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Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest news on Alpha Two.
Check out general Announcements here to see the latest news on Ashes of Creation & Intrepid Studios.
To get the quickest updates regarding Alpha Two, connect your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Comments
Unless you are a vassal node then you can't declare war, you got to suck it up or try guild wars.
Chasing off those you don't agree with? Grow up.
So until further clarifications, we don't know what's gonna be the case in the game.
Get out of here.
Riiight.....
In the hypothetical scenario given (even though it is probably not practical enough to exist), anybody can attack the level 5 killer without consequence while the level 5 is flagged or red named.
Players use Lv1 mules? You go with your group +1 Lv5 char. You find those notorious Lv1 rich mules, you get your Lv5 to do the killing, you pick up those imaginary treasures.
Then let whoever wants to approach your red Lv5, you protect it. If they touch, you heal, if they touch your purple healer, you kill, if your Lv5 red dies, you spam pick up.
Point is, the whole Lv1 mules is ridiculous as I said many months ago, the devs wouldnt allow crafters/gatherers to bypass levelin up in the open world pvp, thus avoiding the dangers, as told on this months update, but ye....
Some people floated the idea of griefing PKers with low lv chars... (which was also laughable) but since I see ppl struggling with common logic, here is a Lv5 lv1 item plan for you.
I cant believe that people made a fuss about such things months ago, and I cant believe that people want to seriously debate this topic.
So many try to outhink the Devs, thinking they found the holes in the system alrdy; some proceed to suggest changes, without even realized how limited their understanding was at the moment of their lightbulb, without even realizing how ridiculous their far stretched/forced scenarios were.
Come and kill me Lv5. Whatever.
Somebody, who I cant dress with verbs due to forum rules, even said that I shut down ppl I disagreed with in this topic, not having understood that the person at the beginning of the quotes didnt even knew what was being discussed here.
Anyways. Month after month Steven will deflect peoples "cOnCerNs" and then say "feedback welcome".
But... do note that he pretty much said "educate yourselfs" in a nicer way that I would ever care to say.
So, you need to make a level 5 character (which I imagine will take a few hours to a couple of days given that levelling to 50 is projected to take about 6 weeks playing 4-6 hours a day) , locate a level 1 player that is built into a maxed gatherer (in your original example) in a large world and the gatherer has to have enough useful mats to make it worth the time to hunt him or her down when you only get a percentage of the mats after killing the gatherer. If all this works out, you still need to get the mats back to safety while purple or red named.
Its hard for me to imagine very many people succeeding at this even if people actually try it. Which I doubt. Because it seems like a waste of time with a low reward and little control over what you can get.
Alright, I will explain myself:
1) in the land management system if you harvest everything of a certain thing, that won't grow back easily, it will take a long time and there will be scarcity... even animals will go live somewhere else because the land devastation. The land deterioration itself will ask for crop rotation
2) the node will be upgraded through the generated xp, PVE activities will level the node and this will make the surrounding nodes as slave nodes. So carebears can go for a power grab and level their node just with PVE
That's fine, if they do it because they are smart that is fine.
But look at this:
-where are the counters against that?
-vassal nodes can't declare war against the master nodes
-ganking their gatheres will likely poop on your character because corruption
This leaves people with guild wars, we don't know much about it right now.
In last week's video the devs said something about node policies that will prevent harvesting griefers
So it's fine, probably we won't have to gank people and there will be more ways of dealing with a green horde
That's what I hope for
1) you need to have a lvl 5 character
2) you somehow need to now transport that lvl 5 character to location
3) you have enough man power to beat them up to begin with.
1) easy to do
2) by the time you logged into your alt and got there, they are gone.
3) in the event they arent gone, do you have the man power - by the time you got your guildies organized - they are gone.
the logistic of having a lvl 5 rdy to move and be there on time is low & most ppl wont bother.
2) for all we know - AOC can go the NW route by not allowing ALTS into the same server. You may have multiple characters but not in the same server. Which brings me to another point
3) most players arent gonna have multiple accounts, pay multiple accounts, so they can have multiple toons in the same server.
What? How is that going to be a problem?
Organized ppl will have a designated person in every session to log in the Lv5 riches maker. It's just another role. Some days you find a victim some days you dont.
Besides didnt you hear Steven? There wont be such a thing as a Lv1 super duper artisan, bypassing the open world dangers. How did you ever expect them to be was beyond me.
Dont try to poke holes again.... stop doing that, you dont have what it takes...
The carebear is the guy who wants to do his pve while having a safety net of ingame mechanics and systems, he can't stand being challenged ingame and if anyone stops him from doing his farming then he says it's griefing
everything is griefing for carebears and carebears are ingame hoarders, they can't stand losing a copper
but as a joke in the end of the day we say all pve is carebearing, even if a pirate chops wood he will say:
-I'm doing some carebear s### today!
People don't understand that, it is like living in the eastern EU and living in west EU. It may variate from person to person, but at least in my country people are more humble, but often criticize others, where in west people are more tolerant and have bigger desires because they have availability for thus are more ''happy'' positive, but search for comfort because they can.
They cannot understand why someone would choose to play Skyrim in harder mode with starvation just because they want to experience game without some restrictions, again it depends from person to person, but that's my point. They see everything as risk / hard / restriction as bad or not convenient for them thus will not understand our (old-school) ideology of RPG games.
Last thing I want to say, there is one universal truth to RPG games and that is to immerse yourself in fantasy world. That is the whole point of this genre, same as some movies have different genres to serve their purpose. - You cannot immerse yourself without risk vs reward, or sandbox design that gives you opportunity to play how you want to play. Sandbox can be seen in crafting like vanilla WoW crafting where you could craft item on 35lvl and still serve you on end game (60lvl), it utilizes old zones better and creates world full of players everywhere. (example: Vanilla wow potions that used to be made in 30ish level zones, or gear for tailoring that was being made on 35-45 level and not be replaced until raids, etc...)
Those players that like theme park MMOs will search for convenience because they don't care about tradition of RPG games nor they do care about immersion, or if they do, they search it in other ways that are less punishing because their ideology revolves around not wasting time, being the most productive etc... Which can tell me few things about that person, I cannot simply tell how I can predict if that person has some elements that I think of, just because I cannot generalize people and I will be called wrong.
Just do the refining and crafting, then use your proceeds to get more mats to make more...
You level your crafting and never leave town.
Keep dreaming.
I mean, this is viable in every game I have ever played. I see no reason it wont be viable in Ashes.
Ye.. everybody will want to give this Lv1 char all the stuff they need to start leveling their artisan class.
Eveeybody will have a need for the earliest produce of this Lv1 artisan, these expensive low grade crafts, making that char wealthy.
People will just come and say "hey you are a low lv crafter that doesnt produce anything useful yet. How would you like this useful recipe for free, to get you started? I know you got no money because you cant sell any of those lame Lv1 crafts, so here, take it for free. Me and my friends were killing mobs to find it or questing, fighting in pvp, but since you dont want to leave your node, here, take it." Steven even spelt it out for you.
Keep dreaming I say.
Plenty of games have level reqs for crafting, or at least level reqs for using the top end crafting tools or ingredients. Although some games give combat xp for leveling up crafting, it doesn't look like that will be the case in AoC.
Aside from what other games do, I don't think AoC will allow L1 master crafters because that make it too easy to gather on the main, and have a L1 refining and crafting alt that they feed materials to.
BoP items (recipes and boss dropped mats) may be another way to make the L1 not viable.
That wont be the case in AoC. I can understand a guild member being the designated artisan and pretty much having people handing everything to that crafter, but to pretend that people can avoid either PvE (with the owpvp danger) and any form of cooperation, and expect to become rich artisans locked inside their ivory towers is stupid. Simple brains heard "class progression wont be related to artisan profession" and started all these weird scenarios. That's what they put together in their heads. I ask, how could you ever believe that, when the devs have said many times that all systems are interlinked for a healthy social open world mmo? How did people went deaf to "risk vs reward" and started saying crap like Lv1 master gatherers and Lv1 master crafters?
Id guess the same way as any other game. You need to be level 10 to get copper, level 20 to get iron, level 30 for gold, level 40 for steel, 50 for mithril etc. If you only want to farm copper go for it but you're wasting your time the market will already be flooded. I highly doubt you'll crack that rock open level 1 and get the best ore in the game. That doesn't sound like any system I have ever seen before.
Oh for sure. I didnt say no games have it, just that games I have played dont.
I tend to avoid games with shit design, and forcing players to level up in combat when they just want to craft is bad game design, just as forcing players to craft if they just want to go out and fight.
"Leveling won't follow a traditional linear path, although classic mechanics for leveling exist.[2][3]
Experience (XP) is gained through a variety of vertical and horizontal progression paths, such as PvP, PvE, Exploration, Gathering/Processing/Crafting, Events/Quests, Grinding mobs"
https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Leveling
So, if you have enough guildies who are happy to funnel you the mats you need, then yeah, I can see an instance, albeit likely a rare one, where someone could spend all their time crafting and never leave the city.
Similarly, given that Gathering itself provides XP, the idea of a permanently Level 1 Gatherer seems unlikely.
Ok, with a 10 gold loan to get started from a bank
😜
Or hear me out a lv 2 crafter character.
Left town for one initial quest and mat run... And then never leaves town
I 100% think it would be feasible to get a Max level crafting with the less than level 5character
Here is my reasoning. The systems place a base value on the game, value on things you have. But if you indeed do not care, or just accept the losses, then that is no longer a penalty. No matter if it's small percentage of the pvp / free world oriented people, if there are some of those that simply enjoy ganking someone few times, or once in a blue moon think it'll be fun to kill someone and just make them suffer a bit, that is forcing outcome to someone that may not be able to avoid it. Alright, if victims and others hunt down person that's been marked to lose a lot, then they win something for it, so there is incentive to put hurt back onto a bad actor? Sure, unless they just choose to roll with nothing of real value? Even if they are not coming out mechanically strong, they can still ruin someones experience or keep messing with them in many ways, and what is there to gain or what are the means to permanently stop this person past certain point?
Now is all of this part of the game? Yes, it can be. And one should accept that if it will be. However, the balance of that transaction becomes imbalanced if the other party has nothing to lose in their mind. If they are alright with all the losses and go at it without regard for it, just to ruin someones time, then it's only a matter of time until someone looks around and if they find something else they can guarantee enjoyment in, with the limited time they may have, then they likely will choose that. Fair enough. Carebear attitude, sure. I mean, what does it matter what you want to call it. This is not a matter to get angry about but recognize some facts. In customer service, in business, bad rumors, bad reviews, bad-anything spreads far wider than anything positive. Is there any game in this genre that is as big as the "pve carebear" options ? Has any of them lasted as long as the respective options? I am genuinely asking because right now I can't think of one. Could this be the one that does it and makes it, with open pvp? Yes, maybe. I really don't know. And just because it has not really happened before, does not mean it should not be tried or that it cannot happen.
It is still more than likely that few bad actors will slowly eat away and chase away more than their own weight of people. Folks that tend to do pve are around even when tired and just gathering, just enjoying some social aspects of the game, but they are around, and if they enjoy it, generally longterm. PvP oriented folks may end up being more hardcore. They are active when they are in it. And if there's nothing to do, they search other games or other things, often at least. Again, people are unique, so everyone is different, but there's generally bit of a pattern that emerges with the type of people and their use of time.
If everything is open for pvp, it will fully depend on how things go, and that can only be seen when we play the game, but yeah. More than likely, eventually most people will choose more pve oriented approach and choose to do pvp in organized activity and by choice. Same happened to wow in big parts with time. And mostly those left longterm in pvp realms and such ended up mostly ignoring each other in open world, outside someone thinking it was fun to gank random guy for a while. Perfect example of the worst actor, again. The only goal is to tackle someone else for a while. It's not even about skill or specific goal or incentive, other than tackling another person and show superiority, by taking success away from them.
I can't put everything I think in words, not properly or articulate all of the nuances and thoughts I have. Shortly, I do not believe full, open pvp would carry longterm in large scale. Now, it could in some scale. Just depends what kind base the game is after. I believe though that at worst it's at a scale where the people left around, may find it slowly becoming dull because they are mostly left with only their peers, and the competition is at such level that if they can't achieve sense of success or victory in the sense they would by having more chances at open world to surprise a weaker victim - they will eventually quit. They will go for different kind pvp oriented game, competitive games or others that exist always as they are. But with mmo, there's so much more to them as games than pvp. The world won't take much away from pvp, but pvp can take away from the experience in the world. It can take everything away from that experience, and it's unlikely that all of that can take everything away from pvp, even if it was not fully open world and had more limited areas or opt-in activities.