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Why do people compare this game with WoW??

Why do people compare this game with WoW?

A lot of people are comparing this game with world of warcraft, in all honesty, it kind of makes me wonder if either me or these people really understand what this game will be. As from my perspective, it has little in common with WoW.

I do not understand why people are asking for Pve and PvP that is in WoW, both to me seem lackluster on many levels.
Crafting in WoW is shallow and honestly is boring as F. Addons like in WoW, etc.

Is it because a lot of people have never played any other MMO seriously or for a long time that they are unaware of what's out there? It's been something I have tried to figure out for a while hihi :smiley:

To me Ashes seems nothing like WoW as it is bringing back: Risk vs reward, teamwork and communication, expanded features that impact you or/and the world/server, Pve that is not just another DPS race, PvP that brings the world to live and is impactful and all of this is connected to the community you are forming around yourself. All things that WoW just isn't or isn't anymore in some aspects.

So again why do people compare this with WoW all the time?

I've played next to WoW, MMO's for almost 20 years and some long term for many years such as L2, Lotro, Archeage, Gw2, BDO, FF14, etc and Ashes to me seems to build on everything that was done well in these kinds of games and I cannot figure out what WoW and Ashes have in common to me = nada, zero, nul xD
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Comments

  • JamationJamation Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Two main reasons I think.
    One is that WoW is a popular MMO that's been around for a long time and every new MMO gets compared to it in one way or another.
    And two, some very large and popular WoW streamers have recently taken a big interest in this game, meaning their fanbase would also take an interest, and thus post about their own experiences with their favorite game.
  • XraelXrael Member
    edited July 2020
    The end game PvE content in WoW is extremely good, even if everything else sucks. I'm specifically talking about raids and dungeons. The raid and dungeon design team in WoW is really good.

    The majority of players are PvE oriented. If this game doesn't have sufficient, end game PvE content, then you wont have a large enough player base. And without a large enough playerbase, PvPers wont enjoy the game either. So you need PvE for a PvP game to succeed.
  • tugowartugowar Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    I agree with the OP’s premise: this game has very, very little resemblance to WoW.

    People who expect that it’s going to have features that are in retail or classic are going to be disappointed. No AH for example.

    Virtue is the only good.
  • XraelXrael Member
    edited July 2020
    Jamation wrote: »
    Two main reasons I think.
    One is that WoW is a popular MMO that's been around for a long time and every new MMO gets compared to it in one way or another.
    And two, some very large and popular WoW streamers have recently taken a big interest in this game, meaning their fanbase would also take an interest, and thus post about their own experiences with their favorite game.

    If you need a significant portion of their playerbases to leave WoW for Ashes, you need to have PvE content that can contest the end game PvE content in WoW, which is not easy to do.
  • VolgaireVolgaire Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Well since it is the same genre and wow is the most popular mmo in the world for a long time now it's not surprising that some people will compare them.
  • mcstackersonmcstackerson Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    A big factor is probably Asmongold's recent coverage of the game. Being someone who mainly plays wow on stream(i think), he brought a lot of wow players to the community, and as you said, I'd bet a portion of these players haven't spent a lot of time in MMOs other than wow or other western-style MMOs.
  • NagashNagash Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    people are fools
    nJ0vUSm.gif

    The dead do not squabble as this land’s rulers do. The dead have no desires, petty jealousies or ambitions. A world of the dead is a world at peace
  • LeiloniLeiloni Member
    edited July 2020
    The end game PvE content in WoW is extremely good, even if everything else sucks. I'm specifically talking about raids and dungeons. The raid and dungeon design team in WoW is really good.

    The majority of players are PvE oriented. If this game doesn't have sufficient, end game PvE content, then you wont have a large enough player base. And without a large enough playerbase, PvPers wont enjoy the game either. So you need PvE for a PvP game to succeed.

    There is a ton of PvE content, it's just mostly open world. The node system will add a ton of content by itself that should be really interesting, and we'll also have open world dungeons, world bosses, and story content. There's a lot of potential for interesting PvE. It just won't be focused on instanced endgame raid progression but tons of MMO's have shown us recently that you can still attract an engaged PvE playerbase without that (GW2, ESO, SWTOR, BDO, etc. all have a lot of non-raid PvE content and busy, active PvE communities). In fact even WoW's PVE playerbase isn't primarily raiders. Most are some sort of casual. The hardcore raiders are simply the ones that get Twitch views and such, but they don't represent the average player and game developers know this.
  • JamationJamation Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    If you need a significant portion of their playerbases to leave WoW for Ashes, you need to have PvE content that can contest the end game PvE content in WoW, which is not easy to do.

    I'm not sure if you meant to reply to my message? Whether the player-base leaves or not isn't really what I was talking about, or what was being asked. I was giving suggestions as to why people would compare the games, not how they compare them.
  • halbarzhalbarz Member
    edited July 2020
    The end game PvE content in WoW is extremely good, even if everything else sucks. I'm specifically talking about raids and dungeons. The raid and dungeon design team in WoW is really good.

    The majority of players are PvE oriented. If this game doesn't have sufficient, end game PvE content, then you wont have a large enough player base. And without a large enough playerbase, PvPers wont enjoy the game either. So you need PvE for a PvP game to succeed.

    I personally do not see it, I played WoW until Pandatown (didn't enjoy the expansion). so maybe a lot has changed but PVE. While there was plenty of content in the overall game I just found it lackluster when it came to:
    - risk vs reward, teamwork, communication, and real complexity. Everything was so streamlined that a lot of players no matter good or bad (skill-wise) could almost do everything. WoW for me took away the sense of achievement. I miss the days of playing Lotro for example were taking down the balrog took months for some guilds to complete and the only addon we had was putting our heads together to figure out the fights.

    I do agree that the Pve and Pvp players need each other! as together they form a community

    Of course each to their own :smiley:
  • XraelXrael Member
    edited July 2020
    halbarz wrote: »
    The end game PvE content in WoW is extremely good, even if everything else sucks. I'm specifically talking about raids and dungeons. The raid and dungeon design team in WoW is really good.

    The majority of players are PvE oriented. If this game doesn't have sufficient, end game PvE content, then you wont have a large enough player base. And without a large enough playerbase, PvPers wont enjoy the game either. So you need PvE for a PvP game to succeed.

    I personally do not see it, I played WoW until Pandatown (didn't enjoy the expansion). so maybe a lot has changed but PVE. While there was plenty of content in the overall game I just found it lackluster when it came to:
    - risk vs reward, teamwork, communication, and real complexity. Everything was so streamlined that a lot of players no matter good or bad (skill-wise) could almost do everything. WoW for me took away the sense of achievement. I miss the days of playing Lotro for example were taking down the balrog took months for some guilds to complete and the only addon we had was putting our heads together to figure out the fights.

    I do agree that the Pve and Pvp players need each other! as together they form a community

    Of course each to their own :smiley:

    By PvE, im referring to raids and dungeons. Even though i barely played WoW for 4 months or so, i enjoyed their dungeon and raid content.
  • Because, you know, wow is the most renown MMORPG in the world. As such, wow will by default will come up as a comparison every time when people talk about MMORPG.

    For many people it is also the only MMO they have ever played.

    I also don't think it is bad or detrimental to compare them. Yeah, they are different. But wow does a lot of things well, and even more things it did well in the past. It also can serve as an example of many mistakes, which also benefits the discussion.
  • tugowar wrote: »
    I agree with the OP’s premise: this game has very, very little resemblance to WoW.

    People who expect that it’s going to have features that are in retail or classic are going to be disappointed. No AH for example.

    The only resemblence to WoW is that it's an MMORPG. Although you could argue that WoW is slowly moving away from the RPG part.
  • grisugrisu Member
    Why do people compare anything?
    I can be a life fulfilling dream. - Zekece
    I can be a life devouring nightmare. - Grisu#1819
  • AardvarkAardvark Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    halbarz wrote: »
    Why do people compare this game with WoW?

    A lot of people are comparing this game with world of warcraft, in all honesty, it kind of makes me wonder if either me or these people really understand what this game will be. As from my perspective, it has little in common with WoW.

    I do not understand why people are asking for Pve and PvP that is in WoW, both to me seem lackluster on many levels.
    Crafting in WoW is shallow and honestly is boring as F. Addons like in WoW, etc.

    Is it because a lot of people have never played any other MMO seriously or for a long time that they are unaware of what's out there? It's been something I have tried to figure out for a while hihi :smiley:

    To me Ashes seems nothing like WoW as it is bringing back: Risk vs reward, teamwork and communication, expanded features that impact you or/and the world/server, Pve that is not just another DPS race, PvP that brings the world to live and is impactful and all of this is connected to the community you are forming around yourself. All things that WoW just isn't or isn't anymore in some aspects.

    So again why do people compare this with WoW all the time?

    I've played next to WoW, MMO's for almost 20 years and some long term for many years such as L2, Lotro, Archeage, Gw2, BDO, FF14, etc and Ashes to me seems to build on everything that was done well in these kinds of games and I cannot figure out what WoW and Ashes have in common to me = nada, zero, nul xD

    Wow has nothing in common you say? Lets compare to old wow since that's the one I am most famliure with...
    PVP arenas? check
    Open world PVP? check if their pvp server
    allows pvp griefing ? Check if their pvp server
    has 40 man raids? Check
    has dungeons? check
    classes and monsters loosly based on DnD? Check
    has guilds? check
    has crafting? check
    has mounts? check
    has large world to adenture and level in? check

    Yes there are differences like the corruption system, how many factions, and if pve is a focus with progression or not but most parts are actually very easy to compare.
  • halbarzhalbarz Member
    edited July 2020
    Aardvark wrote: »
    halbarz wrote: »
    Why do people compare this game with WoW?

    A lot of people are comparing this game with world of warcraft, in all honesty, it kind of makes me wonder if either me or these people really understand what this game will be. As from my perspective, it has little in common with WoW.

    I do not understand why people are asking for Pve and PvP that is in WoW, both to me seem lackluster on many levels.
    Crafting in WoW is shallow and honestly is boring as F. Addons like in WoW, etc.

    Is it because a lot of people have never played any other MMO seriously or for a long time that they are unaware of what's out there? It's been something I have tried to figure out for a while hihi :smiley:

    To me Ashes seems nothing like WoW as it is bringing back: Risk vs reward, teamwork and communication, expanded features that impact you or/and the world/server, Pve that is not just another DPS race, PvP that brings the world to live and is impactful and all of this is connected to the community you are forming around yourself. All things that WoW just isn't or isn't anymore in some aspects.

    So again why do people compare this with WoW all the time?

    I've played next to WoW, MMO's for almost 20 years and some long term for many years such as L2, Lotro, Archeage, Gw2, BDO, FF14, etc and Ashes to me seems to build on everything that was done well in these kinds of games and I cannot figure out what WoW and Ashes have in common to me = nada, zero, nul xD

    Wow has nothing in common you say? Lets compare to old wow since that's the one I am most famliure with...
    PVP arenas? check
    Open world PVP? check if their pvp server
    allows pvp griefing ? Check if their pvp server
    has 40 man raids? Check
    has dungeons? check
    classes and monsters loosly based on DnD? Check
    has guilds? check
    has crafting? check
    has mounts? check
    has large world to adenture and level in? check

    Yes there are differences like the corruption system, how many factions, and if pve is a focus with progression or not but most parts are actually very easy to compare.

    not sure if you read my whole post because I get the impression you just read the title. (no offense)

    Yes, WoW has those features, but they are in many ways extremely lackluster. WoW's age is of course a factor, but also their design choices to keep things dumbed down.

    The idea behind both games is very different. To the point that a lot of people might like the features in Ashes when hearing about them but when confronted might be overwhelmed because they have never experienced a lot of them.

    So yes WoW might be the biggest MMO on the market but we should also look at why, and let's be honest the easy to enter/accessibility to the game is a factor here + it is a decent MMO so do not take me wrong.

    Risk vs. reward, simple concept but it impacts so many things in the game. This is partially also linked to trail and error. Pve in a lot of MMO's including WoW is for a lot of people downloading an addon and off they go (not talking about the harder content like mythic+ and etc. (but even then) xD Ashes is putting the player back in control of the fight, the communication and teamwork. These might not be features to put on a box but they are the things that make these games so different from each other.



  • tugowartugowar Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    grisu wrote: »
    Why do people compare anything?

    Most people lack the ability to imagine a complete unknown. They have to relate it to a construct that they do understand. It’s very interesting to study that concept in relation to marketing & communication.

    Virtue is the only good.
  • KohlKohl Member
    I was into WoW religiously during WotKL. I stopped playing after, and went to FF14.
    Now, I'm comparing this game to FF14. Why?
    Because it looks like a potential newer game that I'll want to spend my time in, instead of the current one. I might end up liking it, and move completely, or just return to FF14.
    Isn't it as simple as that?
  • If you need a significant portion of their playerbases to leave WoW[...]

    Activision Blizzard already managed to accomplish that with BFA without needing the help of any other game...

  • AtamaAtama Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    edited July 2020
    Nagash wrote: »
    people are fools

    “Wizard First Rule: people are stupid.”
    - Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander, Wizard’s First Rule

    “A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it.“
    - Agent Kay, Men in Black
     
    Hhak63P.png
  • BunjaBunja Member
    edited July 2020
    Because they are in the same genre as a Fantasy MMORPG? Seriously, if they were comparing this to Warframe which is a Scifi Grindfest would make sense to compare it.

    What do WoW and AoE have in common?
    Trinity System
    Fantasy races with racial stats
    Fantasy classes
    Raids
    Instances
    Quests
    Dungeons
    Battlegrounds
    PVP
    PVE
    etc.

    I'd have to say this is dumb, of course, you can compare them. This is the worst take of "they are not the same".
  • PeggysuegotParriedPeggysuegotParried Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    I don't think it has as much to do with WoW the game, as it does people for years have been waiting for a game to take the crown away from WoW. AoC is ripe with promise and lot's of people are very excited to see a MMO Super Fan finally come out and be able to do what we all have wanted to do for years!.
    They do have some similiarities but I believe the Node, No Faction, and the PvP and advanced Crafting will seperate these 2 games.

    WoW had a great run, but sooner or later a new dog takes the lead, personally I'm hopeful this is it.
  • KhronusKhronus Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    "So again why do people compare this with WoW all the time?"

    Every new MMO should be compared to the most successful mmo of all time. I wouldn't have this any other way. For AoC to be successful, there needs to be some sort of similarities between the two as WoW has proven that their model works. Now, don't get me wrong, I cannot STAND WoW anymore. AoC so far looks to take a lot of classic wow social and community aspects. There are similarities but AoC is 100% standing out.
  • Bunja wrote: »
    Because they are in the same genre as a Fantasy MMORPG? Seriously, if they were comparing this to Warframe which is a Scifi Grindfest would make sense to compare it.

    What do WoW and AoE have in common?
    Trinity System
    Fantasy races with racial stats
    Fantasy classes
    Raids
    Instances
    Quests
    Dungeons
    Battlegrounds
    PVP
    PVE
    etc.

    I'd have to say this is dumb, of course, you can compare them. This is the worst take of "they are not the same".

    Can I ask? Did you just read the title or the whole post?

    I clearly mention that that WoW's features are extremely lackluster and shallow, and that because of this there is little comparisons. WoW has little in common due to it being a straight line, while Ashes gives you so many options when it comes to character development.
  • KohlKohl Member
    halbarz wrote: »
    I clearly mention that that WoW's features are extremely lackluster and shallow, and that because of this there is little comparisons. WoW has little in common due to it being a straight line, while Ashes gives you so many options when it comes to character development.

    That doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if the features are shallow or lackluster. They're still similar features.
    Also, there is no reason to be so aggressive.

    Ashes is also going to be linear. It has some other side gigs you'd have fun doing, but in its core it's just like any other mmorpg. I don't consider having mayors some huge content. And we'll still need to see how the whole thing will play out with castle sieges and whatnot once the servers goes persistent.

    Ashes seems to focus on having more things to do, and more freedom doing them. Whether they'll turn out to be actually useful or people will find a way around them remains to be seen. But I digress.

    Saying that it has little in common is silly.



  • People compare this game to WoW because sadly it's all they've played. WoW and WoW clones. I wish more people would try classic EQ, its the best MMO out there. The graphics are retro, but the gameplay is like no other game.
  • SepiDNSepiDN Member
    I was thinking the same seeing shouts out for more gank owpvp, addons etc.
    Surely people are allowed to make suggestion but juat dont try to mold this to another Wow. Will never happen as the idielogy behind the game is totally different.
  • Even if two games have the exactly same systems, it is the design philosophy behind them that dictates how the world will operate/feel. I agree with tugowar: people just lack the ability to imagine the unknown, so they refer to other games in the genre (or even out of the genre). The bad part is that some people try to mold the systems to mimic the same feelings from another MMO instead of letting the design unfolds and see if it works for them.
    "Magic is not a tool, little one. It is a river that unites us in its current."

    I heard a bird ♫
  • ExtermicideExtermicide Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    To be completely honest, I think unlike other MMO's that have come & gone - and have tried to be that next big 'WOW Killer', i personally feel that Ashes Of Creation will be bringing a lot more to the table. Even those of us who consider ourselves to be "seasoned MMORPG'ers" are gonna fins that with 'Ashes Of Creation' there is gonna be much more of a learning curve involved.

    'Ashes of Creation' is not gonna be that simple 'cookie cutter' mmorpg. There's a lot more going on with this game, and no shortage of things to learn and to accomplish. I think some people will be overwhelmed when they actually realize how much there is to accomplish in this game.

    I created a video about games that have tried to be that next 'WOW Killer', and how that relates to
    'Steven Sharif' and 'Ashes Of Creation'. I would be honored if you guys took a look at it.
    https://youtu.be/7Qb6ZeTcVz0
    ZJ0OYf9.png
    WATCH & SUBSCRIBE TO ME ON: Twitch --- YouTube --- PLAY: Ashes Of Creation
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