Will there be Quest Helper Arrows in the game?

ArchivedUser

A lot of MMOs these days show you exactly where to go when you get a new quest. I find this takes a lot of the immersion out of the game. I want to explore and find out for myself where and how to complete a quest. I know you can generally turn off "Quest Helpers" in game, but what is the point when everyone else is using them? Do I really want to be the guy that holds up the group because I want to read the quest and figure out what it wants me to do?

What is everyone else's opinion? Do you like "Quest Helpers"? Should they be in the game even if you don't personally like them?

Sorry if this has been discussed before. I couldn't find a topic talking about it.

ArchivedUser

I too would be perfectly happy without a quest helper arrow to guide me, but unfortunately it seems that most gamers these days are too lazy to figure things out on their own. Hell, they don't even bother to read quest text to see where they have to go, let alone try to figure things out on their own.

ArchivedUser

Internet wikis with every location spawn and last detail.
And you are worried about quest arrows ?
That boat sailed years ago.

I think we are way beyond that nowadays.
Dont want them... switch them off.
Seems like a personal preference to me anyway.
:D

ArchivedUser

This game spawns and quest aren't static to an area, so hopefully wikis will be mostly useless other than how chain quest tend to develop and how to defeat "insert mob here"

Quest helpers go against everything a partially sandbox mmo stands for. And "!" above NPC heads is pretty awful as well.

Heck, even name tags is pretty immersion breaking, and would prefer that they only fade in at very close range, or not at all unless you click on something directly.

I could deal with quest givers being marked, and just grumble a bit about name tag appearance, but if there's a quest helper option I'll just pass altogether. It's that big a deal to me.

ArchivedUser

I remember old EverQuest where there was the find to kinda help but you had to actually read the quest to find where to go, i really liked that.

ArchivedUser

The game has to appeal to the masses not a niche. The majority of players will be used to important NPCs being marked in some way and have guidance markers for quests. So to attract as large a player base as possible and therefore more money I'd bet markers will be present and enabled by default with the option to toggle them off.

ArchivedUser

Hmm I'm in 2 camps here. My first MMO was Everquest and the questing in that could be fairly ambiguous when it came to details, consequently you could spend several hours trying to work out exactly what was required and how to accomplish it, then finally actually accomplishing the quest.

Along came WOW with all its friendly quest markers and pointers etc and it was nice, you could log on, do a few quests and log out. Lord of the Rings is similar, maybe not quite as "hand holding" as WOW, but is's nice, in the morning before work, while drinking my coffee, I can log on and actually get something done, in the hour that I play.

I would like some sort of Quest Difficulty scale. So for instance easy quests, less xp/money/items would be fairly "hand holdy" but you can get several done in a short time. Next you could have less "hand holdy" but still achievable in say a hour os so. And finally hard quests, good rewards but will take maybe an afternoon or even several days of play time to complete.

ArchivedUser

As long as it's clearly explained in the quest where the person is located and once there, they can be easily spotted by a specific identifier, I'm good with that.

ArchivedUser

I guess it would be okay playing the game without visual quest markers because as others already mentioned the quest design will be not that static as in other games and I prefer that a lot because I want to explore the world on my own, too. There are some other games which have quests without visual markers too and where you have to ask the npc to get further informations. I'd have no problems with spending some time asking npc's for that kind of information.

If there will be quest markers... well than let be it but in the most mmorpg's I played in the past with quest markers most people are just running around, accepting every quest without even reading the text devlievered by the game which makes me sad. I think it's really improtant especially in this game to understand what you are doing because your doing will have effect on your surroundings and for that for other players too.

ArchivedUser

[quote quote=25089]
If there will be quest markers… well than let be it but in the most mmorpg’s I played in the past with quest markers most people are just running around, accepting every quest without even reading the text devlievered by the game which makes me sad.

[/quote]

When you have played in group after group who have already done the quests, most wont wait now days.
If you stop to read, you simply get left behind.
That makes me sad.

Its why I play mostly solo. I value the story.

ArchivedUser

Although not an mmo, in the past in Skyrim I would always prefer to use the Clairvoyance spell to find my way to the quest target. It added a certain depth to the immersion imo. But I do agree it should be a toggled option to have or not, just to satisfy the whole group.

ArchivedUser

hmm I would like to do away with quest marker on top of the head and instead, give a compass like thing to kinda guide the player but not really mark it with a huge "!"

ArchivedUser

I dont mind that @Valenores
I wouldnt even mind a compass leading you to a +-50m area.
Then leave you to ask around.

Seems to be a compromise between at least interacting with soem other NPCs for stories and tidbits
vs
Hi...I'm over here....you can ignore everything else around you!

ArchivedUser

No no.... leave helper arrows be. There's nothing more annoying than wandering for hours in one place and not being able to find what you're supposed to do. Then you're alt+tabbing to search the wiki and all, unable to progress.... It feels like a waste of time and it's not fun at all. It just leaves you frustrated.

ArchivedUser

I still am not sure how hardcore they are intending to make this game. I cant seem to find a point of reference based on the information that has been released.

ArchivedUser

Although I haven't read any of the comments ... i strongly hope not - i would like to use my brain to figure stuff out. Personally, I'd hoped the closest thing to an ... "Guiding Arrow" would just be a Text paraphrased in the form of a Riddle. i.e. Slight hint

OR ... Lets say Player A has not logged in awhile ( taking care of business :/ ) ...

as soon as she/he Logs in, an in-game Notification pops requesting if the Player would like a recollection ( via Text or Game-Flashback, etc ... idk could be whatever ) of what they were doing.

(Similar to Pokemon LeafGreen/ FireRed - when you resume ? Just not in a Monochrome Screen. But instead ... presented in a Blurry Haze ? )

But thats about it

ArchivedUser

I don't believe quest arrows is the way there going with this game. They want you to explore the word and talk to everyone. 

ArchivedUser

If the world is as dynamic and immersive as the devs wish it to be , then I don't see much use, need, or want for directive quest arrows. Simply being, a lot of people are tired of handholding and similarly a lot of people are sick of games that are too hard, if they can find a way to please both crowds I think it will go over well.

ArchivedUser

Stephen confirmed in a QA that there will not be ? or ! guiding us around like other games do.

ArchivedUser

Maerik85 said:

Stephen confirmed in a QA that there will not be ? or ! guiding us around like other games do.

I like it.
Actually one other possibility would be to add that as an option also for the lazy players

ArchivedUser

I would like to have huge question marks over their heads, arrows, glowing lights, beepers and guide dogs. In real life I can circle a 8 block area for two hours looking for a one block sized hotel that is across the street from me.  In game.. yup same. 

It would be great if it could be turned off for people who don't want it though. That would be best of both worlds.

I get what the Devs say they won't do. Will and will nots change a lot from beginning to end. So will see what happens. 

ArchivedUser

I typically solo so the arrows of harassment are only used when I really just don't care anymore lol... I'd like to see a game force me more to focus though I like the old ones with like a journal entry setup. Baldur's Gate comes to mind as you typically can find some quests and secrets simply by reading things.

ArchivedUser

Most quests in MMOs these days are insignificant, a little flavor to mask the grind. If I'm going to be killing x amount of monsters or fetching/delivering, then I'd much rather NPCs be clearly marked. I want to do something fun to level, not spend most of my time hunting down NPCs.

I'm all for the immersion in quests of consequence, though. We'll just have to wait and see if AoC lives up to that, because almost every new big MMO title promises that it'll be different.

ArchivedUser

Quests won't be marked and therefore I doubt the arrow will guide is in Ashes. From the examp quest the had done in the KS stream shown us they had to read the quest properly to work out what they needed to do. i actually look forward to quests in Ashes - I loved that the loot you pick from mobs is being recycled into the community into a practical purpose xD it's  nice seeing npcs actually do what they are supposed to be doing /tavern cook or whatever xD I wanna eat that wolf meat I  got him

ArchivedUser

@Diura Poor puppies =<  On the bright side though if they get it done like that then It should be rather fun to play. However I know for a fact they'll get a lot of complaints from the lazy crowd so maybe their should be a simple set mixed in for those kinds of players. Some days I'm to lazy to read let alone remember my own name lol.

I hope the quests involve some kind of basic processing knowledge or a reasonable showing of what actually happens with the stuff you do collect doing the "kill 10 X" quests.

ArchivedUser

Bannith said:

@Diura Poor puppies =<  On the bright side though if they get it done like that then It should be rather fun to play. However I know for a fact they'll get a lot of complaints from the lazy crowd so maybe their should be a simple set mixed in for those kinds of players. Some days I'm to lazy to read let alone remember my own name lol.

I hope the quests involve some kind of basic processing knowledge or a reasonable showing of what actually happens with the stuff you do collect doing the "kill 10 X" quests.

I doubt they'll have essays to read to complete quest xD my sense of direction is hopeless so not having a marker for me will be a nice challenge xD but I'm up for it aha.
it keeps track of stuff you collect but doesn't tell you the exact location xD 

ArchivedUser

If you are going to eliminate quest markers or quest helpers then you really need to make quests VERY INTUITIVE. That can definitely stretch out the time and effort to code in quests. If I had any say, I'd suggest to Intrepid to leave that decision until almost the end but put some foundation coding in so that they have options at crunch time.

Not all have the patience for questing in the first place. Not all have the knowledge of the area that is needed. Need intuitive steps.

ArchivedUser

I think its better when people have to search for things on there own but I enjoyed a lot of the pre-wow games that didn't hold your hand and walk you to everything. That and having photographic memory i become a quest finder for my friends usually after i go through everything atleast once >_>

ArchivedUser

Why would you need quest helper arrows if you have God to guide you...

ArchivedUser

I have a headache.....

ArchivedUser

Hopefully alpha and beta players will be able to dig into all of the quest types. Make sure that they are fairly intuitive if Intrepid goes the no "!" route. The designers might feel that the quest is easy, finding location wise, but they know much more about their world than the average player.

It would be cool in a sense if they were not marked out and you could find "hidden quests" by exploring and talking to NPCs. Best if they quests were not there all the time, had player reqs or even Node triggers.