Code-In Input Delay

96 milliseconds. Subtract Latency from this base delay and you get the player's Input Delay. I say 96 because it's simpler in binary. 00110000

Someone with 40 ms latency and someone with 90 ms latency can play the same game. Small shared delay lends itself to easing up and thinking about what you're doing. To be clear: They both play with about 96 ms latency this way.

40ms player and 180ms player can play a similar game, improving fairness and community. To be clear: One plays with 96 ms latency, the other with 180 ms latency.

Latency checks shouldn't be exploitable; it would definitely be attempted.

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Comments

Warth

ahm, no?

Sapiverenus

ahm, yes?
At least 64 ms delay.

Warth

How about limiting everybody to 23 fps while we are at it

Sapiverenus

How about 36 fps or lower.

BaSkA_9x2

We don't know yet how Intrepid will deal with input delay, if there will be a minimum/global cooldown between skills, if they'll implement any mechanic to try and normalize latency so that someone with 5ms has the same experience as someone with 50ms.

All I know is that as long as the game feels fluid and doesn't feel laggy, I don't care what they implement under the hood.

hleV

Nobody likes input lag. Better allow to queue your next action up (this input should be sent to the server) before the current one is finished and it'll be executed without extra delay.

Taleof2Cities

Warth wrote: »

How about limiting everybody to 23 fps while we are at it

The OP gave you a 'like' despite some mild sarcasm ... your reputation precedes you.

hleV

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

The OP gave you a 'like' despite some mild sarcasm ... your reputation precedes you.

He might be unironically agreeing

Sapiverenus

hleV wrote: »

Nobody likes input lag. Better allow to queue your next action up (this input should be sent to the server) before the current one is finished and it'll be executed without extra delay.

Sounds good.

And yeah FPS cap can have benefits.

MrPockets

This is a meme post, right? ...right?!

Sapiverenus

MrPockets wrote: »

This is a meme post, right? ...right?!

Input delay allows server-side to correctly process everything in proper sequence and send you the correct game state.

Delay on servers sending updated game state allows every player to be updated at the same time as well, so there's a good reason to have Delay on Server Output.

With 64 ms delay the server could tick the game state twice -> so half of players updated every 32 ms but every player waits 64 ms at least.

Keeps everyone playing the same game.

MrPockets

Oh, you are being serious....

Let me explain why I think this is so out of place here:
1) this is a low level software problem that has probably been solved in many ways, why would the devs be looking on this forum for anything on this topic?

2) Delay based net code probably has its uses, but this didn't work out well for the Fighting Game Community. Recent years have proven that players do not like their inputs being delayed, and there are better solutions to this problem (ie: rollback net code)

This whole post has big "Dunning–Kruger effect" energy. Let the Devs make the game, and you can provide feedback during alpha 2 (or when the game comes out) that you don't like the way the game feels, or that there are specific bugs/exploits. Back seat game designing is one thing...but back seat programming in this manner makes me cringe.

Sapiverenus

MrPockets wrote: »

Oh, you are being serious....

Let me explain why I think this is so out of place here:
1) this is a low level software problem that has probably been solved in many ways, why would the devs be looking on this forum for anything on this topic?

If by low level you mean closer to the hardware then yes lol. What is out of place about that?
It's not solved. Everyone has different latency and an MMO needs to make sure a crap ton of people are updated correctly.

2) Delay based net code probably has its uses, but this didn't work out well for the Fighting Game Community. Recent years have proven that players do not like their inputs being delayed, and there are better solutions to this problem (ie: rollback net code)

Nothing works well for the Fighting community because they need the lowest latency possible but physical distance and hardware creates latency.
The immediacy fighting games benefit from is not as much of a necessity for a hack n slash MMORPG. The amount of data a fighting game has to deal with is also microscopic compared to an MMO; there are different priorities.

This whole post has big "Dunning–Kruger effect" energy.

You've shown your own Dunning-Kruger confidence with the rest of your message.

Let the Devs make the game, and you can provide feedback during alpha 2 (or when the game comes out) that you don't like the way the game feels, or that there are specific bugs/exploits. Back seat game designing is one thing...but back seat programming in this manner makes me cringe.

Why are you telling me what to do? Don't start telling people what to do. You should expect some animosity at this point.

Jahlon

This is one of those because I have to suffer you have to suffer too posts.

Sapiverenus

Jahlon wrote: »

This is one of those because I have to suffer you have to suffer too posts.

You don't care about anyone else's experience. You don't enjoy sharing an experience with others but want an MMO?
Maybe you don't know what you want or just hate people? Every online game has delay; 64 ms might seem excessive to you but the real issue is when others have an advantage you don't.

Hasil

I absolutely DO NOT support this suggestion.

Sapiverenus

Hasil wrote: »

I absolutely DO NOT support this suggestion.

What are you going to do when you have 120ms latency and everyone has an advantage over you? Change your mind because it affects you?

Hasil

Sapiverenus wrote: »

Hasil wrote: »

I absolutely DO NOT support this suggestion.

What are you going to do when you have 120ms latency and everyone has an advantage over you? Change your mind because it affects you?

Choose a different server, upgrade my internet, choose a less ping-intensive class, move IRL (lol?)

I am old as dirt, I have been dealing with this my whole life, since the days of dial-up/modem connections.

I didn't really want to get into a discussion, I just wanted to place my vote for "No, no way!"

Sapiverenus

Hasil wrote: »

Choose a different server, upgrade my internet, choose a less ping-intensive class, move IRL (lol?) I am old as dirt, I have been dealing with this my whole life, since the days of dial-up/modem connections.

I didn't really want to get into a discussion, I just wanted to place my vote for "No, no way!"

There is always latency. 40 - 90 ms is normal.
People can't even click 10x a second 99.999% of the time. Latency in early 2000s was often hundreds of milliseconds. You probably play most games at at least 64 ms delay as it is; there is nothing for you or most anyone to complain about.
People lack grounding; it is clear by these responses that they have no grounding and are baited into outrage from nothing. And no an online video is not an accurate reference.
You and everyone else has had to deal with over .1 second of delay in games and in real life from their own limited reaction time compounded by the reaction time of others their entire life.
Most reaction times are .25 - .45 seconds [250 - 450 milliseconds]. When things are unexpected but not necessarily startling, reaction times can be over a second.

I feel like I just trolled you all but you just trolled yourselves. Clearly your vote is meaningless.

FuryBladeborne

Regardless of how you feel about our meaningless votes, I vote no as well.

Input delay is a great way to make a game feel bad.

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