The quest for supreme quality for an MMORPG

I believe that the model of "realistic world", "coherent progression" and "verisimilitude" are fundamental to a 21st century MMORPG.

I believe the base model for Ashes of Creation needs to go beyond what ArcheAge, Black Desert, New World has already done.

Ashes of Creation needs to be Read Dead Redemption 2 with a face of 3.

If it is less than that, it will be just another MMORPG, not a game to make history.

Do you agree?

https://youtu.be/YisYNBBd3Jw

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Kilion

fogovivo wrote: »

In time, it's worth noting that the creative foundation of Ashes of Creation derives from ArcheAge. And we already have a taste of what ArcheAge 2 will be like. The fact is that Ashes of Creation needs to surpass ArcheAge and ArcheAge 2, doesn't it?

Ashes might take a lot of inspiration from ArcheAge, but is by no means aiming to be a clone of it.
Nor does is everyone interested in ArcheAge's story & world.
And giving these factors - there is no simple "this is better and this is worse" as, from all I have read people say now about ArcheAge, the games aim at different (not completely but notably) different players.

fogovivo wrote: »

And if you haven't played ArcheAge or Read Dead Redemption Online yet, your opinion about the future of Ashes of Creation lacks an experimental basis.

That is a nice attempt at dismissing possible criticism, but it doesn't stick very well, because ArcheAge or RDR aren't the only credible standards. Even if someone hasn't played these games, they still are able to have valid opinions and perspectives on Ashes. Saying otherwise would be as ridiculous as me stating "Anyone without a degree in economics has no proper basis to evaluate Ashes."

Arya_Yeshe

You wanna see the supreme MMO?

Devs should deliver everything we need for a community workshop, then the best addons/creations should be bought by the company.

If this ever happen someday, it will bring the best MMO in history.

Azherae

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

You wanna see the supreme MMO?

Devs should deliver everything we need for a community workshop, then the best addons/creations should be bought by the company.

If this ever happen someday, it will bring the best MMO in history.

Forget CrowdFunded MMOs, bring on the CrowdSourced MMOs, eh?

fogovivo

fogovivo wrote: »

The fact is that Ashes of Creation needs to surpass ArcheAge and ArcheAge 2, doesn't it?

Kilion wrote: »

Ashes might take a lot of inspiration from ArcheAge, but is by no means aiming to be a clone of it.

Nor does is everyone interested in ArcheAge's story & world.

fogovivo wrote: »

Read it https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Inspiration

And if you haven't played ArcheAge or Read Dead Redemption Online yet, your opinion about the future of Ashes of Creation lacks an experimental basis.

Kilion wrote: »

Saying otherwise would be as ridiculous as me stating "Anyone without a degree in economics has no proper basis to evaluate Ashes."

fogovivo wrote: »

"Anyone without enough background in MMORPG has no proper basis to evaluate Ashes."

Arya_Yeshe

Azherae wrote: »

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

You wanna see the supreme MMO?

Devs should deliver everything we need for a community workshop, then the best addons/creations should be bought by the company.

If this ever happen someday, it will bring the best MMO in history.

Forget CrowdFunded MMOs, bring on the CrowdSourced MMOs, eh?

Yes, for projects that are ongoing already, all the extra stuff could be done by the public. If a company handles the patterns to be followed for code, assets, server jobs, which standards to follow, etc, there would be a lot of people doing stuff. Then if the community likes something and the company approves it, just incorporate in the game, everybody signs the contract and both parties have their rights secure.

In the present times, it is common to come across developers who are unable to deliver games that meet satisfactory standards. As a result, the community takes charge of developing and launching add-ons that not only fix the issues but also introduce functionalities that should have been included in the game from the beginning.

Have you ever played goblin wars in The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion?
Goblin Wars is even in Oblivion's manual, if you decompile the game the funcion calls are there, but the functions bodies are empty! What kind of trickery is that? Then modders had to fully develop the functions as game mods as they see fit and it is pretty damn good.

fogovivo

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

Azherae wrote: »

Forget CrowdFunded MMOs, bring on the CrowdSourced MMOs, eh?

Yes, for projects that are ongoing already, all the extra stuff could be done by the public. If a company handles the patterns to be followed for code, assets, server jobs, which standards to follow, etc, there would be a lot of people doing stuff. Then if the community likes something and the company approves it, just incorporate in the game, everybody signs the contract and both parties have their rights secure.

It's really cool to talk about the future of future MMORPG games. I am happy to see a growing market and a demand for more involved and engaging communities. I hope Ashes of Creation doesn't lose the thread.

https://youtu.be/OwpqufkynZA

Arya_Yeshe

@fogovivo why? what? why are you linking this?

This has nothing to do with crowdsourcing, it's just news about Fable's dev

fogovivo

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

@fogovivo why? what? why are you calling this?

This has nothing to do with crowdsourcing, it's just news about Fable development

Collaborative Knowledge is : ) Crowdsourcing.

The video is just one example of what the public (the crowd) demands and what the market is doing.

Arya_Yeshe

fogovivo wrote: »

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

@fogovivo why? what? why are you calling this?

This has nothing to do with crowdsourcing, it's just news about Fable development

Collaborative Knowledge is : ) Crowdsourcing.

The video is just one example of what the public (the crowd) demands and what the market is doing.

I don't think Fable is the case, people were hired, people are in the office, this is just another project

The crowd is not programming, not modelling, not running debugs, etc... not offering tools, not anything, not participating in any significant way.

I will give one example of what is significant, game mods take hundreds to thousands of hours making addons and game mods... there's mods that should even be part of the game... but the companies prefer not to do so.

Companies just thank the community by stuffing more money into their pockets, modders and devs making community addons are just like voluntary slaves. Very frequently game mods and the addons are better than the game's core systems.

So, that's it, companies profit bilions altogether, but community devs work for free... they work "for the community" while making the game more enjoyable and bringing more people spending money in the game

Would be nice seeing a company officialy seeking community devs and paying them for mods and addons, or at least giving tiny shares in the product... profit shares... sales shares... or even if the game is sold for bilions of dollars in the future

fogovivo

https://youtu.be/PgjgJqWukU8

fogovivo

https://youtu.be/U3xYZ1RqJRs

Songcaller

Odyssey looks awesome, however, the gameplay is not actual gameplay and until that time I do not consider odyssey to be capable of having the video format as in the game.

Korean MMOs are all about beauty and lack a lot of substance which isn't pay to win.

Nemeses

fogovivo wrote: »

I believe that the model of "realistic world", "coherent progression" and "verisimilitude" are fundamental to a 21st century MMORPG.

I believe the base model for Ashes of Creation needs to go beyond what ArcheAge, Black Desert, New World has already done.

Ashes of Creation needs to be Read Dead Redemption 2 with a face of 3.

If it is less than that, it will be just another MMORPG, not a game to make history.

Do you agree?

https://youtu.be/YisYNBBd3Jw

Just talking complete rubbish! but i bet it made you feel clever

Caww

I feel clever that I did not respond to this post.. (?)

fogovivo

Be clever.
This thread is about "The quest for supreme quality for an MMORPG"

I think AoC should move forward to surpass others.

https://youtu.be/pX1KE7mIRDE

https://youtu.be/MAOQN9NF0bY

https://youtu.be/_sYjq-zR8As

https://youtu.be/IPTtpuw4SsY

Songcaller

Give the devs time to provide the polish. Also, 500vs500 needs a specific style and design. We can't have everything or everyone will need 5000 pound computers.

fogovivo

Neurath wrote: »

Give the devs time to provide the polish. Also, 500vs500 needs a specific style and design. We can't have everything or everyone will need 5000 pound computers.

500vs500 is not required. There is also no demand for it. ArcheAge and GuildWars 2 have already shown numbers of players allowed in World PvP combat currently ranges from 500 to 1,000 per map. It's a mess even when instantiated.

Currently, the best existing systems are those of Guild Wars 2 and Read Dead Online in which you can choose which sessions and with whom to be on the same server. Switching between open world and instanced areas just needs to be subtle.

As for the need for better machines, I'm sorry to say there's no going back. 32GB of ram and 12GB of video memory will be the base requirements for every AAA game coming out in 2024 and beyond.

"Dreams can become nightmares."

Songcaller

12gb vram might not be enough though. Also, guild wars 2 and red dead are older games. Ue5 dev said by 2030 ue5 will need 48gb gpu and 16 core cpu.

Noaani

Neurath wrote: »

Give the devs time to provide the polish. Also, 500vs500 needs a specific style and design. We can't have everything or everyone will need 5000 pound computers.

That is a really heavy computer!

Noaani

fogovivo wrote: »

Neurath wrote: »

Give the devs time to provide the polish. Also, 500vs500 needs a specific style and design. We can't have everything or everyone will need 5000 pound computers.

500vs500 is not required. There is also no demand for it. ArcheAge and GuildWars 2 have already shown numbers of players allowed in World PvP combat currently ranges from 500 to 1,000 per map. It's a mess even when instantiated.

There is a demand for 500v500.

Even in Archrage - with server populations much smaller than Ashes plans, many servers wanted fights that were bigger than that and simply couldn't.

I cant speak for GW2 (not at that stage of gameplay, at least), but if 500v500 worked I Archeage, there would have been many fights that were larger scale than what we saw.

This wouldnt have been sieges though. Archeage sieges sucked.

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