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Just make a lv5 PK char with lv1 gear

George_BlackGeorge_Black Member, Intrepid Pack
edited October 2022 in General Discussion
And kill all those pesky Lv1 super gatherers.

Many months ago, somebody though that the Devs would let people bypass character progress, open world pvp and risk vs reward, said (without thinking too much, but wanting to appear intelligent) "since combat progression and artisan progression aren't the same people will have Lv1 master gatherers/crafters". They wouldn't admit to the fact that that's ridiculous. Oh well.

Today you heard it. How did you even expected to progress a Lv1 char, in a dangerous open world, by just focusing on artisanship, ignoring potential combat? How? It wont happen.
And even if it does and people start carrying around treasures with low lv chars, just make a low lv low item PK char and take all their stuff and watch them say "the corruption system didn't work when I tried to bypass it"

And as you heard in todays live stream, "be informed. Watch. Read". And then think.
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    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.
    PvE means: A handful of coins and a bag of boredom.
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    George_BlackGeorge_Black Member, Intrepid Pack
    edited October 2023
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    I've seen your posts btw. You want unrestricted ganging and I disagree with your ideas. You are part of the other extreme.



    ozpd0a5mdbd6.gif


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    I like all these nuances to how people will navigate the world to their benefit and also how others will try stop that.

    I think about Classic WoW with world buffs and how people would coordinate getting the flower buff in felwood with summons / invis pots ect, it had such a high risk but was awesome if you achieved it.

    And on the other side it was awesome seeing gankers at the right time kill groups of people trying to get the buff, it always gave the world a risk feeling if you were to try adventure out to it.
  • Options
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    I've seen your posts btw. You want unrestricted ganging and I disagree with your ideas. You are part of the other extreme.

    I am mostly interested in guild wars, but the ganking to me is assymetric war against people who I can't officialy declare war.
    PvE means: A handful of coins and a bag of boredom.
  • Options
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    I've seen your posts btw. You want unrestricted ganging and I disagree with your ideas. You are part of the other extreme.

    I am mostly interested in guild wars, but the ganking to me is assymetric war against people who I can't officialy declare war.

    Between enemy of the state, node wars, and guild wars who is gonna piss you off so much that you can't declare war on them? Odds are if someone does something that pisses you off to want to kill them they have done it to other players. At that point go to your mayor and say X is a piece of filth for Y reason can you make him an enemy of the state. If he is in a shit guild use your guild to declare war with his. And if his whole node is shit just declare a node war or seige there node. I don't think there will be many players that I'll need to kill that I can't through the different systems. Hell you could even just stalk the dude and wait for him to launch a caravan or go into the open sea.
  • Options
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    And then the game will die. You clearly aren't to bright. Maybe you should seek help, with this need you have, to ruin the gaming experience for others
  • Options
    George_BlackGeorge_Black Member, Intrepid Pack
    insomnia wrote: »
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    And then the game will die. You clearly aren't to bright. Maybe you should seek help, with this need you have, to ruin the gaming experience for others

    Get out of here.
  • Options
    insomnia wrote: »
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    And then the game will die. You clearly aren't to bright. Maybe you should seek help, with this need you have, to ruin the gaming experience for others

    The experience will be fine. Gatherers seem to be safer on land but not on sea.
    Still not clear to me why gatherers would use caravans and expose their rare resources to PvP rather than transporting them in their inventory.
    September 12. 2022: Being naked can also be used to bring a skilled artisan to different freeholds... Don't summon family!
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    NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack
    edited October 2022
    insomnia wrote: »
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    And then the game will die. You clearly aren't to bright. Maybe you should seek help, with this need you have, to ruin the gaming experience for others

    Get out of here.

    I mean, he isnt wrong.

    The game is getting more and more PvP focused, meaning it is segregating itself more and more away from the bulk of the MMO player base, and in to the VERY crowded corner of PvP MMO's.

    The way the game is going now, I predict 3 servers in total across all regions 18 months after launch. That is technically not dead, but is also a far cry from what the game had the potential to be.
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    Noaani wrote: »
    The game is getting more and more P P focused
    P P focus! B)
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    PercimesPercimes Member
    edited October 2022
    Strevi wrote: »
    insomnia wrote: »
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    And then the game will die. You clearly aren't to bright. Maybe you should seek help, with this need you have, to ruin the gaming experience for others

    The experience will be fine. Gatherers seem to be safer on land but not on sea.
    Still not clear to me why gatherers would use caravans and expose their rare resources to PvP rather than transporting them in their inventory.

    Then again, what is there even to gather on the open sea? Aside from salted water. As far as we know, there could have little there to be gathered in the first place and so its purpose is only to provide an area large enough to have interesting naval manoeuvring with fast moving ships in battle. Add a few roaming sea monsters (world boss) that would generate an PvP battleground with no corruption anyway. The shallow waters around the lands are another story, and they're not ffPvP.

    Caravans are for moving large quantity of materials between nodes. You could transport them on your character and do multiple trips to achieve the same result, but on each of these transit you'd also be open to PvP and being looted. So you could spread the risks at the cost of time. I remember there was supposed to be a possible character progression linked with defending or attacking caravans, but the only thing I found on the wiki was this: "A quest system will track a player's successful or failed defenses and attacks. This will provide rewards that scale up over time based on the player's history." Not sure if it was scrapped or if I misremember things.
    Be bold. Be brave. Roll a Tulnar !
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    Percimes wrote: »
    Add a few roaming sea monsters (world boss) that would generate an PvP battleground with no corruption anyway.
    Why exactly would the generate a pvp battleground "anyway"? Don't think we've heard anything about bosses generating battlegrounds. There's been several people who think Intrepid will go down that design route, but there's been no news on that front to my knowledge.
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    Then again, what is there even to gather on the open sea?
    @Percimes Uh.... Well Idk... Maybe fishing? Diving for treasures? Underwater prospecting and gathering with all of the current gathering artisans? There's probably islands out there too that would be still in the "open seas" area to gather from normally.
    5000x1000px_Sathrago_Commission_RavenJuu.jpg?ex=661327bf&is=6600b2bf&hm=e6652ad4fec65a6fe03abd2e8111482acb29206799f1a336b09f703d4ff33c8b&
    Commissioned at https://fiverr.com/ravenjuu
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    insomnia wrote: »
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    And then the game will die. You clearly aren't to bright. Maybe you should seek help, with this need you have, to ruin the gaming experience for others

    Not it won't!

    Do you think you will stop playin a game because you got ganked a couple times and lost a bit of lumber?
    Are you even serious?

    Plus now we know that there's land deterioration of fauna and flora, in this week's video we saw demonstrations about it.

    PVE carebears will come to your node and havoc the enviroment link a bunch of beavers they will destroy your forests and cause global warmming! :D
    PvE means: A handful of coins and a bag of boredom.
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    Arya_YesheArya_Yeshe Member
    edited October 2022
    insomnia wrote: »
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    And then the game will die. You clearly aren't to bright. Maybe you should seek help, with this need you have, to ruin the gaming experience for others

    When I walk around my freehold I want all the trees there, if I know you are clearning all the trees around me and just make me walk long distances for getting some wood, I will declare war on you... if you are a neutral I will tell you to go chop wood somewhere else and if you don't go then I will gank you
    PvE means: A handful of coins and a bag of boredom.
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    Arya_YesheArya_Yeshe Member
    edited October 2022
    Noaani wrote: »
    I mean, he isnt wrong.

    The game is getting more and more PvP focused, meaning it is segregating itself more and more away from the bulk of the MMO player base, and in to the VERY crowded corner of PvP MMO's.

    The way the game is going now, I predict 3 servers in total across all regions 18 months after launch. That is technically not dead, but is also a far cry from what the game had the potential to be.

    Carebears are just bad players because they fail to realize this:
    - problems can come through players
    - problem solving can come through players too!

    So why are they so affraid of people and interactions?
    The same people who can kill these carebears are also the people who can save them!

    Bring pvpers to your guild, ally pvpers, support pvpers, pay gold to pvpers

    If a player is completely spineless, then he should find people who fight for him
    PvE means: A handful of coins and a bag of boredom.
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    NiKr wrote: »
    Percimes wrote: »
    Add a few roaming sea monsters (world boss) that would generate an PvP battleground with no corruption anyway.
    Why exactly would the generate a pvp battleground "anyway"? Don't think we've heard anything about bosses generating battlegrounds. There's been several people who think Intrepid will go down that design route, but there's been no news on that front to my knowledge.

    You're right, my bad, I think I remembered old discussions on the forum but nothing in these lines is official. Still, kind of a moot point as world boss, whether on land or sea, will probably be often contested and fought over by different groups. Not that's the same as everyone being purple by default.
    Sathrago wrote: »
    Then again, what is there even to gather on the open sea?
    @Percimes Uh.... Well Idk... Maybe fishing? Diving for treasures? Underwater prospecting and gathering with all of the current gathering artisans? There's probably islands out there too that would be still in the "open seas" area to gather from normally.

    High seas, deep ocean, bottomless depths... Generally, games don't allow you to access these dark places. So no deep diving for the Heart of the Ocean or oil. "Deep-sea fishing This is a more sports-oriented style of fishing, which will feature a mini-game. This will require equipment, such as fishing boats and expensive lures, but will yield higher rewards", so it's not really gathering exactly. The map shows a grand total of 3 smallish islands. Are things turn back normal once on the islands? Corruption and all. How are moving large quantity of resources from these island different that a caravan?

    I'm not saying it's all safe and the same as on land, but I have a hard time being convinced it will have a dramatic effect all things considered. I guess, for me, it will depend on how far from the shore the zone begins. There's also the unknown of ship speed, so it could be possible to cross the danger zone quick enough that large armed ship can't follow you, but not having significant cargo capacity. Or a fast mount that can dive out of reach of ship based attacked. I'm rather optimist for once.
    Be bold. Be brave. Roll a Tulnar !
  • Options
    Strevi wrote: »
    insomnia wrote: »
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    And then the game will die. You clearly aren't to bright. Maybe you should seek help, with this need you have, to ruin the gaming experience for others

    The experience will be fine. Gatherers seem to be safer on land but not on sea.
    Still not clear to me why gatherers would use caravans and expose their rare resources to PvP rather than transporting them in their inventory.

    There's no loot loss in caravans, killing the wagon only drops tokens.

    Carebears are just inferior players who whine about everything with no reason
    PvE means: A handful of coins and a bag of boredom.
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    Arya_YesheArya_Yeshe Member
    edited October 2022
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Ma man!
    That's the way people got to start thinking, carebears will be weasels behind a system like that while holding hands with the Corruption system.

    Low level pk all the way for killing the neighbours you dont like.

    I've seen your posts btw. You want unrestricted ganging and I disagree with your ideas. You are part of the other extreme.

    I am mostly interested in guild wars, but the ganking to me is assymetric war against people who I can't officialy declare war.

    Between enemy of the state, node wars, and guild wars who is gonna piss you off so much that you can't declare war on them? Odds are if someone does something that pisses you off to want to kill them they have done it to other players. At that point go to your mayor and say X is a piece of filth for Y reason can you make him an enemy of the state. If he is in a shit guild use your guild to declare war with his. And if his whole node is shit just declare a node war or seige there node. I don't think there will be many players that I'll need to kill that I can't through the different systems. Hell you could even just stalk the dude and wait for him to launch a caravan or go into the open sea.

    If a green gatherer chop all the wood around your freehold, then you can't harvest wood around your house, you will have to do long walks everyday because this guy over here chop all the wood around your freehold.

    He is also a neutral, you can't declare war on him, so you tell him to go gather wood around his own home and he doesn't go because he chopped all the wood where he actually lives and he wants yours now.

    How do you fix that?
    Gank the guy and make him go back to his home.
    PvE means: A handful of coins and a bag of boredom.
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    NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Noaani wrote: »
    I mean, he isnt wrong.

    The game is getting more and more PvP focused, meaning it is segregating itself more and more away from the bulk of the MMO player base, and in to the VERY crowded corner of PvP MMO's.

    The way the game is going now, I predict 3 servers in total across all regions 18 months after launch. That is technically not dead, but is also a far cry from what the game had the potential to be.

    Carebears are just bad players because they fail to realize this:
    - problems can come through players
    - problem solving can come through players too!

    So why are they so affraid of people and interactions?
    The same people who can kill these carebears are also the people who can save them!

    Bring pvpers to your guild, ally pvpers, support pvpers, pay gold to pvpers

    If a player is completely spineless, then he should find people who fight for him
    You have a misplaced notion of what PvE players are.

    I mean, you start this post out with "Carebears are just bad players because", yet I have seen many posts where you complain that "carebears" will oppress PvP players.

    What you seem to miss in that is if one group of players is able to oppress another in an MMO with PvP enabled, and yet are able to do so without even using PvP, that group of players oppressing the other is orders of magnitude better at the game than the group of oppressed players.

    I mean, if you think carebears are bad at the game, yet also think they will oppress you in game, what does that say about you?
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    SathragoSathrago Member
    edited October 2022
    Percimes wrote: »
    High seas, deep ocean, bottomless depths... Generally, games don't allow you to access these dark places. So no deep diving for the Heart of the Ocean or oil. "Deep-sea fishing This is a more sports-oriented style of fishing, which will feature a mini-game. This will require equipment, such as fishing boats and expensive lures, but will yield higher rewards", so it's not really gathering exactly. The map shows a grand total of 3 smallish islands. Are things turn back normal once on the islands? Corruption and all. How are moving large quantity of resources from these island different that a caravan?

    I'm not saying it's all safe and the same as on land, but I have a hard time being convinced it will have a dramatic effect all things considered. I guess, for me, it will depend on how far from the shore the zone begins. There's also the unknown of ship speed, so it could be possible to cross the danger zone quick enough that large armed ship can't follow you, but not having significant cargo capacity. Or a fast mount that can dive out of reach of ship based attacked. I'm rather optimist for once.

    You do realize that archeage, one of the primary catalysts for this game existing and where most of the naval and fishing design come from, has no aforementioned "bottomless zones". Right? The entire ocean floor was accessible from what I remember, and you could dive with special vehicles or gear to harvest, battle monsters, and treasure hunt.
    As for Deep-sea Fishing, how is it "not really gathering" Do you even know what you are saying? What part of that made it not really gathering? The gathering part? or the you need tools to gather part?

    Edit: Also, you do not need to add every little island to the map. And you didnt understand what I meant. These islands would most likely still be considered open seas territory and still flag you. Naturally this was speculation. its just one of many ways they could bring gathering in this high risk area for high quality and rare materials.
    5000x1000px_Sathrago_Commission_RavenJuu.jpg?ex=661327bf&is=6600b2bf&hm=e6652ad4fec65a6fe03abd2e8111482acb29206799f1a336b09f703d4ff33c8b&
    Commissioned at https://fiverr.com/ravenjuu
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    Noaani wrote: »
    You have a misplaced notion of what PvE players are.

    I mean, you start this post out with "Carebears are just bad players because", yet I have seen many posts where you complain that "carebears" will oppress PvP players.

    What you seem to miss in that is if one group of players is able to oppress another in an MMO with PvP enabled, and yet are able to do so without even using PvP, that group of players oppressing the other is orders of magnitude better at the game than the group of oppressed players.

    I mean, if you think carebears are bad at the game, yet also think they will oppress you in game, what does that say about you?

    I know PVE people really well.

    They just farm like drone ants and ignore the player drive content.

    AoC will be the first game in which PVE carebears will oppress people from the other node because they will farm so much xp in their node that will become the master node... vassal nodes can not declare node war against the master.

    PVE carebears will also be able to destroy your fauna and flora behind a Corruption system if they want to.

    Those are two examples of unnatural interactions among players, carebears will go for a power grab through PVE, just like when they lock a dungeon in World of Warcraft.
    PvE means: A handful of coins and a bag of boredom.
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    Didnt steven say that tools will have level requirements from your combat class?
    I have to re watch the whole thing but that would get rid of the low level gatherers in one go.
    53ap2sc6pdgv.gif
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    Xenotor wrote: »
    Didnt steven say that tools will have level requirements from your combat class?
    I have to re watch the whole thing but that would get rid of the low level gatherers in one go.

    Yep.
    5000x1000px_Sathrago_Commission_RavenJuu.jpg?ex=661327bf&is=6600b2bf&hm=e6652ad4fec65a6fe03abd2e8111482acb29206799f1a336b09f703d4ff33c8b&
    Commissioned at https://fiverr.com/ravenjuu
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    Xenotor wrote: »
    Didnt steven say that tools will have level requirements from your combat class?
    I have to re watch the whole thing but that would get rid of the low level gatherers in one go.
    But from what I understand tools just make your artisan life easier. So, in theory, low lvls should still be able to gather general resources in the fields.

    There's a chance that some nodes will only have some high lvl resources around, but I feel like that goes against the "you see a tree - you cut it" phrase from the stream.
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    NiKr wrote: »
    Xenotor wrote: »
    Didnt steven say that tools will have level requirements from your combat class?
    I have to re watch the whole thing but that would get rid of the low level gatherers in one go.
    But from what I understand tools just make your artisan life easier. So, in theory, low lvls should still be able to gather general resources in the fields.

    There's a chance that some nodes will only have some high lvl resources around, but I feel like that goes against the "you see a tree - you cut it" phrase from the stream.

    I believe steven mentioned if you weren't high enough level or have the higher level tool you wouldn't be able to cut down the larger trees.
    5000x1000px_Sathrago_Commission_RavenJuu.jpg?ex=661327bf&is=6600b2bf&hm=e6652ad4fec65a6fe03abd2e8111482acb29206799f1a336b09f703d4ff33c8b&
    Commissioned at https://fiverr.com/ravenjuu
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    StreviStrevi Member
    edited October 2022
    Arya_Yeshe wrote: »
    Noaani wrote: »
    You have a misplaced notion of what PvE players are.

    I mean, you start this post out with "Carebears are just bad players because", yet I have seen many posts where you complain that "carebears" will oppress PvP players.

    What you seem to miss in that is if one group of players is able to oppress another in an MMO with PvP enabled, and yet are able to do so without even using PvP, that group of players oppressing the other is orders of magnitude better at the game than the group of oppressed players.

    I mean, if you think carebears are bad at the game, yet also think they will oppress you in game, what does that say about you?

    I know PVE people really well.

    They just farm like drone ants and ignore the player drive content.

    AoC will be the first game in which PVE carebears will oppress people from the other node because they will farm so much xp in their node that will become the master node... vassal nodes can not declare node war against the master.

    PVE carebears will also be able to destroy your fauna and flora behind a Corruption system if they want to.

    Those are two examples of unnatural interactions among players, carebears will go for a power grab through PVE, just like when they lock a dungeon in World of Warcraft.

    And Steven is God >:)
    "look but don't touch"
    "touch but don't taste"
    ...
    September 12. 2022: Being naked can also be used to bring a skilled artisan to different freeholds... Don't summon family!
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    @Sathrago I don't know anything about Archeage, nor do I really care about that game. It's another game. Some of its concepts may inspire AoC, but I'll wait to see what is announced.

    I'm also quite ok with some content being out of reach for some players. I know I'll probably never raid and I'm not bitter that the best rewards are often behind that type of gameplay. I never visited the Plans when I played EQ, but I was glad they existed. I never entered Molten Core, but I thought it cool that this kind of challenge existed for those who looked for it. So I perceive the high sea as a huge ship battleground, with known rules about it. You don't have to go there. You don't have to harvest its resources: you decide to do so.

    As for high sea fishing vs. gathering. When I think gathering I expect what we saw in the demo. You go from resource point to resource point and gather the resources as you go. The high sea equivalent would be to cast nets to catch small fishes. What they present it to be is more akin to hunting, finding a big prey and mini game it on the deck of your ship. Marlin or sailfish kind of fishing instead of school of fishes.
    Be bold. Be brave. Roll a Tulnar !
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    Sathrago wrote: »
    I believe steven mentioned if you weren't high enough level or have the higher level tool you wouldn't be able to cut down the larger trees.
    If that's the case, that would mean that the big trees are the juiciest and are meant for the pro lumberjacks. They'll probably be the first ones to be cut by the citizens of the attacked node (in the context of a directed aggressive gathering). So most of the trees/gatherables would be on the early-mid life stage, which theoretically would be cuttable by either lowest or just a bit low lvl artisans. And any potential super young or super old tree could be cut down by high lvl gatherers from the attacking node/guild. And realistically you wouldn't differentiate them from any given passerby gatherer, unless you knew exactly who your enemies are.

    And if this kind of action seems any beneficial results, I'm sure that hardcore guilds will just make their members level up gatherer alts to do these aggressive gathering "raids".

    I've seen this kind of action made by muuuultiple guilds in L2, because you had several epic bosses at lower lvls and once your guild was all maxed out in leveling - you'd need your members to make alts. And everyone did because it was beneficial to the guild.
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    https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Citizenship

    Considering your citizenship is 1 per account, you can declare war on the offending node / guild and it doesn't matter that they change to an alt character.
    Even their level 1 alt should be marked as enemy and be ok to kill without getting corruption during the war.

    If its a single person, then declaring them enemy of the state should do the same hopefully.
    We sadly still know little about this mechanic at the moment



    53ap2sc6pdgv.gif
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