PvP with skins an advantage?

So I don't have anything against skins. I just had a thought about PvP with a skin on. Wouldn't people with skins on have the advantage to hide their gear in PvP? Or do you guys think gear won't be much influence on someone engaging an fight or not? If it does I would atleast suggest for corrupted players to have their skins disabled

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Elder

There are ways to assess players combat capabilities.

Players will have a buff on their nameplate that indicates the gear set they are wearing. Other players will be able to see this buff by targeting that player at a distance.

https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Threat_assessment

Wlgenroosje

Elder wrote: »

There are ways to assess players combat capabilities.

Players will have a buff on their nameplate that indicates the gear set they are wearing. Other players will be able to see this buff by targeting that player at a distance.

https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Threat_assessment

Ah I didn't know this! Do you think this will be quick and good way to check someone out before a fight starts?

Ludullu

Yes they will be. Costumes especially. Allegedly cosmetics will be tied to your gear type (light, heavy, etc), but that doesn't really help with pvp. And we'll have an icon in our target's nameplate that indicates what kind of gear their wearing, but unless that icon is always visible (w/o clicking on the target) I personally think that cosmetics will definitely influence pvp in a bad way. But alas we live in the age of cosmetics, so they're inevitable.

Wlgenroosje

NiKr wrote: »

Yes they will be. Costumes especially. Allegedly cosmetics will be tied to your gear type (light, heavy, etc), but that doesn't really help with pvp. And we'll have an icon in our target's nameplate that indicates what kind of gear their wearing, but unless that icon is always visible (w/o clicking on the target) I personally think that cosmetics will definitely influence pvp in a bad way. But alas we live in the age of cosmetics, so they're inevitable.

Do you think that maybe also that if combatants and/or corrupted players get their skins disabled until they turn neutral again is a good idea?

George_Black

Wlgenroosje wrote: »

NiKr wrote: »

Yes they will be. Costumes especially. Allegedly cosmetics will be tied to your gear type (light, heavy, etc), but that doesn't really help with pvp. And we'll have an icon in our target's nameplate that indicates what kind of gear their wearing, but unless that icon is always visible (w/o clicking on the target) I personally think that cosmetics will definitely influence pvp in a bad way. But alas we live in the age of cosmetics, so they're inevitable.

Do you think that maybe also that if combatants and/or corrupted players get their skins disabled until they turn neutral again is a good idea?

No. Relax a bit. ESO has way faster combat and everybody wears skins. There was never a problem identifying your enemy.

Noaani

There is an advantage to be had with skins.

It isn't a big advantage, but it still exists.

Daggial

cannot wait to have to click on 50 enemies one by one to find out what they are wearing (and die before i can find out)
or having 50 nameplates enabled all at the same time (and die because i can't see anything)

disabling skins should be an option.

George_Black

Daggial wrote: »

cannot wait to have to click on 50 enemies one by one to find out what they are wearing (and die before i can find out)
or having 50 nameplates enabled all at the same time (and die because i can't see anything)

disabling skins should be an option.

Will you be alone vs 50 ppl? You gonna die anyway. Name one multiplayer videogame that allows to disable skins that people wasted money on.

Elder

Daggial wrote: »

cannot wait to have to click on 50 enemies one by one to find out what they are wearing (and die before i can find out)
or having 50 nameplates enabled all at the same time (and die because i can't see anything)

disabling skins should be an option.

I assume you're being hyperbolic, I couldn't imagine a scenario in which you would need to instantly assess the individual capabilities of anywhere near 50 players.

Enigmatic Sage

The game is high fantasy. It's more about appearance than realistic practicality. It's why there is so much focus around cosmetics and skins etc. There can definitely be a disadvantage in understanding what you may or may not be fighting against.

Daggial

George_Black wrote: »

Name one multiplayer videogame that allows to disable skins that people wasted money on.

Albion Online.
When you are meeting players u can recognize at a glance what they are wearing.

Not just that, but you also have multiple options for allies / everyone else.

So for example i used to disable skins for everyone else (opponents), to immediately recognize threat, while kept them enabled for my guilmates / party (and have the social interaction that comes with it).

Fantastic option! Would love to see it in Ashes too.

Daggial

Elder wrote: »

I assume you're being hyperbolic, I couldn't imagine a scenario in which you would need to instantly assess the individual capabilities of anywhere near 50 players.

A possible scenario: you are are farming a 40 man raid dungeon / boss with your guild, another 40 man raid gets in and shit hits the fan quickly because they want to contest the dungeon / boss and farm it themselves.

daveywavey

Daggial wrote: »

George_Black wrote: »

Name one multiplayer videogame that allows to disable skins that people wasted money on.

Albion Online.
When you are meeting players u can recognize at a glance what they are wearing.

Not just that, but you also have multiple options for allies / everyone else.

So for example i used to disable skins for everyone else (opponents), to immediately recognize threat, while keept them enabled for my guilmates / party (and have the social interaction that comes with it).

Fantastic option! Would love to see it in Ashes too.

daveywavey

And add 'Disable Stuffertons' and 'Disable That Fricking Corgi' settings.

Elder

Daggial wrote: »

Elder wrote: »

I assume you're being hyperbolic, I couldn't imagine a scenario in which you would need to instantly assess the individual capabilities of anywhere near 50 players.

A possible scenario: you are are farming a 40 man raid dungeon / boss with your guild, another 40 man raid gets in and shit hits the fan quickly because they want to contest the dungeon / boss and farm it themselves.

Sure, but I don't see why knowing that information for all 40 players at once would be useful.

Dygz

I really don't expect to be able to "farm" raids in Ashes.
And, the primary reason for me to participate in a raid should be to rid the region of specific threats; not because I want to farm, soo...

If some other raid wants to join in - that's probably fine.
Also... I'm pretty sure we will be able to easily assess their threat to us.

JustVine

Noaani wrote: »

There is an advantage to be had with skins.

It is isn't a big advantage, but it still exists.

Yeah, that's why I keep trying to get them to clarify 'the costume question™'. It's not big but it exists.
If you can obscure what type of gear even if only briefly with no limitation, it is still going to affect the first few interactions of combat. Depending on the match up, skill gap, and gear/lvl that could be a determining factor. Nameplate only goes so far to combat this.

I still have no idea how they plan on handling racial skins. They have never mentioned race being on the name plate and given waterfall stats it matters almost as much as hiding your gear type if not more.

Hopefully they never sell cosmetics that alter sound effects. That always gets spicy soft p2w in games that do have them.

BaSkA_9x2

Simple answer: maybe they will. Skins might give an advantage in PvP, even if it's a minimal one. Even with the buff/badge/symbol to make it "easy to tell what type of gear you're wearing" implemented, it'll be an advantage, even if it's only a 134 millisecond advantage. However, I don't think this can be treated as P2W, at least not in our current MMORPG environment, maybe it would 20 years ago.

In my opinion, people who dismiss the argument about skins giving an advantage and say there's no advantage at all are defending skins in the wrong way. Skins should be defended for the following reasons only: it's necessary to keep the servers up, the development going and the game P2W free.

If there are ways to acquire skins by playing the game, then I believe this argument is settled. However, if there's no transmogs or no way to obtain in-game, that means the only way to "try to hide" your gear through skins is with real money. For that reason, I hope that Intrepid makes it possible to at least get some ugly ass looking skins by playing the game just for the sake of ending this type of discussion.

One worry I have though is about camo skins that help you hide in bushes or in the dark. I feel like that is worse than not being able to instantly tell what armor somebody is using. An easy fix, which I hope will be true, is for the minimap to show player dots so that won't be a problem if you're paying attention to it (obviously, invisible characters like rogues or whatever, won't appear).

Noaani

Daggial wrote: »

George_Black wrote: »

Name one multiplayer videogame that allows to disable skins that people wasted money on.

Albion Online.
When you are meeting players u can recognize at a glance what they are wearing.

Not just that, but you also have multiple options for allies / everyone else.

So for example i used to disable skins for everyone else (opponents), to immediately recognize threat, while kept them enabled for my guilmates / party (and have the social interaction that comes with it).

Fantastic option! Would love to see it in Ashes too.

While I know you bought it up to show that it happens in other games, Steven has already said no to this - several years ago.

His thinking is that if people pay to have their character look a specific way, then they should be assured that this is how everyone will see them.

Truthfully, this is a stance I agree with, even if I do not like the implications.

Hinotori

I'm glad you won't be able to turn off cosmetics. Otherwise it would hurt the incentive to purchase them in the first place.

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