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Fleeing with Mounts while in combat

Forgive me if this has already been discussed, but being able to insta-cast your mount and ride away from danger seems kinda lame.

A few ideals to fix this:
-some type of mounting animation coupled with a 2-3 second timer to fully mount
-have you mount spawn off screen and run to you thus adding a small time delay
-make your mount summon take 2-3 seconds and be interruptible
-make the mount attackable and have it flee from aggro

Would like to hear everyone's thoughts on this.

Thanks in advance!

Comments

  • George_BlackGeorge_Black Member, Intrepid Pack
    I agree.
  • TalentsTalents Member, Intrepid Pack
    edited September 2021
    That's why mounts are planned to be killable, we've already known this for literal years. If they mount up then kill their mount.
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  • George_BlackGeorge_Black Member, Intrepid Pack
    Killing a green players mount, pet or summon would result in pk. Keep that in mind.
  • DygzDygz Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Get a faster mount.
  • Magic ManMagic Man Member
    edited September 2021
    1yardshort wrote: »
    Forgive me if this has already been discussed, but being able to insta-cast your mount and ride away from danger seems kinda lame.

    A few ideals to fix this:
    -some type of mounting animation coupled with a 2-3 second timer to fully mount
    -have you mount spawn off screen and run to you thus adding a small time delay
    -make your mount summon take 2-3 seconds and be interruptible
    -make the mount attackable and have it flee from aggro

    Would like to hear everyone's thoughts on this.

    Thanks in advance!

    Fully agreed. Hopefully we won't have that ''attack till your health gets too low - summon mount - ride away till you get out of tab targeting range - heal - come back - repeat''. That is really lame.
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  • Just make it a cast time longer than any hard CC in the game and interrupted by any damage? Thats how I would go about it
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  • Talents wrote: »
    then kill their mount.

    Sad no my baby. I hope we dont lose them in our inventory tough it would be sad. Or maybe mount are really easy to capture who knows

  • akabearakabear Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    edited September 2021
    No, to lose them
    No, to instant summons and ride if in pvp or flagged
    Yes to they get damaged, become impaired to un-ridable until repaired/fixed
    A degree of fixing in the field possible but if too damaged a walk back to town and fully fix there.
  • Agreed. No insta-cast on mounts.
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  • akabear wrote: »
    No, to lose them
    No, to instant summons and ride if in pvp or flagged
    Yes to they get damaged, become impaired to un-ridable until repaired/fixed
    A degree of fixing in the field possible but if too damaged a walk back to town and fully fix there.

    I like the idea that if your mount gets injured it lowers its run speed. If someone your fighting mounts up to escape, target their mount and then run them down.
  • I was watching a video of Alpha 1 PvP, and this dude was mounting up during combat just to position himself better to hit abilities. Looked like no cast time on it, which is weird. Hopefully it takes a few seconds to summon the mount.
    ptitoine wrote: »
    Talents wrote: »
    then kill their mount.

    Sad no my baby. I hope we dont lose them in our inventory tough it would be sad. Or maybe mount are really easy to capture who knows

    Mounts being "killed" is not permanent death, but will put them on a cooldown before they can be used again. Steven mentioned this a while ago on a dev stream, but as with all things Steven says, this may be changed in the future.
  • NerrorNerror Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    My guess is the insta-mounting in Alpha 1 was just that, Alpha 1.

    For release I'd want a long cast time to summon, that can be interrupted, if in combat. But I would also like to be able to have the mount be pre-summoned. Like I am sure we will be able to with mules. In that case it should just be a matter of getting to the mount and jump on before it's killed.
  • Nerror wrote: »
    But I would also like to be able to have the mount be pre-summoned. Like I am sure we will be able to with mules. In that case it should just be a matter of getting to the mount and jump on before it's killed.

    Steven did talk about having your mount exist in the world when not riding on it, so this definitely can be a thing.
  • No mounting while combat except it is already out so you risk it getting killed by other players, npcs or AOE.
    The mount and pet system in Archeage was nice.
  • bloodprophetbloodprophet Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Mounted combat is supposed to be a thing:

    https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Mounts

    Mounts have different core abilities, utility skills and stats.[15][16]

    Based on skill choice, mounts can be used as initiation vehicles, escape vehicles, utility vehicles, and traversal vehicles.[17]

    Mounts have obviously many different applications and that's also going to speak to its identity when it has a skill selection choice too. Like do you- are you more aggressive in initiation with your mount? Okay well you probably want the ones that are going to be able to charge through and do some type of CC effect on players in front of you. Are you more about kind of using them out to dodge and avoid you know different types of things? Well then you probably want some type of invulnerability skills or some type of protective skills that you can activate at certain times. Are you going to be more traversal and focus on kind of speed you use your mount just kind of go around the world and you don't really care about the combat aspect? Well then you probably want some skill sets on your mount that reflect that.[17] – Steven Sharif

    Mounts will provide resistances, defensive abilities, skills, charge abilities, and attacks.[18]

    Mounts will have varied speeds.[19]

    With some exceptions, mounts are able to be summoned during combat in the open-world.[17]

    There's definitely a difficulty from a balance perspective obviously on the design side when you're having to incorporate speeds that are so radically different from the normal player movement speeds; and mounts do have a obviously a significantly faster component there. But that's why you build into the to the skill sets that players have obviously those types of cc's which can either, as we spoke about previously, knock the player off of their mount, kill them with some massive damage, or stun the player. Those are components that are taken into account when balancing out these skill selections.[17] – Steven Sharif

    A player can dismount and have their mount follow them.[15][20]

    Mounted combat

    Certain mounts will have combat abilities.[21][12]

    Players can't use their class skills while mounted.[21]
    Mounts can be targeted separately from the player while mounted.[20]
    Mounts can be killed by players, but can be resurrected after a certain cooldown period.[20][22]
    Potions can be used to reduce the cooldown.[20]
    Most people never listen. They are just waiting on you to quit making noise so they can.
  • Killing a green players mount, pet or summon would result in pk. Keep that in mind.

    If I were trying to stop them running away then I'm struggling to think of a scenario where I only wanted to give them a harsh telling off! :wink:
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  • 1yardshort wrote: »
    Forgive me if this has already been discussed, but being able to insta-cast your mount and ride away from danger seems kinda lame.

    A few ideals to fix this:
    -some type of mounting animation coupled with a 2-3 second timer to fully mount
    -have you mount spawn off screen and run to you thus adding a small time delay
    -make your mount summon take 2-3 seconds and be interruptible
    -make the mount attackable and have it flee from aggro

    Would like to hear everyone's thoughts on this.

    Thanks in advance!

    Do like albion they have easily the best system for that
  • akabearakabear Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Also prefer mounts to not be capable of being summonsed whilst indoors. Perhaps exception being castle sieges and larger dungeons.
  • I liked the lotro system. Cast time with a decent animation to mount. And if u get enough damage you dismount. Also you getting slowed a bit too.
  • Psomopsoli wrote: »
    I liked the lotro system. Cast time with a decent animation to mount. And if u get enough damage you dismount. Also you getting slowed a bit too.

    Yep getting dismounted + a little bit of slow once dismounted is a good way to balance it
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  • 1yardshort wrote: »
    Forgive me if this has already been discussed, but being able to insta-cast your mount and ride away from danger seems kinda lame.

    A few ideals to fix this:
    -some type of mounting animation coupled with a 2-3 second timer to fully mount
    -have you mount spawn off screen and run to you thus adding a small time delay
    -make your mount summon take 2-3 seconds and be interruptible
    -make the mount attackable and have it flee from aggro

    Would like to hear everyone's thoughts on this.

    Thanks in advance!

    Hopefully summoning mounts takes a few seconds. Yes to be able to kill someone's mount with maybe a cooldown until they can resummon it. Never really liked the "spawn off-screen" summon ... I want to see the animation of them spawning.
  • It may just be that when the game is officially released people who run away on their mounts would be seen as bad pvpers
  • JustVineJustVine Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    I think this conversation is missing a key discussion perspective. Anyone who dislikes instant mount for aesthetic/immersion reasons please ignore me as my argument is purely gameplay related.

    Ganker attacks Gatherer. Gatherer ponies up and flees.

    Is the Ganker unable to summon their own mount? If they do and can't catch up the head start...

    Why is a proper ganker lacking in the fastest aggressive steed they can buy or raise?

    If they do, then shouldn't they be able to knock the gatherer off their mount and resume attacking the now prone gatherer?

    In other words it shouldn't MATTER that it's instant. Mounts should have abilities that can dismount other players and give the dismounter advantage. After all its a knockdown that isn't tied to your unmounted cc. Mounts should be an integral part of the combat system.

    You may not have realized it but if you are pro timer over instant you are for lowering the relevance of mounts to combat. Think of it from a risk reward point of view:

    As a gatherer you want to lower your loses. If your mount gets damaged, you lose profit in the time and resources to fix it.

    If there is a timer longer than activating a high damage ability where is the incentive to activate your mount in a gank situation?

    You risk, getting hard cc'd interrupting your summon. You risk the person with cc 'waiting' to damage you send your mount just for grief. The chances of proper mounted escape are slim. You still risk even more resource lost than if you had just stayed fighting due to the way death penalty encourages combat. The cost benefit analysis just doesn't add up to me.

    I will go as far as to say no serious escapee is going to use their mounts in a gank situation. Why risk damaging your mount on top of getting even more damage because you cant run away while summoning in such a system. Just do a basic attack and accept death and be rewarded with lower resource loss.

    We should be encouraging the risk of damage to your mount and getting dismounted vs the reward of possible escape. We should be encouraging this for the health of the animal husbandry economy and to encourage more masterpiece worthy design and thought from IS.

    What I propose instead is a cooldown timer after being knocked off. Keep the insta mount. Make quick dismount a valuable mount ability for ganking. Add in subtle interplay of mount abilities so that there are valid differences in mount builds and things aren't one or two singular best builds so both players have to actually think of how to catch or escape an unknown opponent.
    🔦🔱⚔️Selling pro pain and pro pain accessories. ⚔️🔱🔦
  • I like instant mounting if the mount being damaged slows it down. The problem with instant mounting is usually being no downside to it. However, if they introduce downsides to being mounted in combat then I'd love it. Always feels stupid to charge a mount like a spell when in real life you would just jump on and run away. xD
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    U.S. East
  • akabearakabear Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    @JustVine I would have thought that summoning a mount once flagged would not be possible.
  • George_BlackGeorge_Black Member, Intrepid Pack
    edited September 2021
    akabear wrote: »
    @JustVine I would have thought that summoning a mount once flagged would not be possible.

    I am curious to see if mounts will be anything more than speedboosts.
    Mounted combat will take a lot of development in order to be meaningful. Otherwise nobody will give a damn and if that is the case and you can summon while in combat to run away, then we are in for tedious open world pvp.


    Let's wait and see.
  • maouwmaouw Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    akabear wrote: »
    @JustVine I would have thought that summoning a mount once flagged would not be possible.

    I think we could?
    I remember popping out of a Siege in A1, and for some reason the game flagged me purple but I mounted up and got stuck in the river (coz I didn't know about [H])
    I wish I were deep and tragic
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