Glorious Alpha Two Testers!
Alpha Two Realms are now unlocked for Phase II testing!
For our initial launch, testing will begin on Friday, December 20, 2024, at 10 AM Pacific and continue uninterrupted until Monday, January 6, 2025, at 10 AM Pacific. After January 6th, we’ll transition to a schedule of five-day-per-week access for the remainder of Phase II.
You can download the game launcher here and we encourage you to join us on our for the most up to date testing news.
Alpha Two Realms are now unlocked for Phase II testing!
For our initial launch, testing will begin on Friday, December 20, 2024, at 10 AM Pacific and continue uninterrupted until Monday, January 6, 2025, at 10 AM Pacific. After January 6th, we’ll transition to a schedule of five-day-per-week access for the remainder of Phase II.
You can download the game launcher here and we encourage you to join us on our for the most up to date testing news.
xp debt on pvp related activities
dnn_
Member, Alpha Two
I’m level 22 right now, and I consider myself a pvp player. But here’s the thing: I still haven’t done any pvp in the game. Why? Simple: xp debt. I don’t want to deal with a whole bar of xp debt just because I wanted to have some fun.
And I think this is true for most players, as I haven’t been attacked either.
This whole scenario makes me want to rush to level 25 as fast as I can so I can finally enjoy PvP without worrying about xp debt. And that feels completely opposite to what Intrepid’s trying to achieve with the “game starts at level 1” philosophy.
Here’s two possibilities that i see on how to fix this:
Cap xp debt based on current progress: for example, if you’re 99% into a level, you can only gain up to 99% xp debt; if you’re at 1%, you can only gain 1% XP debt. ( this would make a safe zone to go have some fun if you had like <10% of xp)
Another option would to abolish xp loss from pvp deaths: If another player takes you out, there should be zero xp penalties.
That's my two cents on how the game is feeling rn and how i would make different decisions if certain thing were implemented.
And I think this is true for most players, as I haven’t been attacked either.
This whole scenario makes me want to rush to level 25 as fast as I can so I can finally enjoy PvP without worrying about xp debt. And that feels completely opposite to what Intrepid’s trying to achieve with the “game starts at level 1” philosophy.
Here’s two possibilities that i see on how to fix this:
Cap xp debt based on current progress: for example, if you’re 99% into a level, you can only gain up to 99% xp debt; if you’re at 1%, you can only gain 1% XP debt. ( this would make a safe zone to go have some fun if you had like <10% of xp)
Another option would to abolish xp loss from pvp deaths: If another player takes you out, there should be zero xp penalties.
That's my two cents on how the game is feeling rn and how i would make different decisions if certain thing were implemented.
3
Comments
you risk grinding alone while a major guild is rewarded by slowing your progress into the negative!
I've said it before, if people want actual pvp to happen, it needs to be something that's not punished by participating. Anything else devolves into big guilds zerging around. I'd rather see a situation where two individual players feel like it's a reasonable choice to fight over a grind spot, and feel like it's still worth fighting the other person even if you've lost once or twice. As it stands, the game currently promotes this: don't fight back, let them go red, and then PK them repeatedly with no consequence until they don't have the gear to farm the same mobs anyways.
and for those saying if it's not enough you'll have people ganking low levels - well TERA solved this issue, killing a lowbie makes it so you can't toggle your flag until it wears off. This ofcourse can be exploited too - but less of a problem in a targeting game than it was in TERA. if someone wants to stay perma flagged they'll have a rough time not being able to go to town because of guards.
PvE focused: WoW / FFXIV / Lineage II
Sandbox: Ultima Online / Darkfall / Mortal Online
Big Influence: SNES Fighting games / Starcraft / Diablo II / Smite
True, it's just that the reward is so little compared to the risks.
If i flag on another party for a grinding spot, what is the most i can get from that? A good grinding spot for like 2 hours before someone have to leave? that is like 10% more xp than what i would get in a worst spot.
But the most you can lose is basically the same 2 hours, but of griefing and pvping, which tbh doesn't sound so bad if weren't for the xp debt.
even worse? the best ways to combat this are literally doing more damage to the mobs they pull or scumbags who train the other group. You have to try to out pve them to 'pvp' them because actually pvping is a trap. It's kind of like the real world, where people make other peoples lives miserable, and you either have to deal with it, or punch them and then get charged and potentially sued in civil court as well. Loophole style pvp ladies and gents.
PvE focused: WoW / FFXIV / Lineage II
Sandbox: Ultima Online / Darkfall / Mortal Online
Big Influence: SNES Fighting games / Starcraft / Diablo II / Smite
I think if they implemented a way to entice players to flagged as combatant rather than coercing them and reducing or not implementing xp debt when killed by a player would help.
I think the main issue is like you said about the xp dept, along with no reason to flag as a combatant and so there are less "targets" for those that like to PvP.
What about something like this:
- Flagged as non-combatant: only gain 80% experience doing things, lower mob drop rate, but when you die, you lose less resources.
- Flagged as combatant: 100% experience, normal mob drop rate, and normal resource loss.
- Flagged as corrupt: stat penalty, only gain 80% experience, lower mob drop rate, lose 1 item per stage when you die, and more resource loss than normal.
I think more would flag up for combatant, so they get more experience, but are also open to attack, which means more targets for the PvP players, and helps reduce the deaths of non-combatants due to less rewards for killing them.
So, higher risk for higher reward for combatants since they are also a PvP target.
You seem to have misunderstood how exp debt works. It applies at lvl25 and applies stat dampening just the same as it would on a lvl10 proportional to how much exp debt you have.
Black desert online tried an open-world PVP with low death penalties and the game is famously known for the karma bombing.
What discourages me isn’t the stat dampening since that wasn’t even working when I made the post-but the xp debt itself, which doesn’t really matter if you’re level 25.
Also, from what I hear, when you reach 25, your xp becomes 0/0 even though your bar is half red. So, idk about your info.
You can check out the wiki if you want to get information on how the penalties will be implemented, but you will absolutely still feel it at level 25 (and level 50 once we reach that point). The pause on level progression is the only death penalty that you don't experience at max level.
except this is a bad design choice. why not switch the two at cap? exp loss on death while leveling and the stat debuff at cap(or 25 for testing purposes)
PvE focused: WoW / FFXIV / Lineage II
Sandbox: Ultima Online / Darkfall / Mortal Online
Big Influence: SNES Fighting games / Starcraft / Diablo II / Smite
It's a very good design choice to encourage players to be smart and defend themselves by engaging in PvP.
You never 'lose' exp anyway. The amount of exp dept reflects the scale of stat damp effects and an acts as a delay toward resuming progress toward another level. The removal of that second aspect is your reward for reaching max level.
It'd make no sense to have a max-level-specific debuff that you don't have any experience with for ~250 hours of game time before that.