Water mounts negative thoughts

George_Black

I found that island locations in many mmos, isolated by the treacherous sea and its dangers, are some of the most interesting places that players want to explore.

Crafting a boat (the only means to reach an island alive) and sailing it with friends is so cool. Even solo, the idea of the unknown was such a drive to spend time in crafting a boat and go to that island.

I find that water mounts belittle that aspect of the game.

George_Black

When I heared about the great underwater features that AoC would have I was so happy.

Images of boats anchoring, friends diving, finding chests of treasure, caves, or plainly monsters to fight.

And now all I see is knights in armor riding mounts zoom zoom underwater.
Forget amout swimming and diving. Just zoom zoom with the mount (same as on land).

George_Black

I also find that mmos in general have ruined the sense of wildlife and the respect we should have for the dangers of the jungle, as well as sea and the creatures lurking.

When you give players all those creatures that they can joyride on, how can I respect them as challenging PvE?

When I ride a bear, how is it not immersion breaking that I have to hunt them for mats, or xp?

Kneczhevo

Submarining Pirate Raiders. I told you so. 😋

The ships better be awesome.

George_Black

Dear developers, please dont deminish the challenges of rediscovering a lost world (Verra) just so that animal husbundry and cosmetic mounts function.

A lot of players will find underwater dissapointing if you can ride around so effortlessly.
A lot of players will lose excitment on sailing and daring islands, upon seeing how ez it is to reach them.

Riding a bear and a lion on land, as well as riding a sea mount underwater goes against the "risk vs reward" mentality, which in it's core is essentially ADVENTURE, CHALLENGE, DANGER.

It's your world that you create. Show it more respect and dont give in to cosmetic collectors.

Tyrantor

Since you can just swim everywhere in AoC per the stream (no stamina loss) I don't see the difference outside of being able to swim faster.

FuryBladeborne

Sounds like we may need a vote on whether swimming should have stamina loss...

Valic

I'm of the mind that water mounts should only be limited underwater travel (oxygen is still a thing for us, maybe not the mount), and single player water surface travel slowly. In such a manner that is similar to the rowboats found in Archeage.

This can be something that can be gated by powerful enemies only found at sea and difficulty of combat in the water with them. This would be where bigger boats or group filled boats would come in handy, to traverse the waters somewhat faster, with people, avoiding enemies or able to attack them as a group, and with boat functionalities like cannons, spears, etc to aid in this. I'd like to see things akin to what Archeage had, with mechanics about where to fish being based on mobs appearing, a giant boss somewhere "out there", maybe even things like phantom ships that occur only at night as a big ghost pirate ship that's known to invade people's ships. Also intense weather and the like that prevents you from being able to swim out too far on just your lil turtle. The sea is vast and should be treated as such as extreme with unknown treasures, horrors, creatures, and so on to be found. This should encourage things like pirate pvp, trade across oceans with people needing to hire mercenaries for their boat to guide them... Etc.

I always liked the concept of needing a good boat to travel across the sea and the idea that it's big because it can hold PEOPLE on it to help with all the different functions of the ship. Assigning someone a captain to steer it, someone on cannons, crow's nest for navigation up ahead and seeing key points like enemies and etc. I would love to see more of that cooperation on someone steering the boat and someone keeping their eyes on what's out at sea, seeing the chatbox will with "hey we got jellyfish up ahead, go east." and etc community inspiring concepts.

Irohnic

I think there should be underwater dungeons so that you can have the best of both worlds, underwater adventure as well as water mounts that don't trivialize said adventure anymore than land mounts do for land dungeons. If underwater combat is fluid these dungeons could be fully submerged, requiring that you come with a stack of some sort of consumable to breath underwater, or if underwater combat sucks they can just make them like underwater caves that have air pockets and "dry areas". I wouldn't be surprised if Intrepid already has that type of content planned, they just haven't been super specific on the sea content yet.

I would also be down for placing lots of deadly creatures in between shore and the cool remote islands that OP mentioned. That way it's possible to get there witih your water mount, but quite difficult, or you can craft up a ship with your pals and have an easier time.

As for the comments against having lots of exotic mounts in general, I love having tons of mount types and I'm not a cosmetics type of person at all. Being able to ride all the different dinos (especially the water ones), was one of my favorite parts of ARK and the only reason I enjoyed the game since it really lacks the personal RPG type progression that we all love in MMO's.To me it doesn't break immersion to be fighting the same creatures you ride around on, but I could see how for some people it might. I just see it as normal given that even in our boring world called Earth there are still people who cuddle with their bear and lion pets despite most of such creatures being far from tame.

George_Black

@Irohnic
Funny mentioning at the end of your post, since last night I happened to be on that side of the internet, watching videos where people got mauled by "pet" bears and big cats.

stolyaR

George Black wrote: »

I found that island locations in many mmos, isolated by the treacherous sea and its dangers, are some of the most interesting places that players want to explore.

Crafting a boat (the only means to reach an island alive) and sailing it with friends is so cool. Even solo, the idea of the unknown was such a drive to spend time in crafting a boat and go to that island.

I find that water mounts belittle that aspect of the game.

What you can do with water mount:
* Go from X to Z (unsafely).
* Maybe finding chests of treasure (have much slots we will have in character's inventory?)

What you can do with boat:
* Go from X to Z safely (as you can't defend yourself on water mount from monsters or enemies) and maybe faster.
* Also transport resources (as this is the only way to make money as money don't drop from monsters in AoC as far as I know the only way to make cash is by trading goods in different regions).

* Finding chests of treasure ( additional slots of boat's inventory )

* Fishing (can you fish from water mount ?)

* Defend your self while anchoring, diving, finding chests of treasure.

* Fight Sea raid bosses:

* Sea PVP (defend your areas/nodes/harbors)

And I'm sure that there are more features for sea content that we don't know about.
In BDO for example you can just buy a boat and go to any island BUT!
Every one is trying to craft a big ship. WHY?
Because of the ability to fight sea bosses, more weight limit and slots and this provide the ability to make gooooood money for traders.

So I don't think you need to worry my friend.

George_Black

stolyaR wrote: »

George Black wrote: »

I found that island locations in many mmos, isolated by the treacherous sea and its dangers, are some of the most interesting places that players want to explore.

Crafting a boat (the only means to reach an island alive) and sailing it with friends is so cool. Even solo, the idea of the unknown was such a drive to spend time in crafting a boat and go to that island.

I find that water mounts belittle that aspect of the game.

What you can do with water mount:
* Go from X to Z (unsafely).
* Maybe finding chests of treasure (have much slots we will have in character's inventory?)

What you can do with boat:
* Go from X to Z safely (as you can't defend yourself on water mount from monsters or enemies) and maybe faster.
* Also transport resources (as this is the only way to make money as money don't drop from monsters in AoC as far as I know the only way to make cash is by trading goods in different regions).

* Finding chests of treasure ( additional slots of boat's inventory )

* Fishing (can you fish from water mount ?)

* Defend your self while anchoring, diving, finding chests of treasure.

* Fight Sea raid bosses:

* Sea PVP (defend your areas/nodes/harbors)

And I'm sure that there are more features for sea content that we don't know about.
In BDO for example you can just buy a boat and go to any island BUT!
Every one is trying to craft a big ship. WHY?
Because of the ability to fight sea bosses, more weight limit and slots and this provide the ability to make gooooood money for traders.

So I don't think you need to worry my friend.

I do worry friend. I played bdo at the begining, and when I had to go to an island for my next XP grind spot I was excited to build a raft and go with my mate.
I came back to bdo this january, to discover that boats are being handed out, I just logged out.

This is what made me want to create this post.

Dayuhan

Tyrantor wrote: »

Since you can just swim everywhere in AoC per the stream (no stamina loss) I don't see the difference outside of being able to swim faster.

I seem to remember in the video that, while swimming, Steve's character got a cannot attack while swimming message. So probably the advantage of having a mount is you can fight while in the water.

Tyrantor

Dayuhan wrote: »

Tyrantor wrote: »

Since you can just swim everywhere in AoC per the stream (no stamina loss) I don't see the difference outside of being able to swim faster.

I seem to remember in the video that, while swimming, Steve's character got a cannot attack while swimming message. So probably the advantage of having a mount is you can fight while in the water.

My response was in regards to the OP suggesting mounts would ruin the water exploration aspect(s) of the game. I'm simply suggesting that if we can already swim as far as we want (with air) there is no difference between the mounts being available other than speed. I also doubt we will be able to attack from mounts - or I've yet to see anything to suggest we can.

Lethality

I'd generally agree that there should be some kind of practical limits to water mounts in terms of capability.

I am sure of course there will be limited (if any) cargo, speed, player capacity, etc. But more than that, I just think endurance and distance should play into it.

Likewise a swimmer should also become exhausted far sooner (or get eaten by a kraken, either or.)

Kneczhevo

I haven't rewatched the stream. But I recall the devs mentioning; there will be mounts that carry multiple toons (players). My immediate thought, with that statement, was; drive by shooting (gta style). No idea if this is true. But, that leads me to believe; if you can drive by attack, why not use mounts to attack ships (more pirates, see above)? Again, no idea if this is the case. But, you see my concerns?

I see some advantages, for having a ship (fishing, goods hauled, dancing on the decks, faster travel, etc.), But right now, I am seeing an exploit with the water mechanics (water mounts).

Perhaps the "no combat" in water is nessisary. But, imagine the flak Intrepid will receive, when people can't do something, as simple as casting a spell in the water.

Tyrantor

There will have to be casting/fighting in water if there are under water dungeons, nodes or other PoI. Also water would be a get out of jail free card to avoid PvP if attacking wasn't possible. This is also my actual concern with the lack of needing stamina for water to avoid death people near water may just run for it and go swimming until their attacker gives up....

Decidendi

George Black wrote: »

I found that island locations in many mmos, isolated by the treacherous sea and its dangers, are some of the most interesting places that players want to explore.

Crafting a boat (the only means to reach an island alive) and sailing it with friends is so cool. Even solo, the idea of the unknown was such a drive to spend time in crafting a boat and go to that island.

I find that water mounts belittle that aspect of the game.

I have to disagree. If we have land and air based mounts, it only makes sense to have water based mounts. Now, we can discuss abut how easily they should or shouldn't be obtainable, but elimination of water based mounts with aquatic benefits would seem illogical.

CROW3

I personally would rather swim or use boats, but if someone else wants a water mount I think that’s fine.

Caeryl

Watching that weird anteaterhorse swim destroy my suspension of disbelief in their video. A creature with those kind of stick thin limbs would never be able to swim. A land mount shouldn’t be able to fully submerge at all.

Water mounts being able to ride on land at vastly increased stam costs would be fine. A land mount being able to tread water for a very small amount of time would be fine.

Seeing the classifications boil down to “same but faster” in either case is just disappointing. Hopefully the next iteration after feedback will fix these rather glaring issues that I can’t “it’s magic” my brain into believing.

Ravudha

George Black wrote: »

Crafting a boat (the only means to reach an island alive) and sailing it with friends is so cool. Even solo, the idea of the unknown was such a drive to spend time in crafting a boat and go to that island.

I find that water mounts belittle that aspect of the game.

Makes me wonder if acquiring a water mount will be easy or as hard as making a boat. Someone has to do some painstaking exploration to find and tame the mounts to get them in the first place.

Decidendi

Caeryl wrote: »

Watching that weird anteaterhorse swim destroy my suspension of disbelief in their video. A creature with those kind of stick thin limbs would never be able to swim. A land mount shouldn’t be able to fully submerge at all.

Water mounts being able to ride on land at vastly increased stam costs would be fine. A land mount being able to tread water for a very small amount of time would be fine.

Seeing the classifications boil down to “same but faster” in either case is just disappointing. Hopefully the next iteration after feedback will fix these rather glaring issues that I can’t “it’s magic” my brain into believing.

No one is going to be using land mounts in the water anyway - too slow. Don't see what the issue is.

Mojottv

George Black wrote: »

I found that island locations in many mmos, isolated by the treacherous sea and its dangers, are some of the most interesting places that players want to explore.

Crafting a boat (the only means to reach an island alive) and sailing it with friends is so cool. Even solo, the idea of the unknown was such a drive to spend time in crafting a boat and go to that island.

I find that water mounts belittle that aspect of the game.

actually didnt think about that when i was watching the stream, but you have a point... id rather they have smaller boats for 1 man, like katamarans in archage...water mounts kind of makes those smaller boats irelevant...

Tyrantor

Well unless they're going to offer submarine boats I think the water mounts purpose would be for under water dungeons more so than just "swimming faster".

George_Black

Because holding reigns and breathing sitting on a saddle does'nt look silly...

Yuniel

Honestly, after having played ARK, Intrepid should look at that game regarding water/islands/mounts/exploration.

And yeah, stamina loss and breathing timer please.

T Elf

I liked the mounts underwater and that they help you travel faster. I see them used mostly for exploration and getting to underwater dungeons. As mounts vs boats, they have no carrying capasity or other defenses. I'm not a stickler for all kinds of "realism" in games.

George_Black

T Elf wrote: »

I liked the mounts underwater and that they help you travel faster. I see them used mostly for exploration and getting to underwater dungeons. As mounts vs boats, they have no carrying capasity or other defenses. I'm not a stickler for all kinds of "realism" in games.

It's not a matter of realism. It doesn't make sense to swim on a knight suit. That's not what the topic is about.

It's about people expecting naval nodes, naval combat, ships, piracy.

A sense of coastal lifestyle, but instead we will be ridding on seahorses and stingrays because it will end up being an easier speedbuff.

bluesmoke

I don't get the turtle/ tortoise.
This was sold as an aquatic mount, yet it is afraid of water and moves slower in water than on land?
Also, i'm not sure if more work is being done on it, but the galaxy in the shell is supposed to move.

Valic

bluesmoke wrote: »

I don't get the turtle/ tortoise.
This was sold as an aquatic mount, yet it is afraid of water and moves slower in water than on land?
Also, i'm not sure if more work is being done on it, but the galaxy in the shell is supposed to move.

Tortoises are land creatures while turtles are aquatic. There's 2 differences here. Also I believe the galaxy in the shell does move a bit.

Decidendi

bluesmoke wrote: »

I don't get the turtle/ tortoise.
This was sold as an aquatic mount, yet it is afraid of water and moves slower in water than on land?
Also, i'm not sure if more work is being done on it, but the galaxy in the shell is supposed to move.

Google: 'Can tortoises swim'.