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Bad Boys, Whatcha ganna do? Jail and Trial System

We all make mistakes, but sometimes there are just bad hombres. Maybe they're born with it? Maybe it's Mayballine. No one knows...

The men and women of law enforcement (which I've been told are filmed on location) work day in and day out to put these bad boys behind bars.

Since we will have a bounty system, will we have a trial and jail system? What are your thoughts about jury system? I've played games were players were the judge and the jury, and I could see Ashes doing this.

I know we all await the global shout announcing @Kratz is escaping on his white bronco with the Node's finest in hot pursuit.
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    I don't think there will be a trial and jail system, just a penalty system for being corrupted.
    I would be interested in seeing such a system, though I think being in jail might deter a lot of people as it isn't exactly fun to not being able to do anything for x amount of time. Though I suppose you could implement an escape mechanism of some sort..
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    AoC cops show? cool. Justice and Law, many make 'lists' of people they have, or have had issues with. This could be interesting take on Node development, with a citizen voting do they get to create laws for their regions as well?
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    I mean I joke and jape, but this is actually a feature I'm really interested in. I really like real consequence in games. 

    I also hope to be a bounty hunter with a girl in every node, and bar where everybody knows my name and a really cool jacket
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    It has already been denied in one of the May livestreams.
    The outlaw and bounty hunter system is all we'll get - therefore with some neat features.
    A jail system would hurt the thoughtfully created system.
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    Herdo said:
    It has already been denied in one of the May livestreams.
    The outlaw and bounty hunter system is all we'll get - therefore with some neat features.
    A jail system would hurt the thoughtfully created system.
    I completely missed that. I'll have to go back and rewatch them.

    I don't think it would "hurt" the system. I'm curious why you think that? It seems a logical step in a game that let's the players control and shape so much. Why not let them create their own justice?
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    Karthos said:
    I know we all await the global shout announcing @Kratz is escaping on his white bronco with the Node's finest in hot pursuit.
    I think the tallest animal I'll get away on will be a hog ;) It's a great idea @Karthos and would add a layer of depth to the game. I've never seen anything like that in an MMOrpg before (Which I guess is the point) but I'm not sure how they'd implement it to be fair and effective rather than just a lame few clicks on your mouse. I think the Bounty Hunter system will have to provide all the justification and excitement needed for catching crims! :)
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    Karthos said:
    We all make mistakes, but sometimes there are just bad hombres. Maybe they're born with it? Maybe it's Mayballine. No one knows...

    The men and women of law enforcement (which I've been told are filmed on location) work day in and day out to put these bad boys behind bars.

    Since we will have a bounty system, will we have a trial and jail system? What are your thoughts about jury system? I've played games were players were the judge and the jury, and I could see Ashes doing this.

    I know we all await the global shout announcing @Kratz is escaping on his white bronco with the Node's finest in hot pursuit.
    I mean , Kratz we be in the back and I'll be driving ! I think this would be sweet .. and maybe like the kings and queens of a metro we could have voted in officials .. I don't know if a jail would work as people are paying for game time. but maybe a sentencing where they pay higher taxes and things in the city cost more or their equipment  suffers more of a durability from deaths until the time has been served..

    Me thinking out loud again.
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    Kings and Queens? I don't think they need our taxes the DRAGON will eat us for supper :(
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    The devs already said no jail system, which is a decision I agree with.
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    Something that would be nice is if players that have concerns about random PVP could have someway to affect RPKers. Something beyond system penalties, which are great but don't give justice to the victims directly.

    Maybe if players and Nodes could bar use of all facilities to those they choose to? Deny banking, training and buying/selling to outlaws within their Node?

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    UMJI HEAR BOUNTY AND CORRUPTION. GOOD.
    JAIL IS DELAY FOR MEAL. BAD.
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    There's to be no jail system. 
    That could be interesting though.  Although it could also be abused I think.  Also let's face it, no one wants down time that will take away from the mobility of the game.  Having corruption and running from bounty hunters is one thing.  Sitting at your pc or going AFK waiting while you suffer through your sentence is another thing even though I'm sure we will be wishing that on some pkers.
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    There's to be no jail system. 
    That could be interesting though.  Although it could also be abused I think.  Also let's face it, no one wants down time that will take away from the mobility of the game.  Having corruption and running from bounty hunters is one thing.  Sitting at your pc or going AFK waiting while you suffer through your sentence is another thing even though I'm sure we will be wishing that on some pkers.
    LoL! I am sure we will! :)
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    Way I see only people really causing issues would even end up in this jail system. So unless your outright harassing people then your fine. Occasional RPK eh your fine the bounty hunter just kills you. Continually harass and abuse low levels and that my friend is when you need a time out... Besides it's not like they have to make it escape proof...

    Just give em ways to escape and it's no longer "taking the time they payed for" even though that's exactly what their doing to others. But more like putting a puzzle obstacle in front of them to slow them down. I've seen a simple jail system in runescape before for leveling the thieving skill for a while.

    You got locked in a tiny open cell and had rotten tomatoes thrown at you was actually pretty funny. Solved a short lock puzzle and your out. I got locked in there quite a few times myself and it was just a part of the game.
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    Some great points here. I really love games that give players control over shaping it. The down side of it is that it can be (and will be ) abused by certain players.

    Can we still have a AoC Cops show though? 
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    I think there's a Jail system in Archeage, with a player run judge/jury sytem. Not something I'm too fond of. 
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    You have to measure how much use any mechanic will see before you decide to invest time/money into it.

    I argue lots for the need for random PVP and try to help people realize not that it will be uncommon but that they need just be prepared to deal with it depending on how they choose to(freeze, fly or fight).

    My point is that the Bounty Hunter mechanic would not be in the works if RPK was not going to be somewhat common. They would not bother to allow RPK if they did not plan for there to be a certain amount of it and they would not plan the bounty hunter either. Too many "punishment mechanics" need for RPK to be even more prevalent. That would lessen the players on the PVP averse side of the scale.

    I'm not against "jail time" but that is probably because I don't play in ways that would get me there. :)

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    Karthos said:
     Maybe it's Mayballine. 
    It's Mayballine.



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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    As was stated earlier, Steven isn't too keen on instituting a "jail mechanic", into the game.  And, I can understand, because it would be terribly unfun to sit around, until a whatever time you've been sentenced to, runs out.

    That being said, if properly implemented, it could also be a lot of fun.  My initial thinking was in line with @ReaperOfCookies, and @Bannith.  

    Corrupted players, once they attain a bounty, are hunted.  Once one of these corrupted players is captured (killed), they are brought before that realms court, to be judged by their peers (other players).  A run down of all their "crimes" will be introduced (a breakdown of their corruption), and the jury will decide innocent, or guilty.  If innocent, all prior corruption is cleansed.  If found guilty, "time served" is commiserate with the amount of corruption earned.

    If found guilty, convicted criminals would be placed in that realms prison facility.  To: 
        A.  Wait out their sentence, while performing community service (gathering, processing, or crafting)

       B.  Attempt to break out.  Construct prisons with mazes, full of puzzles and monsters, that the convicted can choose to brave, to earn their freedom.

    C.  Friend can break you out.  Friends can attempt to break the criminal out, by storming the prison, either by stealth or force, to attempt to rescue their compatriot.

    If options B or C are successful, whatever corruption the player had, would still be in effect, after escaping, and the bounty would be reinstituted.  Completion of option A would result in an immediate cleansing of corruption.
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    I'm assuming that there will more than likely be an Archeage-Esque trial system. However instead of nationwide, Whichever node you have the most criminal activity oversees the trial and the game randomly selects some citizens to be your judge and the majority vote based on the evidence (sort of a mix of Town of Salem and Archeage) decides what happens to you. I don't think if there is a prison, it'd be very large like the ones in archeage since the world is ever changing. But in my head, i think this system plays out well.
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    That would be so stupid a jail system.

    If the bounty hunter kils the hunted they wil get a reward to.

    Force someone to sit time or wait or pay a fee thats a normal part of the game would be wierd and annoying, also what would be the rules to do that etc etc, if thats a player decision or choose that can be abused to. xD

    Simply said, i dont like it.
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    I don't know about a trial by other players, seems like the system only flags you if you are in fact guilty. Why give them the chance at having a jury selected (even randomly) that contains their guild mates or other PK's?

    In our law system sure, people make mistakes. In a video game, unless at such a time when Ashes randomly starts flagging/corrupting people as PK's, I don't think there is much to debate.

    I do agree with most about jail in that I believe there should not be one. If they made it a game so there was a chance prisoners could escape what would be the final purpose of it to start with?

    I like the bounty system, the members that have talked about making a bounty hunting guild, and yes even the members that have expressed their desires to be a PK. It's like the playground, you get along with some kids, you don't get along with some kids, you don't even know some kids, but the bullies everyone knows about and their reputation often causes them more trouble than they do themselves.

    They are going to suffer corruption. The corruption system will be *hopefully* improved during alpha/betas, so why come up with ways to punish them more or personally?

    I hope nobody is going into this game (here in ~2 years) thinking about personal grudges or ways to get even with other players.
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    It would be awesome for RP if there were some non scripted assets in the game, like dungeons (in the traditional sense) underneath castles, jails in city hall, stocks in town squares etc. 
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    Azathoth said:
    I don't know about a trial by other players, seems like the system only flags you if you are in fact guilty. Why give them the chance at having a jury selected (even randomly) that contains their guild mates or other PK's?

    In our law system sure, people make mistakes. In a video game, unless at such a time when Ashes randomly starts flagging/corrupting people as PK's, I don't think there is much to debate.

    I do agree with most about jail in that I believe there should not be one. If they made it a game so there was a chance prisoners could escape what would be the final purpose of it to start with?
    I see your point, and that it is very valid.  In that case, any captured criminals would be whisked straight to prison, with some sort of public notification.  "Xarec, the infamous murderer accused of multiple random slayings in the province of Gridania, has been captured and sentenced to 'X amount of time' at Rock Fort Prison", or something like that.  

    Azathoth said:
    I do agree with most about jail in that I believe there should not be one. If they made it a game so there was a chance prisoners could escape what would be the final purpose of it to start with?

    I like the bounty system, the members that have talked about making a bounty hunting guild, and yes even the members that have expressed their desires to be a PK. It's like the playground, you get along with some kids, you don't get along with some kids, you don't even know some kids, but the bullies everyone knows about and their reputation often causes them more trouble than they do themselves.
    The point would be IF a prison mechanic were to HYPOTHETICALLY be implemented, how could it be made both fair, and fun, for all.  With the above amendment made (the removal of a trail), only jail time awaits, and options A, B, and C (in my previous post) would still stand.  Also, if the prisoner did break free, the corruption he sustained would still be in place, and the bounty on his/her head would also be resumed.  

    This idea wasn't meant to replace the corruption/bounty system, but add to it.  But, as I said before, this is all just idealizing for fun.  Steven has stated that he's not putting in any jail mechanics.  So, no need for anyone who doesn't like the idea to worry.
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    lexmax said:
    It would be awesome for RP if there were some non scripted assets in the game, like dungeons (in the traditional sense) underneath castles, jails in city hall, stocks in town squares etc. 
    This is sort of what I had invisioned when I posted this, Node run jails. 

    I mostly was just curious how popular if an idea this was (not very apparently) and pee have made compelling arguments in both sides of the issue.

    Edited because I suck at teh English
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    Ohhh. Jail system for RP? That would be pretty awesome.
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    I think doing time for doing a crime is an important feature of a sandbox-style game! Would love to see them revisit the idea, if they've already talked about leaning away from a law system.
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    The point would be IF a prison mechanic were to HYPOTHETICALLY be implemented, how could it be made both fair, and fun, for all.  With the above amendment made (the removal of a trail), only jail time awaits, and options A, B, and C (in my previous post) would still stand.  Also, if the prisoner did break free, the corruption he sustained would still be in place, and the bounty on his/her head would also be resumed.  

    This idea wasn't meant to replace the corruption/bounty system, but add to it.  But, as I said before, this is all just idealizing for fun.  Steven has stated that he's not putting in any jail mechanics.  So, no need for anyone who doesn't like the idea to worry.
    Fair point and spoken well.
    I could see keeping the corruption/bounty if they escaped before their time. To that matter I could be down for a slow reduction rate of corruption timed to be "0" when the sentenced was finished.

    I never considered it from an RP POV. I was stuck on crime & punishment I guess. If there was a bulletin that went out "Xarec, known bandit, has escaped incarceration..." that would be a super fun gimmick. Everyone would know there was a prison break and the player would, I think, feel more like an outlaw.

    Freespiryt, thank you for your insight!
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    Arest me sir, i have stolen 5 loafs of bread to feed my children and mi wife
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    Arest me sir, i have stolen 5 loafs of bread to feed my children and mi wife
    "No arrest for thee, knave!  20 lashes of the whip should change your ways!  Hahaha!"
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