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Every encounter doesn't need to end in PVP

I have played Mortal Online 2 a few times with friends. It's very PVP-focused. The group I play with are PvErs with some PVP when needed to defend ourselves. Having the optional VOIP really change some of our confrontations with other players. Many times we were able to trade and become online friends just because of the option to speak. Things move very fast when meeting other players not know their true intention. I know some fellow players don’t like open comms, which I totally understand, but with the ability to turn off or on (with the default being off) we can experience some emergent gameplay rather than just ending with pvp. I’m really looking forward to the caravans, being on either side of things. :p
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Comments

  • +1 for the "we want voip in Ashes" crowd. Thank you for your contribution, VOIP should be in Ashes.
  • mcstackersonmcstackerson Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Alpha One
    This is one of the reasons I like VOIP. Allowing convenient communication can really change player interactions.
  • George BlackGeorge Black Member, Intrepid Pack
    edited October 5
    Voip or not this is what I like about open world pvp.

    You choose who you help, who you ally with and who you become friends with, instead of queuing up for a 20min instanced run and not say a word (I am playing ff14 2 days now. Havent said a word to anyone), or ignoring EVERYONE while you do one easy quest chain after another.

    You choose who you fight, who you mark as a kill-on-sight, who you go to war with, as opposed to queuing up in a bg, fight for 15min, or force to fight blue or yellow or red alliance, or Horde or Alliance.

    Real human interaction, guild gameplay, player driven story.
  • This is one of the reasons I like VOIP. Allowing convenient communication can really change player interactions.

    Exactly!... Many times we were outnumbered and no way could have escaped, but using “charisma ;) ” we were able to talk our way out of danger and even now have made allies.
  • KesthelyKesthely Member
    edited October 6
    Kaishang wrote: »
    I have played Mortal Online 2 a few times with friends. It's very PVP-focused. The group I play with are PvErs with some PVP when needed to defend ourselves. Having the optional VOIP really change some of our confrontations with other players. Many times we were able to trade and become online friends just because of the option to speak. Things move very fast when meeting other players not know their true intention. I know some fellow players don’t like open comms, which I totally understand, but with the ability to turn off or on (with the default being off) we can experience some emergent gameplay rather than just ending with pvp. I’m really looking forward to the caravans, being on either side of things. :p

    My pvp gaming experiance comes from a totally different background. We use comms all the time, in fact we hop in comms before we hop in game to get a update of whats happening. For me it would be unthinkable to use a non secure (passworded with background checks if your not a spy before your allowed to enter) in a game of what i hope Ashes will become for my player group. So we'll still be using that most likely.

    That said, Voip is a low entry form towards such systems, so i'll give you a +1
  • SathragoSathrago Member
    edited October 6
    Voip as always is a double-edged sword but I believe it's worth having despite the downside of increased Modern Warfare lobby type "conversations". Being able to shout out that you are friendly or will leave an area instead of typing it is just super useful for the less pvp-inclined people. It's also useful for players that want to gain a reputation of lying about being friendly lol.

    If it's easily implemented and not gonna push the development back by an insane amount I believe it would be a nice addition to the game. However I would not say it's a must have.
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  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack
    If the game has proximity chat, many players (likely most, tbh) will turn it off. This means these opportunities like in the OP will be rare.

    If the game doesn't have it, it means players can make that first introduction via text, and then move seamlessly to voice chat simply by inviting the people to a group (or inviting a group to a raid).

    Most players are not going to turn off group/raid voice chat, so this should always be an option.
  • mcstackersonmcstackerson Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Alpha One
    Noaani wrote: »
    If the game has proximity chat, many players (likely most, tbh) will turn it off. This means these opportunities like in the OP will be rare.

    If the game doesn't have it, it means players can make that first introduction via text, and then move seamlessly to voice chat simply by inviting the people to a group (or inviting a group to a raid).

    Most players are not going to turn off group/raid voice chat, so this should always be an option.

    The option to meet with text is still there with VOIP. I'm not sure how many people will keep it muted but it's a more convenient way to communicate which means more people will communicate then if it wasn't present which I see as a positive in a social game.
  • botbot Member
    Typing in chat exists
  • mcstackersonmcstackerson Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Alpha One
    edited October 6
    bot wrote: »
    Typing in chat exists

    You type with the same input device you use to control your character. Not only do you have to use your keyboard but also your hands. You can use voice without stopping control your character. It's also something you can take in with your ears, instead of your eyes which you use more often to control and react in-game.

    To type you have to stop controlling your character and to read what is being typed, you usually have to look away from what your character is doing.

    When something is more convenient to use, people are more likely to use it.
  • maouwmaouw Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    bot wrote: »
    Typing in chat exists

    You type with the same input device you use to control your character. Not only do you have to use your keyboard but also your hands. You can use voice without stopping control your character. It's also something you can take in with your ears, instead of your eyes which you use more often to control and react in-game.

    When something is more convenient to use, people are more likely to use it.

    That's a fair point.
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  • Noaani wrote: »
    If the game has proximity chat, many players (likely most, tbh) will turn it off. This means these opportunities like in the OP will be rare.

    VOIP would enable sending messages without the use of hands --> no need to leave yourself defenseless for that duration.
    VOIP would enable receiving messages without the use of eyes --> better control of character cuz we dnt need to read the message.
    VOIP makes communicating far more convenient than the default solution of typing everything and managing different chat windows for different chats like guild chat, node chat, world chat along with talking to friends.
    So I believe other than extremely casual/new players, most people would have it on. After all, convenience always wins. Moreover it shouldn't be very hard to implement.
  • I've had more negative experiences with random open comms than positive ones, so I'd most likely be keeping mine turned off. Having said that, if there are enough players wanting this, I don't see why it shouldn't be an option.
  • DygzDygz Member, Braver of Worlds, Alpha One
    Ashes has voice chat in the design. "Fully functional for your mute/chat preference."
    It's not proximity-based.
    Dunno if it will be available outside of a party/raid/guild/siege.
  • RamirezRamirez Member
    edited October 13
    Voip is needed in new gen mmorpg, last night i had had an similar experience in New world, i was doing an quest and two guys from the enemy faction start to gaking, and i start ,saying "wait wait, you are doing the quest selfless nature you will need to kill an elite mob?" they stop and we joined forces to do the quest.

    In the end we did it, both had low hp, so i kill them and can t stop launghing all night..
  • Ramirez wrote: »
    In the end we did it, both had low hp, so i kill them and can t stop launghing all night..

    giphy.gif
  • MerekMerek Member
    New World as a whole proved that VOIP in open world games is garbage. You'll either get zero response because people are too busy on Discord/tabbed out auto-walking to their location, horrendous music spammers or the PVP players that talk the usual shit. It's dumb and unnecessary, if implemented it'll barely be used, just like the 'Raid VOIP'.
  • BaSkA13BaSkA13 Member
    edited October 13
    I will have proximity VOIP turned off 100% of the time, I will only use group VOIP.

    However, I am not against toggleable proximity VOIP. It won't make any difference to me, as long as it doesn't hurt the game performance.
  • When I see this I remember how much I love proximity voice chat in Rust...

    But in Ashes I don't know if it would work equally as good, I very much doubt it.
  • voip would be great ..just make sure to put in a toggle to mute it.. that way when someone starts being a dumbass you can just mute and unmute after u kill the fucker ;)
  • GrilledCheeseMojitoGrilledCheeseMojito Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Proximity voice chat will just open up even more avenues for griefing, and it's not that much of a desired feature to begin with. You don't even need to look far to see the negative sentiment; every time it's been brought up in this forum in the past six months you immediately see that a lot of people want to turn it off, and the counterexamples brought up in this thread already outweigh the positives.

    If you want voice comms with your team, the out of game voice call ecosystem is probably the healthiest it's been. Or learn to type real quick between actions.
    Grilled cheese always tastes better when you eat it together!
  • CROW3CROW3 Member
    If proximity voice chat is the path toward de-escalation, all of my encounters will end in pvp. 😉
  • MybroViajeroMybroViajero Member
    edited October 14
    Not having it would be more damaging than having it, in the end the people who will use it will be the ones who want to socialize in a greater way and we know that AoC is going to have a great and necessary social content.



    This is not an example of MMO but it is a good example of what VOIP can generate


    Do what you want, but be strong to accept the consequences of it
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack
    edited October 14
    Sylvanar wrote: »
    Noaani wrote: »
    If the game has proximity chat, many players (likely most, tbh) will turn it off. This means these opportunities like in the OP will be rare.

    VOIP would enable sending messages without the use of hands --> no need to leave yourself defenseless for that duration.
    VOIP would enable receiving messages without the use of eyes --> better control of character cuz we dnt need to read the message.
    VOIP makes communicating far more convenient than the default solution of typing everything and managing different chat windows for different chats like guild chat, node chat, world chat along with talking to friends.
    So I believe other than extremely casual/new players, most people would have it on. After all, convenience always wins. Moreover it shouldn't be very hard to implement.

    In an MMO, the people that are not casual don't care what some random passer by has to say.

    Most people that are actually in to MMO's will log in to their guilds voice chat at the same time they log in to the game, and will not use voice chat at all.

    In fact, in my experience, most (not all, but most) people that are in to MMO's turn all sounds off from the game completely.

    So, your assertion thatnit is only casuals that will turn it off is blatantly incorrect. Casuals are the most likely people to use it, as they are the least likely to have existing guild chat.
  • Noaani wrote: »
    Sylvanar wrote: »
    Noaani wrote: »
    If the game has proximity chat, many players (likely most, tbh) will turn it off. This means these opportunities like in the OP will be rare.

    VOIP would enable sending messages without the use of hands --> no need to leave yourself defenseless for that duration.
    VOIP would enable receiving messages without the use of eyes --> better control of character cuz we dnt need to read the message.
    VOIP makes communicating far more convenient than the default solution of typing everything and managing different chat windows for different chats like guild chat, node chat, world chat along with talking to friends.
    So I believe other than extremely casual/new players, most people would have it on. After all, convenience always wins. Moreover it shouldn't be very hard to implement.

    In an MMO, the people that are not casual don't care what some random passer by has to say.

    Most people that are actually in to MMO's will log in to their guilds voice chat at the same time they log in to the game, and will not use voice chat at all.

    In fact, in my experience, most (not all, but most) people that are in to MMO's turn all sounds off from the game completely.

    So, your assertion thatnit is only casuals that will turn it off is blatantly incorrect. Casuals are the most likely people to use it, as they are the least likely to have existing guild chat.

    Within my friend groups everyone that plays stuff like rust or new world all use guild voice chat, true, but they also leave in game voice chat on. Basically have a press to talk for your discord to mute your mic on discord whenever you speak in the game. It's the best of both worlds.
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  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack
    Sathrago wrote: »
    Noaani wrote: »
    Sylvanar wrote: »
    Noaani wrote: »
    If the game has proximity chat, many players (likely most, tbh) will turn it off. This means these opportunities like in the OP will be rare.

    VOIP would enable sending messages without the use of hands --> no need to leave yourself defenseless for that duration.
    VOIP would enable receiving messages without the use of eyes --> better control of character cuz we dnt need to read the message.
    VOIP makes communicating far more convenient than the default solution of typing everything and managing different chat windows for different chats like guild chat, node chat, world chat along with talking to friends.
    So I believe other than extremely casual/new players, most people would have it on. After all, convenience always wins. Moreover it shouldn't be very hard to implement.

    In an MMO, the people that are not casual don't care what some random passer by has to say.

    Most people that are actually in to MMO's will log in to their guilds voice chat at the same time they log in to the game, and will not use voice chat at all.

    In fact, in my experience, most (not all, but most) people that are in to MMO's turn all sounds off from the game completely.

    So, your assertion thatnit is only casuals that will turn it off is blatantly incorrect. Casuals are the most likely people to use it, as they are the least likely to have existing guild chat.

    Within my friend groups everyone that plays stuff like rust or new world all use guild voice chat, true, but they also leave in game voice chat on. Basically have a press to talk for your discord to mute your mic on discord whenever you speak in the game. It's the best of both worlds.

    In a game like Rust, sure.

    In a game like Archeage - not as likely.

    Keep in mind, after a few months, you'll know most of the people in the area/time you frequent.
  • DygzDygz Member, Braver of Worlds, Alpha One
    edited October 14
    Ha!
    Rust is my example of why proximity chat is so horrible.
  • CROW3CROW3 Member
    Not having it would be more damaging than having it

    I disagree, but I’m curious as to what your argument is. 20+ years of mmos with TS, Vent, and Discord haven’t run into a need for proximity chat, which 9/10 times is just noise.

  • MybroViajeroMybroViajero Member
    edited October 14
    CROW3 wrote: »
    Not having it would be more damaging than having it

    I disagree, but I’m curious as to what your argument is. 20+ years of mmos with TS, Vent, and Discord haven’t run into a need for proximity chat, which 9/10 times is just noise.


    My opinion is similar to yours but with the addition that diversity generates more diversity and that's why I say that not having it would be more damaging than having it.

    It is not that it is 100% necessary, right now, in the past there have been many other ways to communicate as you have exemplified but that does not mean that VOIP should not be, it is like removing a tool that could have a function at a specific time, and since we are talking about AoC that will have a lot of social content, I guess at some point it will be the time to use VOIP.

    I must admit that I am very influenced by RUST's VOIP , and I understand the point of view of @dygz, many times VOIP is used in a way that generates more toxicity than sociability, that is understandable but that does not mean that ALL the moment generates toxicity or it is not necessary to have it, there will be times when it will be necessary, removing it from my point of view is removing an option that could be used correctly (as incorrectly, I do not deny it) and generate a more sociable environment.

    For instance :
    Let's imagine a mission where necessarily a group of people should communicate, out of a group of 16 people, 14 are in the same discord, the other 2 should get that discord to communicate. With VOIP that process would be much easier, it is not 100% used but for certain times where you need quick communication with people you don't know if it is useful.


    Of course, we must also take into account the work that will lead to the AoC system having a VOIP, if it is not profitable in terms of development to have a VOIP in an MMO like AoC then VOIP is not necessary even if you have the possibility of losing those interactions.



    Do what you want, but be strong to accept the consequences of it
  • ZythtyzZythtyz Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    edited October 15
    The argument is that there exists a group of players that enjoys VOIP. Providing counterexamples that you or your friend do not enjoy VOIP in no way invalidates the original argument. The real question is: What is the size of this group relative to the total size of the playerbase. Currently, the answer is unknown due to the game still being in true development. Another pertinent question, already raised, is what is the cost associated with the implementation of VOIP, in dollars and time? What about the additional moderation inevitably required?

    These are all excellent discussion topics, and spur further discussion for the betterment of the game from a community perspective. So sure, you and everyone you know doesn't enjoy it, but some people do. The Universe of opinions is vast, with all weighted equally.


    Personally, I think VOIP is an incredible mode for RP to be taken to a whole new level. Before you say, "Hey, Ashes isn't a dedicated RP game", remember it is an MMO-RPG. The RP still stands for roleplaying :) Being able to communicate with others and exchange ideas is what brings people back to their favorite gather place. HOWEVER, I think there needs to be full-time moderation of players use of VOIP to prevent and correct any behavior against the ToS.

    *EDIT* I realize after re-reading that people are discussing proximity VoIP and not VoIP as a whole. My bad, thought I understood but I was wrong. My comment on others disregarding opinions now applies to myself alone :neutral:
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