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The "Big Bad"

In the newest ashen forge podcast with steven, there was something that grabbed my attention, which was the main antagonist of ashes and a brand new culture.  We have not yet seen or had any hints to what they may be or if they are linked to the main antagonist but as steven mentioned them together I would say they are linked in some way. My question is what do you think is the "big bad" of ashes? 

Everything below is just what I think.

Now we don't have much lore about ashes but we do know a cataclysmic event happened that drove people away from Verra. Now my theory is that what if the main antagonist created the great cataclysm to gain overall leadership of Verra and this unknown culture was his faction/army.

Whatever this calamity was it seems to have affected the world in some way. The point I have is magic is a big part of Verra but what is the magic became corrupted much like players can become corrupted when engaged in an "evil" acts. What if this corruption also changed the people of this new culture. We have an example of this in the Tulnar as they stayed in the world of Verra during the fall and have changed. Now we don't know if the corruption did this or something else but for the sake of my theory we will go with its corruption.

If the corruption did cause the change does that also mean that the new culture and the antagonist have also changed into something new and more powerful or are they just twisted images of their old selves and that we must fight to stop the flow of corruption from affecting everyone.

Like I said this is just my theory with the limited amount of lore we have but I found it interesting. I would love to hear what you all think about the Big Bad of ashes and the reason for the fall. 


Here is the link to the podcast 
https://youtu.be/ZnoHtzaQeMs?t=1h8m27s
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    Hmmn.
    Well, we don't have much to go on, but...
    I think it's a faction of gods who caused the calamity that drove our ancestors from Verra.
    Apparently, the original inhabitants of the Castles will belong to a culture that stayed on Verra. I don't think they are gods, but could be some form of demi-gods.
    I would prefer that most of the owners of the 5 Castles are antagonists without being Corrupted. But it may be that everyone who remained on Verra was tainted with Corruption.
    We shall see.
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    Obviously its stuffertons or whatever the bear's name is. He plotted the downfall of the world just to be reincarnated as a mount.


    Jokes aside, I have to agree with Dygz here. Going by the story about that dwarf girl from a while back, it seems as if this calamity was forseen a long time ago. From that story alone, doesn't seem like any being living in the world could cause a calamity of that size on their own. No super dark lord Sauron or something because they simply don't have the power to cause destruction of such a scale (Even sauron being as powerful as he was couldnt just wipe out man and elves, he had to fight them first).

    I think its something along the lines of "the inhabitants of verra knew about this rogue faction of gods and hoped it would be resolved but were prepared to expect the worst" kinda thing. Not much to go off of but i'm gonna bet some evil god or something is the Big Bad
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited May 2018
    I'm thinking it's an alien force that arrived on Verra and started the corruption.  It seems to me that the original NPC owners of the castles when we arrive will be part of that corruption.  Perhaps this alien also corrupted some of the gods; but I don't think it started with one/some of gods that existed on Verra.
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    So if it was a rouge god that caused the fall does that mean we are fighting their troops like the Nephilim?
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    hmm a red god with giants for an army...interesting
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    It's obviously us. The players, wreaked havoc millennia ago n wiped out all the previous races and then their own, we're just all joining back in for round 2 as the descendents of the original big bad calamity.
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    My line of thinking most closely aligns to @T-Elf's assumptions.

    I think the source of the corruption originated outside of Verra's sphere of influence, although the portent of it's coming was conveyed as a warning, by the gods.  Perhaps the hubris of our ancestors somehow "called out" to the progenitor of this corruption, on a metaphysical level, thus starting a calamitous chain of events, leading up to the present day.  The warnings the gods tried to gift their children, gone unheeded, lost as the mortals were, to decadence.  

    Once the corruption found a home within Verra, it changed all it touched, without restraint.  It's up to us, the players, to learn about our true past, reclaim ancient knowledge, and restore Verra to it's former natural beauty, while withstanding the corruption that lurks within, and without.  To learn from our ancestors mistakes, and forge our world anew!

    Or, something like that, lol.




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    So many interesting ideas so far
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    @T-Elf The alien theory crossed my mind but that would lead to a more sci-fi theme and less high fantasy so i didn't comment on it
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    @T-Elf The alien theory crossed my mind but that would lead to a more sci-fi theme and less high fantasy so i didn't comment on it
    lol  It's common for for most people to think of "little green men", when you hear "alien".  But, "alien" could also just me foreign.  An outside presence, totally unrelated to the native species.  Also, it is a term most used in sci-fi settings.
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    @T-Elf The alien theory crossed my mind but that would lead to a more sci-fi theme and less high fantasy so i didn't comment on it
    lol  It's common for for most people to think of "little green men", when you hear "alien".  But, "alien" could also just me foreign.  An outside presence, totally unrelated to the native species.  Also, it is a term most used in sci-fi settings.
    well that's interesting if the gateways leed to Verra and the world we are in now does that mean there are other places that could reach Verra?
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    nagash said:
    @T-Elf The alien theory crossed my mind but that would lead to a more sci-fi theme and less high fantasy so i didn't comment on it
    lol  It's common for for most people to think of "little green men", when you hear "alien".  But, "alien" could also just me foreign.  An outside presence, totally unrelated to the native species.  Also, it is a term most used in sci-fi settings.
    well that's interesting if the gateways leed to Verra and the world we are in now does that mean there are other places that could reach Verra?
    Before I saw the art for the planetarium, Intrepid released, I, too, thought the corruption was "home grown", in a sense.  And, it could still very well be.  But, I theorize that the corruption is probably plane(t).

    I'm sure that there are doors that lead to Verra, the same way there were/are doors leading out, that we know nothing about, yet.
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    nagash said:
    @T-Elf The alien theory crossed my mind but that would lead to a more sci-fi theme and less high fantasy so i didn't comment on it
    lol  It's common for for most people to think of "little green men", when you hear "alien".  But, "alien" could also just me foreign.  An outside presence, totally unrelated to the native species.  Also, it is a term most used in sci-fi settings.
    well that's interesting if the gateways leed to Verra and the world we are in now does that mean there are other places that could reach Verra?
    Before I saw the art for the planetarium, Intrepid released, I, too, thought the corruption was "home grown", in a sense.  And, it could still very well be.  But, I theorize that the corruption is probably plane(t).

    I'm sure that there are doors that lead to Verra, the same way there were/are doors leading out, that we know nothing about, yet.
    So maybe this unknown culture is from that world then. gods its the end times all over again
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    nagash said:
    nagash said:
    @T-Elf The alien theory crossed my mind but that would lead to a more sci-fi theme and less high fantasy so i didn't comment on it
    lol  It's common for for most people to think of "little green men", when you hear "alien".  But, "alien" could also just me foreign.  An outside presence, totally unrelated to the native species.  Also, it is a term most used in sci-fi settings.
    well that's interesting if the gateways leed to Verra and the world we are in now does that mean there are other places that could reach Verra?
    Before I saw the art for the planetarium, Intrepid released, I, too, thought the corruption was "home grown", in a sense.  And, it could still very well be.  But, I theorize that the corruption is probably plane(t).

    I'm sure that there are doors that lead to Verra, the same way there were/are doors leading out, that we know nothing about, yet.
    So maybe this unknown culture is from that world then. gods its the end times all over again
    Sounds like a romp through the daisies, for someone of your...particular...predilictions, right?  lol

    "More bones for the offering!", and all that.  (stole that quote from Lord Marrowgar) ;)
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    nagash said:
    nagash said:
    @T-Elf The alien theory crossed my mind but that would lead to a more sci-fi theme and less high fantasy so i didn't comment on it
    lol  It's common for for most people to think of "little green men", when you hear "alien".  But, "alien" could also just me foreign.  An outside presence, totally unrelated to the native species.  Also, it is a term most used in sci-fi settings.
    well that's interesting if the gateways leed to Verra and the world we are in now does that mean there are other places that could reach Verra?
    Before I saw the art for the planetarium, Intrepid released, I, too, thought the corruption was "home grown", in a sense.  And, it could still very well be.  But, I theorize that the corruption is probably plane(t).

    I'm sure that there are doors that lead to Verra, the same way there were/are doors leading out, that we know nothing about, yet.
    So maybe this unknown culture is from that world then. gods its the end times all over again
    Sounds like a romp through the daisies, for someone of your...particular...predilictions, right?  lol

    "More bones for the offering!", and all that.  (stole that quote from Lord Marrowgar) ;)
    Oh no no no when I say the end time I'm going back to sleep in my tomb you don't know the pain of the end times
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited May 2018
    Some alien force outside of Verra doesn't exclude it being in a fantasy setting; as was pointed out by @freespiryt there were several planets in that piece of concept art.  We, ourselves, traveled off planet, and are coming back.  So the concept of beings coming from another part of space is already a concept in the game.

    I want to add that in the lore story Verra was being invaded.
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    What about evil turtles that control people through mind rays? The turtles are also all tax attorneys and have mustaches.

    That's pretty scary right?
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    Karthos said:
    What about evil turtles that control people through mind rays? The turtles are also all tax attorneys and have mustaches.

    That's pretty scary right?
    We should have known all along!
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    Either a god going crazy or somebody playing with magic too much :3
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    I think the big bad will be like Thanos...but they'll call it....Nagos.
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    @T-Elf The alien theory crossed my mind but that would lead to a more sci-fi theme and less high fantasy so i didn't comment on it
    lol  It's common for for most people to think of "little green men", when you hear "alien".  But, "alien" could also just me foreign.  An outside presence, totally unrelated to the native species.  Also, it is a term most used in sci-fi settings.
    oh so something along the lines the horde invading in world of warcraft could be considered alien. The theory makes sense then i suppose
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    @T-Elf The alien theory crossed my mind but that would lead to a more sci-fi theme and less high fantasy so i didn't comment on it
    lol  It's common for for most people to think of "little green men", when you hear "alien".  But, "alien" could also just me foreign.  An outside presence, totally unrelated to the native species.  Also, it is a term most used in sci-fi settings.
    oh so something along the lines the horde invading in world of warcraft could be considered alien. The theory makes sense then i suppose
    Yep.  Though, in the case of WoW's orcs, it would be "big green men".  :p
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    @T-Elf The alien theory crossed my mind but that would lead to a more sci-fi theme and less high fantasy so i didn't comment on it
    lol  It's common for for most people to think of "little green men", when you hear "alien".  But, "alien" could also just me foreign.  An outside presence, totally unrelated to the native species.  Also, it is a term most used in sci-fi settings.
    oh so something along the lines the horde invading in world of warcraft could be considered alien. The theory makes sense then i suppose
    Yep.  Though, in the case of WoW's orcs, it would be "big green men".  :p

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    I think there is lots of hints.. I see several NPC factions, but i would guess that these demonic styled spider hybrid creatures are the main evil and reason for apocalypse.




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    Ferryman said:
    I think there is lots of hints.. I see several NPC factions, but i would guess that these demonic styled spider hybrid creatures are the main evil and reason for apocalypse.




    Well, it could be them or they could just be the tulnar as we have not seen them yet. The huge spider was a monster summoned by a token I believe so it may not be linked to the main antagansit and the last image I have no idea.
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    To piggyback off of @Nagash's response, the images numbered 1-14 are iterations of the Tulnar, a playable race, with "mixed features". 

    The second image is boss monster, currently called a "spider demon". (the name is on the upper left corner)

    The last image is of a corrupted, intelligent, bird race.  Their enemy mob's.  @UnknownSystemError would undoubtedly know more specific information.
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    To piggyback off of @Nagash's response, the images numbered 1-14 are iterations of the Tulnar, a playable race, with "mixed features". 

    Are you sure? Not all looking same race to me if you check carefully the tails and heads for example. And i guess there is also few pics of orcs too.

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    Ferryman said:
    To piggyback off of @Nagash's response, the images numbered 1-14 are iterations of the Tulnar, a playable race, with "mixed features". 

    Are you sure? Not all looking same race to me if you check carefully the tails and heads for example. And i guess there is also few pics of orcs too.

    That's what corruption does to people its like the warp or chaos you don't mess with it unless you want to be horribly mutated 
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    Ferryman said:
    To piggyback off of @Nagash's response, the images numbered 1-14 are iterations of the Tulnar, a playable race, with "mixed features". 

    Are you sure? Not all looking same race to me if you check carefully the tails and heads for example. And i guess there is also few pics of orcs too.

    I believe so.  I remember hearing Steven saying that the Tulnar would all exhibit features incorporating humanoid, mammalian (animal), reptilian, and insectoid(?).  He said that players creating a Tulnar would be able to freely choose how much of those previously named features they would like to exhibit, when creating their character. 
  • Options
    To piggyback off of @Nagash's response, the images numbered 1-14 are iterations of the Tulnar, a playable race, with "mixed features". 

    The second image is boss monster, currently called a "spider demon". (the name is on the upper left corner)

    The last image is of a corrupted, intelligent, bird race.  Their enemy mob's.  @UnknownSystemError would undoubtedly know more specific information.
    For number 1 that was one of the earliest concept images of the Tulnar thrown around. People love to use it as their "see, see, they are going to be like this>>>" go to in posts. But many of the concepts and weapons put out by the artist in that early image have already been ruled out. They haven't even worked on the Tulnar really as a race and what they end up being will be radically different from that initial proof of concept drawing that was commissioned before they had even a workable demo.

    Yes, the second image is of a spider demon, which is also a named boss when you look at the A0 "raid" video they recently put out. There has been no confirmation either way as to whether they constitute a npc "race."

    And yes the final image is of the corrupted avian race that was featured at PAX West as part of their pve themepark experience. Any group that was left behind on Verra and didn't hide in the Underrealm was corrupted and will make an appearance. Like most things they are keeping the backstory and lore to snippets, going to be a long, hot summer for those in the northern hemisphere filled with speculation.

    [13:30] Concept art.
    1. [13:50] Concept of creatures for the mountainous zone.
      1. [13:55] Weird Kobold looking critters.
      2. [14:14] Spider person.
      3. [14:16] Winged Kobold looking critter.
      4. [14:25] Corrupted bird looking people.
      5. [15:03] Palanquin riding dude.
      6. [15:14] Fat, obese, corpulent one.
      7. [15:37] Smoky demon boss.
      8. [15:47] Spiky crystal boss.
      9. [16:01] One eyed cyclops crystal boss.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_8HoPU6HGw
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