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Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest news on Alpha Two.
Check out general Announcements here to see the latest news on Ashes of Creation & Intrepid Studios.
To get the quickest updates regarding Alpha Two, connect your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Comments
We all know sex sales.
Have a real argument.
Don't just try to point a finger at me for speaking the truth.
Whatever you think people's motives are, don't matter. The end effect is that Intrepid gets paid more, and we get a better game.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
You can do better than repeating yourself.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
No you really don’t get a better game by adding a bunch of creepy sexist designs, it just attracts creeps
It's almost like you are calling Korean and Japanese MMORPG players a bunch of creeps. I don't know what expectations you have of the average MMORPG player, but it's not a stretch to say your expectations are quite high. You are going to be playing with creeps with or without these cosmetics.
You just don't want to see it. Which is a fair argument and the one you should be using.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
The only things I am against are the super cutsie cartoony stuff like Stuffertons.
You mean Suffertron right?
Inside the mount is a tortured soul trying to escape. Which fuels the mount's speed. Some say you can see a screaming face if you look deep into its cold black eyes.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
And catering to creeps by adding gross outfits brings in more than the average amount of weirdos, so obviously I don’t think it’s at all “good for the game” to add skimpy outfits.
No. You don't think it's good for you.
If the difference between skimpy outfits and no skimpy outfits is less content and less moderation staff, then I have to disagree with you.
It's all about the money to me. I have lost too many games to low budgets to care anymore. If they did a Fortnite or Roblox cosmetics skin cross over campaign, and it put more money into the game, I would have to be for it. Even if I hate both of those franchises and don't want to see their aesthetics in Ashes.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
If a game would fail without skimpy outfits, then tbh it’s not good enough to succeed
I dont believe he said it would fail without them, but simply succeed even more financially with them
Real question for you, and I ask you this knowing you are Ferengi and knowing that you know I'm not arguing against skin in the game.
'Money for what'? Their cosmetics will already sell with the current balanced approach. The game fully funded. What do you want that is worth making a subsection of possible fans uncomfortable?
It's not like a more balanced approach is going to stifle creativity nor be outright prudish. I am all for a business making money and profit. Especially ones I like. But 'keep chipping away at that balance until its all generically 'slut mog' to make more sales' sounds like the opposite of vain to me.
^ That heavily implies the games failed
I'm sorry but adding options (if both male and female) doesn't make it sexist... Just like in real life, give people the freedom to choose...
As far as SJW is concerned think of WoW recently. Their whole replacing a painting with cleavage with fruits, everyone thought it was dumb. Then they added an incubus model option INSTEAD of getting rid of the skanky succubus. That's the better way of dealing with it, having equal options, not just glossing over it to remove the flavor...
Eh, perhaps. Either way, I don't necessarily agree with the argument because I personally despise goofy/silly cosmetics in high fantasy with in depth lore. Selling them can make the game money, but they just ruin the look of the game to me. "sexy" outfits don't bother me as long as they go along with the aesthetic of the game. Age of Conan is a pretty good example for what I mean. It had revealing outfits and even full-blown nudity, but it went with the gritty world the game was built from.
The cutsie, goofy, obnoxious skins to me belong in cartoon games like fortnite and anime based games.
The premise of money, to me, comes after how viable it is to the game.
The basis of this thread is that they want skimpy outfits. The linked video in this thread has a thumbnail showing a grossly objectifying outfit being turned into a really cool, still stylish outfit that isn’t flashing 80% of the boob, and somehow they’re mad about that.
What "sex sells" usually means in the vast, vast majority of games (and outside of games) is the hypersexualisation/objectification of young women's bodies. The males get the power fantasy treatment, not the sexualization treatment. Most guys I've talked to about it don't know the difference at first.
I have never seen an MMORPG featuring hypersexualization where the male characters are even remotely sexualized to the extent the female ones are. It's not just outfits showing skin, it's animations, emotes and poses too.
Now, I have certainly not played all MMORPGs out there, and I am sure there might be some featuring sexualized male outfits/poses. Maybe some of the women here have seen an MMORPG where it's somewhat equal?
Anyone familiar with the Hawkeye Initiative? It's a satirical site that showcases the often ridiculous, but also extremely ubiquitous hypersexualization of women in comics. Much of it applies to games and other media as well though. It's been so normalized that most people probably don't even see it for what it is. There is a wiki page as well.
To get get back on topic, this game doesn't need sex to sell it. In fact, I would argue it cheapens the whole thing if they add too many sexy outfits/poses, to the detriment of the game overall. And whatever they do decide to add, I hope they make sure to make it equal.
I am here for the nodes, not the nudes.
Money can do so much good if allowed. There is a drastic difference between fully funded and well funded.
Square was "fully funded" up until this year when it became very "well funded". The outlook for the game looks even greater now, but I will not forget that we did lose an "Ultimate" raid during Shadowbringers due to sacrifices that had to be made for Covid. No, doubt if there were in the finical situation they are in now, when when they choose to rob us of content. Maybe they would have made sure to have the extra staffing on hand to make the Dragonsong War Ultimate happen in Shadowbringers.
This is all speculation, of course, but I can't imagine we would have lost that raid if they were selling out of CD keys when they had to make that choice.
It also just means when the time comes to build or update servers, they think about buying better tech. When the time comes to hire more admins, they can consider a larger admin staff. When it comes time to do nice things for the developers to improve moral, they can afford to do more things more often.
In theory, extra money can go into making the game better for the players and everyone else involved. As long as Steven is not following the rules of acquisition 100% as they are written.
Vanity is subjective. There will always be "That guy/gal" running around town in no armor. People are going to be as slutty as the game allows. It's how some people express themselves. I dislike all the fur suits and mascot attire in FFXIV more than the slutmogs, but I deal with it because I know some people like wearing a frog suit or a pig suit.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
This really hits it on the nose. A lot of my friends who have shown off their transmogs in various games definitely pursue that 'cute' factor. Looking at the cosmetics so far it seems like they are right on track.
Ashes pursuing a 'slutmog' level of character skin wouldn't help the game. It wouldn't be a dealbreaker for the few people I know who would go for that and it would be a dealbreaker for a few who don't want to have that all over their screen. Imagine what your node might look like the day after a bikini cosmetic went on sale.
Personally, I don't care for it, but it wouldn't change how much I play the game. And I think Intrepid has demonstrated good taste thus far.
I cant even just count on both of my hands how many women I know who have played witcher who have told me how much they loveeeee this scene. Sex sells all around my friend, male or female.
Remember that censorship is never a good idea.
Aren't we all sinners?
Of course it does. It kind of proves my point too. My point is that scenes like the above are pretty friggin' rare. And going with the witcher, how many scenes of scantily clad/nude women aren't there compared to those with Geralt or men in general? It's not equal in that game either.
Or in other words, yeah "sex sells" up to a point, but the implementation in the vast majority of games is heavily on the side of sexualization of young women.
I think that mostly goes along with the fact that male players are much more common than female. That being said I I still don't see the problem. Hell if there was a game with nothing but dong accentuating outfits for rugged men to appeal to women, thats just as ok to me as that hypersexualized anime bullcrap thats out there. What it really comes down to is the goal of the developers. As I said earlier, if it fits the world that is being built, then do it. If it doesnt fit, don't include it.
Wouldn't it be because it's what is liked the most by the majority of gamers?
Hell, i could say it's what is most liked and what sells the most in the majority of types of media out there...
Sure, you can call it wrong or dislike it, but it's not like you can or should control what people like or want to see in what they consume.
Aren't we all sinners?
You don't think Hypersexualization of males is that present in games or media?
Khal Drogo would like a word. Every chance they get, they will show you a guy's chest if it's shredded. Sometimes the guy don't even have to be in that great of shape... look at twilight. XD
How many action movies end with the guy being covered in sweat and their cloths shredded. There are plenty of armor sets in MMORPGs that show off dudes abs and glam muscles. Just because the guys are not posing like girls does not mean they are not sexualized.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
I would argue it's not that there are fewer women playing games but that there are more male developers than female developers, and a whole lot of those developers were raised on the comic book style of drawing their characters. I saw an article or video a long time ago about it. It was about a book that almost everyone who learned to do art in those circles had learned from at some point. I think it might have been this one: https://ratcreature.livejournal.com/175099.html Or one similar at least.
I agree with the last part though
I implied no such thing. You just don't have a generous interpretation of my posts.
I don't consider GW2 to be a failure, but I think it would have better content if they had the revenue WOW or FFXIV has.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
A ) Players who would quit Ashes because they don't like 'slutmogs' in the game; or
B ) Players who would quit Ashes because they can't wear 'slutmogs' in the game,
I'd rather have Group A in my guild and server. Group B is weird.
Has anyone said: "I would quit Ashes if they had no slutmogs."? or anything like that?
I don't think I have seen that one yet. In fact, I have not seen A or B.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
As far as the comic book thing goes, I can't ever follow along with the "Oversexualized/unachievable" argument to design of characters in comics. Theyre meant to be unachievable and as a result desirable. The idea of the "realistic/everyday average looing" heroes is just narcissist's self inserting themselves as their own characters usually. Super is Super... not a typical or even optimal human being.
But yea, I don't necessarily lean either way for ashes because we don't know what direction the developers want to go. I don't care if they put in a boob slider or not, I just don't want to see the weeaboo cats ears and bunnys ears crap.