Is the Ecosystem of AoC an intelligent Ecosystem?

MybroViajero

The Most Complex Ecosystem in any Game
https://youtu.be/GMx8OsTDHfM
What to do when the most typical quests in MMORPGS story are :
Go to a certain place to get an artifact/unique thing by passing through areas where there are very dangerous MOBS but they always behave the same way.
It makes no difference if it is a level 20 dangerous MOB or a level 100 dangerous MOB , they always behave the same way , so what is the point of one MOB being much higher level than another if that MOB will always behave the same way idiot , more strength ? just that?.

MOBS in MMORPGS have been given little love , innovation and versatility , being these a big component of the environment in which is involved most of the content in MMROGPS.

Rain world gives very good examples of how those little details can create "that special thing" in a video game.
Of course it is well understood that there is no way to compare Rain World with a MMORPG since a MMORPG is massive, tends to have many systems and too many things that could make the "smarter and more alive" world that Rain World has created fail, but it would be interesting to think about WHAT THINGS COULD BE DONE.

Ideas:
- It would be interesting that some zones would exist ALPHA MOBS, that have more intelligence , some intelligent mechanics with which players can interact to take advantage or be harmed , that way it would add to that area something more interesting than just MOBS in red that would attack you if they see you.
-This could be applied for the neutral NPCS, something like in Elden Ring or BDO but thinking in a more intelligent style like in Rain World.
-It could also apply to materials, for example if I need a sacred flower that flower will only appear if I meet certain characteristics. Like in the WOW Shadowland quests in BASTION.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9ReS9MRZkQ

Any more ideas? I hear you, have you played Rain World? totally recommended.

tautau

I think some of this is already in game. For example, some mobs can be tamed, become livestock, be bred selectively and the offspring trained and sold.

In other words, this is one example of a mob being either:
- A mob you can kill like any other mob
- A mob you can tame, breed and turn into either livestock, mounts or pets

Azherae

I'll accept the return of FFXI's Penguin Mafia anytime.

Are we talking about actual interactives or just immersively designed food chains and such?

MybroViajero

tautau wrote: »

I think some of this is already in game. For example, some mobs can be tamed, become livestock, be bred selectively and the offspring trained and sold.

In other words, this is one example of a mob being either:
- A mob you can kill like any other mob
- A mob you can tame, breed and turn into either livestock, mounts or pets

That's cool

MybroViajero

Azherae wrote: »

I'll accept the return of FFXI's Penguin Mafia anytime.

Are we talking about actual interactives or just immersively designed food chains and such?

It depends on what a MMORPG can create and maintain.
I would like it to be "actual interactives" but I find it hard to believe that an MMORPG can do that with such a massive and complex game.
That's why I prefer to believe in small details like the examples I gave.

Azherae

MybroViajero wrote: »

Azherae wrote: »

I'll accept the return of FFXI's Penguin Mafia anytime.

Are we talking about actual interactives or just immersively designed food chains and such?

It depends on what a MMORPG can create and maintain.
I would like it to be "actual interactives" but I find it hard to believe that an MMORPG can do that with such a massive and complex game.
That's why I prefer to believe in small details like the examples I gave.

Ah, so you're unfamiliar. Anyways MMOs have been doing this since forever, it's just more numbers and similar.

I feel like we've discussed this before...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KFNxJVTJleE

Do you recall me or anyone else ever mentioning this to you? I don't want to run the required 'search' on the forums at the moment.

MybroViajero

Yeahhhhhh , that was just what i was looking for, thanks!.
I was too young to experience that MMORPG.

I think that is also an excellent example.

Azherae

Well, here's two 'stories' for you, one of the 'illusion of ecosystem' type, and another of the 'actual dynamism' type.

Story #1:

So, FFXI's Jugner Forest zone has some herbivores (sheep), some parasites (leeches), some 'scavengers' (walking mushrooms), some predators (Pugils, a longnosed fish near the water) and some apex predators (the Orcs and Tigers).

It also has some birds and some juvenile motile plants.

There are approximately 3 sheep for every Tiger in the zone, and one Funguar for every Sheep. There's 1 leech for every 10 mobs in the zone that the Leeches would reasonably feed on, and the juveniles of the wandering plants outnumber any other single thing.

The 'adults' of the plant though, are Treants, and there are only 3 of those, because those are the True Apex Predators, since they eat everything else, but only when they are sprouting the juveniles for reproduction. The Leeches drop Fiend Blood, which is basically what Leeches drop when their diet is varied, unlike locations that have more limited food types, in those places, Leeches drop the appropriate Blood.

You can't change the spawn rates of any of these by affecting any of the others. It's an illusion. You're supposed to imagine the ecosystem is maintaining balance and that's why you always encounter it that way. Because if you were able to influence it, you'd get the outcome in the video.

Story #2

Elite Dangerous spawns NPC ships and pirates every so often, and they go about their business, following a complex simulated behaviour set. Pirates are not just there to attack players, they attack and rob other NPC ships and traders.

You can happen to be nearby and drop into the battle to save them, or, if you're a bounty hunter properly equipped, intercept them before they can even get their attack locked on. If you do this enough, the star system actually does improve in safety. The more times someone defeats a pirate NPC, particularly the type that are actually spawned and flying around, the less of them will spawn as the Security rises, until the Pirates get frustrated and call in allies.

Once that starts to happen, the chances of a ship moving toward that system when randomly traversing the galaxy increases, so sometimes you'll meet a Pirate who is over a hundred light years (standard distance between two stars is about 16) from their spawnpoint, just hanging around.

If enough of these show up and no one deals with them, the status of the Star System changes. The Security Forces, other NPCs, also count for this.In one case the Devs forgot to add a Security Forces spawner to a system that was supposed to be 'developing' in a distant part of the galaxy, but remembered to add the 'Pirate Spawner'. Result, this 'new system' was completely overrun by Pirates within a few days and it required a massive effort from the community to 'clean it up' (the Devs didn't do it until next update because they tend not to negate their own emergent gameplay, even the mistakes).

It's fun to 'watch and figure out the status of a star system based on the Signal instances and the pirates flying around, and to find out where they come from in the galaxy'. Some will even respect you and interact differently than the 'home grown' ones, and if you're friendly with the pirates in the area, they'll come help you fight to get the newcomers off their 'turf'. And then of course some of them try to rob you anyway.

MybroViajero

"Reinvent an ecosystem"
https://youtu.be/f8iJpFFmIN0