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Open Sea, Naval Battles, Storage, Trading, and Corruption
Ravicus
Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
So taken from the Wiki is this statement on corrupted player interactions. The corrupted player will not be able to access storage or do personal trades with other individuals.
" Player to player trading, interacting with vendors or NPCs, and the ability to access storage is disabled for corrupted players.[119][8][120]
Previously it was stated that corrupted players could not store items in public warehouses but could utilize private storage within their freehold.[8][120]
Corrupted players will still be able to enter and leave their freehold buildings but may not deposit or withdraw items from storage.[119]"
Now my question is if this will apply to open seas where there is no corruption penalty but it is a free for all.
If you are a red player on the open seas, will you be able to trade with others? (I understand that if you are corrupt you will stay corrupt when you go to sea.)
Will there be an outlaw NPC coastal town that would allow Storage or banking for outlaws? (Think of Buccaneers Den in UO ( https://www.uoguide.com/Buccaneer's_Den ) Maybe a floating city or island out in the middle of the ocean We can name it "Corruption Island" lol. If This was possible could there be something like a thieves or pirates guild based there?
Could there be instanced limited housing on ships that could have some storage, or how does that work if you loot other players or ships? Where can you store items if you are at sea, or can you just loot or take what you can hold?
In addition if something like a pirates den could be implimented it could be a valid source for a prime pvp spot. This would be the place to go to look for reds if you where a bounty hunter as the reds would only be able to do any kind of interactions there. This might be crucial because as I see it the only way a red could get new armor or weapon would be to make them himself, or loot from other players. I could be wrong on this but with what is stated in the wiki that you cannot trade and cannot use a warehouse, then you might be screwed lol.
I did go over the wiki and tried to find answers for these so pardon me if it is listed or has been discussed in other places.
" Player to player trading, interacting with vendors or NPCs, and the ability to access storage is disabled for corrupted players.[119][8][120]
Previously it was stated that corrupted players could not store items in public warehouses but could utilize private storage within their freehold.[8][120]
Corrupted players will still be able to enter and leave their freehold buildings but may not deposit or withdraw items from storage.[119]"
Now my question is if this will apply to open seas where there is no corruption penalty but it is a free for all.
If you are a red player on the open seas, will you be able to trade with others? (I understand that if you are corrupt you will stay corrupt when you go to sea.)
Will there be an outlaw NPC coastal town that would allow Storage or banking for outlaws? (Think of Buccaneers Den in UO ( https://www.uoguide.com/Buccaneer's_Den ) Maybe a floating city or island out in the middle of the ocean We can name it "Corruption Island" lol. If This was possible could there be something like a thieves or pirates guild based there?
Could there be instanced limited housing on ships that could have some storage, or how does that work if you loot other players or ships? Where can you store items if you are at sea, or can you just loot or take what you can hold?
In addition if something like a pirates den could be implimented it could be a valid source for a prime pvp spot. This would be the place to go to look for reds if you where a bounty hunter as the reds would only be able to do any kind of interactions there. This might be crucial because as I see it the only way a red could get new armor or weapon would be to make them himself, or loot from other players. I could be wrong on this but with what is stated in the wiki that you cannot trade and cannot use a warehouse, then you might be screwed lol.
I did go over the wiki and tried to find answers for these so pardon me if it is listed or has been discussed in other places.
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Comments
Steven has mentioned this in the past, though I wouldn't be able to tell you where.
Steven has also said no to "outlaw" towns in the past.
Interesting about him stating that. I can see why he would. I would like to see the source to see how set in stone his statement was. Maybe we can get some good feedback on this idea.
The idea essentially being if there was a town you could go to while corrupt, then corruption loses it's meaning.
Thank you for the video. He does state that corruption penalties apply to everywhere in the world.
I guess I would like feedback on if other player would like this Idea and if it was possible to have something like this implimented.
I am not sure if the PVP base is aware of the severity of the corruption penalty as applied to being able to get/recieve gear. If you are corrupt you cannot trade or access a warehouse, or NPC's. @Isth3reno1else @Liniker is this correct and what is your take on this?
Yes, I watched that. So do you think its a good penalty or do you think not being able to gear up again is to much. Just looking for honest feedback. Hopefully the pvp players can have an opinion on this.
It was always my take that the restrictions are there to stop people from cheesing the system and negating the penalties corruption gives you. If you have Unique, or higher tier gear. Can use it to kill people who don't attack back and then just go to your storage and deposit it, run around naked while getting killed with no chance of item drops (and yes, every piece has a chance of dropping, even those single per server Uniques) and basically making a mockery of the intended penalties beyond the negative exp pool you would have to work off to get back to "full power." If you lose all your gear in drops, just go home and pick up another set and keep on being a pain in the ass. Corruption/Karma/Whatever they call it in other mmos have been pretty much a universal joke to those that plan the types of play that they are intended to curb. Could be the same here, but at least they seem to be taking from all the other various ones out there and trying to close those loopholes. Whether they are successful remains to be seen.
Right, I totally understand that. The only talking point that I can add is that being that they switched the open seas to auto consent pvp that it might have changed the outlook on the restrictions while at sea. If there was a floating black market or island out in the middle of the sea, it would be really hard for a pvp ganker to go out and change gear if he has to go to the middle of the ocean to do it :P. I do understand why corruption is the way it is, but they might reconsider on this one point maybe.
Yes, corruption penalty is severe, not being able to trade/deposit is part of what makes it severe, it increases your chance of losing your shit, but even if it weren't for now, even if we didn't had these details - it wouldn't really matter because what matters is the end goal
Steven said he does not want people to be PKing other Non-Combatant players without a very good reason for that - he expects these PK situations to be around 2% of what you experience in a month of playtime
so they will balance it and make the system as severe as it needs to achieve this goal, and this is necessary for the game to keep a healthy player base, and that is good
now, that doesn't mean we won't have plenty of open world pvp with the flagging system going - most of the PvP will be with both players flagged so no corruption is applied,
and again, if someone thinks the "meta" is going to be people not flagging, they gonna balance it to the point it is extremely worth flagging to reduce your death penalties, so yea, great system, can't wait to test it in A2.
to add: as a PvP player, this whole corruption discussion isn't important for me, I'm not interested in ganking people, I care about meaningful PvP against the top-tier guilds and players, and I can assure you any decent pvp player is not worried about not being able to spend his day ganking random carebears that won't flag up, gankers are often the worst players that can't achieve anything in the game so they need to find pleasure ruining the day of people that offer no challenge or risk.
while the idea is cool, it wouldn't be a good fit for ashes. It's a way to "cheat" the system and not lose your items when you are corrupt. you go red, go to your outlaw town, deposit your valuables and get crappy gear and start killing mobs. if you die, you won't lose anything important. so yeah no it removes the risk
I agree with this and this part of the system is often overlooked. Griefing low levels shouldn't be the goal of the corruption system and I am glad that people will have a chance to potentially recoup resources. The goal of any good pvp system should revolve around fun and inhibit as much of the more toxic side that pvp can induce. Going corrupt and being on the run until it is cleared is a good way to do so, imo.
As a pvp player my enjoyment comes out of fair or outnumbered fights, so corruption itself for me is quite a bit behind the caravan system, naval combat, open world pvp and node wars.
I do want to do some corruption based content though, revolving around having a corruption score(with willing participants) and allowing people to potentially get gear off of me when I inevitably die. I think that would be a fun way to give back to the community if done well.
I also think that risk/reward system for farming spots, grinding spots etc will also be nice to have. you choose what relationships you have in the game, not the game system itself. I think there are also negative PVE aspects that often get overlooked without this type of system(I.e. griefing at resources, pulling world bosses, ads etc). It's a system that needs to be thoroughly tested, but if implemented well could make the game much more enjoyable as a whole, which is another reason as to why I'll be testing it thoroughly.
This is still a thing that most people would sensibly do if they can.
If you enter the Open Seas while Red, you're not really in more danger. If anything you're in considerably less danger.
Everyone is theoretically Purple to you, so you can keep fighting without ever accruing more Corruption. An entire Node could come for you with their torches and pitchforks and you will just end up with your corruption removed.
If you felt you were strong enough to meaningfully be Red and had the support of some friends (assuming that you can work off Corruption via Open Seas PvE, but not necessary) it's your immediate best option if you have it.
The death penalty may always be worse but at least nothing will snowball, and your friends can protect you from anyone who tries to come for you without worrying about becoming Corrupted themselves.
You're not wrong, but the rade off is you're heading into a zone that is actively hostile, and while you can't gain more corruption, you're in an area where players PvP, and you have a chance to drop some gear
I would assume that running into Green players with the skills to PvP you on land should be just as frequent, and technically worse?
Not to mention the getaways would be more difficult on land?
Are you expecting the areas in the game that do have Corruption to have less players, less skilled players, or... what exactly? Is it an expectation about it being an 'endgame high level area'?
On land you potentially have a freehold, and many more places to evade and hide.
Where on the ocean, youll mostly be exposed in open water. Sure you can dive, but irrc you have to go to a port to summon and unsummon your ship. So unless you're riding a water mount across the sea, you'll be easier to find.
The one thing I did just think of as an advantage though is if your guildies use you as bait to drag bounty hunters into PvP... devious hahaha
In your freehold you just sit on your ass and hope that the BH that's literally outside your door will leave the game soon.
It's a classic bait and switch dude. Go log off in the freehold until the heat dies down and level an alt/do auction house stuff or professions.
To destroy your freehold could be a good reason for a siege.
Indeed!
Either this gets changed or seas become fucking SAO
So with that current knowledge, yeah, going to your FH is almost always the answer. Though then you'd be limited to PKing only around your FH, otherwise you're getting caught and killed before you reach it. And PKing around your freehold is PKing in your node. Which is shitty and imo there should be ways of pushing out such people out of the node through "enemy of the state" or increased taxes or smth like that. Cause fuck people who mess with their own mates.
Oh God, yea I feel like you should just do the 60s log out when flagged as well, or maybe even 30s. Otherwise the sea will be BRUUUUTAL having to travel all the way back to shore for a log out if you need to step away for some IRL stuff.
I almost think there should be an indicator for which node a player got corrupted in, or like if that corrupted player got corrupted outside of your home node or within your home node. Or an indicator for if a player got corruption from killing a player from a different node than you, or the same one as you. That allow players to potentially avoid killing fellow node citizens clearing their node of outsiders.
I just do not see this happening. With the way the corruption works I find it very unlikely that anyone would waste their exp pool on newbies, and if they do it will only be once. My main concern with the way corruption works is that you cannot access any warehouse, npc, or personal trade. I understand it is a great deterent to pk, but I think its to the point of gamebreaking for some. If you gank and loot, who can you give it to? What can you do with your inventory? If you are a crafter do you lose the crafting exp also from corruption? If so then that would hinder your ability to make your own gear, in which you cant anyway because you can only master 2 skills and no one can give you the other items crafted needed to make gear. I see this as a dead open world pvp scene really, as far as role playing a villian. I really do understand the intent and I think it will work as intended, but man, its overkill. Thats why I suggested something on the open sea where there could be a black market underground or something. As it stands right now bounty hunters will be bored shitless because no one is going to go red lol.
I do think corruption shouldn't hinder your ability to use your own storage. But I'm not against no trades or city access. I do think it's possibly overkill, but I want to test it first. I believe with a bounty system, there should be some leniency to corruption as to allow enough of it for some awesome bounty content, otherwise bounty hunting will be pointless like you said.
Nah, even more strictness on owpvp isn't necessarily the answer. And the corrupted could be corrupted from killing outsiders unbeknownst to the mayor
Interesting option.
The mayor should get the info from the game. Maybe the info could be more or less accurate depending on the level of some administrative buildings. Enforcing that action could also cost resources which would otherwise go toward building the city defense.