cannot accept it from the perspective of an MMORPG player who not only loves MMORPGs, but who also UNDERSTANDS that MMORPGs NEED a pillar, an example to restore balance to what the concept and perception of MMORPGs have become “right now.”
We shouldn’t be naïve. I know very well that “open development” has two sides. As Steven said in his interview with NyceGaming, he knows both sides have pros and cons; he has accepted them, experienced them, and understands that the positive side is the most rewarding. HOWEVER, let’s not be naïve enough to allow “bad faith and ill intentions” to run wild simply because open development grants that freedom.
These past weeks, we’ve seen heavy pressure from testers on social media—especially on r/MMORPG, Reddit in general, and other platforms, as well as on the forums—trying to push Ashes away from its vision as an MMORPG. They attempt to pressure, discredit, and frame Ashes as a mediocre project “because it doesn’t meet the expectations of the modern MMORPG audience.”
Is it good to take into account all types of feedback—constructive, critical, negative—in order to adapt the project’s vision to the requirements of the future majority audience?
OF COURSE. It’s always valuable to understand your focus group’s perspective.
But is it good to SURRENDER the project’s vision because of the constant pressure of a potential majority audience?
ABSOLUTELY NOT. And although it may sound contradictory, the truth is that the majority of players usually ask for what they are WILLING to play, not what they could actually ENJOY.
Ashes is an MMORPG project built on a pure vision and philosophy of what a true MMORPG should be. If that vision doesn’t align with the future “majority audience,” then why is Ashes even being developed? It makes no sense to build Ashes without at least some “guarantee” that it will become a profitable business—because OBVIOUSLY, without profit, no project can survive, and OBVIOUSLY Steven’s wallet isn’t infinite. Intrepid cannot rely forever on Steven’s personal funding.
Ashes MUST be profitable to continue its journey.
This creates an apparent contradiction, which reveals a truth:
If Ashes has a vision and philosophy that may not scale with what the majority of modern MMORPG players are used to, and if that means 70–80% of future players could drop the game within the first months—should the project be reshaped to secure that future player base?
OF COURSE NOT! If the people developing Ashes do not BELIEVE, BREATHE, and FEEL that the current vision and philosophy of Ashes are THE vision and philosophy that will make millions of players want to play for years, then there is no point in chasing those 70–80%.
Feedback will be meaningless, open development will be meaningless, and the “double-edged sword” of freedom for testers to voice their opinions will also be meaningless.
The only real question is: DO YOU TRULY BELIEVE IN THE VISION AND PHILOSOPHY OF ASHES? Because if the development is merely about adapting to what players expect—even when it’s clear that MANY testers right now don’t fully grasp that vision—then maybe it’s better to start building something else.
As I said before, Ashes of Creation’s development runs VERY DEEP—so deep that many testers currently cannot fully grasp what is being built. Is that bad? NO. That is NECESSARY, because it gives Intrepid the clarity they need to ADAPT, to ADJUST, to LEARN WHAT CAN BE IMPROVED—while always respecting the MMORPG vision and philosophy they are creating.
“Do not be swayed by newcomers who fail to grasp Ashes’ vision, even if they appear to be the majority.
Do not be swayed, either, by those who praise it and claim to understand the path ahead.
If you TRULY believe in Ashes’ vision and philosophy, then the only influence that should truly matter is your OWN DECISION—whether feedback comes as negativity, positivity, constructive advice, destructive attacks, harsh criticism, or blind praise.
None of that alone defines Ashes. What will define Ashes is the strength of its vision, carried by the choices made along the way. And if, for the sake of the project, those choices must sometimes feel like a hard blow in the present so they can secure a stronger future, then that is what must be done.”
In the end, the answer will always be the same: If Ashes is TRULY GOOD, the players will come. Nothing else matters.
I fully trust the Intrepid team. I just wanted to share these words. Best wishes, and have an excellent week.
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Comments
I understand that and I agree with it; that's what open development is designed and created for. HOWEVER, we mustn't be naive. We are seeing attempts to pressure or discredit Ashes thanks to “freedom of expression” and open development. We must be more vigilant than ever because, even though it may seem silly to pay attention to the opinions of others on “social media,” these things escalate and can sometimes cast a negative light on the future vision.
I'm not asking that “some people be ignored or not taken into account,” but rather that Intrepid be attentive enough to make decisions based on what they consider to be right and not on future pressure, because even though it may seem silly, sometimes massive pressure can cloud judgment.
That topic must easily have 500,000 views, if not more. How many people do you think have been negatively persuaded about Ashes?
If you notice, the comments are not “legal criticism” at all, but rather seem like attacks aimed at damaging Ashes' image.
Also one of the issues is that the criticism is 'valid', just also 'misguided'. We've seen 'not-valid' criticism many times, sure, 'people complaining that Intrepid did or is doing things that just aren't true'.
But that kind of post is what people I know just call 'salt', and there will always be people like that. It's the most 'ignorable' type of criticism because there isn't even really a response to have to it in the first place.
"These models/areas don't look good!" is a standard example. If you're working on models, there must be some point where they don't look good. You take note of why the person thinks that, check it against your plans, and move on.
I think Ashes of Creation is generally viewed 'in a negative light' right now, yes, there's probably nothing more that can be done about that except continue to iterate and improve.
Also remember that humans are very tribal. Half the people complaining about Ashes don't understand anything about it, the same way that people who complain about any released MMO usually 'formed an opinion early in like 3 hours, and now refuse to change it'.
Steven has faith that people can change their opinions, and look beyond their tribal responses to appreciate the game, and I think he knows better than to chase an audience that is very tribal, because most of the time, the only reason those people are playing your game is because they're busy 'hating on' some other game without really understanding it.