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Backpacks not Inventories.

2

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    hleVhleV Member
    edited September 2022
    Liniker wrote: »
    tautau wrote: »
    A bit off topic here...

    But @Sapiverenus may have the record for the lowest ratio of likes to posts on the boards. His ratio is .022 (two percent as many likes as posts).
    We can compare this to @SongRune at 93.2 (almost every single post has received at least one like) and @George_Black at 1.0 (rounded, with 2.5k posts and likes), which show that Song and George make posts which are respected and liked by the board population.

    Gratz Sap, you stand out!

    You deserve 100 likes for this comment LMAO
    While I do think OP is trolling or just really out there, you shouldn't encourage such posts.
    (OP could probably post a popular PvE-based opinion somewhere to get back into the "likes" game.)
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    The dev time is taking forever and yall act like everything is fine.

    It's not taking forever. It's only been just over 5 years since the Kickstarter launched. You would struggle to complete a Masters Degree in that time. I personally think that if it takes a person around 9 years from start to becoming a qualified Architect, for example. Then I'd expect the creation of a huge MMORPG to take at least as long.
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    CptBrownBeardCptBrownBeard Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Forget likes, we need the "lol" button back. Sap would be rolling in them.
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    It's interesting how some people will have developed a reputation for themselves before even Alpha 2 is out ;)
    r7ldqg4wh0yj.gif
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    tautautautau Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Quite right, Scar, some can do it in only a few days!
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    tautau wrote: »
    A bit off topic here...

    But @Sapiverenus may have the record for the lowest ratio of likes to posts on the boards. His ratio is .022 (two percent as many likes as posts).
    We can compare this to @SongRune at 93.2 (almost every single post has received at least one like) and @George_Black at 1.0 (rounded, with 2.5k posts and likes), which show that Song and George make posts which are respected and liked by the board population.

    Gratz Sap, you stand out!

    do-me-drax.gif
    This link may help you: https://ashesofcreation.wiki/


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    HinotoriHinotori Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    @daveywavey 4K LIKES!?!?!?!?

    this is a certified froot pog moment!

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    Noaani at over 5k :o
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    WHIT3ROS3 wrote: »
    The dev time is taking forever and yall act like everything is fine.

    It's not taking forever. It's only been just over 5 years since the Kickstarter launched. You would struggle to complete a Masters Degree in that time. I personally think that if it takes a person around 9 years from start to becoming a qualified Architect, for example. Then I'd expect the creation of a huge MMORPG to take at least as long.

    That's 1 person lol. Without skill. What is this comparison.

    Most tools are already provided by Unreal. Animation & Modelling tools are often very streamlined and people that aren't green tend to produce high quality animations/ models relatively quickly.
    Given that there were 17 employees 5 or so years ago and it's only been growing (according to Sharif) it is suspicious. There are even tools in Unreal to get an MMO running day 1; this can't be used on launch but is fine for getting playtesting going.
    You don't need more than 1 netcode guy unless you're constantly fiddling with stuff and creating unique mechanics near launch. Or you hired the wrong person lol. Maybe they need an assistant; not sure; but that's 1 netcode guy that's great at what he does and 1 intern/assistant college student that will learn a hell of a lot and work for "free" [knowledge/training].

    Everything suggests inexperience from this company so I guess you're right about the college parallel lol. You are right that Sharif was completely unprepared and who knows who he is hiring or why.


    Copying over some backpack stuff I posted in relation to Hotkeys:

    As for Inventory: Open Backpack.

    Take off physical backpack or open Easy Access menu.
    How?
    Tap F -> easy access container menu opens with locations on the screen different based on what container it is; belt type stuff is at the bottom, side bags are at the side.
    Hold F -> cursor appears and you can click on something.

    Hold Shift + Tap F ->Takes the main bag off and puts it in your hand or in front of you; this can take variable time to take off based on relative backpack weight/size ->
    Large and heavy is 2 seconds to take off, 1.5 seconds for medium, .75 second for light. When in combat this decreases by .25 seconds for each.

    If you're holding a light or medium pack and have an open hand, you hold the bag in your hand and can hold left/right click to open and hold left/right click then press E to drop or Hold E to throw.

    Tap E interacts. Hold E to steal or Hold Left/Right Click [left/right hand] then Tap E to drop or Hold E to throw.
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    tautau wrote: »
    A bit off topic here...

    But @Sapiverenus may have the record for the lowest ratio of likes to posts on the boards. His ratio is .022 (two percent as many likes as posts).
    We can compare this to @SongRune at 93.2 (almost every single post has received at least one like) and @George_Black at 1.0 (rounded, with 2.5k posts and likes), which show that Song and George make posts which are respected and liked by the board population.

    Gratz Sap, you stand out!

    Now on topic. Alpha 1 was not intended to be a completed game, it was not intended to be 'fun' and it was not intended to be an example of what AoC will be like when it was released. They made that very clear to those of us who volunteered for the test. I think you misunderstood the purpose of Alpha 1, Sap.

    The Wiki (found at https://ashesofcreation.wiki/) will give you far better information about the game's "deep design."

    Do me next!
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    Also terrible idea OP
    GJjUGHx.gif
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    Dolyem wrote: »
    Also terrible idea OP

    There needs to be more ways to interact with the world.
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    DolyemDolyem Member
    edited September 2022
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Also terrible idea OP

    There needs to be more ways to interact with the world.

    Sure, but none of them should be bad ways. This is a bad way.
    GJjUGHx.gif
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    @Dolyem
    Elaborate. Carrying things has 0 weight to it except maximum inventory space; which is pennies given you can stack things to obscene amounts and have 40 or more spaces. A piece of paper and 20 ore (which makes about 2 pieces of armor) take up the same space.
    You can't just take off and move a bag because everything is a token of an item rather than an actual item.

    There is no physical interaction between the world and its resources once it reaches your bag; then it's GM tier where you can summon from your bag or banish the item to Deletion at whim.

    This isn't my argument it's an introduction to a different kind of gameplay and dynamic.
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    FenlohFenloh Member
    edited September 2022
    Greetings. In my opinion, immersion in a computergame is nice, but is it playable? I can understand that you WANT this. But have you PLAYED already a game with these requests implemented? How was that experience. WHY do you want it. Just for immersion? For Gameplay issues? To enforce more Party play?

    There is a difference between possible, interesting, likeable and playable. A lot of things get tested and make it in the game or get scrapped. Instead of bitching about that for the most part, maybe you can try constructive critisim, and enjoy that there is so much testing of new possibilities. You could say... oh I do not like this, but then you should say - I would like it better this way BECAUSE....

    If you want immersion on a level that will beat any computer game any time, at least for the time being, play tabletop RPGs. With a group of friends. At home. Or with a virtual Tabletop. There you can have all what you want at a level that you want.

    BR
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    SapiverenusSapiverenus Member
    edited September 2022
    Fenloh wrote: »
    Greetings. In my opinion, immersion in a computergame is nice, but is it playable? I can understand that you WANT this. But have you PLAYED already a game with these requests implemented? How was that experience. WHY do you want it. Just for immersion? For Gameplay issues? To enforce more Party play?

    There is a difference between possible, interesting, likeable and playable. A lot of things get tested and make it in the game or get scrapped. Instead of bitching about that for the most part, maybe you can try constructive critisim, and enjoy that there is so much testing of new possibilities. You could say... oh I do not like this, but then you should say - I would like it better this way BECAUSE....

    If you want immersion on a level that will beat any computer game any time, at least for the time being, play tabletop RPGs. With a group of friends. At home. Or with a virtual Tabletop. There you can have all what you want at a level that you want.

    BR

    A lot of things get tested and scrapped out of inability to fidget it into something good or figure out what's missing.
    What is this about possibilities and constructive criticism I'm missing; when all I've done is suggest some constructive changes that permit for more possibilities? You are veiling your bitching about my post very thinly.

    Tabletop RPGs are not great immersion. The only 'immersion' is that you can simply write/speak something into existance. This is fine and developing a game [mechanics] is immersive; playing one is less so immersive for anyone that is "mechanically inclined".

    Maybe you can grind some XP on your mobile game? Farmville perhaps?

    I don't like Tabletop RPGs. I like mechanics. Real things. Things that do something on their own because they exist.
    The way it is it seems like Tabletop RPGs are more your thing.
    Two-faced rat
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    @Dolyem
    Elaborate. Carrying things has 0 weight to it except maximum inventory space; which is pennies given you can stack things to obscene amounts and have 40 or more spaces. A piece of paper and 20 ore (which makes about 2 pieces of armor) take up the same space.
    You can't just take off and move a bag because everything is a token of an item rather than an actual item.

    There is no physical interaction between the world and its resources once it reaches your bag; then it's GM tier where you can summon from your bag or banish the item to Deletion at whim.

    This isn't my argument it's an introduction to a different kind of gameplay and dynamic.

    Your argument has less to do with dynamic and more to do with a realistic feel and a hard limit to gameplay. MMOs are heavy grinds and tend to require an unrealistic amount of inventory space which progresses over the course of leveling up. There are limits. But limiting yourself to a couple of pieces of ore, a stick, and a piece of armor is bland gameplay. You have to factor in the whole of a games design, and ashes is being made to have players go out and gather mass amounts of materials for large endeavors
    If you want realism, go play a game that focuses on that. This is a fantasy mmorpg. If nothing else, just roleplay that you have a bag of holding or something, problem solved.
    GJjUGHx.gif
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    SapiverenusSapiverenus Member
    edited September 2022
    Dolyem wrote: »
    @Dolyem
    Elaborate. Carrying things has 0 weight to it except maximum inventory space; which is pennies given you can stack things to obscene amounts and have 40 or more spaces. A piece of paper and 20 ore (which makes about 2 pieces of armor) take up the same space.
    You can't just take off and move a bag because everything is a token of an item rather than an actual item.

    There is no physical interaction between the world and its resources once it reaches your bag; then it's GM tier where you can summon from your bag or banish the item to Deletion at whim.

    This isn't my argument it's an introduction to a different kind of gameplay and dynamic.

    Your argument has less to do with dynamic and more to do with a realistic feel and a hard limit to gameplay. MMOs are heavy grinds and tend to require an unrealistic amount of inventory space which progresses over the course of leveling up. There are limits. But limiting yourself to a couple of pieces of ore, a stick, and a piece of armor is bland gameplay. You have to factor in the whole of a games design, and ashes is being made to have players go out and gather mass amounts of materials for large endeavors
    If you want realism, go play a game that focuses on that. This is a fantasy mmorpg. If nothing else, just roleplay that you have a bag of holding or something, problem solved.

    I have done nothing but factor in the whole of it and you're giving me rehearsed platitudes ffs. Respond to shit I say instead of monologuing.

    Haven't you been reading my messages? I'm pretty sure I've seen you posting in similar threads for a couple days.

    Well I guess not. I'll go ahead and try to keep it brief then:
    It's a game resting partially on resource management. Requiring 10, 000 ore to make a set of gear is not intelligent or fun design. If I suggested the addition of tedious shit then yeah that would be bad.
    But many of the characters are physical classes with above average or monsterous strength that can carry a shit ton; there are animals with packs; there are caravans that transport goods; and this 'world' "Verra" is about as big as a suburban neighborhood.
    There's no point to Caravans if your character carries enough ore or whatever resources for 10 whole sets of armor, weapons, enough wood for 3 houses, et cetera et cetera.
    The game already has plans to limit your carry amount and to have you lose shit on death.
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    DolyemDolyem Member
    edited September 2022
    Dolyem wrote: »
    @Dolyem
    Elaborate. Carrying things has 0 weight to it except maximum inventory space; which is pennies given you can stack things to obscene amounts and have 40 or more spaces. A piece of paper and 20 ore (which makes about 2 pieces of armor) take up the same space.
    You can't just take off and move a bag because everything is a token of an item rather than an actual item.

    There is no physical interaction between the world and its resources once it reaches your bag; then it's GM tier where you can summon from your bag or banish the item to Deletion at whim.

    This isn't my argument it's an introduction to a different kind of gameplay and dynamic.

    Your argument has less to do with dynamic and more to do with a realistic feel and a hard limit to gameplay. MMOs are heavy grinds and tend to require an unrealistic amount of inventory space which progresses over the course of leveling up. There are limits. But limiting yourself to a couple of pieces of ore, a stick, and a piece of armor is bland gameplay. You have to factor in the whole of a games design, and ashes is being made to have players go out and gather mass amounts of materials for large endeavors
    If you want realism, go play a game that focuses on that. This is a fantasy mmorpg. If nothing else, just roleplay that you have a bag of holding or something, problem solved.

    I have done nothing but factor in the whole of it and you're giving me rehearsed platitudes ffs. Respond to shit I say instead of monologuing.

    Haven't you been reading my messages? I'm pretty sure I've seen you posting in similar threads for a couple days.

    You clearly needed an explanation since you obviously don't play or know much about mmo's. Your bag idea sounds like an awful game mechanic because it doesn't fit in an mmorpg, and it would be a waste of development resources on a pointless hindrance in an effort to appease an escape from tarkov player who is clearly lost.
    GJjUGHx.gif
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    Dolyem wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »
    @Dolyem
    Elaborate. Carrying things has 0 weight to it except maximum inventory space; which is pennies given you can stack things to obscene amounts and have 40 or more spaces. A piece of paper and 20 ore (which makes about 2 pieces of armor) take up the same space.
    You can't just take off and move a bag because everything is a token of an item rather than an actual item.

    There is no physical interaction between the world and its resources once it reaches your bag; then it's GM tier where you can summon from your bag or banish the item to Deletion at whim.

    This isn't my argument it's an introduction to a different kind of gameplay and dynamic.

    Your argument has less to do with dynamic and more to do with a realistic feel and a hard limit to gameplay. MMOs are heavy grinds and tend to require an unrealistic amount of inventory space which progresses over the course of leveling up. There are limits. But limiting yourself to a couple of pieces of ore, a stick, and a piece of armor is bland gameplay. You have to factor in the whole of a games design, and ashes is being made to have players go out and gather mass amounts of materials for large endeavors
    If you want realism, go play a game that focuses on that. This is a fantasy mmorpg. If nothing else, just roleplay that you have a bag of holding or something, problem solved.

    I have done nothing but factor in the whole of it and you're giving me rehearsed platitudes ffs. Respond to shit I say instead of monologuing.

    Haven't you been reading my messages? I'm pretty sure I've seen you posting in similar threads for a couple days.

    You clearly needed an explanation since you obviously don't play or know much about mmo's. Your bag idea sounds like an awful game mechanic because it doesn't fit in an mmorpg, and it would be a waste of development resources on a pointless hindrance in an effort to appease an escape from tarkov player who is clearly lost.

    What is this idea that genre precedent is all you need to discuss something? Are you just incapable of discussing the topic? Are you scared of sounding dumb if you try?

    I wasn't aware you were discussing anything. Rather just getting angry at people disagreeing with you.
    GJjUGHx.gif
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    @Dolyem
    Because you lack reading comprehension and anything to contribute to the topic.
    Dolyem wrote: »
    @Dolyem
    Elaborate. Carrying things has 0 weight to it except maximum inventory space; which is pennies given you can stack things to obscene amounts and have 40 or more spaces. A piece of paper and 20 ore (which makes about 2 pieces of armor) take up the same space.
    You can't just take off and move a bag because everything is a token of an item rather than an actual item.

    There is no physical interaction between the world and its resources once it reaches your bag; then it's GM tier where you can summon from your bag or banish the item to Deletion at whim.

    This isn't my argument it's an introduction to a different kind of gameplay and dynamic.

    Your argument has less to do with dynamic and more to do with a realistic feel and a hard limit to gameplay. MMOs are heavy grinds and tend to require an unrealistic amount of inventory space which progresses over the course of leveling up. There are limits. But limiting yourself to a couple of pieces of ore, a stick, and a piece of armor is bland gameplay. You have to factor in the whole of a games design, and ashes is being made to have players go out and gather mass amounts of materials for large endeavors
    If you want realism, go play a game that focuses on that. This is a fantasy mmorpg. If nothing else, just roleplay that you have a bag of holding or something, problem solved.

    I did contribute. You just weren't happy that it wasn't what you wanted to hear. Your idea is bad for the mmorpg as it is designed. It is better suited for.a game like tarkov or some battle royale. Maybe conan exiles.

    GJjUGHx.gif
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    Dolyem wrote: »

    I did contribute. You just weren't happy that it wasn't what you wanted to hear. Your idea is bad for the mmorpg as it is designed. It is better suited for.a game like tarkov or some battle royale. Maybe conan exiles.[/spoiler]

    I admit that in this specific thread you gave the most constructive input out of all of the ones you replied to me in.

    Your characterization of a limit to inventory is:

    "MMOs are heavy grinds and tend to require an unrealistic amount of inventory space which progresses over the course of leveling up. There are limits. But limiting yourself to a couple of pieces of ore, a stick, and a piece of armor is bland gameplay"

    Which is simply dishonest and not what I suggested. I suggested limits. You said there are limits. I haven't suggested a limit of a couple pieces of ore, a stick, and a piece of armor; it isn't very relevant. I suggested very large packs for stronger characters and smaller ones for lighter characters, and less tedious resource requirements for simple gear.

    Then you just start feuding ->
    "You clearly needed an explanation since you obviously don't play or know much about mmo's. Your bag idea sounds like an awful game mechanic because it doesn't fit in an mmorpg, and it would be a waste of development resources on a pointless hindrance in an effort to appease an escape from tarkov player who is clearly lost. "

    So no you can't discuss jack shit. You drop your rehearsed opinion then start feuding.
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    I have done nothing but factor in the whole of it and you're giving me rehearsed platitudes ffs. Respond to shit I say instead of monologuing.

    Haven't you been reading my messages? I'm pretty sure I've seen you posting in similar threads for a couple days.
    Dolyem wrote: »

    I did contribute. You just weren't happy that it wasn't what you wanted to hear. Your idea is bad for the mmorpg as it is designed. It is better suited for.a game like tarkov or some battle royale. Maybe conan exiles.[/spoiler]

    I admit that in this specific thread you gave the most constructive input out of all of the ones you replied to me in.

    Your characterization of a limit to inventory is:

    "MMOs are heavy grinds and tend to require an unrealistic amount of inventory space which progresses over the course of leveling up. There are limits. But limiting yourself to a couple of pieces of ore, a stick, and a piece of armor is bland gameplay"

    Which is simply dishonest and not what I suggested. I suggested limits. You said there are limits. I haven't suggested a limit of a couple pieces of ore, a stick, and a piece of armor; it isn't very relevant. I suggested very large packs for stronger characters and smaller ones for lighter characters, and less tedious resource requirements for simple gear.

    Then you just start feuding ->
    "You clearly needed an explanation since you obviously don't play or know much about mmo's. Your bag idea sounds like an awful game mechanic because it doesn't fit in an mmorpg, and it would be a waste of development resources on a pointless hindrance in an effort to appease an escape from tarkov player who is clearly lost. "

    So no you can't discuss jack shit. You drop your rehearsed opinion then start feuding.

    Did I start the fueding? Pretty sure I wasn't the one who started out being disrespectful.
    GJjUGHx.gif
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    edited September 2022
    Backpacks are a terrible idea. With crafting being such a huge part of AoC why would you make it more difficult and tedious for people to carry items? Being hindered in combat? hiding gold? this will just make the player experience worse. Every MMO I have ever played uses bags... MMO players like bags.

    Adding an arbitrary backpack system with less bag space is just an unneeded addition adding friction for no reason and I'd argue going off your other posts you are just trying to add survival game systems to an MMO, my friend you need to understand the genre you are in.
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    "Literal backpacks. Get people to carry your stuff for you. Be hindered in combat if you don't take it off.
    Catch people trying to steal your stuff. Hide your gold somewhere in a hole. Stronger people can carry more. Carry stuff in a cart from one place to another"

    Sounds like you want to play homeless simulator
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    SapiverenusSapiverenus Member
    edited September 2022
    Backpacks are a terrible idea. With crafting being such a huge part of AoC why would you make it more difficult and tedious for people to carry items? Being hindered in combat? hiding gold? this will just make the player experience worse. Every MMO I have ever played uses bags... MMO players like bags.

    Adding an arbitrary backpack system with less bag space is just an unneeded addition adding friction for no reason and I'd argue going off your other posts you are just trying to add survival game systems to an MMO, my friend you need to understand the genre you are in.

    What is "less bag space" to you.

    The genre is massively multiplayer online role-play game.
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    Dolyem wrote: »

    Did I start the fueding? Pretty sure I wasn't the one who started out being disrespectful.

    I doubt you honestly believe that but to be clear: you did.
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    Literal backpacks. Get people to carry your stuff for you. Be hindered in combat if you don't take it off.
    Catch people trying to steal your stuff. Hide your gold somewhere in a hole. Stronger people can carry more. Carry stuff in a cart from one place to another. Build minetracks from the quarry/mine to the processing area or animal harnessed cart.

    Most characters are stronger than your average person so it's not a big deal for the Tank to be using a backpack larger than himself; so what's the issue?
    Designing a game around stacks of 1000 wood or whatever isn't respecting your time it's making the whole game solo-able lol; no point to it. Most people are useless to others in an MMO; why wouldn't you make it a cooperative game by having constraints.

    Everyone complains about lack of meaningful socialization but this is the solution they're anxious about promoting.

    And if backpacks are a thing, so should pockets. Keep keys and whatever in pockets. On your belt. Whatever. Small items should get their own space for better organization and no competition with "Inventory" where you have to pick out which item is the key or small note amongst 50 other items.

    That sounds very UN-quality of life
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    @SirChancelot

    Bag space would be similar enough; other than that it would amount to some unique interactions between stuff, players and world.
    Cooperative players experience greater benefit from said cooperation.

    I imagine Nodes have protected storage [besides if a siege succeeds] so it should be fine.
    Creates demand for strong guilds & mayors as well, which is neat.

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    SapiverenusSapiverenus Member
    edited September 2022
    If the Bags don't need to be sorted based on fragility, volume and weight, how will everyone great at bag sorting get enjoyment out of the game?
    :,(

    Some sort of improvement to how bag items are displayed and fill the space would be great though. If anyone has ideas let everyone else know. Or anything tangentially related to that.
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