Realistic vs Fantastical Armor & Weapon Designs

I'm glad to see in the video that was released that it looks like the development team is sticking closer to the realistic design of armor and weapons to the hyper fantasy ala World of Warcraft floating rocks for shoulder armor.

Has the development team commented on this fact that they are steering more toward the realistic (Witcher or Elder Scrolls fantasy feel for weapons and armor) or are they just using placeholder models?

What types of designs do you guys enjoy? Personally the more realistic the better for me tho small flairs of high fantasy are ok with me especially when dealing with elven or dwarven armaments but still to a degree leaning more towards realistic. I hate the games that the greatswords are bigger then the person wielding it. In real life that sword would weight 2000 lbs!
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  • my personal thoughts on Fantasy/ Realistic would be more on the realistic side of things. i love the witcher/elders scrolls armour types and i think that a game that has graphics that look like they do in <a href="https://youtu.be/RshdOyXyU4E">the environment promo</a> could be more suited towards realistic armours etc.
  • oh and in regards to "the greatswords are bigger then the person wielding it. In real life that sword would weight 2000 lbs" i would like to see something similar to BDO's inventory weight where you can only hold so much, its more realistic than carrying around several thousand items at once.
  • So here are my thoughts on the design direction for aesthetics.

    I'm looking forward to a bit more on the realistic, however I think things like Orcish armor (depending on how they are depicted in lore) to be less ornate and either very utilitarian or more tribal looking. On the opposite end of the spectrum I would hope dwarves have very intricated detailing, sketching, and etchings in their armor. They are well known for fantastic craftsmanship and put a lot of pride in their craftworks.

    Dwarves would have golden, brass, bronze, or overall just very intricate sketchings and writings in their armor sets. In many fantasy settings even the lowly dwarven warriors have some form of exquisite pattern theme.

    Orcs could rely on dark aggressive or neutral colors. Reds, Blacks, Dark tans, maybe some greens, and a few other various designs to fit a bit more tribal culture to their overall aesthetic.

    Humans would be somewhere in the realm of "Function over Form" except on noble looking citizens or very high tier armors which are relatively fancy and show a lot of flair. Lots of metal colors in the early tiers, then with later high tier gear getting royal reds, blues, golds, and purples for lining with tabards/tassets aesthetically.

    Elves would be organically ornate. Exquisite with lots of curves/twists and very earthly/nature based colors. Tans, Greens, Browns, maybe some golden colors / fall leaf colors.

    As for inventory wieght: I'm totally against. In an MMO setting where there will be thousands upon thousands of items the only thing weighing you down should be specific items you wield or wear. Carrying pieces of siege equipment, pushing trebuchets, or MAYBE if they begin to design from the start if heavy armor affects overall movement speed. Though I would not approve of this in a balancing factor for PvP unless it can be negated constantly. Then you just get light armor archers or mages who can kite like nobody's business. Many MMO's avoid speed variations except through buffs and debuffs for this exact reason to counter guaranteed kiting.
  • [quote quote=660]I’m glad to see in the video that was released that it looks like the development team is sticking closer to the realistic design of armor and weapons to the hyper fantasy ala World of Warcraft floating rocks for shoulder armor.

    Has the development team commented on this fact that they are steering more toward the realistic (Witcher or Elder Scrolls fantasy feel for weapons and armor) or are they just using placeholder models?

    What types of designs do you guys enjoy? Personally the more realistic the better for me tho small flairs of high fantasy are ok with me especially when dealing with elven or dwarven armaments but still to a degree leaning more towards realistic. I hate the games that the greatswords are bigger then the person wielding it. In real life that sword would weight 2000 lbs!

    [/quote]

    I dont mind so much wether the armor or realistic or fantasy like, but i would be disapointed to see the armor be "cartoony". Realistic proportions is definately a winner. Also armor should be relevent to how "tanky" a character is, having someone in cloth but being able to take huge amounts more damage than a guy in full armor is just wierd.



    [quote quote=663]oh and in regards to “the greatswords are bigger then the person wielding it. In real life that sword would weight 2000 lbs” i would like to see something similar to BDO’s inventory weight where you can only hold so much, its more realistic than carrying around several thousand items at once.

    [/quote]

    Once again dont mind weapons being oversized, but I absolutely love the Berserk Anime/Dark Souls series so maybe im slightly biased. Infact having an MMO with Darksouls stylised armor would be amazing.

    Guts Full Armor Mode from Berserk
    <img src="http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/berserk/images/4/46/Guts3.png/revision/latest?cb=20160808014405" alt="" />

    Darksouls 3 Armor Designs:
    <img src="http://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/4307089126946560a9ea23006183291c.jpg" alt="" />

    I do agree with weight being important for carry weight in total, but i think it should be more like Elderscrolls (Skyrim/Morrowind) carryweight and less Like BDO's which also has "Inventory Squares". Perhaps even a throwback to ultima onlines inventory system
    but with a weight limitation added on.
  • I like the more realistic vision for armor/weapons/characters. I realize that we are working with a virtual world where our current concepts of physics and the natural order may not correspond to what we are use to. However, back in my younger days I actually wore armor and fought with weapons, and trust me, weapons the size of a Cessna wing stretch even my ability to suspend reality.

    I have been happy so far with the ESO models and weapons and would be happy to see that type of setup. I was also very much involved with Landmark, and the more "animated" look and feel was off putting for me. Still, if I am happy with with underlying mechanics, the gameplay, and depth of story arc, an animated look would probably not be important to me (unless it included guys dressed as DDD breasted elf women with two foot long ears and postage stamps for armor) :)
  • Realistic when it comes to proportions and the ability of your character to actual weild it.
    That being said, with 8 different races, i don't mind having fantasy themed armour in any way.
  • personally i love what ive seen so far, i dislike the extreme fantasy route that some take. some fantasy is good and even some realistic look higher fantasy armors are good. what id really like to see is norse style armor, and or building set since city building is a factor.

    weighing in on the carry weight limit, im all for it, id like it low personally, it gives a reason to buy pack animals maybe backpacks / use wagons and what good would caravans be if you can just carry everything you need from one town to the other. if nothing else it would give another reason for comunity interaction. need lots of wood to build up that house? pay some people to help you out, maybe join a guild dedicated to the crafts. i guess the other words that could be useful... logistics and industry. this makes great focus for guilds.
  • I for one want to see large flaming swords with demon head pommels, A wizards staff with a human skull in it with magic alive in the eye sockets. Bring on the Fantasy!
  • [quote quote=1324]I for one want to see large flaming swords with demon head pommels, A wizards staff with a human skull in it with magic alive in the eye sockets. Bring on the Fantasy!

    [/quote]
    Everyone's been going the realistic way, and then you come and rebel :)

    I really like the middle way, though leaning more towards realistic. If it is just plain bland normal weapons, then there not much fantasy in it for me... But it doesnt have to be much, just a thing line of glowing runes on the sword. Maybe the cape is held in place with rune-edged plates etc.
    Generally I think anything that light up just a tiny bit, is very fantasy looking.

    If you wanna go the more unrealistic route, I think it would be more fitting if it was only on ancient artifact, maybe with some lore: "The grand old magus of Ros'vedan made this staff, and in the process killing him... It is said that its his burning skull that makes up the magical energy emitting from it" (<-- awesome lore skill I know;) ). When/if you wanna go this route it kinda needs some lore to make it realistic, you can't just have a burning-skull-staff, it needs lore so it makes sense.

    But it's definitely the glowing runes route for me, maybe a little more (if the above is filled in).
  • My take is this...Considering that there will be horses running around with runes (first mount concept art)...I'm guessing there will be plenty of glowing stuff in the armor/weapons. To me the debate should be between "fantastical" and "cartoony". Just by its very nature, this is a fantastical game. I like fantastical...as long as it doesn't get too cartoony. Glowing/Magical is awesome if it is done in a more "adult" style...if that makes sense.
  • Please create some amazing rogue armor. What does amazing rogue armor look like you might be asking? Take a look at <a href="http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Nightingale_Armor" target="_blank">Nightingale Armor</a>. Rogue armor should be dark and matte in finish as to not reflect the moon. The head should combine a draping hood with a mask that covers the face, save for the eyes. Im not saying copy Nightingale armor, I am saying use that as a reference point. Take a look at how Warframe on its deluxe skins creates dimension in the armor, and gives the armor a sinew-ish look, which I think is really incredible. Belts going diagonally across the torso, from right shoulder to left hip that hold knives, poisons, smoke bombs etc, belt at the waste for holding weapons. Pants should be tight, not baggy, the material would tear of and leave evidence of the rogue. The only time rogue armor should appear baggy is in a winter environment, when the rogue needs to wear over-whites for camouflage, upon nearing the mission, taking off the over-white would be recommended. I am have a nerdgasm.
  • Creating armour can be extremely tricky, you have the different races, all the different classes.

    I think whilst its important for each race to have its own armour types, this should be wearable by all races. Elder scrolls follow this very well, you can wear ork armour while being argonian, or elf armour whilst being an ork. That adaptability allows more freedom for players to dress how they want without being restrained by an early on game decision as to what race you chose to play. It also allows for a uniformed approach to organising a group if, like myself you wanted your own military, it would allow players to decide upon uniforms.

    However! What should be avoided is 'the best armour'
    I know, this might sound a bit odd, but the last thing you want is hundreds of players running around with the same armour simply because its the overall best. Have armours that give defence in different areas, melee/magic/range defence. This will break it up and allow for a lot more variety which I always find key in any sandbox game/mmo.

    Also have light, medium and heavy variations of armour per race motif as it were. Whatever allows for the most variety to allow players to specialise in their preferred style is vital I think. Its pretty obvious what kinds of shapes and ideas we should expect from dwarven/elven/orc type races so I don't think I need to go into those.

    1 thing I think could be a nice touch: Banners. The ability to go into battle with people wielding a shield or a flag or a cloak with a banner/symbol or emblem that represents your guild I think will bolster the community aspect of the game. Even if it was basic, its something more than nothing. As an alternative, for those not in the guild, allow them to represent the node they are in support of. It would be a way of creating a natural defensive force and building a bond between a player and their favourite territories. I have found in my experience that even if numbers dwindle many years down the line, its the guilds that are a constant, and can help the life span of any game.

    Regarding carry weight, using my earlier idea of light medium and heavy...if you just keep these 3 boundaries, its a simple system to put into place. It makes sense that a knight in full plate armour should not be able to carry the same as a completely unarmoured 'skiller' who is solely aiming to gather materials.

    Just a few ideas. I imagine I'll be a medium armour kind of guy, with Elven design, specialising in a assassin/tank hybrid :P So long as I can loot or carry my reward after collecting a bounty....this mercenary will be happy ;)
  • Even a fantasy game is based on using physics that the players can all associate with.

    So i don tmind how they stylise the armour, as long as it is based on the materials used to contruct it, and is size limited by realistic mass.

    I would also like to see the E=mc2 applied to magic. Meaning even magic (energy) must have inertia effects, just like weapons.

    Which also hits on animation cancelling that 8ft 100lb hammer your wielding.
    1. Its going to be slow to get upto speed.
    2. Its going to be slow to slow it down and change direction too.
    Daggers on the other hand will, have little intertia effect, allowing greater hits per second with light damage.
    In effect, both putting out the same DPS but in a unique style....the players preferred style.
    ie do away with animation cancelling and force players to choose between quick or slow weapons.....and deal with the consequences.

    As for balance, inducing penalties to go with bonuses will do the job fine. Neuralising any and all advantages and just leaving preferred 'play styles'.
  • I like realistic. I wouldn't mind colourful and stylised as long as it's not a caricature. People say cartoony lasts longer but for me I never like it to begin with
  • I love Ultra Great swords too! Berserk and The Souls series <3 Does that make me more on the Fantasy side? I'd say yes. I also think more fun can be had with the Fantasy style Armour and weapons I really wouldn't mind a mix between the 2. I doubt ill get an Ultra GS here but i can hope :) And Yes the Witcher series had awesome Armour.
  • Realistic armor like in ESO just looks boring as hell. Someone who played the game for 2 years literally looks the exact same like someone who just started 7 days ago.

    Not going to spend a single $ on costumes if they look as boring as ESO costumes/armors.
  • The graphics in this game look outstanding with its realism and blended fantasy style. I have had enough of exaggerated cartoon worlds. I hope the combat graphics stay tamed and do not obscure the action. Some games have such excessive combat animation that you can't see whats going on through the cloud of screaming pixels.
  • I too was very happy with the aesthetic style they've shown us so far. It's not excessively realistic, adding just the right touches of fantasy to make things look just awesome. Kinda reminds me of Lineage II, which has my favorite aesthetic style of all time in an MMO.

    <img src="http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-oX6onUK9JGc/UqYUFVjFtjI/AAAAAAAACbQ/J8J_PRO5iec/s1600/majesticheavy.jpg" alt="Ugly ass graphics, amazing style." />

    Ugly ass graphics, amazing style.
  • The armor has to be immersive to the world its in and make sense to the world and environment. If you make the architecture/environment/time line in the game very creative and make it look like some high fantasy game, then the armors should match that style. From the previews it looks like the architecture and environment will be the typical style most mmo's use, so the armors made should match their architectural style/environment/time in order to be immersive; it should all blend in with the culture to be immersive. Different nodes having different architecture styles or technologies or resources should influence the designs of the armors in those areas, and there should be distinct cultural differences between them. It doesn't matter if its high fantasy or realistic, as long as it doesn't break immersion to the game. The armors should also look cool too. I don't like ugly armors.
  • [quote quote=11469]The armor has to be immersive to the world its in and make sense to the world and environment. If you make the architecture/environment/time line in the game very creative and make it look like some high fantasy game, then the armors should match that style. From the previews it looks like the architecture and environment will be the typical style most mmo’s use, so the armors made should match their architectural style/environment/time in order to be immersive; it should all blend in with the culture to be immersive. Different nodes having different architecture styles or technologies or resources should influence the designs of the armors in those areas, and there should be distinct cultural differences between them. It doesn’t matter if its high fantasy or realistic, as long as it doesn’t break immersion to the game. The armors should also look cool too. I don’t like ugly armors.

    [/quote]

    This can be Awsome, i can imaginate armors like old Otomans, or Like Berserkers of the Vikings, in diferentes types of nodes.

    Maybe a Variarity types of the same armor, (i mean the same score of defense or habilities) in sinergy with the local where crafted are a interessanting ideia.

    Btw, i'm particulary like the fantasy armor, but some realistic things can be more atractive
  • <img src="http://img3.mmo.mmo4arab.com/news/2011/01/31/tera/human_07.jpg" alt="" />

    Still one of my favourite heavy armor sets in any MMO - probably forever.

    A general mix between fantasy and realistic armor is usually the best way to go.

    • Not as fantasyish like WoW
    • Not as boring as ESO
  • I think many of us are on the same song sheet.
    Makes me feel better.

    So ...highly stylised (by biome and race especially) is ok....but must be physics realistic ?
    ie class & race specific styles of each biome.
    After all, you want to wear appropriate gear to suit both your type of activity and the environment in which you act.

    Which also means which gear stats rise and which gear stats fall also depends on the location you are in.
  • Why not both?? I want some days to wear very awesome looking armor and some days to be in a thong. Give people choice!
  • [quote quote=11467]I too was very happy with the aesthetic style they’ve shown us so far. It’s not excessively realistic, adding just the right touches of fantasy to make things look just awesome. Kinda reminds me of Lineage II, which has my favorite aesthetic style of all time in an MMO.

    <img src="http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-oX6onUK9JGc/UqYUFVjFtjI/AAAAAAAACbQ/J8J_PRO5iec/s1600/majesticheavy.jpg" alt="Ugly ass graphics, amazing style." />

    Ugly ass graphics, amazing style.

    [/quote]
    It looks like bikini armor to mee.
    Leaving legs and stumack free for hits on female characters only.
  • [quote quote=682]<blockquote>
    <div class="d4p-bbt-quote-title"><a href="https://www.ashesofcreation.com/forums/topic/realistic-vs-fantastical-armor-weapon-designs/#post-660" rel="nofollow">Aggelos wrote:</a></div>
    I’m glad to see in the video that was released that it looks like the development team is sticking closer to the realistic design of armor and weapons to the hyper fantasy ala World of Warcraft floating rocks for shoulder armor.

    Has the development team commented on this fact that they are steering more toward the realistic (Witcher or Elder Scrolls fantasy feel for weapons and armor) or are they just using placeholder models?

    What types of designs do you guys enjoy? Personally the more realistic the better for me tho small flairs of high fantasy are ok with me especially when dealing with elven or dwarven armaments but still to a degree leaning more towards realistic. I hate the games that the greatswords are bigger then the person wielding it. In real life that sword would weight 2000 lbs!

    </blockquote>
    I dont mind so much wether the armor or realistic or fantasy like, but i would be disapointed to see the armor be “cartoony”. Realistic proportions is definately a winner. Also armor should be relevent to how “tanky” a character is, having someone in cloth but being able to take huge amounts more damage than a guy in full armor is just wierd.

    <blockquote>
    <div class="d4p-bbt-quote-title"><a href="https://www.ashesofcreation.com/forums/topic/realistic-vs-fantastical-armor-weapon-designs/#post-663" rel="nofollow">Shunex wrote:</a></div>
    oh and in regards to “the greatswords are bigger then the person wielding it. In real life that sword would weight 2000 lbs” i would like to see something similar to BDO’s inventory weight where you can only hold so much, its more realistic than carrying around several thousand items at once.

    </blockquote>
    Once again dont mind weapons being oversized, but I absolutely love the Berserk Anime/Dark Souls series so maybe im slightly biased. Infact having an MMO with Darksouls stylised armor would be amazing.

    Guts Full Armor Mode from Berserk
    <img src="http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/berserk/images/4/46/Guts3.png/revision/latest?cb=20160808014405" alt="" />

    Darksouls 3 Armor Designs:
    <img src="http://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/4307089126946560a9ea23006183291c.jpg" alt="" />

    I do agree with weight being important for carry weight in total, but i think it should be more like Elderscrolls (Skyrim/Morrowind) carryweight and less Like BDO’s which also has “Inventory Squares”. Perhaps even a throwback to ultima onlines inventory system
    but with a weight limitation added on.

    [/quote] I do like the realistic armour with a touch of fantasy. Like from Beserk. Bog clunky armour with a badass greatsword (...ish) weapon (more a lump of iron). I also like the simplistic rogue looks and fast movements. More and more aspects of this game are making my brain hurt. There is so much complexity and so much choice that I don't know what to do with myself xD Races then Class then subclasses then jobs. These are common in many other MMORPGs but this one for some reason (because I'm so nervous about my character build) is confusing me (in a good way) on what I want and how I want to play. Which is how it should be. Gone a little off track but I am glad youv'e gone more realistic than fantasy.
  • I do like the realistic armour with a touch of fantasy. Like from Beserk. Bog clunky armour with a badass greatsword (...ish) weapon (more a lump of iron). I also like the simplistic rogue looks and fast movements. More and more aspects of this game are making my brain hurt. There is so much complexity and so much choice that I don't know what to do with myself xD Races then Class then subclasses then jobs. These are common in many other MMORPGs but this one for some reason (because I'm so nervous about my character build) is confusing me (in a good way) on what I want and how I want to play. Which is how it should be. Gone a little off track but I am glad you've gone more realistic than fantasy.
  • I have to say Im definitely on the more realistic side of things, but at the same time I don't want the designs to be too boring (like ESO felt). I think the Dark Souls or Bloodborne aesthetic probably found the best balance between the two.
    While the ESO armors in general were kind of boring, I did really like how their armor crafting system worked - where armor made by a player of a certain race matched that race's aesthetic. I think that would fit really well in this game too!

    But honestly, I don't care how ridiculously fantasmical the armor designs are so long as they are consistent between male and female characters. I'm so sick of seeing female characters looking like they belong in porno versions of the game while the male characters look like they actually belong. Pick one style and stick to it! (That being said, I'd prefer they go the everyone-is-practical route rather than the everyone-is-a-fantasy-porn-star route that FFXIV took :P)

    And please, I'm begging you, no boobplates!!!! >A<
  • As other have said I think the right balance is realistic proportions, leaning a towards practical but with fantasy flair.

    No sense in turning this into the western sense of the word 'realistic' where absolutely everything is brown or seen through a brown filter.
  • To me I love the realistic base stuff with a bit of creative flair. I absolutely hate the over the top giant style or Anime type armor/art style that some games have had. Just not interesting to me at all. Warriors would use chain and plate, it's not THAT fancy but some higher end stuff could be a little bit more decorative. I should also look similar to my status in the game (though mostly this would tie in to level etc..) I should start off with janky or ripped basic gear and find things along the way that both perform and look better.
  • I think there should be a middle ground. WoW, since you mentioned it, has amazing tier sets. I love fantastical designs but they should consider the character models and how it should not look disproportionate. All the way realistic (Weapons/gear) in a supposed fantasy game is, in my opinion, boring.
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