I still don't understand why this item type is necessary. It's just bloat. In a game that by its nature must already have some of the most robust and complex itemization out there. If it's just to give people money while they level, just give them the money outright, at that point.
If it isn't going to flag them, it can't be lost, it's entire purpose is to sell to NPC for Currency... just give them the currency for the kill and be done with it.
I believe they put it in to get people to use the caravan system or even just to.make it more realistic. Steven doesn't like wolves dropping gold. And since he is the one making the game we kinda gotta just put up with it. Doubt he will change his mind on this.
I still don't understand why this item type is necessary. It's just bloat. In a game that by its nature must already have some of the most robust and complex itemization out there. If it's just to give people money while they level, just give them the money outright, at that point.
If it isn't going to flag them, it can't be lost, it's entire purpose is to sell to NPC for Currency... just give them the currency for the kill and be done with it.
I believe they put it in to get people to use the caravan system or even just to.make it more realistic. Steven doesn't like wolves dropping gold. And since he is the one making the game we kinda gotta just put up with it. Doubt he will change his mind on this.
I'm moreso arguing the other part. If Wolves must drop SOMETHING, then that something should have some use or meaning, not just 'hey this NPC will buy this because they're an idiot and will literally pay you silver for stuff they will never use'.
Which means that it is Caravan/'Soft Flag' material. Literally.
I believe they put it in to get people to use the caravan system or even just to.make it more realistic. Steven doesn't like wolves dropping gold. And since he is the one making the game we kinda gotta just put up with it. Doubt he will change his mind on this.
I think Azherae is asking about the OP's incessant love for trash items, while Ashes won't have those.
Though I'd assume that love comes mainly from the fact that the suggestion barely works w/o such trash items
I'm moreso arguing the other part. If Wolves must drop SOMETHING, then that something should have some use or meaning, not just 'hey this NPC will buy this because they're an idiot and will literally pay you silver for stuff they will never use'.
Which means that it is Caravan/'Soft Flag' material. Literally.
Is it 100% confirmed they will have no other use? I agree with you it should be a choice between using them for crafting or to make some money.
Also would be fine with mobs dropping both the trash npc vendor items and a chance to drop rare crafting items.
Example - wolf fur 75% drop chance, wolf tooth 5% drop chance 9 wolf teeth make wolf's dagger
I believe they put it in to get people to use the caravan system or even just to.make it more realistic. Steven doesn't like wolves dropping gold. And since he is the one making the game we kinda gotta just put up with it. Doubt he will change his mind on this.
I think Azherae is asking about the OP's incessant love for trash items, while Ashes won't have those.
Though I'd assume that love comes mainly from the fact that the suggestion barely works w/o such trash items
That's what I'm trying to point out to OP. Once you have to start changing other systems to make your change to a system work it's time to accept it's a bad idea.
Its not really hard to add trash items to a loot table for the purpose of making it work.
Because wolves wont drop gold coin, they will drop fur (flaggable) and a broken tooth (100% junk item) that little jimmy will buy for 1s each, regardless if it was a winter wolf, a summer wolf,. a wolf from africa, a wolf from russia.
Its not a major overhaul to add basic junk items. That is probably the most simplest thing they can do
{UPK} United Player Killer - All your loot belongs to us.
Its not really hard to add trash items to a loot table for the purpose of making it work.
Because wolves wont drop gold coin, they will drop fur (flaggable) and a broken tooth (100% junk item) that little jimmy will buy for 1s each, regardless if it was a winter wolf, a summer wolf,. a wolf from africa, a wolf from russia.
Its not a major overhaul to add basic junk items. That is probably the most simplest thing they can do
I mean. Yeah. It's very easy. It's just very pointless. Trash drops exist only to force players to play the 'inventory' minigame, and sometimes to force players to stop farming and go home early if they want to keep getting that little bit of money for their grinding. That doesn't add to the game, it only detracts from it.
This doesn't even benefit the system you proposed, @novercalis. You don't need grey items to make it work. If it soft-flagged for "everything above grey" and there was no grey, then it would work exactly the same, soft-flagging for all valuable items. What am I missing? Is it that you want players to lose/drop the grey items when they finally soft-flag from a green one and get ganked? There's really no other reason not to just give silver directly.
this is to appease the PVE player who is looking to grind for XP, quest for XP and make some coin, because he/she doesnt like PVP.
This gives them just a tiny extra layer of protection.
They can still be killed, still be attacked - at the cost of the other individual hard flagging maybe and accepting the consequence of killing someone who isnt carrying anything of value. (Value being anything used by AoC game mechanics such as crafting, smelting, deconstruction maybe, resources to start wars, mats, recipes, etc)
Let the player walk that dumb thin line - they want safety - this is the best they can get. Let them be enticed by soft flagging for real coins and enter the world of pvp risk vs reward.
Why is the notion of giving this TINY SECTOR such a big deal? Let's look at previous open world pvp.
Wow - Classic WoW - ppl left servers and all servers are lopsided for 1 faction, ppl dont want it.
New World - ppl dont flag up for it.
EQ - PVP servers died first before eq died. P99 Red Servers r dead compared to blue/green server.
Ultima Online - the carebears ruined it and we got Trammel.
Mortal, Age of Conan, several Korean MMO..
I have very little experience with Archeage, but the recent fresh start drove many away with the one shot pvp aspect of things.
YES THE CORRUPTION SYSTEM IS THERE TO AVOID MANY OF THESE PROBLEMS and I am not changing nothing about that. Merely enforcing it and giving the tiniest protection for the guy who just wants to get XP.
Why is that a bad thing. Why is killing someone who has nothing for you to sell to an AH or other players or provide for your node so worth it?
Instead of gatekeeping and scaring players - find some medium. Most ppl are trying to push a pve server or a toggle feature.. NO...
But this covers their main crux - "I just wanna level up in peace", "I got only 2 hours to play and just being harassed/bullied/gank/grief/annoyed by so and so player(s)", "I dont want to PVP at lvl 5, 10,20,30,40 or until I am max level, leave me alone'.
COOL - here is the deal - go fucking level up, DONT FUCKING LOOT ANY RESOURCES - take the trash item and turn that crappy copper coin in. It will take you a long time, like a F2P in a P2W game - difference is P2W in this aspect is - Soft Flag yourself n fight/run/defend!
These trash items arent even worth killing someone who grinded 500 pocket lint.
Pocket Lint - lil jimmy will buy it for 1c each... or 50s total.
You - the soft flagger can kill a goblin and get goblin blood, probably worth 10s to an NPC or more to another player since it's used in recipes.... so its not even worth your time to kill that PvE not flagged player up. He probably had to kill 100 goblins, whereas you got balls to play the pvp game, and looted not only some lint, but the goblin blood. congrats - let him be. He made his decision, he choose his risk/reward. No Risk, No Reward. It will take forever get wealth in the game via this process.
{UPK} United Player Killer - All your loot belongs to us.
First of all, why are you love tapping for? Resources I assume, not just mindlessly killing someone for the funsies.
If it's for the potential resource he/she is carrying let's continue on.
Regardless of my idea being added - INTENTION was there, you planned to kill someone for their resources.
Instead of suggesting a TOGGLE pvp bullshit - I am suggesting, carrying specific items, mats, resources toggles you into PVP. So now, you can leave the PVE player alone who has nothing to loot.
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
{UPK} United Player Killer - All your loot belongs to us.
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
I don't understand what purpose your system has. If people can still hard flag to kill random people questing what protection are you giving them? If the jerk wants to kill you he doesn't care if he has to hard flag or not.
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
I don't understand what purpose your system has. If people can still hard flag to kill random people questing what protection are you giving them? If the jerk wants to kill you he doesn't care if he has to hard flag or not.
he just wants to see who has valuables on them so he can cherry pick who to kill. thats it. other than that, that system would be completely pointless and redundant
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
I don't understand what purpose your system has. If people can still hard flag to kill random people questing what protection are you giving them? If the jerk wants to kill you he doesn't care if he has to hard flag or not.
Lets assume - current corruption system
a lvl 60 killing a lvl 1
Corruption point is the maximum 100 corruption points. Serious Dampen of stats and all that jazz.
With Hard Flag - you intentionally knew, this person doesnt have NOTHING and still choose to kill this person.
He doesnt fight back and gives you corruption. Now it's double.
Reinforces the purpose of corruption system - to discourage non-meaningful pvp conflicts.
To Depraved - you seems dead set to consistently accuse me of that out of the blue with no reasoning. I've stated and told you that doesnt matter. If I was hunting gatherers on my max level toon, and accepted today I am gonna get corrupted - it wouldnt have change any outcome. I was logging in that day with the intention to kill players for resources. I'd rather avoid killing someone who aint got shit and leave them be. But I still wouldnt know who has what, who isnt soft flag, I still had to initiate combat.
Now, I found someone soft flag by initiating, realize he/she isnt fight back, I am purple still and BH can spot me now - Do I continue and slay you or give up, cause you didnt fight back n hide. I am still putting myself at other risks. I can't find out if you are soft flag until I become purple. So it's not like im gonna be running by every single person, punching them in the face to see if they are soft flag or not & hope they fight back, so I can attempt to avoid corruption.
seriously - come up with some other excuse, cause all I am getting, with your username is - you're the type of player that wants to grief and be perma red with benefits or find / found a potential loophole that you don't want shut down. Can I prove it? ABSOLUTELY NOT - just like your accusation towards me - but I guess going forward - this is what I believe now in terms of you.
There is a mute forum button - please use it on me unless you got meaningful dialog, explanation, why (in detail) this is good/bad and what you would suggest to finding a solution - or is it, u dont want a solution at all.
{UPK} United Player Killer - All your loot belongs to us.
Why would we assume that a lv60 PKs a lv1?
What are the reasons that a lv60 will do that?
Without any reasons you are just proposing developing changes based on nothing.
Why would a lv60 PK a lv1, lv5, lv10, lv20, lv35?
What for? Why would he risk his gear?
Why would we asse that a lv60 PK a lv1?
What are the reasons that a lv60 will do that?
Without any reasons you are just proposing developing changes based on nothing.
Why would a lv60 PK a lv1, lv5, lv10, lv20, lv35?
What for? Why would he risk his gear?
I think he honestly thinks there is gonna be a bunch of max level players killing random low levels for no other reason than because they can. If he actually understood anything about the corruption system he would know this isn't going to happen. No one besides the most depraved people are going to want to spend hours grinding away corruption or there negative xp from dying while corrupted, or risk losing gear, or want to go do some quest to get rid of that murder just to kill a noobie.
Why would a bunch of high lv players put themselves in a situation where there are no mobs of their high lv, since they are in areas of low lv players?
How would they burn of their corruption?
There are no teleports. They will be stuck there.
How many such people do you think exist OP?
100? Should IS change the game for 100 lunatics, whose actions will have ZERO impact in the progress of those low lv victims?
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
I don't understand what purpose your system has. If people can still hard flag to kill random people questing what protection are you giving them? If the jerk wants to kill you he doesn't care if he has to hard flag or not.
Lets assume - current corruption system
a lvl 60 killing a lvl 1
Corruption point is the maximum 100 corruption points. Serious Dampen of stats and all that jazz.
With Hard Flag - you intentionally knew, this person doesnt have NOTHING and still choose to kill this person.
He doesnt fight back and gives you corruption. Now it's double.
Reinforces the purpose of corruption system - to discourage non-meaningful pvp conflicts.
To Depraved - you seems dead set to consistently accuse me of that out of the blue with no reasoning. I've stated and told you that doesnt matter. If I was hunting gatherers on my max level toon, and accepted today I am gonna get corrupted - it wouldnt have change any outcome. I was logging in that day with the intention to kill players for resources. I'd rather avoid killing someone who aint got shit and leave them be. But I still wouldnt know who has what, who isnt soft flag, I still had to initiate combat.
Now, I found someone soft flag by initiating, realize he/she isnt fight back, I am purple still and BH can spot me now - Do I continue and slay you or give up, cause you didnt fight back n hide. I am still putting myself at other risks. I can't find out if you are soft flag until I become purple. So it's not like im gonna be running by every single person, punching them in the face to see if they are soft flag or not & hope they fight back, so I can attempt to avoid corruption.
seriously - come up with some other excuse, cause all I am getting, with your username is - you're the type of player that wants to grief and be perma red with benefits or find / found a potential loophole that you don't want shut down. Can I prove it? ABSOLUTELY NOT - just like your accusation towards me - but I guess going forward - this is what I believe now in terms of you.
There is a mute forum button - please use it on me unless you got meaningful dialog, explanation, why (in detail) this is good/bad and what you would suggest to finding a solution - or is it, u dont want a solution at all.
If the corruption system is balanced correctly your system is completely uneeded. We don't know numbers but we do know that you get more corruption for killing lower levels. The system should make it so killing a lv 1 is never worth it irregardless of if they have rare mats or not. If the system is done right killing even a lvl 30 at 50 will be worth only 1/1000 situations.
Your system actually does the opposite of what you want. Intrepid has stated that low level gatherables will still be useful in high level crafting. As such a system that tells me that low level players have rare gatherables makes me more inclined to kill them then a system that tells me nothing.
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
I don't understand what purpose your system has. If people can still hard flag to kill random people questing what protection are you giving them? If the jerk wants to kill you he doesn't care if he has to hard flag or not.
Lets assume - current corruption system
a lvl 60 killing a lvl 1
Corruption point is the maximum 100 corruption points. Serious Dampen of stats and all that jazz.
With Hard Flag - you intentionally knew, this person doesnt have NOTHING and still choose to kill this person.
He doesnt fight back and gives you corruption. Now it's double.
Reinforces the purpose of corruption system - to discourage non-meaningful pvp conflicts.
To Depraved - you seems dead set to consistently accuse me of that out of the blue with no reasoning. I've stated and told you that doesnt matter. If I was hunting gatherers on my max level toon, and accepted today I am gonna get corrupted - it wouldnt have change any outcome. I was logging in that day with the intention to kill players for resources. I'd rather avoid killing someone who aint got shit and leave them be. But I still wouldnt know who has what, who isnt soft flag, I still had to initiate combat.
Now, I found someone soft flag by initiating, realize he/she isnt fight back, I am purple still and BH can spot me now - Do I continue and slay you or give up, cause you didnt fight back n hide. I am still putting myself at other risks. I can't find out if you are soft flag until I become purple. So it's not like im gonna be running by every single person, punching them in the face to see if they are soft flag or not & hope they fight back, so I can attempt to avoid corruption.
seriously - come up with some other excuse, cause all I am getting, with your username is - you're the type of player that wants to grief and be perma red with benefits or find / found a potential loophole that you don't want shut down. Can I prove it? ABSOLUTELY NOT - just like your accusation towards me - but I guess going forward - this is what I believe now in terms of you.
There is a mute forum button - please use it on me unless you got meaningful dialog, explanation, why (in detail) this is good/bad and what you would suggest to finding a solution - or is it, u dont want a solution at all.
If the corruption system is balanced correctly your system is completely uneeded. We don't know numbers but we do know that you get more corruption for killing lower levels. The system should make it so killing a lv 1 is never worth it irregardless of if they have rare mats or not. If the system is done right killing even a lvl 30 at 50 will be worth only 1/1000 situations.
Your system actually does the opposite of what you want. Intrepid has stated that low level gatherables will still be useful in high level crafting. As such a system that tells me that low level players have rare gatherables makes me more inclined to kill them then a system that tells me nothing.
Currently - top guild gets lvl 1 alts to carry super rare mats from a raid dungeon back into town.
Someone is gonna have to kill this lvl 1 alt who is transporting all the goods.
This soft flag doesnt change the corruption point at all, but to say there is no gameplay to utilize lvl 1 to carry goods under the protection of corruption is also very viable.
{UPK} United Player Killer - All your loot belongs to us.
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
I don't understand what purpose your system has. If people can still hard flag to kill random people questing what protection are you giving them? If the jerk wants to kill you he doesn't care if he has to hard flag or not.
Lets assume - current corruption system
a lvl 60 killing a lvl 1
Corruption point is the maximum 100 corruption points. Serious Dampen of stats and all that jazz.
With Hard Flag - you intentionally knew, this person doesnt have NOTHING and still choose to kill this person.
He doesnt fight back and gives you corruption. Now it's double.
Reinforces the purpose of corruption system - to discourage non-meaningful pvp conflicts.
To Depraved - you seems dead set to consistently accuse me of that out of the blue with no reasoning. I've stated and told you that doesnt matter. If I was hunting gatherers on my max level toon, and accepted today I am gonna get corrupted - it wouldnt have change any outcome. I was logging in that day with the intention to kill players for resources. I'd rather avoid killing someone who aint got shit and leave them be. But I still wouldnt know who has what, who isnt soft flag, I still had to initiate combat.
Now, I found someone soft flag by initiating, realize he/she isnt fight back, I am purple still and BH can spot me now - Do I continue and slay you or give up, cause you didnt fight back n hide. I am still putting myself at other risks. I can't find out if you are soft flag until I become purple. So it's not like im gonna be running by every single person, punching them in the face to see if they are soft flag or not & hope they fight back, so I can attempt to avoid corruption.
seriously - come up with some other excuse, cause all I am getting, with your username is - you're the type of player that wants to grief and be perma red with benefits or find / found a potential loophole that you don't want shut down. Can I prove it? ABSOLUTELY NOT - just like your accusation towards me - but I guess going forward - this is what I believe now in terms of you.
There is a mute forum button - please use it on me unless you got meaningful dialog, explanation, why (in detail) this is good/bad and what you would suggest to finding a solution - or is it, u dont want a solution at all.
If the corruption system is balanced correctly your system is completely uneeded. We don't know numbers but we do know that you get more corruption for killing lower levels. The system should make it so killing a lv 1 is never worth it irregardless of if they have rare mats or not. If the system is done right killing even a lvl 30 at 50 will be worth only 1/1000 situations.
Your system actually does the opposite of what you want. Intrepid has stated that low level gatherables will still be useful in high level crafting. As such a system that tells me that low level players have rare gatherables makes me more inclined to kill them then a system that tells me nothing.
Currently - top guild gets lvl 1 alts to carry super rare mats from a raid dungeon back into town.
Someone is gonna have to kill this lvl 1 alt who is transporting all the goods.
This soft flag doesnt change the corruption point at all, but to say there is no gameplay to utilize lvl 1 to carry goods under the protection of corruption is also very viable.
A much easier fix to that is to make it so a lvl 1 can't equip tools to gather the super rare mats. If however you think high levels are just gonna run around with lvl 1 and pass all the mats to that lvl 1 then you just have to program a smarter mob ai where it targets lower levels first. Even in WOW this was somewhat a thing as the lower your level the higher the aggro range of mob was. Sure they might be able to keep that lvl 1 alive but it's gonna take a lot of effort and tbh if they are willing to put that effort in let them. Killing a lvl 1 in your system still gives you a ton of corruption it just doesn't double it. So again your not solving anything.
Also I thought your system was to protect low levels who just wanted to quest? Now that we have shut that down by saying the current corruption system will stop that you pivot to this but guilds will just have level 1 alts to hold there mats argument.
I'm sorry but it's a bad idea and it's time to just accept that.
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
I don't understand what purpose your system has. If people can still hard flag to kill random people questing what protection are you giving them? If the jerk wants to kill you he doesn't care if he has to hard flag or not.
Lets assume - current corruption system
a lvl 60 killing a lvl 1
Corruption point is the maximum 100 corruption points. Serious Dampen of stats and all that jazz.
With Hard Flag - you intentionally knew, this person doesnt have NOTHING and still choose to kill this person.
He doesnt fight back and gives you corruption. Now it's double.
Reinforces the purpose of corruption system - to discourage non-meaningful pvp conflicts.
To Depraved - you seems dead set to consistently accuse me of that out of the blue with no reasoning. I've stated and told you that doesnt matter. If I was hunting gatherers on my max level toon, and accepted today I am gonna get corrupted - it wouldnt have change any outcome. I was logging in that day with the intention to kill players for resources. I'd rather avoid killing someone who aint got shit and leave them be. But I still wouldnt know who has what, who isnt soft flag, I still had to initiate combat.
Now, I found someone soft flag by initiating, realize he/she isnt fight back, I am purple still and BH can spot me now - Do I continue and slay you or give up, cause you didnt fight back n hide. I am still putting myself at other risks. I can't find out if you are soft flag until I become purple. So it's not like im gonna be running by every single person, punching them in the face to see if they are soft flag or not & hope they fight back, so I can attempt to avoid corruption.
seriously - come up with some other excuse, cause all I am getting, with your username is - you're the type of player that wants to grief and be perma red with benefits or find / found a potential loophole that you don't want shut down. Can I prove it? ABSOLUTELY NOT - just like your accusation towards me - but I guess going forward - this is what I believe now in terms of you.
There is a mute forum button - please use it on me unless you got meaningful dialog, explanation, why (in detail) this is good/bad and what you would suggest to finding a solution - or is it, u dont want a solution at all.
If the corruption system is balanced correctly your system is completely uneeded. We don't know numbers but we do know that you get more corruption for killing lower levels. The system should make it so killing a lv 1 is never worth it irregardless of if they have rare mats or not. If the system is done right killing even a lvl 30 at 50 will be worth only 1/1000 situations.
Your system actually does the opposite of what you want. Intrepid has stated that low level gatherables will still be useful in high level crafting. As such a system that tells me that low level players have rare gatherables makes me more inclined to kill them then a system that tells me nothing.
Currently - top guild gets lvl 1 alts to carry super rare mats from a raid dungeon back into town.
Someone is gonna have to kill this lvl 1 alt who is transporting all the goods.
This soft flag doesnt change the corruption point at all, but to say there is no gameplay to utilize lvl 1 to carry goods under the protection of corruption is also very viable.
What crazy scenario is this now?
People are going to watch other raid witout PKing them, letting them get the drops, but they will PK the Lv1 chars that you imagine people will have to "safely carry mats"?
Why wouldnt the PKers kill the raiding group?
If the players choose to attack the Lv1 char, what is stopping the raiders from jumping on the PKer and take stuff back?
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
I don't understand what purpose your system has. If people can still hard flag to kill random people questing what protection are you giving them? If the jerk wants to kill you he doesn't care if he has to hard flag or not.
Lets assume - current corruption system
a lvl 60 killing a lvl 1
Corruption point is the maximum 100 corruption points. Serious Dampen of stats and all that jazz.
With Hard Flag - you intentionally knew, this person doesnt have NOTHING and still choose to kill this person.
He doesnt fight back and gives you corruption. Now it's double.
Reinforces the purpose of corruption system - to discourage non-meaningful pvp conflicts.
To Depraved - you seems dead set to consistently accuse me of that out of the blue with no reasoning. I've stated and told you that doesnt matter. If I was hunting gatherers on my max level toon, and accepted today I am gonna get corrupted - it wouldnt have change any outcome. I was logging in that day with the intention to kill players for resources. I'd rather avoid killing someone who aint got shit and leave them be. But I still wouldnt know who has what, who isnt soft flag, I still had to initiate combat.
Now, I found someone soft flag by initiating, realize he/she isnt fight back, I am purple still and BH can spot me now - Do I continue and slay you or give up, cause you didnt fight back n hide. I am still putting myself at other risks. I can't find out if you are soft flag until I become purple. So it's not like im gonna be running by every single person, punching them in the face to see if they are soft flag or not & hope they fight back, so I can attempt to avoid corruption.
seriously - come up with some other excuse, cause all I am getting, with your username is - you're the type of player that wants to grief and be perma red with benefits or find / found a potential loophole that you don't want shut down. Can I prove it? ABSOLUTELY NOT - just like your accusation towards me - but I guess going forward - this is what I believe now in terms of you.
There is a mute forum button - please use it on me unless you got meaningful dialog, explanation, why (in detail) this is good/bad and what you would suggest to finding a solution - or is it, u dont want a solution at all.
If the corruption system is balanced correctly your system is completely uneeded. We don't know numbers but we do know that you get more corruption for killing lower levels. The system should make it so killing a lv 1 is never worth it irregardless of if they have rare mats or not. If the system is done right killing even a lvl 30 at 50 will be worth only 1/1000 situations.
Your system actually does the opposite of what you want. Intrepid has stated that low level gatherables will still be useful in high level crafting. As such a system that tells me that low level players have rare gatherables makes me more inclined to kill them then a system that tells me nothing.
Currently - top guild gets lvl 1 alts to carry super rare mats from a raid dungeon back into town.
Someone is gonna have to kill this lvl 1 alt who is transporting all the goods.
This soft flag doesnt change the corruption point at all, but to say there is no gameplay to utilize lvl 1 to carry goods under the protection of corruption is also very viable.
A much easier fix to that is to make it so a lvl 1 can't equip tools to gather the super rare mats. If however you think high levels are just gonna run around with lvl 1 and pass all the mats to that lvl 1 then you just have to program a smarter mob ai where it targets lower levels first. Even in WOW this was somewhat a thing as the lower your level the higher the aggro range of mob was. Sure they might be able to keep that lvl 1 alive but it's gonna take a lot of effort and tbh if they are willing to put that effort in let them. Killing a lvl 1 in your system still gives you a ton of corruption it just doesn't double it. So again your not solving anything.
Also I thought your system was to protect low levels who just wanted to quest? Now that we have shut that down by saying the current corruption system will stop that you pivot to this but guilds will just have level 1 alts to hold there mats argument.
I'm sorry but it's a bad idea and it's time to just accept that.
family holds what 8 ppl? ensure 1 is a lvl 1 alt.
u can still have a high lvl gatherer get the mat and then pass it to the lvl 1 alt. Unless your restricting lvl 1 to carry or hold higher level items in their storage/bank/inventory. that in itself will cause an uproar.
You got a guild protecting the player. If it's 10 players, all max level with a max level gathering and they lose the fight - they lose their shit and got nothing out of it.
Here, u got 9 max players + the lvl 1. If they once again lose, at the least, they ensured as insurance, someone getting fucked and corrupted.
{UPK} United Player Killer - All your loot belongs to us.
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
I don't understand what purpose your system has. If people can still hard flag to kill random people questing what protection are you giving them? If the jerk wants to kill you he doesn't care if he has to hard flag or not.
Lets assume - current corruption system
a lvl 60 killing a lvl 1
Corruption point is the maximum 100 corruption points. Serious Dampen of stats and all that jazz.
With Hard Flag - you intentionally knew, this person doesnt have NOTHING and still choose to kill this person.
He doesnt fight back and gives you corruption. Now it's double.
Reinforces the purpose of corruption system - to discourage non-meaningful pvp conflicts.
To Depraved - you seems dead set to consistently accuse me of that out of the blue with no reasoning. I've stated and told you that doesnt matter. If I was hunting gatherers on my max level toon, and accepted today I am gonna get corrupted - it wouldnt have change any outcome. I was logging in that day with the intention to kill players for resources. I'd rather avoid killing someone who aint got shit and leave them be. But I still wouldnt know who has what, who isnt soft flag, I still had to initiate combat.
Now, I found someone soft flag by initiating, realize he/she isnt fight back, I am purple still and BH can spot me now - Do I continue and slay you or give up, cause you didnt fight back n hide. I am still putting myself at other risks. I can't find out if you are soft flag until I become purple. So it's not like im gonna be running by every single person, punching them in the face to see if they are soft flag or not & hope they fight back, so I can attempt to avoid corruption.
seriously - come up with some other excuse, cause all I am getting, with your username is - you're the type of player that wants to grief and be perma red with benefits or find / found a potential loophole that you don't want shut down. Can I prove it? ABSOLUTELY NOT - just like your accusation towards me - but I guess going forward - this is what I believe now in terms of you.
There is a mute forum button - please use it on me unless you got meaningful dialog, explanation, why (in detail) this is good/bad and what you would suggest to finding a solution - or is it, u dont want a solution at all.
If the corruption system is balanced correctly your system is completely uneeded. We don't know numbers but we do know that you get more corruption for killing lower levels. The system should make it so killing a lv 1 is never worth it irregardless of if they have rare mats or not. If the system is done right killing even a lvl 30 at 50 will be worth only 1/1000 situations.
Your system actually does the opposite of what you want. Intrepid has stated that low level gatherables will still be useful in high level crafting. As such a system that tells me that low level players have rare gatherables makes me more inclined to kill them then a system that tells me nothing.
Currently - top guild gets lvl 1 alts to carry super rare mats from a raid dungeon back into town.
Someone is gonna have to kill this lvl 1 alt who is transporting all the goods.
This soft flag doesnt change the corruption point at all, but to say there is no gameplay to utilize lvl 1 to carry goods under the protection of corruption is also very viable.
A much easier fix to that is to make it so a lvl 1 can't equip tools to gather the super rare mats. If however you think high levels are just gonna run around with lvl 1 and pass all the mats to that lvl 1 then you just have to program a smarter mob ai where it targets lower levels first. Even in WOW this was somewhat a thing as the lower your level the higher the aggro range of mob was. Sure they might be able to keep that lvl 1 alive but it's gonna take a lot of effort and tbh if they are willing to put that effort in let them. Killing a lvl 1 in your system still gives you a ton of corruption it just doesn't double it. So again your not solving anything.
Also I thought your system was to protect low levels who just wanted to quest? Now that we have shut that down by saying the current corruption system will stop that you pivot to this but guilds will just have level 1 alts to hold there mats argument.
I'm sorry but it's a bad idea and it's time to just accept that.
family holds what 8 ppl? ensure 1 is a lvl 1 alt.
u can still have a high lvl gatherer get the mat and then pass it to the lvl 1 alt. Unless your restricting lvl 1 to carry or hold higher level items in their storage/bank/inventory. that in itself will cause an uproar.
You got a guild protecting the player. If it's 10 players, all max level with a max level gathering and they lose the fight - they lose their shit and got nothing out of it.
Here, u got 9 max players + the lvl 1. If they once again lose, at the least, they ensured as insurance, someone getting fucked and corrupted.
This is an incoherent mess you are all over the place and I literally can't even understand what you are even trying to say. Point is in both systems you kill the level 1 as a lvl 50 u r fucked with corruption unless in your system lvl 1's with rare mats are free game giving only normal corruption for an equally leveled player. If that's the case you are screwing 99% of the player base who from level 1 will participate in all aspects of the game to protect the ones who only want to quest.
You do know that when you die you don't lose all of the gatherables right? If you have 10 max levels you are much more likely to win the fight then with 1 player gimped. And if you all fight back you will lose 10% atm of what you had. You still got 90% of what you needed.
Idk if you want people to have the level 1 gatherer or not because your arguments are terribly worded.
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I believe they put it in to get people to use the caravan system or even just to.make it more realistic. Steven doesn't like wolves dropping gold. And since he is the one making the game we kinda gotta just put up with it. Doubt he will change his mind on this.
I'm moreso arguing the other part. If Wolves must drop SOMETHING, then that something should have some use or meaning, not just 'hey this NPC will buy this because they're an idiot and will literally pay you silver for stuff they will never use'.
Which means that it is Caravan/'Soft Flag' material. Literally.
Though I'd assume that love comes mainly from the fact that the suggestion barely works w/o such trash items
Is it 100% confirmed they will have no other use? I agree with you it should be a choice between using them for crafting or to make some money.
Also would be fine with mobs dropping both the trash npc vendor items and a chance to drop rare crafting items.
Example - wolf fur 75% drop chance, wolf tooth 5% drop chance 9 wolf teeth make wolf's dagger
That's what I'm trying to point out to OP. Once you have to start changing other systems to make your change to a system work it's time to accept it's a bad idea.
Because wolves wont drop gold coin, they will drop fur (flaggable) and a broken tooth (100% junk item) that little jimmy will buy for 1s each, regardless if it was a winter wolf, a summer wolf,. a wolf from africa, a wolf from russia.
Its not a major overhaul to add basic junk items. That is probably the most simplest thing they can do
I mean. Yeah. It's very easy. It's just very pointless. Trash drops exist only to force players to play the 'inventory' minigame, and sometimes to force players to stop farming and go home early if they want to keep getting that little bit of money for their grinding. That doesn't add to the game, it only detracts from it.
This doesn't even benefit the system you proposed, @novercalis. You don't need grey items to make it work. If it soft-flagged for "everything above grey" and there was no grey, then it would work exactly the same, soft-flagging for all valuable items. What am I missing? Is it that you want players to lose/drop the grey items when they finally soft-flag from a green one and get ganked? There's really no other reason not to just give silver directly.
This gives them just a tiny extra layer of protection.
They can still be killed, still be attacked - at the cost of the other individual hard flagging maybe and accepting the consequence of killing someone who isnt carrying anything of value. (Value being anything used by AoC game mechanics such as crafting, smelting, deconstruction maybe, resources to start wars, mats, recipes, etc)
Let the player walk that dumb thin line - they want safety - this is the best they can get. Let them be enticed by soft flagging for real coins and enter the world of pvp risk vs reward.
Why is the notion of giving this TINY SECTOR such a big deal? Let's look at previous open world pvp.
Wow - Classic WoW - ppl left servers and all servers are lopsided for 1 faction, ppl dont want it.
New World - ppl dont flag up for it.
EQ - PVP servers died first before eq died. P99 Red Servers r dead compared to blue/green server.
Ultima Online - the carebears ruined it and we got Trammel.
Mortal, Age of Conan, several Korean MMO..
I have very little experience with Archeage, but the recent fresh start drove many away with the one shot pvp aspect of things.
YES THE CORRUPTION SYSTEM IS THERE TO AVOID MANY OF THESE PROBLEMS and I am not changing nothing about that. Merely enforcing it and giving the tiniest protection for the guy who just wants to get XP.
Why is that a bad thing. Why is killing someone who has nothing for you to sell to an AH or other players or provide for your node so worth it?
Instead of gatekeeping and scaring players - find some medium. Most ppl are trying to push a pve server or a toggle feature.. NO...
But this covers their main crux - "I just wanna level up in peace", "I got only 2 hours to play and just being harassed/bullied/gank/grief/annoyed by so and so player(s)", "I dont want to PVP at lvl 5, 10,20,30,40 or until I am max level, leave me alone'.
COOL - here is the deal - go fucking level up, DONT FUCKING LOOT ANY RESOURCES - take the trash item and turn that crappy copper coin in. It will take you a long time, like a F2P in a P2W game - difference is P2W in this aspect is - Soft Flag yourself n fight/run/defend!
These trash items arent even worth killing someone who grinded 500 pocket lint.
Pocket Lint - lil jimmy will buy it for 1c each... or 50s total.
You - the soft flagger can kill a goblin and get goblin blood, probably worth 10s to an NPC or more to another player since it's used in recipes.... so its not even worth your time to kill that PvE not flagged player up. He probably had to kill 100 goblins, whereas you got balls to play the pvp game, and looted not only some lint, but the goblin blood. congrats - let him be. He made his decision, he choose his risk/reward. No Risk, No Reward. It will take forever get wealth in the game via this process.
Oh wow, then your idea is even worse than what I originally understood:
Let's say that carrying "rare resources" or better (just an example) toggles your for PvP. That means a green player will only be flagged/toggled to be attacked by another player if they're carrying rare resources.
Now I don't even need to give love taps (remove my weapon, punch players and deal 13 damage) to check if they are flagged or not, I can just click on them and check if they have a "rare resources indicator" in their nameplate.
Your intention is good, now people who have nothing valuable are safe from being attacked. Sadly, something very common in good intentions, is the collateral damage: the risk of getting corruption for killing green players carrying nothing valuable is removed and now green players who are carrying valuable loot became beacons of death.
As a fragile PvEer, I'm now safe from any player threats unless I loot some rare resources, oopsie.
As an evil PKer, I'm now safe from accidentally killing green players and getting no good loot, thankfully I can only attack green players who the game tells me are carrying something good, regardless of player levels.
TL;DR: flagging or toggling PvP based on inventory value/rarity/weight is a bad idea, based on gear score bracket is a bad idea, based on level bracket is a bad idea, based on basically anything might sound like a good idea, but it'll have collateral effects (i.e. be abuseable and/or have the opposite effect) that do more harm than good to the game. The current system is better in theory, and probably in practice too.
Cheers
You can still hard flag yourself to kill a player who isnt soft flag.
Most players will be soft flag anyways as they arent gonna let their loot rot away. So this returns us to the normal state of AoC pvp system. The question is - were you intended on pvping a player to begin with, had you known or not known if they had something?
So, this beacon you speak of isnt really there. Unless you were intending to kill ppl on sight, or seeking out players who might have loot for you to take.
Before or after this idea - you do not know what they have. You need to kill if u want that resources and you were gonna do it anyways - atleast here, we saved (hopefully) both you and the innocent pve who didnt soft flag.
Sure, you can now punch the soft flag guy up - does he fight back or allows you to kill him, and do you decide to kill or just punch and walk away... thats on ya.
I am all for hearing unintentional consequences that comes from this idea & to seek a resolution. Never stated this was perfect and fleshed out. but what you're stating isnt a unintended thing. If so and I am misunderstanding it - please clarify it better, afiak That was always there to begin with.
I don't understand what purpose your system has. If people can still hard flag to kill random people questing what protection are you giving them? If the jerk wants to kill you he doesn't care if he has to hard flag or not.
he just wants to see who has valuables on them so he can cherry pick who to kill. thats it. other than that, that system would be completely pointless and redundant
Lets assume - current corruption system
a lvl 60 killing a lvl 1
Corruption point is the maximum 100 corruption points. Serious Dampen of stats and all that jazz.
With Hard Flag - you intentionally knew, this person doesnt have NOTHING and still choose to kill this person.
He doesnt fight back and gives you corruption. Now it's double.
Reinforces the purpose of corruption system - to discourage non-meaningful pvp conflicts.
To Depraved - you seems dead set to consistently accuse me of that out of the blue with no reasoning. I've stated and told you that doesnt matter. If I was hunting gatherers on my max level toon, and accepted today I am gonna get corrupted - it wouldnt have change any outcome. I was logging in that day with the intention to kill players for resources. I'd rather avoid killing someone who aint got shit and leave them be. But I still wouldnt know who has what, who isnt soft flag, I still had to initiate combat.
Now, I found someone soft flag by initiating, realize he/she isnt fight back, I am purple still and BH can spot me now - Do I continue and slay you or give up, cause you didnt fight back n hide. I am still putting myself at other risks. I can't find out if you are soft flag until I become purple. So it's not like im gonna be running by every single person, punching them in the face to see if they are soft flag or not & hope they fight back, so I can attempt to avoid corruption.
seriously - come up with some other excuse, cause all I am getting, with your username is - you're the type of player that wants to grief and be perma red with benefits or find / found a potential loophole that you don't want shut down. Can I prove it? ABSOLUTELY NOT - just like your accusation towards me - but I guess going forward - this is what I believe now in terms of you.
There is a mute forum button - please use it on me unless you got meaningful dialog, explanation, why (in detail) this is good/bad and what you would suggest to finding a solution - or is it, u dont want a solution at all.
What are the reasons that a lv60 will do that?
Without any reasons you are just proposing developing changes based on nothing.
Why would a lv60 PK a lv1, lv5, lv10, lv20, lv35?
What for? Why would he risk his gear?
I think he honestly thinks there is gonna be a bunch of max level players killing random low levels for no other reason than because they can. If he actually understood anything about the corruption system he would know this isn't going to happen. No one besides the most depraved people are going to want to spend hours grinding away corruption or there negative xp from dying while corrupted, or risk losing gear, or want to go do some quest to get rid of that murder just to kill a noobie.
How would they burn of their corruption?
There are no teleports. They will be stuck there.
How many such people do you think exist OP?
100? Should IS change the game for 100 lunatics, whose actions will have ZERO impact in the progress of those low lv victims?
If the corruption system is balanced correctly your system is completely uneeded. We don't know numbers but we do know that you get more corruption for killing lower levels. The system should make it so killing a lv 1 is never worth it irregardless of if they have rare mats or not. If the system is done right killing even a lvl 30 at 50 will be worth only 1/1000 situations.
Your system actually does the opposite of what you want. Intrepid has stated that low level gatherables will still be useful in high level crafting. As such a system that tells me that low level players have rare gatherables makes me more inclined to kill them then a system that tells me nothing.
Currently - top guild gets lvl 1 alts to carry super rare mats from a raid dungeon back into town.
Someone is gonna have to kill this lvl 1 alt who is transporting all the goods.
This soft flag doesnt change the corruption point at all, but to say there is no gameplay to utilize lvl 1 to carry goods under the protection of corruption is also very viable.
A much easier fix to that is to make it so a lvl 1 can't equip tools to gather the super rare mats. If however you think high levels are just gonna run around with lvl 1 and pass all the mats to that lvl 1 then you just have to program a smarter mob ai where it targets lower levels first. Even in WOW this was somewhat a thing as the lower your level the higher the aggro range of mob was. Sure they might be able to keep that lvl 1 alive but it's gonna take a lot of effort and tbh if they are willing to put that effort in let them. Killing a lvl 1 in your system still gives you a ton of corruption it just doesn't double it. So again your not solving anything.
Also I thought your system was to protect low levels who just wanted to quest? Now that we have shut that down by saying the current corruption system will stop that you pivot to this but guilds will just have level 1 alts to hold there mats argument.
I'm sorry but it's a bad idea and it's time to just accept that.
What crazy scenario is this now?
People are going to watch other raid witout PKing them, letting them get the drops, but they will PK the Lv1 chars that you imagine people will have to "safely carry mats"?
Why wouldnt the PKers kill the raiding group?
If the players choose to attack the Lv1 char, what is stopping the raiders from jumping on the PKer and take stuff back?
People will just create lv5 chars with Lv1 gear and PK those mules.
Where is the "sense" in all this?
Stop being afraid of a TRIED AND TESTED design from L2, and then create weird scenarios of why it's not good enough?
Remove the word "sense" from the title, at the very least.
This only happenends because people prefer the bigger faction and migrate, they don't migrate cause they don't like world pvp.
if they kill your level 2, you kill them, res your level 2, and kill his level 1
family holds what 8 ppl? ensure 1 is a lvl 1 alt.
u can still have a high lvl gatherer get the mat and then pass it to the lvl 1 alt. Unless your restricting lvl 1 to carry or hold higher level items in their storage/bank/inventory. that in itself will cause an uproar.
You got a guild protecting the player. If it's 10 players, all max level with a max level gathering and they lose the fight - they lose their shit and got nothing out of it.
Here, u got 9 max players + the lvl 1. If they once again lose, at the least, they ensured as insurance, someone getting fucked and corrupted.
This is an incoherent mess you are all over the place and I literally can't even understand what you are even trying to say. Point is in both systems you kill the level 1 as a lvl 50 u r fucked with corruption unless in your system lvl 1's with rare mats are free game giving only normal corruption for an equally leveled player. If that's the case you are screwing 99% of the player base who from level 1 will participate in all aspects of the game to protect the ones who only want to quest.
You do know that when you die you don't lose all of the gatherables right? If you have 10 max levels you are much more likely to win the fight then with 1 player gimped. And if you all fight back you will lose 10% atm of what you had. You still got 90% of what you needed.
Idk if you want people to have the level 1 gatherer or not because your arguments are terribly worded.