$175 is huge. Shouldn't be larger than the difference: $250 - $150 = $100
Was that info even available before purchase?
I used the beta 2 buyers as an example. They payed 75usd so the upgrade for them to alpha 2 is the extra 175 USD
The expeditionaries paid 150 USD and have to pay an extra $100 USD if they want to now join in.
The access keys on their own would have been fine. But now that they come with a month sub and embers beta holders got shafted.
ok, thanks for clarifying.
Given that with the upgrade they get the $20 cosmetic too which otherwise is gone forever (even if they don't care), and +2 months subscription ($30) and +$50 Embers, I think is a good option to consider.
After all we do it to get a good game out of this project.
I don't feel sad anymore for the $150 supporters.
Yep, that was my point. Anyone who's yelling "waaaaah, I paid 150 for beta, but now A2 and betas are for just 100 waaah, I got scammed" are just dumbasses.
As for my own clowniness of it all - I'm doubly fucked, cause I got an A2 key through a giveaway and Intrepid are greedy enough to not give beta access if you've won your key instead of buying it
So for me, if I wanna play in B1 - I gotta pay $75 for it. And I'm more than sure that Intrepid won't suddenly give in again and change the upgrade cost from 75 to 25 (even though it's only an upgrade from B2 to B1, rather than an upgrade to A2).
So, if anything, I'm in the most fucked over group of people (though it's a tiny group of course)
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HinotoriMember, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
$175 is huge. Shouldn't be larger than the difference: $250 - $150 = $100
Was that info even available before purchase?
I used the beta 2 buyers as an example. They payed 75usd so the upgrade for them to alpha 2 is the extra 175 USD
The expeditionaries paid 150 USD and have to pay an extra $100 USD if they want to now join in.
The access keys on their own would have been fine. But now that they come with a month sub and embers beta holders got shafted.
ok, thanks for clarifying.
Given that with the upgrade they get the $20 cosmetic too which otherwise is gone forever (even if they don't care), and +2 months subscription ($30) and +$50 Embers, I think is a good option to consider.
After all we do it to get a good game out of this project.
I don't feel sad anymore for the $150 supporters.
You might not but you should. I'm not talking about upgrades or any of that stuff. I'm talking about All these old backers who might not be able to afford that upgrade but supported the game while they could watching these people who payed less get access sooner... (for a minimum of 19 months they'll have access before them.) Probably longer because there's likely delays with each delay making their purchase of a beta key even worse as time goes on due to the value of testing.
And those newer people get embers and sub time that has also lessened the value of their beta purchases when the game goes live launch.
They got the worst deal in the history of bad deals.
The world is beautiful whenever you're here. And all the emptiness inside disappears.
Yep, that was my point. Anyone who's yelling "waaaaah, I paid 150 for beta, but now A2 and betas are for just 100 waaah, I got scammed" are just dumbasses.
As for my own clowniness of it all - I'm doubly fucked, cause I got an A2 key through a giveaway and Intrepid are greedy enough to not give beta access if you've won your key instead of buying it
So for me, if I wanna play in B1 - I gotta pay $75 for it. And I'm more than sure that Intrepid won't suddenly give in again and change the upgrade cost from 75 to 25 (even though it's only an upgrade from B2 to B1, rather than an upgrade to A2).
So, if anything, I'm in the most fucked over group of people (though it's a tiny group of course)
You don't have to upgrade if you have A2
Why would you want to change the server to a beta server?
Steven said on Reddit that A2 will run in parallel with the B1 and B2 and the difference will be insignificant.
Before that info I assumed that B1 and B2 players will join the already running A2 servers.
To me listing B1 and B2 access as an additional bonus to the A2 in those packs, meant a technical impossibility to separate them and the recent omission was just a thing people need to be explicitly told because most people don't know that A2 servers run until the full release.
You don't have to upgrade if you have A2
Why would you want to change the server to a beta server?
Steven said on Reddit that A2 will run in parallel with the B1 and B2 and the difference will be insignificant.
Before that info I assumed that B1 and B2 players will join the already running A2 servers.
To me listing B1 and B2 access as an additional bonus to the A2 in those packs, meant a technical impossibility to separate them and the recent omission was just a thing people need to be explicitly told because most people don't know that A2 servers run until the full release.
Because beta servers will have their own builds, their own groups of people (potentially waaaay more people as well) and will be truly fresh. They'll present a whole new experience after several years of testing A2.
I will upgrade to B1, because I only have B2 rn. And I'd imagine B1 will run for way longer than B2.
As for all those who don't know that Alpha 2 runs till release - they're dumb as well. This information has been out there for damn years. It's on the wiki, it's in the showcases, it's on the CC videos. If buyers do not research what they're buying - I have not even 0 pity for them, I have negative pity for them.
You don't have to upgrade if you have A2
Why would you want to change the server to a beta server?
Steven said on Reddit that A2 will run in parallel with the B1 and B2 and the difference will be insignificant.
Before that info I assumed that B1 and B2 players will join the already running A2 servers.
To me listing B1 and B2 access as an additional bonus to the A2 in those packs, meant a technical impossibility to separate them and the recent omission was just a thing people need to be explicitly told because most people don't know that A2 servers run until the full release.
Because beta servers will have their own builds, their own groups of people (potentially waaaay more people as well) and will be truly fresh. They'll present a whole new experience after several years of testing A2.
I will upgrade to B1, because I only have B2 rn. And I'd imagine B1 will run for way longer than B2.
As for all those who don't know that Alpha 2 runs till release - they're dumb as well. This information has been out there for damn years. It's on the wiki, it's in the showcases, it's on the CC videos. If buyers do not research what they're buying - I have not even 0 pity for them, I have negative pity for them.
The community and guild is supposed to keep you on the server... if you want to change it, you know what you do.
You have a deadline until you have to upgrade or you can wait until Beta?
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VeritusMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
I agree the Alpha keys were pricey. If you got in on Kickstarter, you got a (much) better deal through the packs. But here is my copium-induced take:
They're priced that high as an intentional gate. I believe enough people have bought Alpha access for Intrepid to test the things they want to. The keys are just a way for those who are late to the game, want to invest in it, and/or really want in to do so.
That being said, they should have included some other things in with the keys (cosmetics, titles, etc.).
$175 is huge. Shouldn't be larger than the difference: $250 - $150 = $100
Was that info even available before purchase?
I used the beta 2 buyers as an example. They payed 75usd so the upgrade for them to alpha 2 is the extra 175 USD
The expeditionaries paid 150 USD and have to pay an extra $100 USD if they want to now join in.
The access keys on their own would have been fine. But now that they come with a month sub and embers beta holders got shafted.
ok, thanks for clarifying.
Given that with the upgrade they get the $20 cosmetic too which otherwise is gone forever (even if they don't care), and +2 months subscription ($30) and +$50 Embers, I think is a good option to consider.
After all we do it to get a good game out of this project.
I don't feel sad anymore for the $150 supporters.
You might not but you should. I'm not talking about upgrades or any of that stuff. I'm talking about All these old backers who might not be able to afford that upgrade but supported the game while they could watching these people who payed less get access sooner... (for a minimum of 19 months they'll have access before them.) Probably longer because there's likely delays with each delay making their purchase of a beta key even worse as time goes on due to the value of testing.
And those newer people get embers and sub time that has also lessened the value of their beta purchases when the game goes live launch.
They got the worst deal in the history of bad deals.
Yes, well, there are people who indeed can barely gather the required amount of money but I have difficulty to feel empathy for them because a self defense kicks in and asks the question why such poor people want to give money to Steven. My opinion is that the best experience comes on the full released game and they get subscription months on that better version. I don't say this A2 will be only testing as others say but when money is such a big constraint, I think priorities should be different.
And later they'll have to keep paying subscription.
While I understand them (if they they have no patience), I feel no empathy.
I've seen a few people in outside communities laughing at the "poor beta" people who were proud to support intrepid early. And now they feel like a bunch of clowns.
Pride is a sin. Humbleness is a virtue.
Those laughing at them try to punish them if they did it for pride. But those who maintain their humbleness are worth to be praised.
This move made me abandon any idea of playing this game. There are more games than time in my life and this business practice is just scum. My opinion, don't care.
This move made me abandon any idea of playing this game. There are more games than time in my life and this business practice is just scum. My opinion, don't care.
This move made me abandon any idea of playing this game. There are more games than time in my life and this business practice is just scum. My opinion, don't care.
I appreciate your opinion, mr
Who cares when someone created an account? That does not reflect how long someone has read threads. Thanks for the image and attempt at disparaging me on the public forum. Your not exactly changing minds and showing me how toxic this community really is.
This move made me abandon any idea of playing this game. There are more games than time in my life and this business practice is just scum. My opinion, don't care.
You was polite.
And you are correct. We don't even know how this game will be, once released.
If you have other better games, wouldn't be wise to waste time in this Alpha.
But it's a joke for previous purchasers who never cared about those and are at that low tier now seeing people closely matching your your original purchase value seeing these new people paying LESS and getting to jump ahead of you in the access queue
If they wanted in the Alpha line it was available to them. They chose the Beta line.
Yeah I understand that it's upset some people, but there's no obligation to buy it, so if it's not worth it to you then don't buy, seems simple enough.
Who cares when someone created an account? That does not reflect how long someone has read threads. Thanks for the image and attempt at disparaging me on the public forum. Your not exactly changing minds and showing me how toxic this community really is.
I just find it interesting that throughout all of your supposed following time you haven't made an account to support the development or give devs your opinion on stuff, but as soon as there's some huge drama you come in and say "oh this is scummy and I'm not gonna play the game".
You also didn't provide an alternative that would be acceptable to you. You didn't explain which part of the situation you consider scummy (cause there's several parts here). You simply created an account to say that you won't be using the account that you've just created.
I don't mind them selling access to the Alphas (if there is a market for it sell it). But i feel bit cheated since i bought a Beta pack at 150. and now i could be getting Alpha access for 120. I know there are "extras" in the pack but we all know why we bought our packs. If the idea was just to get more people into the Alphas then why not make a lottery for the beta people to access it or even better move them all there.
I'm with you buddy. I feel for all the beta holders. I may not be now, but I used to be one of you. And I would be feeling pretty miffed if I still were.
i just dont understand this take. Its like people will find any reason to get mad. If you intend on playing the game then what does it matter? If you hypothetically bought the 250 dollar pack then you got basically 200 dollars worth of game time and currency, and a couple skins. And if you dont intend on playing the game, regardless, you should not be spending 75 120 175 250 or 500 dollars just to alpha test a game. Thats crazy.
I get the idea that maybe you would test the game and come to the conclusion that its just not for you, but i feel like you could get that from youtube videos or watching other people. Spending this kind of money to alpha test is, i imagine, for people who intend to actually play the game and want to help with the process.
But again, let me say, for the 50th time, this is exaclty why they should have always been selling keys along with pre order packs. And why they still should be selling a single pre order pack, as well as the key pack. They could have dropped the price of the keys a bit, recouped some of that money in packs, and made more people happy.
I don't know how upgrades work. I was not aware it is already possible to upgrade.
Can you upgrade also to Alpha 2 (Voyager Pre-order Package)?
Yeah the b2 people can upgrade for an extra 175 USD if they want access to alpha 2. But it comes with all the skins and stuff associated with it.
But it's a joke for previous purchasers who never cared about those and are at that low tier now seeing people closely matching your your original purchase value seeing these new people paying LESS and getting to jump ahead of you in the access queue
I've seen a few people in outside communities laughing at the "poor beta" people who were proud to support intrepid early. And now they feel like a bunch of clowns.
ya that certainly is an issue that i think is valid. I still think a lot of people are missing the point of what was given in those packs and the understanding that it would be used on a finished game, but i see your issue. I think the way they have always gone about it sucks.
They should have always sold keys and pre order packs from the start, sold skins on the shop to anyone that bought a key or pre order, and made most people happy. But instead they chose fomo, taking the pre orders down, and now boxing themselves into a bit of a corner. This is what happens when you choose tactics like this instead of just being straight forward with the sales. It was so over complicated and unnecessary.
I think the only logical solution to this problem now is to offer the people with beta packs access to the alpha 2 key ONLY (not upgrading the pack to get the extra in game stuff and time) for a reduced cost. Like if you bought a beta pack maybe you can spend 20 bucks or 30 bucks or whatever they think it should cost, to only upgrade to alpha.
I think people keep putting aside the items these packs come with. Again, they should have sold keys alone but they didnt. But i mean, in 15 years, if you are alive, and the game launches, and you're actually playing it consistently, and probably wanting to buy things, you will get at least a good amount of your money back with game time. thats a lot of IFS but thats something people knew when buying these packs.
I'm with you buddy. I feel for all the beta holders. I may not be now, but I used to be one of you. And I would be feeling pretty miffed if I still were.
Nah, only the stupid people spent money on beta bundles thinking that they're only buying access.
The mistakes of the consumer do not relate to the mistakes of the seller. Intrepid's only mistake rn is caving in to all the whiners and complainers, which led directly to fucking several types of people over. They should've just had a $120 key that gives you access to A2 in october. That's it.
All the people that, allegedly, made Intrepid put this sale out would buy it, and everyone else would shut up as soon as A2 is out, because they'd be watching streams of it.
Who are they fucking over? People who bought beta packs for 150 that came with 110 dollars of game time and currency, and 2 skins? The only thing ill agree with some people with is that they should have always just sold keys. Some of us want only alpha/beta access, and some of us actually want some other stuff included. This would have solved those issues. But again, those packs were more than just beta access.
But why do you think you only matter? Why do you think newer players should be charged a ridiculous price, that most people agree is ridiculous, to help test this game? Because they didnt know about it a year ago? Thats a garbage take. I love how i started this thread because of a bad choice intrepid made and now i have to defend them because people have such bad takes on this issue. There is a way for intrepid to be fair to almost everyone. The people who refuse to spend money on an alpha/beta test will never be happy, and are not in the equation. Intrepid chose to charge for testing a long time ago, so that ship has long since sailed.
But again, let me say, for the 50th time, this is exaclty why they should have always been selling keys along with pre order packs. And why they still should be selling a single pre order pack, as well as the key pack. They could have dropped the price of the keys a bit, recouped some of that money in packs, and made more people happy.
Selling expensive stuff not only limits your buyers, but also gives you a ton of money. Having fewer buyers in this context means lesser expenditure later, while the ton of money side lets you develop for longer.
It's a perfect combo. If they sold keys at low prices (i.e. their bundle price of barely even $20) - they'd get a shitton of testers, all of whom will complain if they're not served (which means a shitton of servers which is expensive), while also gives Intrepid only 1/25, 1/12, 1/7, 1/3 of what bundles give you.
One person, allegedly, costs ~$6 a year of testing, in terms of purely server costs. Which means that a single purchase of the three keys (A2, B1, B2), which are priced at $20 in the 250 bundle, would only give intrepid 3 years of server costs for that person. A2 will already be 1.5 years w/o any delays. Most likely it's gonna be closer to 3 years. And then there's at least several months of betas as well.
So that price would already put Intrepid into the red per person. And I haven't even touched dev costs, which are waaaay bigger than server costs. So Steven would need to pay for all of those devs purely out of pocket.
In other words, by selling expensive bundles they both, made money and cut future server costs. 1/3 of dev costs so far have already been covered by those bundle sales. And now that they've changed these keys to bundles as well, they'll probably get a few more mil from these.
But again, let me say, for the 50th time, this is exaclty why they should have always been selling keys along with pre order packs. And why they still should be selling a single pre order pack, as well as the key pack. They could have dropped the price of the keys a bit, recouped some of that money in packs, and made more people happy.
Selling expensive stuff not only limits your buyers, but also gives you a ton of money. Having fewer buyers in this context means lesser expenditure later, while the ton of money side lets you develop for longer.
It's a perfect combo. If they sold keys at low prices (i.e. their bundle price of barely even $20) - they'd get a shitton of testers, all of whom will complain if they're not served (which means a shitton of servers which is expensive), while also gives Intrepid only 1/25, 1/12, 1/7, 1/3 of what bundles give you.
One person, allegedly, costs ~$6 a year of testing, in terms of purely server costs. Which means that a single purchase of the three keys (A2, B1, B2), which are priced at $20 in the 250 bundle, would only give intrepid 3 years of server costs for that person. A2 will already be 1.5 years w/o any delays. Most likely it's gonna be closer to 3 years. And then there's at least several months of betas as well.
So that price would already put Intrepid into the red per person. And I haven't even touched dev costs, which are waaaay bigger than server costs. So Steven would need to pay for all of those devs purely out of pocket.
In other words, by selling expensive bundles they both, made money and cut future server costs. 1/3 of dev costs so far have already been covered by those bundle sales. And now that they've changed these keys to bundles as well, they'll probably get a few more mil from these.
Whales always bring in more money than plebs.
I can agree with some of that. Your logic is certainly right on some of what you said, but no one said sell the keys at 20 dollars. I was thinking more like 60, if they also had some kind of more expensive pack along side it. But that price would of course be up to intrepid. And you're completely missing the fact that they have already sold a ludicrous amount of packs. 250, 375, 500.
I dont see how offering a 60 dollar key pack along side a 250 dollar pack similar to the one they already had could possibly lose them money. You can try to argue it, but imo its a waste of time. Whales do make them money, and as they said new people are discovering AOC every day. Having both options gives regular players an option and whales with money to spend an option.
I also disagree with your use of the word pleb. In my experience in most games the whales are usually the plebs. Useless players that can do little more than look good in the mmo or game they are playing. But of course they are always welcome in any game, they keep the lights on.
But why do you think you only matter? Why do you think newer players should be charged a ridiculous price, that most people agree is ridiculous, to help test this game? Because they didnt know about it a year ago? Thats a garbage take. I love how i started this thread because of a bad choice intrepid made and now i have to defend them because people have such bad takes on this issue. There is a way for intrepid to be fair to almost everyone. The people who refuse to spend money on an alpha/beta test will never be happy, and are not in the equation. Intrepid chose to charge for testing a long time ago, so that ship has long since sailed.
People begged for keys. They would've gotten keys at $120, cause previous A2 access was a default 250. I don't care about people who learn about the game late, cause they'll have countless streams to watch.
And Intrepid are fucking over all the dumbasses that thought they were spending 250 on purely access. The dumbasses that spend 150 with the hopes of later upgrading higher. Now they're fucking over the $120 dudes, cause keys cost more than the bundle keys did. And the latest change to the $120 keys has fucked over anyone who only had the money for beta access and were fine with that, but now there's a bundle that's cheaper (or more expensive in the case of the B2 stuff) but also provides access to the entire A2 testing phase.
Intrepid should've had a single $120 pricetag on the A2 key. That key should've given access from oct 25. And it would've been fine. All the key beggers would've bought the key. They would've been fucked over with the price, but that's normal when you're buying something that's running out or is in super high demand. So the only ones being truly fucked over would be the people who delusionally believed that keys would only cost a few dozen $.
This has been a total needless mess, which is, at this point, a near-usual situation when it comes to Intrepid's presentation of information.
I dont see how offering a 60 dollar key pack along side a 250 dollar pack similar to the one they already had could possibly lose them money. You can try to argue it, but imo its a waste of time. Whales do make them money, and as they said new people are discovering AOC every day. Having both options gives regular players an option and whales with money to spend an option.
When given a choice, majority of people go for the most lucrative for themselves one. The world is full of dumb people. And a ton of those dumb people bought a $250+ access to A2 already. (i.e. 100k+). If there was a direct key option at $60 - a ton of those dumb people would obviously go purely for it rather than the more expensive version. Which means that Intrepid would've lost 3/4 of their current income from those bundles.
All while the overall cost of servers and development wouldn't have changed, so they'd need 3 times the buyers of the $60 keys to get back to the same value. But as this current drama has shown, the poor normies don't consider spending money on an Alpha in any way valuable, so I doubt that Intrepid would've gotten enough of those $60 buyers to get the same amount of money they've gotten so far.
All the while the costs of servers would be higher, cause now you have four $60 people for each previously $250 person (let alone the 375 one), while you do not have 4 times the money.
But why do you think you only matter? Why do you think newer players should be charged a ridiculous price, that most people agree is ridiculous, to help test this game? Because they didnt know about it a year ago? Thats a garbage take. I love how i started this thread because of a bad choice intrepid made and now i have to defend them because people have such bad takes on this issue. There is a way for intrepid to be fair to almost everyone. The people who refuse to spend money on an alpha/beta test will never be happy, and are not in the equation. Intrepid chose to charge for testing a long time ago, so that ship has long since sailed.
People begged for keys. They would've gotten keys at $120, cause previous A2 access was a default 250. I don't care about people who learn about the game late, cause they'll have countless streams to watch.
And Intrepid are fucking over all the dumbasses that thought they were spending 250 on purely access. The dumbasses that spend 150 with the hopes of later upgrading higher. Now they're fucking over the $120 dudes, cause keys cost more than the bundle keys did. And the latest change to the $120 keys has fucked over anyone who only had the money for beta access and were fine with that, but now there's a bundle that's cheaper (or more expensive in the case of the B2 stuff) but also provides access to the entire A2 testing phase.
Intrepid should've had a single $120 pricetag on the A2 key. That key should've given access from oct 25. And it would've been fine. All the key beggers would've bought the key. They would've been fucked over with the price, but that's normal when you're buying something that's running out or is in super high demand. So the only ones being truly fucked over would be the people who delusionally believed that keys would only cost a few dozen $.
This has been a total needless mess, which is, at this point, a near-usual situation when it comes to Intrepid's presentation of information.
It would have been fine? LOL to who? You? No. It would not have been fine. Why do you think so many people were disgusted over it? It was a terrible call to try and sell alpha 2 access ONLY for 120 bucks. You people keep overlooking the fact that those pre order packs came with other stuff. AGAIN, for 150 dollars you got 110 dollars worth of game stuff, plus a skin and beta access. S
I get where you are coming from, and i think it would be a good choice for intrepid to let those people that bought beta 1 packs, and beta 2 packs, upgrade the packs to alpha 2, without the game time, embers, skins, etc. For a lower price.
But i do not agree that the price for only alpha 2 access was ok. In the 250 dollar pack you got like 190 dollars worth of game time and embers. Plus 3 skins. Plus alpha and beta access. And you think someone should pay 120 for only alpha access? No. Thats unreasonable.
Oh, and no one thought you were spending 150 or 250 or 500 dollars on purely alpha/beta access. You would have to be blind to think that. IF you bought those packs and ONLY wanted alpha and beta access, and you had no intentions of playing the game at release, and had no need for the game time skins or embers, you should have NOT BOUGHT THE PACK. Its that simple.
Intrepid should have just sold keys without extras, along with the pre order packs, but they didnt. That was there choice and mistake, but it is what it is.
Oh, and no one thought you were spending 150 or 250 or 500 dollars on purely alpha/beta access. You would have to be blind to think that. IF you bought those packs and ONLY wanted alpha and beta access, and you had no intentions of playing the game at release, and had no need for the game time skins or embers, you should have NOT BOUGHT THE PACK. Its that simple.
You are way too optimistic if you believe that there's no one who spent those money thinking they were only paying that for the access and nothing else.
There's already been complaints about "I spent 250 on A2, but these fuckers get it for 120?! That's unfair!" And those are just the vocal minority of all the dumbasses who were only buying access in those bundles.
Only a small % of people can plan ahead and see the benefit of the future. Literally everything in the support bundles was "the future". But out of all of those things the closest thing was always the alpha. It was also the most tangible of the bundle benefits, cause you'll be enjoying that for months and months, while cosmetics and sub are years away, so they don't matter now.
Comments
I used the beta 2 buyers as an example. They payed 75usd so the upgrade for them to alpha 2 is the extra 175 USD
The expeditionaries paid 150 USD and have to pay an extra $100 USD if they want to now join in.
The access keys on their own would have been fine. But now that they come with a month sub and embers beta holders got shafted.
ok, thanks for clarifying.
Given that with the upgrade they get the $20 cosmetic too which otherwise is gone forever (even if they don't care), and +2 months subscription ($30) and +$50 Embers, I think is a good option to consider.
After all we do it to get a good game out of this project.
I don't feel sad anymore for the $150 supporters.
As for my own clowniness of it all - I'm doubly fucked, cause I got an A2 key through a giveaway and Intrepid are greedy enough to not give beta access if you've won your key instead of buying it
So for me, if I wanna play in B1 - I gotta pay $75 for it. And I'm more than sure that Intrepid won't suddenly give in again and change the upgrade cost from 75 to 25 (even though it's only an upgrade from B2 to B1, rather than an upgrade to A2).
So, if anything, I'm in the most fucked over group of people (though it's a tiny group of course)
You might not but you should. I'm not talking about upgrades or any of that stuff. I'm talking about All these old backers who might not be able to afford that upgrade but supported the game while they could watching these people who payed less get access sooner... (for a minimum of 19 months they'll have access before them.) Probably longer because there's likely delays with each delay making their purchase of a beta key even worse as time goes on due to the value of testing.
And those newer people get embers and sub time that has also lessened the value of their beta purchases when the game goes live launch.
They got the worst deal in the history of bad deals.
You don't have to upgrade if you have A2
Why would you want to change the server to a beta server?
Steven said on Reddit that A2 will run in parallel with the B1 and B2 and the difference will be insignificant.
Before that info I assumed that B1 and B2 players will join the already running A2 servers.
To me listing B1 and B2 access as an additional bonus to the A2 in those packs, meant a technical impossibility to separate them and the recent omission was just a thing people need to be explicitly told because most people don't know that A2 servers run until the full release.
I will upgrade to B1, because I only have B2 rn. And I'd imagine B1 will run for way longer than B2.
As for all those who don't know that Alpha 2 runs till release - they're dumb as well. This information has been out there for damn years. It's on the wiki, it's in the showcases, it's on the CC videos. If buyers do not research what they're buying - I have not even 0 pity for them, I have negative pity for them.
The community and guild is supposed to keep you on the server... if you want to change it, you know what you do.
You have a deadline until you have to upgrade or you can wait until Beta?
They're priced that high as an intentional gate. I believe enough people have bought Alpha access for Intrepid to test the things they want to. The keys are just a way for those who are late to the game, want to invest in it, and/or really want in to do so.
That being said, they should have included some other things in with the keys (cosmetics, titles, etc.).
Alpha's community and guilds do not matter. Especially when we're a few months away from release (which betas will be).
Got no clue. Intrepid simply said "we'll give a warning about disabling upgrades". No such warning has been given so far.
Yes, well, there are people who indeed can barely gather the required amount of money but I have difficulty to feel empathy for them because a self defense kicks in and asks the question why such poor people want to give money to Steven. My opinion is that the best experience comes on the full released game and they get subscription months on that better version. I don't say this A2 will be only testing as others say but when money is such a big constraint, I think priorities should be different.
And later they'll have to keep paying subscription.
While I understand them (if they they have no patience), I feel no empathy.
Pride is a sin. Humbleness is a virtue.
Those laughing at them try to punish them if they did it for pride. But those who maintain their humbleness are worth to be praised.
By Force if needed!
Who cares when someone created an account? That does not reflect how long someone has read threads. Thanks for the image and attempt at disparaging me on the public forum. Your not exactly changing minds and showing me how toxic this community really is.
And you are correct. We don't even know how this game will be, once released.
If you have other better games, wouldn't be wise to waste time in this Alpha.
If they wanted in the Alpha line it was available to them. They chose the Beta line.
You also didn't provide an alternative that would be acceptable to you. You didn't explain which part of the situation you consider scummy (cause there's several parts here). You simply created an account to say that you won't be using the account that you've just created.
i just dont understand this take. Its like people will find any reason to get mad. If you intend on playing the game then what does it matter? If you hypothetically bought the 250 dollar pack then you got basically 200 dollars worth of game time and currency, and a couple skins. And if you dont intend on playing the game, regardless, you should not be spending 75 120 175 250 or 500 dollars just to alpha test a game. Thats crazy.
I get the idea that maybe you would test the game and come to the conclusion that its just not for you, but i feel like you could get that from youtube videos or watching other people. Spending this kind of money to alpha test is, i imagine, for people who intend to actually play the game and want to help with the process.
But again, let me say, for the 50th time, this is exaclty why they should have always been selling keys along with pre order packs. And why they still should be selling a single pre order pack, as well as the key pack. They could have dropped the price of the keys a bit, recouped some of that money in packs, and made more people happy.
ya that certainly is an issue that i think is valid. I still think a lot of people are missing the point of what was given in those packs and the understanding that it would be used on a finished game, but i see your issue. I think the way they have always gone about it sucks.
They should have always sold keys and pre order packs from the start, sold skins on the shop to anyone that bought a key or pre order, and made most people happy. But instead they chose fomo, taking the pre orders down, and now boxing themselves into a bit of a corner. This is what happens when you choose tactics like this instead of just being straight forward with the sales. It was so over complicated and unnecessary.
I think the only logical solution to this problem now is to offer the people with beta packs access to the alpha 2 key ONLY (not upgrading the pack to get the extra in game stuff and time) for a reduced cost. Like if you bought a beta pack maybe you can spend 20 bucks or 30 bucks or whatever they think it should cost, to only upgrade to alpha.
I think people keep putting aside the items these packs come with. Again, they should have sold keys alone but they didnt. But i mean, in 15 years, if you are alive, and the game launches, and you're actually playing it consistently, and probably wanting to buy things, you will get at least a good amount of your money back with game time. thats a lot of IFS but thats something people knew when buying these packs.
Who are they fucking over? People who bought beta packs for 150 that came with 110 dollars of game time and currency, and 2 skins? The only thing ill agree with some people with is that they should have always just sold keys. Some of us want only alpha/beta access, and some of us actually want some other stuff included. This would have solved those issues. But again, those packs were more than just beta access.
But why do you think you only matter? Why do you think newer players should be charged a ridiculous price, that most people agree is ridiculous, to help test this game? Because they didnt know about it a year ago? Thats a garbage take. I love how i started this thread because of a bad choice intrepid made and now i have to defend them because people have such bad takes on this issue. There is a way for intrepid to be fair to almost everyone. The people who refuse to spend money on an alpha/beta test will never be happy, and are not in the equation. Intrepid chose to charge for testing a long time ago, so that ship has long since sailed.
It's a perfect combo. If they sold keys at low prices (i.e. their bundle price of barely even $20) - they'd get a shitton of testers, all of whom will complain if they're not served (which means a shitton of servers which is expensive), while also gives Intrepid only 1/25, 1/12, 1/7, 1/3 of what bundles give you.
One person, allegedly, costs ~$6 a year of testing, in terms of purely server costs. Which means that a single purchase of the three keys (A2, B1, B2), which are priced at $20 in the 250 bundle, would only give intrepid 3 years of server costs for that person. A2 will already be 1.5 years w/o any delays. Most likely it's gonna be closer to 3 years. And then there's at least several months of betas as well.
So that price would already put Intrepid into the red per person. And I haven't even touched dev costs, which are waaaay bigger than server costs. So Steven would need to pay for all of those devs purely out of pocket.
In other words, by selling expensive bundles they both, made money and cut future server costs. 1/3 of dev costs so far have already been covered by those bundle sales. And now that they've changed these keys to bundles as well, they'll probably get a few more mil from these.
Whales always bring in more money than plebs.
I can agree with some of that. Your logic is certainly right on some of what you said, but no one said sell the keys at 20 dollars. I was thinking more like 60, if they also had some kind of more expensive pack along side it. But that price would of course be up to intrepid. And you're completely missing the fact that they have already sold a ludicrous amount of packs. 250, 375, 500.
I dont see how offering a 60 dollar key pack along side a 250 dollar pack similar to the one they already had could possibly lose them money. You can try to argue it, but imo its a waste of time. Whales do make them money, and as they said new people are discovering AOC every day. Having both options gives regular players an option and whales with money to spend an option.
I also disagree with your use of the word pleb. In my experience in most games the whales are usually the plebs. Useless players that can do little more than look good in the mmo or game they are playing. But of course they are always welcome in any game, they keep the lights on.
And Intrepid are fucking over all the dumbasses that thought they were spending 250 on purely access. The dumbasses that spend 150 with the hopes of later upgrading higher. Now they're fucking over the $120 dudes, cause keys cost more than the bundle keys did. And the latest change to the $120 keys has fucked over anyone who only had the money for beta access and were fine with that, but now there's a bundle that's cheaper (or more expensive in the case of the B2 stuff) but also provides access to the entire A2 testing phase.
Intrepid should've had a single $120 pricetag on the A2 key. That key should've given access from oct 25. And it would've been fine. All the key beggers would've bought the key. They would've been fucked over with the price, but that's normal when you're buying something that's running out or is in super high demand. So the only ones being truly fucked over would be the people who delusionally believed that keys would only cost a few dozen $.
This has been a total needless mess, which is, at this point, a near-usual situation when it comes to Intrepid's presentation of information.
All while the overall cost of servers and development wouldn't have changed, so they'd need 3 times the buyers of the $60 keys to get back to the same value. But as this current drama has shown, the poor normies don't consider spending money on an Alpha in any way valuable, so I doubt that Intrepid would've gotten enough of those $60 buyers to get the same amount of money they've gotten so far.
All the while the costs of servers would be higher, cause now you have four $60 people for each previously $250 person (let alone the 375 one), while you do not have 4 times the money.
It would have been fine? LOL to who? You? No. It would not have been fine. Why do you think so many people were disgusted over it? It was a terrible call to try and sell alpha 2 access ONLY for 120 bucks. You people keep overlooking the fact that those pre order packs came with other stuff. AGAIN, for 150 dollars you got 110 dollars worth of game stuff, plus a skin and beta access. S
I get where you are coming from, and i think it would be a good choice for intrepid to let those people that bought beta 1 packs, and beta 2 packs, upgrade the packs to alpha 2, without the game time, embers, skins, etc. For a lower price.
But i do not agree that the price for only alpha 2 access was ok. In the 250 dollar pack you got like 190 dollars worth of game time and embers. Plus 3 skins. Plus alpha and beta access. And you think someone should pay 120 for only alpha access? No. Thats unreasonable.
Oh, and no one thought you were spending 150 or 250 or 500 dollars on purely alpha/beta access. You would have to be blind to think that. IF you bought those packs and ONLY wanted alpha and beta access, and you had no intentions of playing the game at release, and had no need for the game time skins or embers, you should have NOT BOUGHT THE PACK. Its that simple.
Intrepid should have just sold keys without extras, along with the pre order packs, but they didnt. That was there choice and mistake, but it is what it is.
There's already been complaints about "I spent 250 on A2, but these fuckers get it for 120?! That's unfair!" And those are just the vocal minority of all the dumbasses who were only buying access in those bundles.
Only a small % of people can plan ahead and see the benefit of the future. Literally everything in the support bundles was "the future". But out of all of those things the closest thing was always the alpha. It was also the most tangible of the bundle benefits, cause you'll be enjoying that for months and months, while cosmetics and sub are years away, so they don't matter now.