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SOLO vs MassiveMultiplayer

When you enter a world of MMORPG there's this inner statement that at some point you have to interact with other human beings through your avatar in some way, to clear a dungeon,maybe a quest specifically ask to party with others, there's this rare spawn that's simply to much for one man to handle, but I think the SOLO experience has so much to offer , like the crafting, the exploration, the jobs, etc etc. What do you prefer? Should the team at Intrepid should focus more in one of the two? Should this be treated like the guild system where you can access certain quirks when you're fewer o something like that?
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Comments

  • DamoklesDamokles Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Im gonna go and search for a steady provider of ore and maybe a good merchant to sell my gems to :D
    After I reach max level i am most likely searching for a guild or try to make my own with people that i met while dungeon diving (thats how i did it in WoW after all and that worked pretty well!) ^^
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  • VarkunVarkun Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Honestly one of the main reasons I play MMO's is the people I get to play with, my guildmates and all the others who will make up the community of the server I land on. To me, its part of what makes MMO's so much fun and honestly there needs to be a reason for people to work together, have common goals, common enemies a sense of community.

    So yes I think there should be more of a focus on group content but that is not to say that solo content is not important too. There need to be goals that you can achieve on your own things to strive for and accomplish. No MMO should swing too far one way or the other IMO though I can not help but feel MMO's of recent times have been somewhat solo focused.
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    Close your eyes spread your arms and always trust your cape.
  • DevorandomDevorandom Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    What is the point of an MMO if not to be put in a world where you must interact with others to achieve things? This doesn't mean everything must be done by a group, but most of the important stuff should.

    All the stuff you listed for the solo experience is done better in crafting/survival games if those are the only things you are looking for.

    Intrepid should focus on what makes MMOs different from other genres or what is the point of making an MMO in the first place?
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  • For me it's a bit of both. With MMOs the other players can be one of the best things in the game. You can meet some really good people who , sometimes, can end up being friends for years. Other players can also be one of the worst things in the game and leave you in a foaming-at-the-mouth rage. It's kind of like real life that way. :p
  • TeylouneTeyloune Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    If people want to play Solo then MMORPGs are the wrong type of game for them.
  • cotukcotuk Member
    There is a good video from Extra Credits on this topic on YT. (Don't remember the title, sorry).
    I personally, think that since we as people have different social experiences/ skills, game of this genre should give us tools that would suit everyone.
    I will give an example from new mmorpg that I playen half a year ago. Maple Story 2.
    I enjoy doing solo stuff in mmorpg and do stuff with others when It doesn't hurt my own enjoyment of the game (egoistic approach). In MS 2, when I wanted to get specific piece of gear from one dungeon, my guild mates were going to another dungeone that I didn't need to do at all, and I would either get nothing or something uselles from their dungeon, which would be an actual PUNISHMENT for me to join my guildmates. On the other hand, people that were super pro-social, joined any dungeon party in our guild- their gear was absolute trash, which was negatively affecting guild as a whole, cuz guild masters wanted to do end game raids, again PUNISHMENT.
    Only people that were dong fine- people who played in the same stack all the time.
    What I wanted to show by giving this example is game design that kills social interactions at endgame, if you play alone and you are not super social.
    This problem can be avoided in ashes tho, and I think Steven taken good direction with dungeon drops, and resources as a whole. If you go to any dungeon, you will get something that you at least can sell. And if you can't get to specific dungeon, your clanmates can get resources for you.
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  • AzathothAzathoth Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    I look forward to long slow Solo play days. I also look forward to fast paced group play days. Although my time will probably 60/40 with a majority in Solo play.
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    +1 Skull & Crown metal coin
  • beyabeya Member
    teyloune wrote: »
    If people want to play Solo then MMORPGs are the wrong type of game for them.

    I disagree, sometimes I am just having a rough day and want to play solo. Do my own thing for a while. Get the stank off meh! Sometimes I just don't want to deal with the humans.
  • AzryilAzryil Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    teyloune wrote: »
    If people want to play Solo then MMORPGs are the wrong type of game for them.

    I don't agree with this. I think MMOs should have a variety of content, Some content should require groups of varying sizes but other content should be accessible to someone playing alone. I see content in MMOs broadly categorized into three types: Solo content, Content that can be completed solo but is simplified in a small group, and Group content that a solo player has no chance of completing.
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  • DamoklesDamokles Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Beya wrote: »
    teyloune wrote: »
    If people want to play Solo then MMORPGs are the wrong type of game for them.

    I disagree, sometimes I am just having a rough day and want to play solo. Do my own thing for a while. Get the stank off meh! Sometimes I just don't want to deal with the humans.

    Exactly! As an introvert working in a highschool as a teacher, i sometimes just need some me time. Slay some adds, craft some trinkets, etc. I know a ton of people who just want to turn of their brain and do something simple for a time. xD
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  • cyanideinsanitycyanideinsanity Member, Warrior of Old, Kickstarter
    edited April 2019
    teyloune wrote: »
    If people want to play Solo then MMORPGs are the wrong type of game for them.

    I'd argue story related content is better suited for solo play than with a party. I wasn't much of a dungeon diver in gw2 but every time I was doing the first, story mode, run, someone was always complaining to just skip it or watch it on youtube. Its also not fun to want to experience the story and dungeon together and have the entire party progress through multiple objectives while watching a cutscene(end of ffxiv arr).
  • The game should have solo activities, sometimes we just want to do stuff on our own. The game shouldn't reward you for playing solo like someone playing with groups.
    What I mean is, the game should have barricades that can only be passed if playing with players. Want exotic materials? Maybe you need a group.
    If anything is achievable through solo gameplay, why join with others many will say.
  • VarkunVarkun Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Beya wrote: »
    teyloune wrote: »
    If people want to play Solo then MMORPGs are the wrong type of game for them.

    I disagree, sometimes I am just having a rough day and want to play solo. Do my own thing for a while. Get the stank off meh! Sometimes I just don't want to deal with the humans.

    There needs to be solo content, there are times I want nothing more than to head off and do things by myself for a while. My problem is that many MMO's of recent times have swung too far towards solo play and it is IMO to the detriment of the community. The most fun I have had playing MMO's has been with a group of guildmates taking down a raid boss or fighting and winning outnumbered in a PVP.

    There needs to be a balance to cater for both group and solo, the more people play AOC the better.
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    Close your eyes spread your arms and always trust your cape.
  • NagashNagash Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    I think the best MMOs these days have to have a mix of both otherwise you will lose interest
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    The dead do not squabble as this land’s rulers do. The dead have no desires, petty jealousies or ambitions. A world of the dead is a world at peace
  • sivannasivanna Member, Pioneer, Kickstarter
    There has to be both. I always solo as dps. It’s easier to gather and defend myself. But my FAVORITE thing to do is heal in any scenario. (Structured pvp, open world pvp, world bosses, raids, you name it!) Sometimes though I want to do something with less commitment. I want to be able to afk or quit whenever I feel I’ve done enough.

    I think the big question is how to balance rewards for group vs solo to make them both desirable.
  • I liked the speculation I heard about maybe requiring an artisan crafter/gatherer to extract rare materials at the end of a raid or dungeon. This gets the introvert to play with a group and the raiders a need to include not so BiS fighting types in order to reap the benefits of the win. There's something kind of endearing about a team having to protect the hapless scholar PC (not NPC) through the dungeon who is the only one that can read the scroll found at the end.
  • DamoklesDamokles Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    BeerBuddy wrote: »
    I liked the speculation I heard about maybe requiring an artisan crafter/gatherer to extract rare materials at the end of a raid or dungeon. This gets the introvert to play with a group and the raiders a need to include not so BiS fighting types in order to reap the benefits of the win. There's something kind of endearing about a team having to protect the hapless scholar PC (not NPC) through the dungeon who is the only one that can read the scroll found at the end.

    "If you want to be able to get those mats from the boss, they're just not going to drop for anybody. They will only drop for a master gatherer who is capable of extracting those resources from the creature itself... The reason why we say there's a lot of interdependencies between the crafters of the world and the raiders of the world and our PvPers of the world is because we don't want to house the capability to attain these things all within the adventuring class. We want there to be an influence necessary from the craftsmen's guild to come in to either come and participate and spoil the boss and gather the goods or something along those lines. – Steven Sharif"
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  • VolgaireVolgaire Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Neither type of content should be forced and both should be encouraged, some solo quests where you might get trapped somewhere would be one kind of solo content that groups might ruin but things like hunting down an entire nest of monsters would make more sense to be doe in a group. Most mmo's push for group content and simply allow solo content to exist which is still restricted in the end.
  • valerianvalerian Member
    edited April 2019
    I'm more traditional, meaning questing should be done solo or having an option to group up. But solo questing should be in itself challenging and if you group up it should level scale so that the quest doesn't feel too easy. So, for me group content should be left for raids only. But I have a feeling that AOC is going to cater both for solo and for people who like grouping up since there will be activities that will cater both.
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  • I play MMOs for the social interactions and PvP. For this reason I avoid the MMOs that are mainly solo content with the option to group considering no one ever groups or they do a dungeon without ever talking.
  • AmistAmist Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    I like the opportunity to do both. I still want to be able to play the game without being in a group of people, but it makes sense to have bigger accomplishments ingame needing larger groups.

    The community is exactly what makes MMORPG's worth it for me, as I have gotten quite tired of the toxic mentality in games like MOBA's and FPS's
  • The quality of players in MMOs has declined rapidly since WoW came out. Arrogant, loot whores, etc. It's enough to make me NOT want to interact with them.
  • ShadowVenShadowVen Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    edited April 2019
    I prefer to play with others within the MMO experience. I enjoy the teamwork feeling to bring down just regular mobs to Elite Raid Bosses, as well as using party strategies using each others classes to maximize dps, cc, and healing. I believe when it comes to crafting or gathering artisans, that would be a good time to solo, since you can really enjoy the environment and do some exploration while gathering resources. Fishing will be a great relaxing tool and solo'ing experience as well, though I also prefer to fish with friends.
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  • Naturally, there must be a large amount of content that doesn't require another person to complete. If every activity demanded group participation, the game would be irreparably toxic and tiresome. Imagine needing a group to effectively mine or gather. Or perhaps basic kill quests would mandate that you act in a party for some gods-forsaken reason. No. Gods, no.

    It's pretty standard for most basic content of that order to be solo-able, and rightly so. That said, I welcome the addition of more player-interaction in regards to professions and crafting. The idea of a distinction between crafters and gatherers is something that few games actually enforce. More often that not, if you want to craft something, it's standard practice in MMO's to level the relevant crafting and gathering skills and just do everything yourself start to finish.

    I'll be very interested to see if Intrepid manages to make both roles feel distinct and present in the world as opposed to this conglomeration labeled "Crafting". It is my opinion that in such an instance as this, player-to-player interactions would give the game an added level of realism lacking in most other MMO's.

    Combat is another area where the level of solo-able content is often a point of dispute. It is my belief that as the combat of the world increases in both difficulty and reward, the amount of solo-able content (for characters of equal "level" to the enemies) should decrease, to an extent. Granted there should always be places for high strength/level characters to fight enemies solo, but the amount should be greatly reduced in proportion compared to lower strength/levels. I suppose there's no "right" answer for this, but that is what would make the most sense to me.

    :)
  • VarkunVarkun Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    The quality of players in MMOs has declined rapidly since WoW came out. Arrogant, loot whores, etc. It's enough to make me NOT want to interact with them.

    Yes, I have come across all types while playing MMO's but honestly if you cut yourself off from content in MMO's because of such players you really are only playing half a game. It is not easy to find people to play with but making an effort to find a guild that shares some of your ideals and is welcoming is not impossible. It does require some effort on your behalf to become part of a guild getting to know people taking the time to interact and find if that group of people is the right fit for you.

    I have come across all manner of toxic people in my many years of MMO gaming so much so that I will seldom group with people outside of my own guild anymore. There are good people out there you just need to spend the time and find them.
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    Close your eyes spread your arms and always trust your cape.
  • tarrostarros Member
    edited April 2019
    No one should ever have to be part of a guild in order to be part of the content.

    I love MMOs for what they are being able to play with other people.That is what an MMO is.

    I love RPGs because I can do anything I want to do and live in a fantasy world that I am able to create on my own with the given tools that the developers have created.

    However if an MMORPG forces me to have to play with a greater community in order to be part of the world content than that freedom that an RPG gives you is lost. That was what Ultima, Everquest, and of course Vanilla WoW was to me. I played by myself and interacted with people when I needed to. I could do 90% of the content on my own granted with extreme difficulty but it was possible. Maybe once in a while I would get one other person to play with me to help out but I strictly played alone because if the current world we lived in was a fantasy world with orcs, dwarfs, dire wolves, dragons, etc. I would imagine I would live as a solo warrior adventurer. (I love Goblin slayer because of how he lives his life in that fantasy world is how I would be also)

    I am not against content that requires a large group of players such as siege battles and high lvl mob raids. I would be more than happy to lend a hand if a group needed it. But guilds these days have closed themselves off to the surrounding world players. They only focus within their own guild.

    I think i will stop my rambling there because I will end up writing a book.
  • DygzDygz Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Ashes is designed with both solo content and multiplayer content.

    Solo really just means adventuring outside of a formal party/raid.
    I can’t defeat a monster coin attack on my own, but I also don’t have to formally join a party or raid to defend a Node from such an attack alongside my fellow citizens or allies.
    Same for adventuring in open world dungeons.

    We will have to formally join a guild to participate in Castle sieges. And we have to register for attack or defense for caravans and, I think, Node sieges. We will also join social organizations and join Nodes as citizens.
    But that won’t force us to join a party or raid, so, soloers will still experience that as soloing.
  • MorashtakMorashtak Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    edited May 2019
    A nice variety would be ideal;
    • Solo;
      • Gathering (in some cases)
      • Processing (can't see a good reason for this step to need more than one person)
      • Crafting
      • Questing at your characters level.
    • Duo to small group;
      • Gathering in contested areas
      • Questing above your level
      • Exploring in areas above your level
    • Party size
    • Raid size
    • Siege size
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  • AmistAmist Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    tarros wrote: »
    No one should ever have to be part of a guild in order to be part of the content.

    I love MMOs for what they are being able to play with other people.That is what an MMO is.

    I love RPGs because I can do anything I want to do and live in a fantasy world that I am able to create on my own with the given tools that the developers have created.

    However if an MMORPG forces me to have to play with a greater community in order to be part of the world content than that freedom that an RPG gives you is lost. That was what Ultima, Everquest, and of course Vanilla WoW was to me. I played by myself and interacted with people when I needed to. I could do 90% of the content on my own granted with extreme difficulty but it was possible. Maybe once in a while I would get one other person to play with me to help out but I strictly played alone because if the current world we lived in was a fantasy world with orcs, dwarfs, dire wolves, dragons, etc. I would imagine I would live as a solo warrior adventurer. (I love Goblin slayer because of how he lives his life in that fantasy world is how I would be also)

    I am not against content that requires a large group of players such as siege battles and high lvl mob raids. I would be more than happy to lend a hand if a group needed it. But guilds these days have closed themselves off to the surrounding world players. They only focus within their own guild.

    I think i will stop my rambling there because I will end up writing a book.

    I personally don't see an issue with games nudging you to do content as a larger group. Coordination amongst individuals makes sense to accomplish great things. It makes sense needing a large group to take down a world boss, cause part of the accomplishment is how you worked together as a team.

    I don't think you should be unable to do anything as a solo, but it should limit you as MMO's (Massively MULTIPLAYER Online's" are generally meant for playing alongside other people.If you take out the multiplayer aspect it becomes just another single player game.
  • BloodlessBloodless Member, Braver of Worlds, Alpha One
    Obviously, MMORPGs should be focused around the group dynamic. Yes, it's okay to wander off in the world and do things by yourself, but having someone with you should always be more beneficial.
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