@Teraricshon You could have multiple Alts funnel all their gear at the main character. So would you ban the use of Alts ? Not that I disagree with your point.
I just dont think you can get around the problem without removing that which enables automaiton in the first place. The fact that content is scripted...and thus activity is scriptable. Your avatars actions are also predictable....and thus their is no risk automating it.
If the content was dynamic and mixed up. No script would be able to work reliably. If the avatar actions could not be relied upon to do as you expect....no bot could work. You would literally have to watch the bot all the time to ensure the unexpected never happened. And if you have to watch it ALL the time....whats the point of automating it ?
Well, its most likely an academic question now. Steven seems to have little to no problem with "multi boxing" though I am not sure if he meant that or multi accounting. This is per a direct answer from Siigari's thread: Q&A with Steven in Discord (May 14, 2017) Lots of other good info in there.
Next you're going to tell me that people who can afford good internet, powerful computers, comfy chairs, etc are P2W too and should be banned.
Half (scientific, economic, crafting, housing) of what is outlined in the original post is actually describing 'anyone who has multiple accounts' not even 'multi-boxers'. Anyone with a dynamic IP or multiple IP addresses can circumvent just about any protection you would put in place to prevent that except some kind of incredibly intrusive DRM/spyware. It's the same reason that online polling is trash and not credible.
As for actual multi-boxing, very few people actually do it because it's a pain in the butt to manage multiple toons simultaneously. Is it worthwhile to shut out families who play MMOs together to protect us from the .01% of people who actually multi-box? Only reasonable answer IMO is to allow a few accounts logged in from the same location to allow families to play together while at the same time limit the size of multi-box trains; but you won't ever fully prevent multi-boxing that way.
[quote quote=23065]Next you’re going to tell me that people who can afford good internet, powerful computers, comfy chairs, etc are P2W too and should be banned.
Half (scientific, economic, crafting, housing) of what is outlined in the original post is actually describing ‘anyone who has multiple accounts’ not even ‘multi-boxers’. Anyone with a dynamic IP or multiple IP addresses can circumvent just about any protection you would put in place to prevent that except some kind of incredibly intrusive DRM/spyware. It’s the same reason that online polling is trash and not credible.
As for actual multi-boxing, very few people actually do it because it’s a pain in the butt to manage multiple toons simultaneously. Is it worthwhile to shut out families who play MMOs together to protect us from the .01% of people who actually multi-box? Only reasonable answer IMO is to allow a few accounts logged in from the same location to allow families to play together while at the same time limit the size of multi-box trains; but you won’t ever fully prevent multi-boxing that way.
[/quote]
That was genuinely the most logical response I have seen in this chat so far, and I'd be surprised to see someone argue against that first sentence and not end up being hypocritical with their response. Well played sir.
[quote quote=23065]Next you’re going to tell me that people who can afford good internet, powerful computers, comfy chairs, etc are P2W too and should be banned.
Half (scientific, economic, crafting, housing) of what is outlined in the original post is actually describing ‘anyone who has multiple accounts’ not even ‘multi-boxers’. Anyone with a dynamic IP or multiple IP addresses can circumvent just about any protection you would put in place to prevent that except some kind of incredibly intrusive DRM/spyware. It’s the same reason that online polling is trash and not credible.
As for actual multi-boxing, very few people actually do it because it’s a pain in the butt to manage multiple toons simultaneously. Is it worthwhile to shut out families who play MMOs together to protect us from the .01% of people who actually multi-box? Only reasonable answer IMO is to allow a few accounts logged in from the same location to allow families to play together while at the same time limit the size of multi-box trains; but you won’t ever fully prevent multi-boxing that way.
[/quote]
You pretty much summed up my thoughts on this as well.
However, let's say that somehow this becomes a major problem. The devs could always take a note from Runescape, and add in random events from gathering/resource nodes, that are in place to disrupt botters/multi-boxers.
[quote quote=23065]Next you’re going to tell me that people who can afford good internet, powerful computers, comfy chairs, etc are P2W too and should be banned.
Half (scientific, economic, crafting, housing) of what is outlined in the original post is actually describing ‘anyone who has multiple accounts’ not even ‘multi-boxers’. Anyone with a dynamic IP or multiple IP addresses can circumvent just about any protection you would put in place to prevent that except some kind of incredibly intrusive DRM/spyware. It’s the same reason that online polling is trash and not credible.
As for actual multi-boxing, very few people actually do it because it’s a pain in the butt to manage multiple toons simultaneously. Is it worthwhile to shut out families who play MMOs together to protect us from the .01% of people who actually multi-box? Only reasonable answer IMO is to allow a few accounts logged in from the same location to allow families to play together while at the same time limit the size of multi-box trains; but you won’t ever fully prevent multi-boxing that way.
[/quote]
You pretty much summed up my thoughts on this as well.
However, let's say that somehow this becomes a major problem. The devs could always take a note from RS, and add in random events from gathering/resource nodes, that are in place to disrupt botters/multi-boxers.
You pretty much summed up my thoughts on this as well.
However, let's say that somehow this becomes a major problem. The devs could always take a note from RS, and add in random events from gathering/resource nodes, that are in place to disrupt botters/multi-boxers.
Not sure how powerful computers, "good" internet connection, or comfy chairs equates to multi-boxing. You don't <em>need</em> any of those things, to be a multi-boxer, and has no basis for comparison, imo.
I'll reiterate my personal stance, since it's clear that people's ideas on what constitutes multi-boxing differs, also what should/should not, be allowed. I, personally, equate multi-boxing as taking multiple account toons, synching them together under the master control of one player, and playing the many as "one unit". One button press makes all the toons act in unison, whether manually entering that action, or having it set up to perform a rotation.
They do it on a lot of other mmo's, so why not? Well, they do a lot of things on other mmo's, as well. So, why not include those things too? Like P2W cash shops, unlimited flying mounts for all, max lv boosters, globally linked house, etc. etc. etc....
Personally, I'm not against players owning multiple accounts, whether controlling each one manually, or to play as a family. If, on top of all that, you can afford the most sophisticated computer, fastest internet, and comfiest chair, more power to you! My issue with my version of multi-boxing had to do more with going against the "spirit" of the game. Not what one can afford.
I believe Steven has stated that he has no problem with multi-boxing, though I'm not sure how he means that, as apparently the term means different things, to different people. Whatever the case may be, I'll continue to have faith that the devs want a healthy community, and support AoC. Like <ul>@Atlus</ul> says, if future problems arise, adjustments can be made.
Not sure how powerful computers, "good" internet connection, or comfy chairs equates to multi-boxing. You don't <em>need</em> any of those things, to be a multi-boxer, and has no basis for comparison, imo.
I'll reiterate my personal stance, since it's clear that people's ideas on what constitutes multi-boxing differs, also what should/should not, be allowed. I, personally, equate multi-boxing as taking multiple account toons, synching them together under the master control of one player, and playing the many as "one unit". One button press makes all the toons act in unison, whether manually entering that action, or having it set up to perform a rotation.
They do it on a lot of other mmo's, so why not? Well, they do a lot of things on other mmo's, as well. So, why not include those things too? Like P2W cash shops, unlimited flying mounts for all, max lv boosters, globally linked house, etc. etc. etc....
Personally, I'm not against players owning multiple accounts, whether controlling each one manually, or to play as a family. If, on top of all that, you can afford the most sophisticated computer, fastest internet, and comfiest chair, more power to you! My issue with my version of multi-boxing had to do more with going against the "spirit" of the game. Not what one can afford.
I believe Steven has stated that he has no problem with multi-boxing, though I'm not sure how he means that, as apparently the term means different things, to different people. Whatever the case may be, I'll continue to have faith that the devs want a healthy community, and support AoC. Like <strong>@Atlus</strong> says, if future problems arise, adjustments can be made.
Not sure how powerful computers, "good" internet connection, or comfy chairs equates to multi-boxing. You don't <em>need</em> any of those things, to be a multi-boxer, and has no basis for comparison, imo.
I'll reiterate my personal stance, since it's clear that people's ideas on what constitutes multi-boxing differs, also what should/should not, be allowed. I, personally, equate multi-boxing as taking multiple account toons, synching them together under the master control of one player, and playing the many as "one unit". One button press makes all the toons act in unison, whether manually entering that action, or having it set up to perform a rotation.
They do it on a lot of other mmo's, so why not? Well, they do a lot of things on other mmo's, as well. So, why not include those things too? Like P2W cash shops, unlimited flying mounts for all, max lv boosters, globally linked house, etc. etc. etc....
Personally, I'm not against players owning multiple accounts, whether controlling each one manually, or to play as a family. If, on top of all that, you can afford the most sophisticated computer, fastest internet, and comfiest chair, more power to you! My issue with my version of multi-boxing had to do more with going against the "spirit" of the game. Not what one can afford.
I believe Steven has stated that he has no problem with multi-boxing, though I'm not sure how he means that, as apparently the term means different things, to different people. Whatever the case may be, I'll continue to have faith that the devs want a healthy community, and support AoC. Like @Atlus says, if future problems arise, adjustments can be made.
Not sure how powerful computers, "good" internet connection, or comfy chairs equates to multi-boxing. You don't <em>need</em> any of those things, to be a multi-boxer, and has no basis for comparison, imo.
I'll reiterate my personal stance, since it's clear that people's ideas on what constitutes multi-boxing differs, also what should/should not, be allowed. I, personally, equate multi-boxing as taking multiple account toons, synching them together under the master control of one player, and playing the many as "one unit". One button press makes all the toons act in unison, whether manually entering that action, or having it set up to perform a rotation.
They do it on a lot of other mmo's, so why not? Well, they do a lot of things on other mmo's, as well. So, why not include those things too? Like P2W cash shops, unlimited flying mounts for all, max lv boosters, globally linked house, etc. etc. etc....
Personally, I'm not against players owning multiple accounts, whether controlling each one manually, or to play as a family. If, on top of all that, you can afford the most sophisticated computer, fastest internet, and comfiest chair, more power to you! My issue with my version of multi-boxing had to do more with going against the "spirit" of the game. Not what one can afford.
I believe Steven has stated that he has no problem with multi-boxing, though I'm not sure how he means that, as apparently the term means different things, to different people. Whatever the case may be, I'll continue to have faith that the devs want a healthy community, and support AoC. Like <ul>@Atlus</ul> says, if future problems arise, adjustments can be made.
Comments
You could have multiple Alts funnel all their gear at the main character.
So would you ban the use of Alts ?
Not that I disagree with your point.
I just dont think you can get around the problem without removing that which enables automaiton in the first place.
The fact that content is scripted...and thus activity is scriptable.
Your avatars actions are also predictable....and thus their is no risk automating it.
If the content was dynamic and mixed up. No script would be able to work reliably.
If the avatar actions could not be relied upon to do as you expect....no bot could work.
You would literally have to watch the bot all the time to ensure the unexpected never happened.
And if you have to watch it ALL the time....whats the point of automating it ?
Lots of other good info in there.
It’s against the spirit of MMOs, it’s immersion breaking, it requires automation.
Sorry it’s cheating and pay to win, nothing more needs to be said.
[/quote]
Could care less about immersion, to be honest, but if it is against the spirit of MMOs then why can you do it in every MMO?
Half (scientific, economic, crafting, housing) of what is outlined in the original post is actually describing 'anyone who has multiple accounts' not even 'multi-boxers'. Anyone with a dynamic IP or multiple IP addresses can circumvent just about any protection you would put in place to prevent that except some kind of incredibly intrusive DRM/spyware. It's the same reason that online polling is trash and not credible.
As for actual multi-boxing, very few people actually do it because it's a pain in the butt to manage multiple toons simultaneously. Is it worthwhile to shut out families who play MMOs together to protect us from the .01% of people who actually multi-box? Only reasonable answer IMO is to allow a few accounts logged in from the same location to allow families to play together while at the same time limit the size of multi-box trains; but you won't ever fully prevent multi-boxing that way.
Half (scientific, economic, crafting, housing) of what is outlined in the original post is actually describing ‘anyone who has multiple accounts’ not even ‘multi-boxers’. Anyone with a dynamic IP or multiple IP addresses can circumvent just about any protection you would put in place to prevent that except some kind of incredibly intrusive DRM/spyware. It’s the same reason that online polling is trash and not credible.
As for actual multi-boxing, very few people actually do it because it’s a pain in the butt to manage multiple toons simultaneously. Is it worthwhile to shut out families who play MMOs together to protect us from the .01% of people who actually multi-box? Only reasonable answer IMO is to allow a few accounts logged in from the same location to allow families to play together while at the same time limit the size of multi-box trains; but you won’t ever fully prevent multi-boxing that way.
[/quote]
That was genuinely the most logical response I have seen in this chat so far, and I'd be surprised to see someone argue against that first sentence and not end up being hypocritical with their response. Well played sir.
Half (scientific, economic, crafting, housing) of what is outlined in the original post is actually describing ‘anyone who has multiple accounts’ not even ‘multi-boxers’. Anyone with a dynamic IP or multiple IP addresses can circumvent just about any protection you would put in place to prevent that except some kind of incredibly intrusive DRM/spyware. It’s the same reason that online polling is trash and not credible.
As for actual multi-boxing, very few people actually do it because it’s a pain in the butt to manage multiple toons simultaneously. Is it worthwhile to shut out families who play MMOs together to protect us from the .01% of people who actually multi-box? Only reasonable answer IMO is to allow a few accounts logged in from the same location to allow families to play together while at the same time limit the size of multi-box trains; but you won’t ever fully prevent multi-boxing that way.
[/quote]
You pretty much summed up my thoughts on this as well.
However, let's say that somehow this becomes a major problem. The devs could always take a note from Runescape, and add in random events from gathering/resource nodes, that are in place to disrupt botters/multi-boxers.
Half (scientific, economic, crafting, housing) of what is outlined in the original post is actually describing ‘anyone who has multiple accounts’ not even ‘multi-boxers’. Anyone with a dynamic IP or multiple IP addresses can circumvent just about any protection you would put in place to prevent that except some kind of incredibly intrusive DRM/spyware. It’s the same reason that online polling is trash and not credible.
As for actual multi-boxing, very few people actually do it because it’s a pain in the butt to manage multiple toons simultaneously. Is it worthwhile to shut out families who play MMOs together to protect us from the .01% of people who actually multi-box? Only reasonable answer IMO is to allow a few accounts logged in from the same location to allow families to play together while at the same time limit the size of multi-box trains; but you won’t ever fully prevent multi-boxing that way.
[/quote]
You pretty much summed up my thoughts on this as well.
However, let's say that somehow this becomes a major problem. The devs could always take a note from RS, and add in random events from gathering/resource nodes, that are in place to disrupt botters/multi-boxers.
You pretty much summed up my thoughts on this as well.
However, let's say that somehow this becomes a major problem. The devs could always take a note from RS, and add in random events from gathering/resource nodes, that are in place to disrupt botters/multi-boxers.
Edit: Won't show my posts if I quote someone.
Not sure how powerful computers, "good" internet connection, or comfy chairs equates to multi-boxing. You don't <em>need</em> any of those things, to be a multi-boxer, and has no basis for comparison, imo.
I'll reiterate my personal stance, since it's clear that people's ideas on what constitutes multi-boxing differs, also what should/should not, be allowed. I, personally, equate multi-boxing as taking multiple account toons, synching them together under the master control of one player, and playing the many as "one unit". One button press makes all the toons act in unison, whether manually entering that action, or having it set up to perform a rotation.
They do it on a lot of other mmo's, so why not? Well, they do a lot of things on other mmo's, as well. So, why not include those things too? Like P2W cash shops, unlimited flying mounts for all, max lv boosters, globally linked house, etc. etc. etc....
Personally, I'm not against players owning multiple accounts, whether controlling each one manually, or to play as a family. If, on top of all that, you can afford the most sophisticated computer, fastest internet, and comfiest chair, more power to you! My issue with my version of multi-boxing had to do more with going against the "spirit" of the game. Not what one can afford.
I believe Steven has stated that he has no problem with multi-boxing, though I'm not sure how he means that, as apparently the term means different things, to different people. Whatever the case may be, I'll continue to have faith that the devs want a healthy community, and support AoC. Like <ul>@Atlus</ul> says, if future problems arise, adjustments can be made.
Not sure how powerful computers, "good" internet connection, or comfy chairs equates to multi-boxing. You don't <em>need</em> any of those things, to be a multi-boxer, and has no basis for comparison, imo.
I'll reiterate my personal stance, since it's clear that people's ideas on what constitutes multi-boxing differs, also what should/should not, be allowed. I, personally, equate multi-boxing as taking multiple account toons, synching them together under the master control of one player, and playing the many as "one unit". One button press makes all the toons act in unison, whether manually entering that action, or having it set up to perform a rotation.
They do it on a lot of other mmo's, so why not? Well, they do a lot of things on other mmo's, as well. So, why not include those things too? Like P2W cash shops, unlimited flying mounts for all, max lv boosters, globally linked house, etc. etc. etc....
Personally, I'm not against players owning multiple accounts, whether controlling each one manually, or to play as a family. If, on top of all that, you can afford the most sophisticated computer, fastest internet, and comfiest chair, more power to you! My issue with my version of multi-boxing had to do more with going against the "spirit" of the game. Not what one can afford.
I believe Steven has stated that he has no problem with multi-boxing, though I'm not sure how he means that, as apparently the term means different things, to different people. Whatever the case may be, I'll continue to have faith that the devs want a healthy community, and support AoC. Like <strong>@Atlus</strong> says, if future problems arise, adjustments can be made.
Not sure how powerful computers, "good" internet connection, or comfy chairs equates to multi-boxing. You don't <em>need</em> any of those things, to be a multi-boxer, and has no basis for comparison, imo.
I'll reiterate my personal stance, since it's clear that people's ideas on what constitutes multi-boxing differs, also what should/should not, be allowed. I, personally, equate multi-boxing as taking multiple account toons, synching them together under the master control of one player, and playing the many as "one unit". One button press makes all the toons act in unison, whether manually entering that action, or having it set up to perform a rotation.
They do it on a lot of other mmo's, so why not? Well, they do a lot of things on other mmo's, as well. So, why not include those things too? Like P2W cash shops, unlimited flying mounts for all, max lv boosters, globally linked house, etc. etc. etc....
Personally, I'm not against players owning multiple accounts, whether controlling each one manually, or to play as a family. If, on top of all that, you can afford the most sophisticated computer, fastest internet, and comfiest chair, more power to you! My issue with my version of multi-boxing had to do more with going against the "spirit" of the game. Not what one can afford.
I believe Steven has stated that he has no problem with multi-boxing, though I'm not sure how he means that, as apparently the term means different things, to different people. Whatever the case may be, I'll continue to have faith that the devs want a healthy community, and support AoC. Like @Atlus says, if future problems arise, adjustments can be made.
Not sure how powerful computers, "good" internet connection, or comfy chairs equates to multi-boxing. You don't <em>need</em> any of those things, to be a multi-boxer, and has no basis for comparison, imo.
I'll reiterate my personal stance, since it's clear that people's ideas on what constitutes multi-boxing differs, also what should/should not, be allowed. I, personally, equate multi-boxing as taking multiple account toons, synching them together under the master control of one player, and playing the many as "one unit". One button press makes all the toons act in unison, whether manually entering that action, or having it set up to perform a rotation.
They do it on a lot of other mmo's, so why not? Well, they do a lot of things on other mmo's, as well. So, why not include those things too? Like P2W cash shops, unlimited flying mounts for all, max lv boosters, globally linked house, etc. etc. etc....
Personally, I'm not against players owning multiple accounts, whether controlling each one manually, or to play as a family. If, on top of all that, you can afford the most sophisticated computer, fastest internet, and comfiest chair, more power to you! My issue with my version of multi-boxing had to do more with going against the "spirit" of the game. Not what one can afford.
I believe Steven has stated that he has no problem with multi-boxing, though I'm not sure how he means that, as apparently the term means different things, to different people. Whatever the case may be, I'll continue to have faith that the devs want a healthy community, and support AoC. Like <ul>@Atlus</ul> says, if future problems arise, adjustments can be made.