Intrepid should really consider making the new alpha keys go into beta.

EDIT: THIS HAS CHANGED. THANK YOU INTREPID FOR LISTENING TO FEEDBACK:
10.Opening_Alpha_Two_Access_v2.jpg

Now I don't actually think there is any plan to use this to get more money down the road, but the optics make this decision APPEAR like a money grab. The rationale behind canceling the old keys seemed to be about limiting the number of players.

Now, they’re arguing that while the alpha can support more players, the future beta cannot? If that’s not the case, it feels like they’re just trying to charge again for beta access. I wanted to support the development process but wasn’t interested in purchasing a bundaroo that included subscription time and cosmetic skins, like the old ones did. The expectation that I would need to purchase access separately for Alpha 2, Beta 1, and then Beta 2 is unreasonable and not in line with industry standards. I don't believe that it is actually just them trying to get more money, but I can guarantee that this is going to get some push back for this reason.

It could be the case that just an ungodly number of people bought just the beta access keys from the old bundaroos, but they should really clarify that if that's the case. Otherwise this is going to continue to be unpopular. I know for me personally, I just cant reasonable buy just a single phase of alpha for $100, not being able to access any future phases. I'm sure there are some people out there that will. I bet there will be a lot of people who buy it thinking it will get them into Betas.

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PenguinPaladin

Alpha 2 will be going alongside when betas are going. Changing to a beta relm will cause you to "lose your progress" if there isnt a need to wipe everything.

Only reason to switch to beta is to play with those outside of alpha 2

Sythriox

PenguinPaladin wrote: »

Alpha 2 will be going alongside when betas are going. Changing to a beta relm will cause you to "lose your progress" if there isnt a need to wipe everything.

Only reason to switch to beta is to play with those outside of alpha 2

That sounds weird coming from the old packs where they were marketed to having access to alpha AND beta. with both alpha and beta keys in their description. Now it seems like the implied linear direction is becoming a parallel one. You are probably right, but hot damn they really could have explained that better off the rip.

Not to mention that the "alpha" servers will at some point be on the beta servers? And aren't we already expecting there to be wipes here and there during development? I'm at least glad that they will have a Q&A for this specific subject.

Sengarden

Because the beginning of Beta may involve NDA content, different feature sets, and feedback goals, they might not want everyone from the A2 pouring into the Beta right away. So they'll market it and distribute access differently, I think. Personally, I hope they gather some info on how helpful specific A2 testers are over the course of the experience and offer them access first so they can minimize the number of Beta 1 players who're trying to get in just to "play a game" and whine when they find out that's not what they're paying for, and to make Beta 1 go faster by making those feedback channels more efficient.

Ludullu

Sythriox wrote: »

That sounds weird coming from the old packs where they were marketed to having access to alpha AND beta. with both alpha and beta keys in their description. Now it seems like the implied linear direction is becoming a parallel one. You are probably right, but hot damn they really could have explained that better off the rip.

Those keys were separate purchases for separate testing phases. It was always stated that A2 will go in parallel and will turn into PTR. Betas were always a separate thing near the end of testing.

And bundles had those keys exactly because they are bundles, not just keys (as is the case with the new sales).

Sythriox wrote: »

Not to mention that the "alpha" servers will at some point be on the beta servers? And aren't we already expecting there to be wipes here and there during development? I'm at least glad that they will have a Q&A for this specific subject.

No they will not be and they never planned to be "on beta servers".

Yes, there might be wipes on A2 Phase 3, but as Steven said, they want to keep those to a minimum.

Sythriox

Ludullu_(NiKr) wrote: »

No they will not be and they never planned to be "on beta servers".

Yes, there might be wipes on A2 Phase 3, but as Steven said, they want to keep those to a minimum.

So the alpha will not get any of the content added in later "beta servers" so this wouldn't be accurate?:

PenguinPaladin wrote: »

Only reason to switch to beta is to play with those outside of alpha 2

Taleof2Cities

Sythriox wrote: »

That sounds weird coming from the old packs where they were marketed to having access to alpha AND beta. with both alpha and beta keys in their description. Now it seems like the implied linear direction is becoming a parallel one. You are probably right, but hot damn they really could have explained that better off the rip.

Intrepid wants more testers for the Alpha 2 phase of testing (not Beta).

So, they’re selling more keys for the Alpha 2 phase of testing.

Seems transparent … nothing hidden or secret.

There’s no requirement to participate in Alpha 2.

If you still want to do testing (but your budget doesn’t permit it), there’s still a chance to win a free key in an upcoming Intrepid promotion.

Ludullu

Sythriox wrote: »

So the alpha will not get any of the content added in later "beta servers" so this wouldn't be accurate?

A2 will become the PTR, which means that they'll be getting all the content way before other versions of the game.

So this

PenguinPaladin wrote: »

Only reason to switch to beta is to play with those outside of alpha 2

Is exactly right. If you wanna play with people that only have access to the betas - you can switch to that version of the game and play there.

Srixun

I really support this idea. I think the $120 tag is perfect. creates a natural filter and puts skin in the game.

BUT, It should go into Beta imo.

Hadati

I agree. Besides going into beta, the $100-$120 A2 packages should also include maybe 3-6 months of subscription time once the game comes out. This would incentivize people to give feedback for a game they will have paid access to at launch, giving them another reason to be a good tester.

Barzel

In my opinion, it is bad PR (at the very least). No matter how they spin it, it looks cash-grabby and/or desperate to me, and I assume others as well. I think they should reevaluate that decision posthaste.

Dolyem

Nah, but I would say incentivizing alpha testers purchasing said keys to actually test and not just play I would provide beta keys to them once they achieve an undisclosed amount of alpha feedback.

zonechaos

I am glad I do not need any more keys

After this this thread, it sounds confusing...

Taleof2Cities

Barzel wrote: »

In my opinion, it is bad PR (at the very least). No matter how they spin it, it looks cash-grabby and/or desperate to me, and I assume others as well. I think they should reevaluate that decision posthaste.

The devs have also been transparent about what an Alpha 2 key purchase actually is.

It means you support the direction the game is heading and would like to help out by being a play tester. No obligation.

Not interested in spending $120 to play test?

Totally fine.

You can still watch the game’s progress through the monthly development updates and via socials … and still participate in future testing.

However, no obligation also means there’s no “cash grab” nor “bad PR”. You aren’t being forced into anything.

AyeveeGaming11

Srixun wrote: »

I really support this idea. I think the $120 tag is perfect. creates a natural filter and puts skin in the game.

BUT, It should go into Beta imo.

I am leaning toward this as well. The only thing to consider is that some of the kickstarter/package holders have lots of beta keys to give out. I might have 10 or so. I have not looked lately. So what I am saying is that there will be a lot of beta keys out there possibly for free. Being there is not supposed to be RMT they should be free.

arkileo

Depends on IS's motivation for going this direction.

If they're just trying to maintain value for previous backers, then I do think they should just give the new purchasers beta, I personally don't think that diminishes the value of my purchase.

If there's some other calculus here, that they don't want more beta testers or something like that, then stay the course.

Whatever is best for the game long-term.

Sythriox

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Barzel wrote: »

In my opinion, it is bad PR (at the very least). No matter how they spin it, it looks cash-grabby and/or desperate to me, and I assume others as well. I think they should reevaluate that decision posthaste.

The devs have also been transparent about what an Alpha 2 key purchase actually is.

It means you support the direction the game is heading and would like to help out by being a play tester. No obligation.

Not interested in spending $120 to play test?

Totally fine.

You can still watch the game’s progress through the monthly development updates and via socials … and still participate in future testing.

However, no obligation also means there’s no “cash grab” nor “bad PR”. You aren’t being forced into anything.

If it gets to the beta, and they say "instead of grabbing people from our pool of alpha players who already paid $120, we're going to have them pay another $100+ now to buy beta access" you are actually going to get a higher proportion of players who just want to play the game as an early access. Just leaving out everyone who just bought the alpha key is 100% scummy (if it comes down to that). A lot of people outside of the hyper fans on this form are seeing this alpha key purchase as an L.

I would argue that "no obligation" is a bit of a red herring. That's not really the point. A company nickel and diming people proclaiming "well you don't have to buy it if you don't want to" isn't great optics. With how it's served at the moment, it seems like they are only giving access to the alpha because...
a) They will charge more for the beta when that comes out.
b) There's only enough room for alpha testers, because the beta is going to be smaller or is already full.

This mentality of selling beta access like this has so many fundamental problems already. So far the only way to get into the beta, has been to spend money on skins, mounts, and months of playtime. It's for the unrealistically faithful followers. Those who are probably much less likely to do anything other than sing their praises — just a bunch of yes men. I might end up buying it anyway, since I do want to actually have input in how the game feels. Intrepid should want to actually get testers that are more evenhanded. I see these content creators involved in these tests, and it's 99% positive all the time.

Just like with this choice. Take all these previous package buyers compared to everyone else, and compare how people are reacting. These two groups are not in agreement. There is an excusatory minority that is giving "input" on the game. That just doesn't seem like a healthy dynamic for the game imo. Now who's to say that there wont be other systems in the game that this minority just accepts because of their faith in steven, and completely flops when normal gamers come into contact with it. At the end of the day, I love the game and still wish it the best.

Khronus

I agree. The price points are accurate and limits the amount of players wanting to play the game. Make way for players who are here to help them test it to get things moving along.

If they extend those players into Beta, I wouldn't mind as long as they need that many additional testers. If not, put a system in place that will extend possible beta codes to players who reached a certain amount of in game time during A2. Something to encourage being online and testing.

Spif

Considering that Alpha is going to last (IMO) 14-20 months, buying an Alpha key sounds very expensive for not a lot of return. I'm ok with that. It's for people who really want it, or have a business need to get it.

I specifically think that Beta key time and post release game time should not be included in the Alpha sale. Keep this round for people who want to test.

Beta+full game time sounds like a better combo.

rollox

This is something not clear to me. Would these ongoing alpha servers not be updated to the same version as the beta? Is there some thought or expectation that the beta servers will have more content or something more than the existing alpha servers do not?

When do the alpha actually get designated at public ptr realms? Because I would think that the Alpha PTRs would actually be in the list of servers to be selected during beta login. You just may not be authorized to select the PTR or Beta server based on you key credentials.

Besides, there still needs to be a community on the PTR Alphas because that is how development code should be advanced. Bug found in beta, fixed in development, patches to Alpha PTR and play tested, promoted to beta.

Either I am just confused and uninformed, but I don't really care that these alpha keys don't provide beta access. Because the Alpha will still be there through the entire beta period, and even through game release when betas are shut down and replaced/restored to Production release client servers.

Barzel

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Barzel wrote: »

In my opinion, it is bad PR (at the very least). No matter how they spin it, it looks cash-grabby and/or desperate to me, and I assume others as well. I think they should reevaluate that decision posthaste.

The devs have also been transparent about what an Alpha 2 key purchase actually is.

It means you support the direction the game is heading and would like to help out by being a play tester. No obligation.

Not interested in spending $120 to play test?

Totally fine.

You can still watch the game’s progress through the monthly development updates and via socials … and still participate in future testing.

However, no obligation also means there’s no “cash grab” nor “bad PR”. You aren’t being forced into anything.

Well, first I will say I have access, so I won't be purchasing the alpha test for that reason. That being said, if I didn't have it, I certainly wouldn't spend $100+ for it. I have never heard of a game, in over a couple decades of computer gaming, that charged almost twice a normal release price for the privilege to alpha test (no beta; no release product). It is just a bad look, and it doesn't matter what Intrepid says about it, nor does it matter what fans and apologists say. Many people, especially those outside of this supporter base (which sometimes acts a bit like an echo chamber), probably are going to have a negative opinion of Intrepid based on that alpha sale.

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