Best Of
Re: New Alpha Packages, again
you can look in your inventory at https://ashesofcreation.com/settings/inventory
there should be an entry for the Alpha 2 test
if so, you should be able to access it on 25th of october. The new packages give access from 8th of november. no need for you to get that.
greetings
there should be an entry for the Alpha 2 test
if so, you should be able to access it on 25th of october. The new packages give access from 8th of november. no need for you to get that.
greetings
Consternation surrounding the 8x8 Class system and how to move forward.
I would like to preface this by saying that I am new here. I have been following Ashes of Creation for a few years, but only recently have I decided to take a more active role in supporting the game and the developers.
I feel like I speak for many when I say that the original developer pitch of an 8x8 class system with effectively 64 class combinations was one of the things that first attracted my attention to Ashes of Creation. In a systems based RPG there is no system more integral to game play and user experience than the class system. A commitment to fully fleshed out multi-class combinations with unique and flavorful skills, spells, and abilities is a bold undertaking, but it also has the potential to deliver a truly great MMORPG experience.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nle0WV2J-64
This video has made me start to think long and hard about what it is players expect from the 8x8 Class System and whether or not the Augment system really delivers the experience players are looking for. It seems clear to me that the allure of such a system comes from the customization and uniqueness that the individual multi-class options offer players. A player who is excited to be a Paladin is not going to be satisfied by a Tank that has Cleric themed abilities. Their expectation is that combining Tank and Cleric yields an entirely unique class. The unique and flavorful names given to each of the class combinations reinforces the idea that they will stand out as unique and flavorful classes that have their OWN unique abilities.
The community seems to realize that their expectations for the system far exceed the design space that is currently being discussed and the general trend seems to be a tempering of excitement and expectations in anticipation of a disappointing conclusion either in the form a reduction in the overall number of classes or in the watering down of the distinctness and power of each class. I would like to suggest that the original concept of an expansive multi-class system with unique and flavorful multi-classes is not only still within reach, but that the template for creating such a system has been around for decades.
Dragon Warrior VII is a game which came out in 2000 for the original Playstation and which has one of the best templates for a multi-class system I have ever encountered in an RPG.
https://archive.org/details/dragonwarriorviiprimasofficialstrategyguide2001/page/n7/mode/2up
In this system character level and class level are decoupled from each other. A character can go to the class temple and become one of 10 different base classes such as Cleric, Fighter, or Mage. When a player selects a base class for one of their characters it provides a base attribute modifier. A Fighter for example gets STR: No Change/AGI +15%/GRD (guard) -10%/INT -30%/HP - No Change/MP -50%. As they level up in Fighter, they gain fighter abilities along the way with the class defining abilities often coming early in progression and a powerful specialized abilities coming later. A player can change their class at any time, but they retain any skills or abilities they earned along the way. If a player obtains max level as a fighter they learn Windbeast, a powerful single target skill that costs no MP. If the character then changes their class to become a Cleric, they will lose the Fighter attribute modifiers and gain the Cleric modifiers (-20% STR, -10%Agi, +10%INT, +30% MP etc) however they will still know Windbeast along with any other spells/skills they earned along the way. Once a player obtains max level as a Cleric and knows all of the Cleric and Fighter skills they have to option to train as a Paladin which has its own set of much better stat modifiers (+10% STR/+15% AGI/+15% INT and no negatives to any other stats) and a new list of skills and abilities to learn that are completely unique to Paladin. In this way the class system becomes additive with players spending time learning to play each of base classes individually before they dive into the more diverse and challenging advanced classes. By keeping the number of abilities each class obtains relatively small (8-10 abilities per class), but making them exceptionally unique and flavorful it allows the number of tools in the characters toolkit to grow steadily as they progress without overwhelming the player with too many choices. The balance comes from the stat modifiers. While a Fighter who previously trained as a Cleric may have powerful heals in his spellbook, he can only cast one or two of them before his -50% mana pool runs out. Conversely a Cleric who previously trained as a Fighter has access to the powerful Windbeast attack , but its damage will be limited by the Clerics -20% strength modifier. However once a player has mastered both Cleric and Fighter and assumed the role of Paladin they suddenly find they have the right modifiers to use ALL of their skills in conjunction while also gaining powerful Paladin only abilities like Magic Wall which is the only ability in the game that reduces incoming Magic Damage to the entire party.
Obviously such a system would need modifications in order to adapt it from a Single Player RPG to an MMORPG, but ultimately the core system seems like a much BETTER fit for for Ashes of Creation than the Augment system being discussed right now. Furthermore, while the idea of 64 unique classes is tempting I think most players would be happy to compromise on the NUMBER of unique classes at launch in exchange for better EXECUTION of the ones we have. Certain class combinations are much stronger thematically than others and I would like to see 24 class combinations that are done WELL than 64 class combinations that are watered down and samey.
I feel like I speak for many when I say that the original developer pitch of an 8x8 class system with effectively 64 class combinations was one of the things that first attracted my attention to Ashes of Creation. In a systems based RPG there is no system more integral to game play and user experience than the class system. A commitment to fully fleshed out multi-class combinations with unique and flavorful skills, spells, and abilities is a bold undertaking, but it also has the potential to deliver a truly great MMORPG experience.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nle0WV2J-64
This video has made me start to think long and hard about what it is players expect from the 8x8 Class System and whether or not the Augment system really delivers the experience players are looking for. It seems clear to me that the allure of such a system comes from the customization and uniqueness that the individual multi-class options offer players. A player who is excited to be a Paladin is not going to be satisfied by a Tank that has Cleric themed abilities. Their expectation is that combining Tank and Cleric yields an entirely unique class. The unique and flavorful names given to each of the class combinations reinforces the idea that they will stand out as unique and flavorful classes that have their OWN unique abilities.
The community seems to realize that their expectations for the system far exceed the design space that is currently being discussed and the general trend seems to be a tempering of excitement and expectations in anticipation of a disappointing conclusion either in the form a reduction in the overall number of classes or in the watering down of the distinctness and power of each class. I would like to suggest that the original concept of an expansive multi-class system with unique and flavorful multi-classes is not only still within reach, but that the template for creating such a system has been around for decades.
Dragon Warrior VII is a game which came out in 2000 for the original Playstation and which has one of the best templates for a multi-class system I have ever encountered in an RPG.
https://archive.org/details/dragonwarriorviiprimasofficialstrategyguide2001/page/n7/mode/2up
In this system character level and class level are decoupled from each other. A character can go to the class temple and become one of 10 different base classes such as Cleric, Fighter, or Mage. When a player selects a base class for one of their characters it provides a base attribute modifier. A Fighter for example gets STR: No Change/AGI +15%/GRD (guard) -10%/INT -30%/HP - No Change/MP -50%. As they level up in Fighter, they gain fighter abilities along the way with the class defining abilities often coming early in progression and a powerful specialized abilities coming later. A player can change their class at any time, but they retain any skills or abilities they earned along the way. If a player obtains max level as a fighter they learn Windbeast, a powerful single target skill that costs no MP. If the character then changes their class to become a Cleric, they will lose the Fighter attribute modifiers and gain the Cleric modifiers (-20% STR, -10%Agi, +10%INT, +30% MP etc) however they will still know Windbeast along with any other spells/skills they earned along the way. Once a player obtains max level as a Cleric and knows all of the Cleric and Fighter skills they have to option to train as a Paladin which has its own set of much better stat modifiers (+10% STR/+15% AGI/+15% INT and no negatives to any other stats) and a new list of skills and abilities to learn that are completely unique to Paladin. In this way the class system becomes additive with players spending time learning to play each of base classes individually before they dive into the more diverse and challenging advanced classes. By keeping the number of abilities each class obtains relatively small (8-10 abilities per class), but making them exceptionally unique and flavorful it allows the number of tools in the characters toolkit to grow steadily as they progress without overwhelming the player with too many choices. The balance comes from the stat modifiers. While a Fighter who previously trained as a Cleric may have powerful heals in his spellbook, he can only cast one or two of them before his -50% mana pool runs out. Conversely a Cleric who previously trained as a Fighter has access to the powerful Windbeast attack , but its damage will be limited by the Clerics -20% strength modifier. However once a player has mastered both Cleric and Fighter and assumed the role of Paladin they suddenly find they have the right modifiers to use ALL of their skills in conjunction while also gaining powerful Paladin only abilities like Magic Wall which is the only ability in the game that reduces incoming Magic Damage to the entire party.
Obviously such a system would need modifications in order to adapt it from a Single Player RPG to an MMORPG, but ultimately the core system seems like a much BETTER fit for for Ashes of Creation than the Augment system being discussed right now. Furthermore, while the idea of 64 unique classes is tempting I think most players would be happy to compromise on the NUMBER of unique classes at launch in exchange for better EXECUTION of the ones we have. Certain class combinations are much stronger thematically than others and I would like to see 24 class combinations that are done WELL than 64 class combinations that are watered down and samey.
Rippley
1
Re: Next Livestream + Q&A Submission - Friday, August 30, 2024 at 11am Pacific
WHERE IS MY SPEAR STEVEN?
Adestra
2
Rethinking Resource Systems: Enhancing Class Identity in AoC with Diverse Energy Mechanics
Rethinking Resource Systems: Enhancing Class Identity in Ashes of Creation with Diverse Energy Mechanics
1. Addressing Claims of Bias and Unnecessary Comparison
It's important to recognize that the suggestion to implement resources like Rage or Energy for certain classes in Ashes of Creation isn't merely about replicating the success of systems found in other MMOs. Rather, it's about identifying what those mechanics can bring to class identity and player engagement, drawing on successful precedents to inspire, not copy. The goal is not to turn Ashes into another version of existing games but to explore how different resource systems can enhance the distinct feel and gameplay of each class.
2. Responding to Concerns About Homogenization and Tradition
While it's true that many successful MMOs have utilized Mana for a range of classes, including melee and tank roles, this does not necessarily mean it is the only or the best approach for every game. Each MMO creates its own universe with unique lore and gameplay mechanics that might benefit from different approaches. The presence of Mana as a universal resource in these games is often a design choice that aligns with their specific magical universes. Ashes of Creation offers a new canvas, and it might be beneficial to explore how varying energy systems can diversify gameplay, making each class's approach to combat feel unique and fresh.
3. Promoting Gameplay Diversity and Strategic Depth
Adopting different resource systems could lead to a richer gameplay experience by diversifying the strategies and skills required for each class. This isn't just about making Ashes different for the sake of difference but about enhancing the tactical depth and player involvement in each role:
4. Roleplaying and Class Identity
As someone who has enjoyed playing melee classes in various MMORPGs for over two decades, one of the most compelling aspects of these roles is the ability to embody a character who is distinctly non-magical. The idea of playing a class that either dislikes or does not understand Mana adds a layer of depth to roleplaying that resonates with players like myself. It reinforces the identity of the class not just in combat but in the broader narrative and interaction within the game world. Integrating alternative resources like Rage or Energy can emphasize this non-magical, gritty aspect of these characters, making the roleplaying experience more authentic and immersive.
5. Humble Acknowledgment of Diverse Preferences
It's essential to recognize that these suggestions stem from a desire to see Ashes of Creation flourish as a multifaceted game that caters to a wide range of player experiences and preferences. The proposal to differentiate class resources is based on observations and preferences within the gaming community, and while they draw on examples from other successful games, they are tailored to what might benefit the unique world and lore of Ashes.
In conclusion, while some might see the suggestion to move away from a universal Mana system as biased or unnecessary, it is offered in the spirit of enhancing the individuality and depth of each class. By exploring alternative resources, Ashes of Creation has the potential to offer a varied and rich combat experience that allows each player to find a class that resonates with their personal playstyle and contributes to a vibrant, dynamic game world.
That concludes my Ted Talk. Thank you.
1. Addressing Claims of Bias and Unnecessary Comparison
It's important to recognize that the suggestion to implement resources like Rage or Energy for certain classes in Ashes of Creation isn't merely about replicating the success of systems found in other MMOs. Rather, it's about identifying what those mechanics can bring to class identity and player engagement, drawing on successful precedents to inspire, not copy. The goal is not to turn Ashes into another version of existing games but to explore how different resource systems can enhance the distinct feel and gameplay of each class.
2. Responding to Concerns About Homogenization and Tradition
While it's true that many successful MMOs have utilized Mana for a range of classes, including melee and tank roles, this does not necessarily mean it is the only or the best approach for every game. Each MMO creates its own universe with unique lore and gameplay mechanics that might benefit from different approaches. The presence of Mana as a universal resource in these games is often a design choice that aligns with their specific magical universes. Ashes of Creation offers a new canvas, and it might be beneficial to explore how varying energy systems can diversify gameplay, making each class's approach to combat feel unique and fresh.
3. Promoting Gameplay Diversity and Strategic Depth
Adopting different resource systems could lead to a richer gameplay experience by diversifying the strategies and skills required for each class. This isn't just about making Ashes different for the sake of difference but about enhancing the tactical depth and player involvement in each role:
- Resource Dynamics: Classes that operate on Rage or Energy could encourage more active and reactive gameplay, which might appeal to players who enjoy a more visceral and immediate combat experience, as opposed to the strategic reserve and deployment of Mana-based abilities.
- Class-Specific Challenges: Unique resources introduce specific challenges and learning curves that can help define the mastery of a class. For instance, managing Rage in the heat of battle requires a different skill set and strategic thinking than conserving and deploying Mana, potentially leading to a more engaging experience for players who prefer a hands-on combat style.
4. Roleplaying and Class Identity
As someone who has enjoyed playing melee classes in various MMORPGs for over two decades, one of the most compelling aspects of these roles is the ability to embody a character who is distinctly non-magical. The idea of playing a class that either dislikes or does not understand Mana adds a layer of depth to roleplaying that resonates with players like myself. It reinforces the identity of the class not just in combat but in the broader narrative and interaction within the game world. Integrating alternative resources like Rage or Energy can emphasize this non-magical, gritty aspect of these characters, making the roleplaying experience more authentic and immersive.
5. Humble Acknowledgment of Diverse Preferences
It's essential to recognize that these suggestions stem from a desire to see Ashes of Creation flourish as a multifaceted game that caters to a wide range of player experiences and preferences. The proposal to differentiate class resources is based on observations and preferences within the gaming community, and while they draw on examples from other successful games, they are tailored to what might benefit the unique world and lore of Ashes.
In conclusion, while some might see the suggestion to move away from a universal Mana system as biased or unnecessary, it is offered in the spirit of enhancing the individuality and depth of each class. By exploring alternative resources, Ashes of Creation has the potential to offer a varied and rich combat experience that allows each player to find a class that resonates with their personal playstyle and contributes to a vibrant, dynamic game world.
That concludes my Ted Talk. Thank you.
Re: The need for Bone Armor.
I really think there should be craft-able bone armor in game. It is needed for Role Play for sure.
It kiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiindaaa (?) already exists with for Example the Unseen Order Cosmetics, so i wouldn't be to worried about that. But i get what you mean. The Possibility to make it ingame.
Ahhh like back in V-Rising ... ...
I will forever remember these glorious Moments, when i crafted my first Set of Armor from the Remains of someone's Grandparents.
Ahm~UMMM, i mean ... ... ... ... ... Yes, Bone-Armor Please !! (Ò_Ó) it is just logical to make Weapons and Armor out from Stuff before we can smelt down Metal and so on. And maybe Wood or Leather will not always be around to quickly make neat Armors from it. ( )
Yes!!