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Taunt, threat and Narc
Voxtrium
Member
So Narc released a video discussing the tank update and brought up the idea regarding taunt and how to make it less overpowered than it is currently. Personally I thought it was a good way to make a taunt ability something more than a button used on reflex when a mob de aggroes.
At 12:07 he details his thoughts regarding this proposed mechanic
https://youtube.com/watch?v=tr2WWThOBsM&si=EnSIkaIECMiOmarE
Basically he suggested that DPS accidentally aggro a mob have a list of abilities (Not standardly used in rotations) that can apply "skittish". Skittish alone does nothing, however a tank will also have the ability (not standardly used in rotations) that applies "distract" when the target has skittish and distract applied it will act as a taunt.
Reason I like this idea is because it means parties will wipe often on higher tier mobs as dps generate too much threat and aggro the mobs and are unable to properly taunt the enemy. As Narc points out it becomes on the dps to apply "skittish" and allow the tank to re aggro the mob.
I like it, a lot, seems way more complex than merely pressing taunt when a mistake is made, yet it is still superbly simple. Thoughts?
At 12:07 he details his thoughts regarding this proposed mechanic
https://youtube.com/watch?v=tr2WWThOBsM&si=EnSIkaIECMiOmarEBasically he suggested that DPS accidentally aggro a mob have a list of abilities (Not standardly used in rotations) that can apply "skittish". Skittish alone does nothing, however a tank will also have the ability (not standardly used in rotations) that applies "distract" when the target has skittish and distract applied it will act as a taunt.
Reason I like this idea is because it means parties will wipe often on higher tier mobs as dps generate too much threat and aggro the mobs and are unable to properly taunt the enemy. As Narc points out it becomes on the dps to apply "skittish" and allow the tank to re aggro the mob.
I like it, a lot, seems way more complex than merely pressing taunt when a mistake is made, yet it is still superbly simple. Thoughts?
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Comments
Then its just "Big bad awesome ability, threat removal" less dynamic gameplay available overall.
Sounds a good game mechanic.
Similar mechanic are some cc effects which also reset the hate list. Those could land only if the caster is skilled enough and could be another class/party member. Wouldn't be better having a 3rd with such a role?
You never been nervous around a spider? or maybe an elphant?
Now IS will present next month the elephant spider.
Actually would love to see that. And they love weird animal combos...
I've been in street fights and people run after they get 'skittish'. I've even taunted them in person after they run off to no avail. Those people don't re-engage.
I don't mind synergies around effective taunts but I do not want 'skittish' to be the start of a synergy. I had hoped for cc immunities at least at the highest tiers. The whole system sounds like it's an overlay system much like spell weaving which was situational at best.
I do not see how 100% success rates would be able to be implemented so its a death sentence compared to a threat debuff and taunts if we even get a taunt.
You could make an action target cc threat reset ability, but personally I am unsure how to properly implement that. I think the idea behind Narcs suggestion was good partially for its multi party reliance on 1 style of gameplay. I love having a dps be forced to think like a tank for a few seconds.
I don't understand what you mean? Are you unsure how players could do this effectively 100% of the time?
it doesnt need to be called skittish ffs, or distract, call it antsy or something who cares really.
Having a synergy where dps just magically makes someone 'skittish' 100% of the time and then the tank pulling the mob off the dps 100% of the time are too clinical for the kind of fights I want and enjoy. Thus, whatever form the idea takes should not be 100% effective.
there are a billion ways to solve your problem, all I care for is the foundation of the idea.
Especially compared to something like WOW taunt
I think in option 1 the dps will be dead. I feel option 2 makes the pve a faceroll. I'm not sure of the parameters of a single digit pve construct in Ashes but the reason the dps won't move is because more than 1 tank will be in a raid and if the synergy is implemented the extra tank will intervene in split seconds.
I got you fam
The tank currently loses aggro almost every second. How many times can the synergy be used? A threat debuff can be independent of a taunt but instead you want the exact same synergy to replace two functions. I'm just not sure the gimmick holds water.
difference between stun and tripped
need clarification and I am hoping for something like this
Stun - few seconds of mob not being able to do anything.
tripped aka Prone - for the next 1-3 seconds, all incoming damage on a prone mob takes additional damage or automatic crits (however be mindful of pulling threat).
So you basically dont want to prone a mob at the start, but might be safe mid way into the fight.
Elephant with only spider legs no elephant legs.
Why is the fighter being erased? Anyone with either their 1st or 2nd archetype should have this ability. Fighters shouldn't tank anyway, a knight could.
Also the tuning isn't there yet sure but its so super alpha I don't think smaller things like that are anywhere near the fine tuning they intend, they are showing intent as much as anything.
Thus, I can only state that synergies are good and if I don't have to spec into something I don't want then it's all good.
I tried but the AI generator refuses to do that. I wanted to get a Drider essentially with elephant face.
that could be a boss mechanic for some bosses :P if u pull agro there no get out of jail free card u either die or mob run off and reset if u hit the skittish button, side effect guild might wanna kill u for doing it if the mob on 10% though lol :P
A shame that Narc didn't do the least bit of searching, but yes, there will be a taunt. But for some absolutely dumbass reason the TANK showcase didn't show literally the biggest part of the tank's skillset in 99% of mmos. And for an even dumber reason taunt is supposed to come on later in the character's life.
This is literally what the people complained about when it came to class identification and the "I don't want to waste 25 lvl w/o my core abilities" issue. I dearly hope that Intrepid rethink this asap. I don't need 10 abilities with threat gen to be a tank. I need a single taunt that would pull the mob to me immediately.
I would gladly accept a copy of L2's Aggression instead of meme slashing threat generator as a lower level skill.
It certainly would've done wonders in the tank presentation...
It is truly unreasonable for a tank to get one of its most important class defining skills later on instead of early on. I honestly don't know from where such idea would come from!
Tanks in L2 gets their aggression literally 4 levels after becoming a tank, WoW Warrior's Taunt? Lv 8, and in AA The tank skillset literally gets its taunt as its 4th skill.
Aren't we all sinners?
You lost me at "Narc".
Now this is exactly why the genre has gone stagnant.
Why don't you at least try someone elses or a teams approach before making the damning conclusion on a fixation that Tanks MUST HAVE TOTAL CONTROL of the damage, among other things, of every single mob in the game and other players are just "happy" being fixated on some cute little game of performing optimal damage, or a bard just working off of cooldown and a healer just look at the party HP hud and its mainly focused on the Tank.
It's not fucking strategy and I'd struggle to find one person whos addicted to strategy for their entire PvE gameplan, people want to be thrilled and play by what they visual see, not bombaring the PvE field with your best abilities (+ 100% never fail taunts) and we're done! Rinse and repeat for the next 100,000 encounters...
As I more than explained in my long thread "Tanks were a clever idea back in the day but now something I hate", it was a good idea, at the time but there are new standards to meet now and we have the luxury of brighter ideas via the long time span of another developer (and I don't mean simply slapping everything to action/hack and slash!), let the mmorpg genre evolve for fuk sake!