Karma/Fame system

ArchivedUser

They had permanent statloss as a penalty for excessive PKing in Ultima Online.  People are going to play how they want to play regardless of what obstacles are put in place.

ArchivedUser

@Severok
It's more the fact that you're going to loss the fight not the repercussions of doing so

ArchivedUser

Samurai_Salamander said:

@Severok
and if you know what they're making corruption do, you'll know that all the PK guilds will get rekt

Ultima Online incurred permanent stat loss for people who practiced excessive PKing when their character died.  It would takes weeks to rebuild the lost points depending on how bad the stat loss was.  People are going to play how they want regardless of what barrier is in place, and the more challenging it is the more fun it will be.

The corruption system wasnt designed to prevent PKing or make it to where people would 100% not want to PK, otherwise they wouldn't even bother with the combatant system in the first place.  I really don't know what you're trying to get at here.

In any case a fame/karma system that piggy backs the corruption system is a completely different discussion altogether.  If you don't pvp at all you would still be able to affect your fame/karma through PvE, so what is the problem here?

ArchivedUser

The basic ideas have been discussed, but like you I'm waiting for lots more info. What we know so far from the DEVs is:

1. Our flagging system highly deters griefing and outright pking. There are three states that a player can find themselves in: Non Combatant (green), Combatant (purple) and Corrupt (red). Everyone is a Non-Combatant by default. If a Non-Combatant attacks a Combatant or another Non-Combatant, then they become a combatant for a period of time.
2. Similarly, if a Non-Combatant enters a pvp zone (which includes things like castles, city sieges, and caravans) they are automatically flagged as combatant while in the zone and for a period of time after leaving that zone.
3. Players can kill combatants without repercussions, and are encouraged to do so, since dying while a Combatant means you suffer reduced death penalties, where this changes is when a Combatant kills a Non- Combatant. In this case, the Combatant is Corrupt, and acquires a corruption score (which is accrued based on a number of different parameters, including the level differential of their freshly slain victim).
4. This corruption score can be worked off with effort through a few mechanics, but the primary means of getting rid of it is through death.
5. While a player is corrupt, they may be attacked by both Combatants and Non-Combatants. If a Non-Combatant attacks a corrupt player, the Non-Combatant will not flag as a combatant. We also have some other ideas that we haven’t formalized yet that will allow players to participate in what we feel could be a fun Cat - and - Mouse part of the game.
6. As an example, the location of these corrupt players will be displayed on the map, If you have a Bounty Hunter title, which can be obtained through a quest available to a citizen from a military zoned, stage 4 (town) node. These are systems that we’re still working on, but corruption is something we want to provide explicit gameplay opportunities for.
7. Our players can participate in pvp with one another without having to resort to murder. It would be near impossible to camp a player in Ashes of Creation. Our corruption system for PKers ensures that their combat effectiveness diminishes with each murder they commit. Eventually a corrupt player will be ineffective in PVP, and will have the potential to drop his gear if killed while corrupt.

ArchivedUser

Samurai_Salamander said:

@Severok
and if you know what they're making corruption do, you'll know that all the PK guilds will get rekt

It's more the fact that you're going to loss the fight not the repercussions of doing so

Youre jumping to an awful lot of conclusions with not a whole lot of information, I would refer you to lexmax's post above.

Also, the intent of this post has been successfully derailed.  Let's get back to ideas pertaining to the system suggestion.

ArchivedUser

@Severok
I think it's important to distinguish the difference between pking and flagging up (pvp). pking, you are just killing a person out right once or multiple times, whereas when you're flagging up you're signalling to everyone basically "come at me bro" . The combatant system is needed for the open world pvp but the byproduct of that is allowing players the potential to pk/grieve which is where corruption comes in. This is where my previous comments stand in.

ArchivedUser

The problem I see with this is that one person friend could be another's enemy and with out NPC fractions to define laws of good and bad the players governments would ultimately have to define what is good or bad in their nodes. Which would make for a complicated system of laws. There would need to be a karma for each player node or faction to keep track of who your friendly with. Not impossible but kind of complicated. The death penalty system the developers proposed will make death risky if you kill too many people. This will make the player stop and think about who he tries to kills. 

ArchivedUser

Its still to early to tell how it will affect the game but I still think its better than most games anti-PK

ArchivedUser

Lineage 2 used the karma/fame system with it's combat system that is sounding identical to this one. Karma was your corruption from PK's. I liked it primarily because after getting your fame high enough you could get a free PK without penalty 

ArchivedUser

Severok said:

Samurai_Salamander said:

@lexmax
The way I see it Bounty Hunters will be Obsolete Because they have made Corruption such a Deterrent imo.

If you think for one second that ANYTHING will deter people from creating PK guilds and PKing in a sandbox MMO, you've never played a sandbox MMO.

This is so true; I know I bring this game up a lot but, I feel like i'm the only one in the forums who has played Lineage 2???
There WILL be PK guilds.... there will be alts used for PKs. This is the world of MMOs and not even permadeath will deter these events from happening.

Besides, lets not forget the once in a while "oops" attack while fooling around with friends... you accidentally killed your buddy, oh wait... here comes a Bounty Hunter.

The best part is once you are corrupt, you will have to become more corrupt in order to defend yourself. Players will not flag when hitting a corrupt player. I will also assume you must be corrupt or flagged for certain skills to be used on you (aoe, dot, debuff). Defending yourself is going to present one hell of a challenge. Hmm... Hold my beer... 

ArchivedUser

I've never heard of a system like this before, but I would be in support of it. It sounds like a pretty neat system.

ArchivedUser

Welphgryn said:

I've never heard of a system like this before, but I would be in support of it. It sounds like a pretty neat system.

Here is the flagging...
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DeKhbtog_pI

Here is the feeling of being red and trying to run with epic items on hand
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4lC_ygCG24

I hope we also include wars that work like this... I don't like having to flag if war has been declared...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f15SHZr-CK0

Honestly I am yet to see a better system. When I saw this system was being put in place, that's what caught my attention the most