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CLASS Skills seem to be DUMBED-DOWN
ArchivedUser
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After watching the TWITCH Stream on June/30 it seems as though CLASS Skills are DUMBED-DOWN.
I'l explain, WOW use to have a GREAT 3 Tier Tech-Tree for your CLASS and you could go down one of the tiers and specialize in it or have a little bit of everything. Now WOW no longer gives you free reign with your the choices for you CLASS and how you use them are really DUMBED-DOWN. That's the reason I quit WOW.
After Steven finished explaining the CLERIC Class I was really underwhelmed. The CLERIC felt DUMBED-DOWN. I can understand if it was under one Tech-Tree that gives you both healing and damage, but I think there needs to be 3 Tech-Trees to go down like in WOW. One that focuses on HEALING, One that focuses on DAMAGE, and One that focuses on a mix of HEALING & DAMAGE but not as effective as the other two yet would make you more versatile. The CLERIC that Steven explained fits in the HEALING & DAMAGE / Versatile SPEC.
I planned on making a HEALING / CLERIC (Cleric / Cleric) God of Healing, but the way they described the CLERIC isn't the play-style that I want.
We NEED a 3 Tier Tech-Tree to really have A-LOT of CUSTOMIZATION for our CLASS.
I'l explain, WOW use to have a GREAT 3 Tier Tech-Tree for your CLASS and you could go down one of the tiers and specialize in it or have a little bit of everything. Now WOW no longer gives you free reign with your the choices for you CLASS and how you use them are really DUMBED-DOWN. That's the reason I quit WOW.
After Steven finished explaining the CLERIC Class I was really underwhelmed. The CLERIC felt DUMBED-DOWN. I can understand if it was under one Tech-Tree that gives you both healing and damage, but I think there needs to be 3 Tech-Trees to go down like in WOW. One that focuses on HEALING, One that focuses on DAMAGE, and One that focuses on a mix of HEALING & DAMAGE but not as effective as the other two yet would make you more versatile. The CLERIC that Steven explained fits in the HEALING & DAMAGE / Versatile SPEC.
I planned on making a HEALING / CLERIC (Cleric / Cleric) God of Healing, but the way they described the CLERIC isn't the play-style that I want.
We NEED a 3 Tier Tech-Tree to really have A-LOT of CUSTOMIZATION for our CLASS.
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I don't think it's meant to be anything close to the finalized version.
Although repeating and capitalizing key phraises was pretty mind numbing, his argument is completely fair.
I'm not saying that his opinion is invalid. Just saying that his concern about the game being dumbed down based on what the developers shared during the stream might be unfounded.
The developers have mentioned quite a few times previously that there will be quite a lot of opportunity to customize classes with augments to change the way they play.
Which is what the OP is asking for I'm assuming? Being able to customzie classes?
You are also right his opinion is not invalid, but they have a certain way they want to do things and they also need to test it all.
HALF ORC MAYBE.
UMJI SEE VID TALK AGAIN.
~we'll judge after release~ hehehe
From what I've understood, most of the customization is going to come from augmenting your skills. What they described in the last live stream were completely unaugmented skills.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
OP is just jumping the gun in complaining about what the vision of the class is when all we have been allowed to do so far is peek through a keyhole.
Compared to an active situational 5* skill primary system with combos, group chaining and an ultimate ability that have yet to be augmented with the current 8 other possible secondary class systems.
that will be a functional play test for PAX.
having the option of using 100+ skills and abilities typically ends up being the 5 or so used in actuality making the other 95 just an illusion of choice.
Shunex-03/28/2017
i agree that i was underwhelmed as well but not for the same reason. but i think mine is from a lack of information.
i feel like we will have in dept talent trees/exc if we don't the game would crash. we have class combinations. we don't need 3 trees to go into for each class combination, we just need one very well made skill/talent tree for each combination of classes. imo
Are we not allowed to discuss anything 'till the genuine release date of game? Let's shut down the forum's discussion then. These type of responses do not contribute to the the thread or counter what he says, eventhough I get excited for Clerics which seems so fun to me. I liked the way they introduced Clerics.
We're talking upon what been given to us, and they did not say they won't follow the style the skills they explained or they're gonna change everything. They just declared to demonstrate classes with some skills coming to PAX. These skills could be solid.
And OP here declares that he doesn't want to see this kind of cleric system whether the Intrepid does intend to make or not. According to the live stream, I think they intend to avoid an allmighty healing god cleric.
People can discuss whatever the CMs will allow.
Other posters can't stop people from posting.
Theorycraft away - and other people will share their responses.
Oh, I can't speak for the rest. I love theory crafting, speculating and discussing about how classes might turn out or what I would love to see in the game.
I wasn't giving the reply to shoot down his discussion. It was in reply to this:
Yes, these skills could possibly be solid, but we're still missing the 8 secondary class augments (8 tiers instead of 3 tiers for clerics example), and all the other augments (from religion, race, social progressions), that could change and augment those skills to suit the OP's "God of healing" playstyle.
No offense meant, The main point of the OP's post seemed more of a "I'm worried that the class has been dumbed down" rather than an invite to discuss and speculate based on the information we have.
So normally most people, even friendly/helpful ones, would come in to tell him the game is in alpha, things are not solidified (set in stone yet) etc to help comfort or lessen his worry.
I do think it is totally fair for the OP to say that this is not what he was hoping. Even if it is pre-alpha-pax it is what we have to go on for understanding the classes. If this doesn't sound good to a person then they should voice it. Though maybe not using all caps.
Now, most of us do think that with all the 'things yet to come' there will be many more choices and paths for the healer to take. However... what if there isn't? What if the paths just refined what was talked about? Always good to get ideas out there. I don't agree that a three tier tech tree is the way to do it though. It could be 8 tree, could be no tree maybe it could be a bunny path. No reason to limit it to an idea that has already been used over and over again.
Still, I don't trust healers. They always pick weird times to jump into the middle of the fight and start bashing things and talking about the gods. Very distracting.
And comeon, we all know all classes will choose cleric as there 2nd.
This is why I can say, the more complex decks can be made, the better. I'm all for it.
That being said, I'm certain what Intrepid presented to us is just a start of a design, and there is so much more work to be done on class skills. People can't honestly expect that final versions of skills are created on day 1. o.O
I don't think the game needs trees like WoW. The variety that is being planned through augments (race,sub class, religion, social group) and via weapon skills should be sufficient to create variety in the community and allow for a almost completely pure healer class.
I, like others, believe this is just a sample of their skills for a PAX build that is playable.
I also kinda expect that, especially in PVP. RogueCleric and HunterCleric might be very interesting, sucking life out of the enemy while being evasive and fast. They're gonna be so annoying as enemies. I wonder if they're gonna do a Path Of Exile thing like when you have something good, something's taken from you like trading your hp gauge with fast rebuilding energy shield.
I don't know. Jeffrey Bard gave their thoughts around Cleric and their thought on the theme, not just for PAX, what they have in mind like when Steven said "clerics", he added they thought "what does it mean to be a healer" and later added on the Vampire skill that "you can't really generate something from nothning, you have to withdraw it from something else" which also puts what kind of plans they have for Clerics, and it basicly clashes with mentality of what the OP said. OP wants to generate instant life force without majorly requiring to absorb it from a target and the Lead Game Designer kinda have intention for it to get sucked from a target to make the Cleric more engaged with battle.
If they're coming to PAX just for visuals and fun, why would they mention what kind of mindset they have around the classes and game mechanic? They're thinking the roles and the position of the classes, and they're already implementing them to give it a glimpse.